Hr 3962 passes!

[Sidestreamer]

....with only 1 Republican vote..

Who was the Republican?

The next one to get fired.

Considering the district Cao represents... you're right with the conclusion, but not the reasoning.

 

[VaYank5150]

Who was the Republican?

The next one to get fired.

Considering the district Cao represents... you're right with the conclusion, but not the reasoning.

Has Rush demanded Cao's ouster yet? He may want to check with Boehner first on this one...

 

[Navy1960]

NY I'm well aware of the conservative coalition and who it was composed of when the Civil Rights Act of 1964 was voted upon. However I don't think in my posting I mentioned the word conservative until you brought it up. If you mean to imply that the coalition was composed of only republicans you and I both know that implication would be incorrect. As for your other question, my answer(s) were directed to those that seem to imply that Republicans have no record of support on Civil Rights which is completely untrue, nor when the spin machines turn out the little snipits that Republicans opposed Medicare thats also untrue. I was addressing an earlier posting however, so that your clear on it, I was making it clear that both parties have a record both positive and negative when it comes to Civil Rights and to imply otherwise is to buy into the revisionist persons look at history.

 

[oreo]

The next one to get fired.

Considering the district Cao represents... you're right with the conclusion, but not the reasoning.

Has Rush demanded Cao's ouster yet? He may want to check with Boehner first on this one...

Here's your answer--- In fact, it's no wonder that this congress has an approval rating of 14%. Here's what is coming---




This is what happens when you don't listen to the people you were elected to represent--LOL

 

[VaYank5150]

Considering the district Cao represents... you're right with the conclusion, but not the reasoning.

Has Rush demanded Cao's ouster yet? He may want to check with Boehner first on this one...

Here's your answer--- In fact, it's no wonder that this congress has an approval rating of 14%. Here's what is coming---

View attachment 8635


This is what happens when you don't listen to the people you were elected to represent--LOL

So, all of the people that helped elect Democrats to a majority, did NOT want healthcare reform? What planet are you from?

 

[Sidestreamer]

Has Rush demanded Cao's ouster yet? He may want to check with Boehner first on this one...

Here's your answer--- In fact, it's no wonder that this congress has an approval rating of 14%. Here's what is coming---

View attachment 8635


This is what happens when you don't listen to the people you were elected to represent--LOL

So, all of the people that helped elect Democrats to a majority, did NOT want healthcare reform? What planet are you from?

I think it was more of the public getting tired of the economy's shape and wanting the party of Reaganomics out of power. Unfortunately the Democrats decided they'd rather jump on this matter after the stimulus packages floundered, and frankly I don't see too many people left or right all that willing to go forth with something that's going to cost a trillion dollars like this plan.

 

[KittenKoder]

Has Rush demanded Cao's ouster yet? He may want to check with Boehner first on this one...

Here's your answer--- In fact, it's no wonder that this congress has an approval rating of 14%. Here's what is coming---

View attachment 8635


This is what happens when you don't listen to the people you were elected to represent--LOL

So, all of the people that helped elect Democrats to a majority, did NOT want healthcare reform? What planet are you from?

Reform ... sure ... another government take over ... no.

 

[Immanuel]

This was the right vote at the right time by the right electors for the right interest of the right people: all of the U.S. citizens.

I am so thankful that the cold-hearted sons of guns who have made the poor and laboring classes bleed for the wealthy's greed, that the latter are going to have to pay their fair share.

This is what the hard right (the Judas Iscariots of the American Dream) would do if they could to anyone making them participate in the social compact.

YouTube - Jesus Christ - Woody Guthrie

What part of "the poor and lower middle class are going to be hurt more than the wealthy by this bill" do you not understand?

The fact is that only the deepest poor are going to get free health care out of this. Those who are struggling to pay the bills and don't get 100% "availabliity credits", who's employers decide to drop their coverage are going to suffer the most.

And that will be Madam Nancy's fault.

The wealthy really are not going to be affected by this at all except that their taxes will increase a bit. But the man who is working and struggling to put food on the table every night is going to get the shaft the minute his employer realizes it is cheaper for the employer to pay the 8% penalty (how long before the penalty reaches 25% or 50%) rather than be forced to nearly fully cover the employee's health insurance?

Immie

 

[California Girl]

Has Rush demanded Cao's ouster yet? He may want to check with Boehner first on this one...

Here's your answer--- In fact, it's no wonder that this congress has an approval rating of 14%. Here's what is coming---

View attachment 8635


This is what happens when you don't listen to the people you were elected to represent--LOL

So, all of the people that helped elect Democrats to a majority, did NOT want healthcare reform? What planet are you from?

