How can Obama pick this person for the Supreme Court?

[Zona]

Absolutely. What idiot picks a dead person for a job? (Don't kid yourself 0bama wanted to pick Kennedy)

Ah, its mr. dont get it guy. Nice to meet you.

Oh I got it, just chose to ignore the stupid hypothetical.

Then I will make it simple enough for you to understand...NO MATTER WHO HE PICKED, YOU GUYS WOULD COMPLAIN. I will make it even a dumber down type thing for ya....if he picked Bush, you guys would complain. If he went into a room and came out three days later with a cure for cancer, you guys would complain.

Do you need links to everything you guys have said no too? You guys have said no to things you guys wrote, and if Obama said, yeah, that good, you immediatly say no to it.....that is just pathetic. Going against your own ideas because Obama said he liked it.

Sooner or later the not tea bagger republicans will see that just saying no to EVERYTHING Obama and not having any solutions to anything is just dumb. Same ol same ol, but dumb.

 

[Zona]

A "good" justice is one who knows the Constitution, is not caught in the "originalist" crap propaganda, and committed to the law.

That Originalist crap is what knowing and following the constitution means dumb-ass.

"Originalist" means going back to when it was written...you know, slavery, women being second class citizens etc.

You know, the good ol days. The original days! Yeah history!

 

[JakeStarkey]

A "good" justice is one who knows the Constitution, is not caught in the "originalist" crap propaganda, and committed to the law.

That Originalist crap is what knowing and following the constitution means dumb-ass.

I see that you have swallowed the kool-aid in one gulp.

"Originalism" is a meaningless concept.

 

[Intense]

Right wingers tell everyone how to live. What's "moral". Who has the "right" values. Who is going to "hell". Who is "good" and who is "evil". It's easy for them. They have a "Gawd" telling them. They don't need to rely on humanity and common sense.

So...your looking forward to Kagan being able to do all these same things I take it?

Liberals rarely cause the damage white wingers do. Roberts, Scalia, Thomas, these are dangerous men ruled by ideology.

What Ideology? What damage? Be Specific? What danger?

 

[Intense]

She is the Solicitor General, the top legal representation in the Supreme Court.

Ya all crazy, ya heah.

Yes, she will win ratification by 71 to 29 at the best, 64 to 36 at the worst, and she will be far better than Alito and potentially as good as Roberts.

What is a 'good' SCJ, in your opinion?

Leon Panetta.

 

[Intense]

A "good" justice is one who knows the Constitution, is not caught in the "originalist" crap propaganda, and committed to the law.

What exactly is that supposed to mean?

 

[Intense]

USAToday claims she's gonna show Tenacity...use a strong voice....as if she's gonna run roughshod over folks that run circles around her when it comes to legal knowledge.

I suggest she STFU and listen.

Let me guess, you'd do better.

She is qualified. I don't know enough about her opinions to know if I like her per se, but there's nothing wrong with her resume.

Look....first of all....a newbee has no business talking smack to people that have held the position for decades.

Second of all...it is her job to follow the law...not influence others to believe in your adverse beliefs.

The problem I have with anyone Obama selects is Obama....not the selection.

I don't trust his judgment. I also don't trust his motives...because he's such a snake and a liar that I really don't trust anything he does....so I don't trust this woman one bit.

He wouldn't have picked her if she wasn't like him. This political shifting of the court is a dangerous game that will have long-lasting effects....which makes who we put in the White House deadly serious even though some folks think it's a joke.

One of the things her supporters claim is that she's brilliant. Now a story is being floated that at least once she forgot to turn off her car when she got to work....she walked away from a running car and left it running all night.

Talk about having a huge Carbon-Footprint.

My problem is Obama and his lack of integrity.

 

[Intense]

Ah, its mr. dont get it guy. Nice to meet you.

Oh I got it, just chose to ignore the stupid hypothetical.

Then I will make it simple enough for you to understand...NO MATTER WHO HE PICKED, YOU GUYS WOULD COMPLAIN. I will make it even a dumber down type thing for ya....if he picked Bush, you guys would complain. If he went into a room and came out three days later with a cure for cancer, you guys would complain.

