Health Care - we gotta fix this shit...

[debbiedowner]

Trump’s Drug Pricing Czar Found With ‘Multiple Blunt Force Injuries,’ Ruled Suicide

 

[dblack]

Why? Did you want government regulating our food spending next?

Perhaps you didn't understand the question?

Meds or food. What do you choose?

Purple. What's your fucking point?

It seems that this discussion is a tad above your pay grade.

So, no point. Just distraction. Thanks.

Yea...go with that. At least you didn't opt for a color this time. Maybe the next door neighbor's kid can explain this segment to you?

Don't like it much when your bluff is called? You pose a ridiculous dilemma expecting an answer?? You clearly don't expect to be taken seriously.

 

[Howard Roark]

Don't like it much when your bluff is called? You pose a ridiculous dilemma expecting an answer?? You clearly don't expect to be taken seriously.

If you think being forced to choose between buying necessary meds, and buying food is ridiculous, then you aren't qualified to remain in this discussion.

 

[dblack]

Don't like it much when your bluff is called? You pose a ridiculous dilemma expecting an answer?? You clearly don't expect to be taken seriously.

If you think being forced to choose between buying necessary meds, and buying food is ridiculous, then you aren't qualified to remain in this discussion.

Your fantasy scenario has jack squat to do with regulating health care spending.

 

[Howard Roark]

Trump’s Drug Pricing Czar Found With ‘Multiple Blunt Force Injuries,’ Ruled Suicide

That's a little odd. 'Multiple blunt force injuries'? And they believe he did it himself? Maybe he chose to dive down a flight of stairs?

 

[Howard Roark]

Your fantasy scenario has jack squat to do with regulating health care spending.

On the contrary. Your idiotic claim that everyone should 'regulate' their own healthcare spending begs the question:

Meds, or food? What do you choose?

Or do you opt for meaningless rhetoric whenever you don't like the way the discussion is going?

 

[dblack]

Your fantasy scenario has jack squat to do with regulating health care spending.

On the contrary. Your idiotic claim that everyone should 'regulate' their own healthcare spending begs the question:

Meds, or food? What do you choose?

How??? You're going to have to actually make an argument if you expect me to respond to it. You can't just spout random, leading questions as if they mean something. Are you taking notes from Fox News?

 

[Howard Roark]

How??? You're going to have to actually make an argument if you expect me to respond to it. You can't just spout random, leading questions as if they mean something. Are you taking notes from Fox News?

Hmm...so you spout random idiotic statements about 'regulating your own healthcare spending', but don't expect to be questioned about the viability of the nonsense?

Your problem is that you are looking for arguments where they don't exist.

 

[dblack]

How??? You're going to have to actually make an argument if you expect me to respond to it. You can't just spout random, leading questions as if they mean something. Are you taking notes from Fox News?

Hmm...so you spout random idiotic statements about 'regulating your own healthcare spending', but don't expect to be questioned about the viability of the nonsense?

Your problem is that you are looking for arguments where they don't exist.

Heh.. apparently.

 

[Flopper]

Someone has to regulate healthcare spending, that is what medical procedures will be covered.

Why? Why can't you regulate your healthcare spending and I regulate mine? Why the presumption of centralized, authoritarian control of every. god. damned. thing?

How can you regulate your healthcare spending? Sure you can regulate day to day healthcare cost such as yearly physicals, going to doctor with minor health issues, preventive care, and such. But that is not where our major health cost are. If you are struck down by an illness or injury and find yourself in ICU, are you going to research medical procedures and costs and determine which are the most cost effective procedures. I think not. People that think they can control medical costs don't realize how complex the system is nor their limited ability to understand the costs and benefits or various healthcare procedures.

If you go into the hospital today and it's determined you need open heart surgery, it is very unlikely you will be able to get any estimate of what the total bill might be. Yes, your surgeon will be able to give you his fee for the procedure and hospital can give you the cost per day of a room but that's not going be even close to the total cost. The reason is the cost could be 50 thousand or 500 thousand depending on how you respond and what type of treatment you will need. You simple can not regulate your cost because the total cost depends on how a patient responds to treatment and what is discovered during treatment.

 

[dblack]

You simple can not regulate your cost.

I can certainly "regulate" my spending. I don't need, nor want, "we-know-better" busybodies telling me that I'm doing it wrong.

 

[Flopper]

You simple can not regulate your cost.

I can certainly "regulate" my spending. I don't need, nor want, "we-know-better" busybodies telling me that I'm doing it wrong.

It would be interesting to see just exactly how you would do that if you went to an emergency room complaining of extreme pain, swelling, and blisters on your leg. A few tests lead to a diagnosis of necrotizing fasciitis, fleshing eating bacteria. It requires immediate medical attention in the hospital. I had a relative die with this. Over a two week period in the ICU, there were 3 operations, two amputations, 12 doctors involve. The total cost was over $450,000. There were 257 page of medical records, dozens of procedures.

 

[dblack]

It would be interesting to see just exactly how you would do that

It might interesting, but it's none of your business. I think that's the part you really don't get.