An awful lot of them were just sick of the GOP. That does not give the current Administration carte blanche to run roughshod over the country or our Constitution.

 

[ayiakri]

This was the right vote at the right time by the right electors for the right interest of the right people: all of the U.S. citizens.

I am so thankful that the cold-hearted sons of guns who have made the poor and laboring classes bleed for the wealthy's greed, that the latter are going to have to pay their fair share.

This is what the hard right (the Judas Iscariots of the American Dream) would do if they could to anyone making them participate in the social compact.

YouTube - Jesus Christ - Woody Guthrie

What part of "the poor and lower middle class are going to be hurt more than the wealthy by this bill" do you not understand?

The fact is that only the deepest poor are going to get free health care out of this. Those who are struggling to pay the bills and don't get 100% "availabliity credits", who's employers decide to drop their coverage are going to suffer the most.

.... (snipped for brevity)...
Immie

What part of, "that's your opinion, and while you're entitled to it, many other people disagree with you" don't you understand?

And to be honest - if the poorest of the poor are, as you say, the biggest beneficiaries of the reform, well, I consider that a moral victory. My guess is that Mother Theresa would have endorsed it, if that's the end result.

You're merely speculating about what employers will, or will not do, and your speculation is even more suspect when you look at the steep decline in private companies offering health-insurance for their employees now.

It's really easy to sit back and say, "oh, this is going to be horrible, it's going to hurt the poor, and help the rich", but in the past 50 years, we've heard people say that desegregating the schools would destroy America, that mandating unleaded gasoline would bankrupt Americans and lead to the end of car ownership, that eliminating CFCs as coolants would bankrupt both the car business and be useless besides (when in fact, it turns out that banning CFCs worked, and the hole in the ozone layer is on the mend).

Ditto for affirmative action (which I have very mixed feelings about, in that I don't think it's necessarily the right tool for what it's intended), but nevertheless, it hasn't destroyed our education system.

I seriously don't believe that this bill is primarily going to hurt the working class. And if it does turn out to be a colossal mistake, well, then the GOP will sweep to victory in 2014, and can undo it all

I absolutely believe that America will, as it has for over two centuries of laws, make it through this little blip of a change without suffering any real damage, and that the reform is better than the status quo.

The Republicans had six years of essentially uninterrupted power under Bush, with a Republican majority in both houses, and the only attempt at health-care reform was the ill-designed prescription drug plan that Bush and the Democrats somehow agreed to pass. Now, it's the Democrats' turn in power. In my view, they cannot possibly do much worse.

 

[ayiakri]

An awful lot of them were just sick of the GOP. That does not give the current Administration carte blanche to run roughshod over the country or our Constitution.

Some of us were sick of the former administrations' running roughshod over the country, and the constitution ;-)

Remember when Bush declared that he had the power to simply pick any American citizen up, on U.S. soil, declare that person an "enemy combatant", and throw them in a military prison with no due process, no access to a lawyer, and without charging the person with a crime?

I do. I also remember the day the Supreme Court struck that down as unconstitutional.

I believe that former President Bush's authorization for the NSA to wiretap the phones of U.S. citizens making calls overseas, without a warrant from the FISA court (which allows you to get the warrant after you've done the wiretap, even), was also unconstitutional, and there are currently several cases making their way to the Supreme Court that will ultimately determine whether it was, or wasn't, unconstitutional.

So far, the Democrats haven't managed to do anything I'd consider "unconstitutional" (hell, they haven't managed to pass much in the way of legislation at all, which is generally the way I like it). If the health-care reform ends up being struck down by SCOTUS, then so be it - their decision is the final one.

If it's not struck down, then I hope you also acknowledge that the reform turned out not to be unconstitutional.

 

[California Girl]

An awful lot of them were just sick of the GOP. That does not give the current Administration carte blanche to run roughshod over the country or our Constitution.

Some of us were sick of the former administrations' running roughshod over the country, and the constitution ;-)

Remember when Bush declared that he had the power to simply pick any American citizen up, on U.S. soil, declare that person an "enemy combatant", and throw them in a military prison with no due process, no access to a lawyer, and without charging the person with a crime?

I do. I also remember the day the Supreme Court struck that down as unconstitutional.

I believe that former President Bush's authorization for the NSA to wiretap the phones of U.S. citizens making calls overseas, without a warrant from the FISA court (which allows you to get the warrant after you've done the wiretap, even), was also unconstitutional, and there are currently several cases making their way to the Supreme Court that will ultimately determine whether it was, or wasn't, unconstitutional.