Do you need links to everything you guys have said no too? You guys have said no to things you guys wrote, and if Obama said, yeah, that good, you immediatly say no to it.....that is just pathetic. Going against your own ideas because Obama said he liked it.

Sooner or later the not tea bagger republicans will see that just saying no to EVERYTHING Obama and not having any solutions to anything is just dumb. Same ol same ol, but dumb.

Yeah right, Obama has been doing so well from the start, sock puppet heaven.

 

[Intense]

A "good" justice is one who knows the Constitution, is not caught in the "originalist" crap propaganda, and committed to the law.

That Originalist crap is what knowing and following the constitution means dumb-ass.

I see that you have swallowed the kool-aid in one gulp.

"Originalism" is a meaningless concept.

About as meaningless as "Rule Of Law".

 

[saveliberty]

Ah, its mr. dont get it guy. Nice to meet you.

Oh I got it, just chose to ignore the stupid hypothetical.

Then I will make it simple enough for you to understand...NO MATTER WHO HE PICKED, YOU GUYS WOULD COMPLAIN. I will make it even a dumber down type thing for ya....if he picked Bush, you guys would complain. If he went into a room and came out three days later with a cure for cancer, you guys would complain.

Do you need links to everything you guys have said no too? You guys have said no to things you guys wrote, and if Obama said, yeah, that good, you immediatly say no to it.....that is just pathetic. Going against your own ideas because Obama said he liked it.

Sooner or later the not tea bagger republicans will see that just saying no to EVERYTHING Obama and not having any solutions to anything is just dumb. Same ol same ol, but dumb.

That fails. There are many qualified people I would approve of. In fact, I'm not 100% against Kagan. Alberto R. Gonzales, Gregg Abbott, Henry McMaster, Judd Gregg and Sam Brownback might be some good choices.

 

[JakeStarkey]

That Originalist crap is what knowing and following the constitution means dumb-ass.

I see that you have swallowed the kool-aid in one gulp.

"Originalism" is a meaningless concept.

About as meaningless as "Rule Of Law".

"Originalism" is a meaningless term. The "Rule of Law" is not of course meaningless.

 

[Defiant1]

Ah, its mr. dont get it guy. Nice to meet you.

Oh I got it, just chose to ignore the stupid hypothetical.

Then I will make it simple enough for you to understand...NO MATTER WHO HE PICKED, YOU GUYS WOULD COMPLAIN. I will make it even a dumber down type thing for ya....if he picked Bush, you guys would complain. If he went into a room and came out three days later with a cure for cancer, you guys would complain.

Do you need links to everything you guys have said no too? You guys have said no to things you guys wrote, and if Obama said, yeah, that good, you immediatly say no to it.....that is just pathetic. Going against your own ideas because Obama said he liked it.

Sooner or later the not tea bagger republicans will see that just saying no to EVERYTHING Obama and not having any solutions to anything is just dumb. Same ol same ol, but dumb.

I wouldn't complain if he nominated Miguel Estrada.

 

[JBeukema]

The problem I have with anyone Obama selects is Obama....not the selection.

There you have it, people: there's no valid complaint against Kagan- they're just still mad about losing to the black guy.

He wouldn't have picked her if she wasn't like him.

\

Are you saying Kagan is a communist NAZI voodoo priestess from Kenya?

One of the things her supporters claim is that she's brilliant. Now a story is being floated that at least once she forgot to turn off her car when she got to work....she walked away from a running car and left it running all night.

I'm sure you've never had a brain fart or been worn out after a long day and done something stupid

 

[JakeStarkey]

If this is best the 'whistle can pipe, then no story exists.

 

[Mr. Shaman]

Why Obama is picking this new person to be on the supreme court is beyond me. Doesn't anyone see the conflict of interest of having a member of the prosecuting team be on the supreme court. Every case that is going to be argued will have a supreme court justice that has sympathies for the prosecuting team. This would not be a fair and balanced jury in any case.

Shouldn't your name be imwhiningbecausehewon?????



You really are gonna have to get-over his Health Care VICTORY.

​

 

[Mr. Shaman]

The problem I have with anyone Obama selects is Obama....not the selection.