 

[Flopper]

It would be interesting to see just exactly how you would do that

It might interesting, but it's none of your business. I think that's the part you really don't get.

In other words, you have no idea how you would go about regulating healthcare costs.

 

[dblack]

It would be interesting to see just exactly how you would do that

It might interesting, but it's none of your business. I think that's the part you really don't get.

In other words, you have no idea how you would go about regulating healthcare costs.

No, I reject your presumption that government should have the power to "regulate" how I spend money on health care.

 

[Howard Roark]

How can you regulate your healthcare spending? Sure you can regulate day to day healthcare cost such as yearly physicals, going to doctor with minor health issues, preventive care, and such. But that is not where our major health cost are. If you are struck down by an illness or injury and find yourself in ICU, are you going to research medical procedures and costs and determine which are the most cost effective procedures. I think not. People that think they can control medical costs don't realize how complex the system is nor their limited ability to understand the costs and benefits or various healthcare procedures.

If you go into the hospital today and it's determined you need open heart surgery, it is very unlikely you will be able to get any estimate of what the total bill might be. Yes, your surgeon will be able to give you his fee for the procedure and hospital can give you the cost per day of a room but that's not going be even close to the total cost. The reason is the cost could be 50 thousand or 500 thousand depending on how you respond and what type of treatment you will need. You simple can not regulate your cost because the total cost depends on how a patient responds to treatment and what is discovered during treatment.

Whereas you make a valid point, your scenario takes the issue to the extreme. Millions of people are experiencing a problem with ability to afford their medications. Having no control over rising costs, or the lack of regulation of same, makes it impossible to 'regulate your own healthcare spending'

To claim otherwise is just plain foolish. Especially given that the argument is that you can opt to use/not use services that aren't even subject to govt. regulation.

Far and away, medications are the driving force behind the inability to afford insurance, and proper healthcare.

 

[joaquinmiller]

Someone has to regulate healthcare spending, that is what medical procedures will be covered.

Why? Why can't you regulate your healthcare spending and I regulate mine? Why the presumption of centralized, authoritarian control of every. god. damned. thing?

Because you (maybe) have an abdominal aortic aneurysm that hasn't been found yet, and the shunt from your arm to your legs to replace that aorta and keep you alive, is going to cost a quarter-of-a-million dollars, including the hospital stay.

Not in the budget? Oh, man, we'll miss you.

 

[dblack]

Someone has to regulate healthcare spending, that is what medical procedures will be covered.

Why? Why can't you regulate your healthcare spending and I regulate mine? Why the presumption of centralized, authoritarian control of every. god. damned. thing?

Because you (maybe) have an abdominal aortic aneurysm that hasn't been found yet, and the shunt from your arm to your legs to replace that aorta and keep you alive, is going to cost a quarter-of-a-million dollars, including the hospital stay.

Not in the budget? Oh, man, we'll miss you.

So what? That's not a reason to dictate how people pay for their healthcare. Why can't you accept the fact that other people have different ideas about how to deal with risk? Why must you force your preferences on others? Why can't you deal with your health care expenses and I'll deal with mine?

 

[joaquinmiller]

Someone has to regulate healthcare spending, that is what medical procedures will be covered.

Why? Why can't you regulate your healthcare spending and I regulate mine? Why the presumption of centralized, authoritarian control of every. god. damned. thing?

Because you (maybe) have an abdominal aortic aneurysm that hasn't been found yet, and the shunt from your arm to your legs to replace that aorta and keep you alive, is going to cost a quarter-of-a-million dollars, including the hospital stay.

Not in the budget? Oh, man, we'll miss you.

So what? That's not a reason to dictate how people pay for their healthcare. Why can't you accept the fact that other people have different ideas about how to deal with risk? Why must you force your preferences on others? Why can't you deal with your health care expenses and I'll deal with mine?

It's infantile to think healthcare is the same as every other market-based good. There frequently is no "substitute good". Specialties are not fungible. There is an inequality of information in which the patient/decider is the least knowledgeable person in the room. (Then the patient's decision is sometimes subject to insurance company review and reversal.)

BTW, the hypothetical abdominal aortic aneurysm may be a genetic trait and an unknown pre-existing condition. I'm leery of anyone thinking they can adequately prepare for the unknown, particularly in a situation which brings them face-to-face with their instinct for survival.

 

[dblack]

It's infantile to think healthcare is the same as every other market-based good. There frequently is no "substitute good". Specialties are not fungible. There is an inequality of information in which the patient/decider is the least knowledgeable person in the room. (Then the patient's decision is sometimes subject to insurance company review and reversal.)

BTW, the hypothetical abdominal aortic aneurysm may be a genetic trait and an unknown pre-existing condition. I'm leery of anyone thinking they can adequately prepare for the unknown, particularly in a situation which brings them face-to-face with their instinct for survival.

None of this has any bearing on the core issue: why do you feel justified in forcing you preferences on others? You can be "leery" about my choices all you want, but it's really none of your business. You make your choices, I'll make mine. Fair enough?