So far, the Democrats haven't managed to do anything I'd consider "unconstitutional" (hell, they haven't managed to pass much in the way of legislation at all, which is generally the way I like it). If the health-care reform ends up being struck down by SCOTUS, then so be it - their decision is the final one.

If it's not struck down, then I hope you also acknowledge that the reform turned out not to be unconstitutional.

Ah, the old standard "but, but, but, BOOOOOOOOOSSSSSSSHHHH!".... the last resort of a dead argument.

Both fucking parties constantly do things that actually ARE unconstitutional - whether you consider them to be or not. For decades, they have ignored the constitution - all of them - right and left. It's not an opinion, it's facts. And as for our so called 'SCOTUS' - well, that's laughable.

Stop whining.

 

[Immanuel]

This was the right vote at the right time by the right electors for the right interest of the right people: all of the U.S. citizens.

I am so thankful that the cold-hearted sons of guns who have made the poor and laboring classes bleed for the wealthy's greed, that the latter are going to have to pay their fair share.

This is what the hard right (the Judas Iscariots of the American Dream) would do if they could to anyone making them participate in the social compact.

YouTube - Jesus Christ - Woody Guthrie

What part of "the poor and lower middle class are going to be hurt more than the wealthy by this bill" do you not understand?

The fact is that only the deepest poor are going to get free health care out of this. Those who are struggling to pay the bills and don't get 100% "availabliity credits", who's employers decide to drop their coverage are going to suffer the most.

.... (snipped for brevity)...
Immie

What part of, "that's your opinion, and while you're entitled to it, many other people disagree with you" don't you understand?

And to be honest - if the poorest of the poor are, as you say, the biggest beneficiaries of the reform, well, I consider that a moral victory. My guess is that Mother Theresa would have endorsed it, if that's the end result.

You're merely speculating about what employers will, or will not do, and your speculation is even more suspect when you look at the steep decline in private companies offering health-insurance for their employees now.

It's really easy to sit back and say, "oh, this is going to be horrible, it's going to hurt the poor, and help the rich", but in the past 50 years, we've heard people say that desegregating the schools would destroy America, that mandating unleaded gasoline would bankrupt Americans and lead to the end of car ownership, that eliminating CFCs as coolants would bankrupt both the car business and be useless besides (when in fact, it turns out that banning CFCs worked, and the hole in the ozone layer is on the mend).

Ditto for affirmative action (which I have very mixed feelings about, in that I don't think it's necessarily the right tool for what it's intended), but nevertheless, it hasn't destroyed our education system.

I seriously don't believe that this bill is primarily going to hurt the working class. And if it does turn out to be a colossal mistake, well, then the GOP will sweep to victory in 2014, and can undo it all

I absolutely believe that America will, as it has for over two centuries of laws, make it through this little blip of a change without suffering any real damage, and that the reform is better than the status quo.

The Republicans had six years of essentially uninterrupted power under Bush, with a Republican majority in both houses, and the only attempt at health-care reform was the ill-designed prescription drug plan that Bush and the Democrats somehow agreed to pass. Now, it's the Democrats' turn in power. In my view, they cannot possibly do much worse.

Did I say it would "help" the rich? No, not even close. The problem is that it IS going to hurt upper level poor and the lower middle class. You are definitely right in that many companies were dropping insurance coverage for their employees. They were forced to do so because of the high cost of insurance. However, this bill will escalate that and now not only will the poor and middle class be unable to afford the Public Option, but if they can't afford it, they will be fined and imprisoned for not doing so. They will be forced to forego other essentials in order to keep from being imprisoned for not buying insurance. Way to go Dems!

Do I care if the Republican win in 2014? Hell no! The Republicans in Washington are no different than the Democrats. I don't care about either side. I believe we should send them all packing.

And no, you are wrong, they will not be able to undo this travesty. Were they able to undo Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid? Did they even care at the time?

There is absolutely no doubt that something needed to be done about the Health Insurance Industry... no doubt at all. However, taking the leap we just took without even thinking about the consequences down the road is rather disturbing.

Immie

 

[NYcarbineer]

NY I'm well aware of the conservative coalition and who it was composed of when the Civil Rights Act of 1964 was voted upon. However I don't think in my posting I mentioned the word conservative until you brought it up. If you mean to imply that the coalition was composed of only republicans you and I both know that implication would be incorrect. As for your other question, my answer(s) were directed to those that seem to imply that Republicans have no record of support on Civil Rights which is completely untrue, nor when the spin machines turn out the little snipits that Republicans opposed Medicare thats also untrue. I was addressing an earlier posting however, so that your clear on it, I was making it clear that both parties have a record both positive and negative when it comes to Civil Rights and to imply otherwise is to buy into the revisionist persons look at history.