There you have it, people: there's no valid complaint against Kagan- they're just still mad about losing to the black guy.

That's ol' mudwhistle, alright.

He used to be regularly-jettisoned from the Bill Maher forum, due to his bigotry.​

 

[JakeStarkey]

What a bunch of whiners! Some are just sore losers! Others are racist haters. And none of them realize that the rest of the country keeps laughing at folks like them. The same 30% supporting Bush are the same group hating Obama. So: they will lose again this fall. Yah thunk they'd lurn.

 

[Rinata]

Why Obama is picking this new person to be on the supreme court is beyond me. Doesn't anyone see the conflict of interest of having a member of the prosecuting team be on the supreme court. Every case that is going to be argued will have a supreme court justice that has sympathies for the prosecuting team. This would not be a fair and balanced jury in any case.

And whom should he have picked that would have made you happy??? The person hasn't been born, so just admit it and put a sock in it.

 

[Intense]

I see that you have swallowed the kool-aid in one gulp.

"Originalism" is a meaningless concept.

About as meaningless as "Rule Of Law".

"Originalism" is a meaningless term. The "Rule of Law" is not of course meaningless.

Theories of Constitutional Interpretation
The issue: What are appropriate sources of authority to guide interpretation of the Constitution and what relative weight should be assigned to the various appropriate sources?
Eight Reasons to be an Originalist
1. Originalism reduces the likelihood that unelected judges will seize the reigns of power from elected representatives.
2. Originalism in the long run better preserves the authority of the Court.
3. Non-originalism allows too much room for judges to impose their own subjective and elitist values. Judges need neutral, objective criteria to make legitimate decisions. The understanding of the framers and ratifiers of a constitutional clause provide those neutral criteria.
4. Lochner vs. New York (widely considered to be a bad non-originalist decision).
5. Leaving it to the people to amend their Constitution when need be promotes serious public debate about government and its limitations.
6. Originalism better respects the notion of the Constitution as a binding contract.
7. If a constitutional amendment passed today, we would expect a court five years from now to ask what we intended to adopt. [Can the same be said for a court 100 or 200 years from now?]
8. Originalism more often forces legislatures to reconsider and possibly repeal or amend their own bad laws, rather than to leave it to the courts to get rid of them.


.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

.. Examples of Originalist Judges
Justice Hugo Black
Justice Antonin Scalia
Justice Clarence Thomas
Judge Robert Bork


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

An Example of an Originalist Opinion:
Marsh vs Chambers
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Robert Bork
Robert Bork Making the Case for Originalism:

If the Constitution is law, then presumably its meaning, like that of all other law, is the meaning the lawmakers were understood to have intended. If the Constitution is law, then presumably, like all other law, the meaning the lawmakers intended is as binding upon judges as it is upon legislatures and executives. There is no other sense in which the Constitution can be what article VI proclaims it to be: "Law...." This means, of course, that a judge, no matter on what court he sits, may never create new constitutional rights or destroy old ones. Any time he does so, he violates not only the limits to his own authority but, and for that reason, also violates the rights of the legislature and the people....the philosophy of original understanding is thus a necessary inference from the structure of government apparent on the face of the Constitution.



Introduction
There are five sources that have guided interpretation of the Constitution: (1) the text and structure of the Constitution, (2) intentions of those who drafted, voted to propose, or voted to ratify the provision in question, (3) prior precedents (usually judicial), (4) the social, political, and economic consequences of alternative interpretations, and (5) natural law. There is general agreement that the first three of these sources are appropriate guides to interpretation, but considerable disagreement as to the relative weight that should be given to the three sources when they point in different directions. Many interpreters of the Constitution have suggested that the consequences of alternative interpretations are never relevant, even when all other considerations are evenly balanced. Natural law (higher law, God's law) is now only infrequently suggested as an interpretive guide, even though many of the framers of the Constitution recognized its appropriateness. Persons who favor heavy reliance on originalist sources (text and intentions) are commonly called "originalists." Persons who favor giving a more substantial weighting to precedent, consequences, or natural law are called "non-originalists." In practice, disagreement between originalists and non-originalists often concerns whether to apply heightened judicial scrutiny to certain "fundamental rights" that are not explicitly protected in the text of the Constitution.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Definitions
Textualist: An originalist who gives primary weight to the text and structure of the Constitution. Textualists often are skeptical of the ability of judges to determine collective "intent."

Intentionalist: An originalist who gives primary weight to the intentions of framers, members of proposing bodies, and ratifiers.

Pragmatist: A non-originalist who gives substantial weight to judicial precedent or the consequences of alternative interpretations, so as to sometimes favor a decision "wrong" on originalist terms because it promotes stability or in some other way promotes the public good.

Natural Law Theorist: A person who believes that higher moral law ought to trump inconsistent positive law.



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Prof's Prerogative
Any theory of constitutional theory that completely ignores consequences and focuses exclusively on text
or original intentions is wrong.
.
Any theory of constitutional interpretation that completely ignores either text or original intentions and
focuses primarily on consequences is wrong.
.
Certain times and places are better suited to one theory of constitutional interpretation than are other
times and places.
.
The Court should include justices with different approaches to constitutional interpretation. A Court
without dissenters is a Court that will not adequately inform us of the costs of choosing
the path taken.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
TWO SOCIETIES, TWO VIEWS
OF THE CONSTITUTION

American Constitution Society

The Federalist Society

Eight Reasons to be a Non-Originalist
1. The framers at the Convention in Philadelphia indicated that they did not want their specific intentions to control interpretation.
2. No written Constitution can anticipate all the means that government might in the future use to oppress people, so it is sometimes necessary for judges to fill in the gaps.
3. Intentions of framers are various, sometimes transient, and often impossible to determine. Text is often ambiguous and judicial precedents can be found to support either side. In such cases, why not produce the result that will best promote the public good? It's better than flipping a coin.
4. Non-originalism allows judges to head off the crises that could result from the inflexible interpretation of a provision in the Constitution that no longer serves its original purpose. (The amendment process is too difficult and cannot be relied upon to save us.)
5. Non-originalism allows the Constitution to evolve to match more enlightened understandings on matters such as the equal treatment of blacks, women, and other minorities.
6. Brown vs Board of Education (on originalist grounds, it was decided incorrectly).
7. Originalists lose sight of the forest because they pay too much attention to trees. The larger purpose--the animating spirit--of the Constitution was the protection of liberty, and we ought to focus on that.
8. Nazi Germany: Originalist German judges did not exercise the power they might have to prevent or slow down inhumane programs.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Examples of Non-Originalist Judges
Justice Harry Blackmun
Justice William Brennan
Justice William O. Douglas
Judge Richard Posner

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

An Example of a Non-Originalist Opinion:
Griswold vs. Connecticut

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Richard A. Posner
Judge Richard Posner on the Importance of Judicial Gap-Filling:

A constitution that did not invalidate so offensive, oppressive, probably undemocratic, and sectarian law [as the Connecticut law banning the use or distribution of contraceptives] would stand revealed as containing major gaps. Maybe that is the nature of our, or perhaps any, written Constitution; but yet, perhaps the courts are authorized to plug at least the most glaring gaps. Does anyone really believe, in his heart of hearts, that the Constitution should be interpreted so literally as to authorize every conceivable law that would not violate a specific constitutional clause? This would mean that a state could require everyone to marry, or to have intercourse at least once a month, or it could take away every couple's second child and place it in a foster home....We find it reassuring to think that the courts stand between us and legislative tyranny even if a particular form of tyranny was not foreseen and expressly forbidden by framers of the Constitution.



Further Reading

For another view: Strict Constructionism and the Strike Zone (1987, by Doug Linder)

Theories of Constitutional Interpretation

 

[saveliberty]

Why Obama is picking this new person to be on the supreme court is beyond me. Doesn't anyone see the conflict of interest of having a member of the prosecuting team be on the supreme court. Every case that is going to be argued will have a supreme court justice that has sympathies for the prosecuting team. This would not be a fair and balanced jury in any case.

And whom should he have picked that would have made you happy??? The person hasn't been born, so just admit it and put a sock in it.

I made a list of possibles in post #90.