Both parties have a negative record on civil rights because both parties have had conservatives in them over the years.

 

[NYcarbineer]

Would be much the same as democrats denying things that democrats did 50 to 100 years ago would it not?

Who's denying what Democrats did?

Democrats sided with Bush on the wars ... and all his policies.

Another enduring rightwing myth. Most Democrats in Congress voted against the Iraq war resolution.

 

[ayiakri]

An awful lot of them were just sick of the GOP. That does not give the current Administration carte blanche to run roughshod over the country or our Constitution.

Some of us were sick of the former administrations' running roughshod over the country, and the constitution ;-)

Remember when Bush declared that he had the power to simply pick any American citizen up, on U.S. soil, declare that person an "enemy combatant", and throw them in a military prison with no due process, no access to a lawyer, and without charging the person with a crime?

I do. I also remember the day the Supreme Court struck that down as unconstitutional.

I believe that former President Bush's authorization for the NSA to wiretap the phones of U.S. citizens making calls overseas, without a warrant from the FISA court (which allows you to get the warrant after you've done the wiretap, even), was also unconstitutional, and there are currently several cases making their way to the Supreme Court that will ultimately determine whether it was, or wasn't, unconstitutional.

So far, the Democrats haven't managed to do anything I'd consider "unconstitutional" (hell, they haven't managed to pass much in the way of legislation at all, which is generally the way I like it). If the health-care reform ends up being struck down by SCOTUS, then so be it - their decision is the final one.

If it's not struck down, then I hope you also acknowledge that the reform turned out not to be unconstitutional.

Ah, the old standard "but, but, but, BOOOOOOOOOSSSSSSSHHHH!".... the last resort of a dead argument.

Both fucking parties constantly do things that actually ARE unconstitutional - whether you consider them to be or not. For decades, they have ignored the constitution - all of them - right and left. It's not an opinion, it's facts. And as for our so called 'SCOTUS' - well, that's laughable.

Stop whining.

Sounds like you're the one whining here
Note that I'm in FAVOR of the bill that just passed, not whining about how it's gonna undermine my liberty, blah blah.

 

[namvet]

Navy, lets not play ignorance. We both know after Nixon that Southern Democrats and such became Republicans.

I will give you that the dixiecrats became Republicans After Nixon, however it still does not change the fact that that Republicans have a long history of support for Civil rights issues and it's only been in the last 40 years that people seem to be under the impression that Republicans have little if anything to do with Civil Rights and excuse their own party's involvement in it.

The Republicans have become the old, white, Southerners party.

did your old black grandpa tell you that ???? im Gop and live in the north. along with other millions. that's prove's you are: a liar, no credibility AND A RACIST. bubba

 

[ayiakri]

Who's denying what Democrats did?

Democrats sided with Bush on the wars ... and all his policies.

Another enduring rightwing myth. Most Democrats in Congress voted against the Iraq war resolution.

Another myth is that the resolution was to go to war with Iraq at all - it wasn't. Congress passed (with almost unanimous Republican support, with the majority of Democrats opposed) a resolution granting President Bush to use any and all means necessary to disarm Iraq, if Iraq failed to comply with UN inspections regimes.

Not 30 days before Bush ordered the invasion, the head of the UN inspection team reported that Iraq was in material compliance with the inspections, and UN forces were already overseeing the destruction of a bunch of medium-range missiles that were banned by a previous UN resolution.

But at this point, it hardly matters, since Bush is out of office and the war is fait accompli.

The more interesting tactic to me, is that so many right-wingers on here keep decrying any reference to Bush - who just left office this fracking year as if it's somehow no longer relevant.

Yah... just like we never heard anything blamed on Clinton once Bush took office....

 

[NYcarbineer]

I will give you that the dixiecrats became Republicans After Nixon, however it still does not change the fact that that Republicans have a long history of support for Civil rights issues and it's only been in the last 40 years that people seem to be under the impression that Republicans have little if anything to do with Civil Rights and excuse their own party's involvement in it.

The Republicans have become the old, white, Southerners party.

did your old black grandpa tell you that ???? im Gop and live in the north. along with other millions. that's prove's you are: a liar, no credibility AND A RACIST. bubba

Republicans hold about 3 out of 50 Congressional seats in the northeast.

 

[Claudette]

Yes indeedie. I gotta agree. The clowns in DC can't seem to see to see the writing thats all over the walls. They passed this peice of shit which nobody read. I just wonder how many surprises are in this 2,000 pages of shit????