Hate crime?

[Sky Dancer]

Then hate crime legislation is unnecessary.

So sez you. Not likely to be a victim of such, are you?

My daughters boyfriend was driving somewhere last night, forget what backwater it was, but there was a sign at a rest stop the boys were going to stop at: "Whites only"

They didn't stop, they were afraid to. Two young kids on the road alone.

That shouldn't be in today's America. They shouldn't have anything more to fear besides the random serial killer or violence any of us might deal with. Instead, they have so much more to avoid.

THAT infringes on their rights, and THAT is just one example of what makes this legislation not only NECESSARY, but important, not to "punish free speech" (whatta crock), but to protect others from infringements on their constitutional rights, because your right to do anything ends where it impinges mine to breathe free.

you'll excuse me for not believing this little anecdote.

You're implying this poster is lying?

 

[KittenKoder]

Here, point to one actual prejudiced thing, anywhere, that is REAL, not doctored or hyped in any way, from after 2000 that was widely supported by the public, then maybe I will consider the possibility of a problem existing. Until then, I just don't see it. But here's the thing, for every one against one side I can guarantee that I will find one on the other.

 

[KittenKoder]

So sez you. Not likely to be a victim of such, are you?

My daughters boyfriend was driving somewhere last night, forget what backwater it was, but there was a sign at a rest stop the boys were going to stop at: "Whites only"

They didn't stop, they were afraid to. Two young kids on the road alone.

That shouldn't be in today's America. They shouldn't have anything more to fear besides the random serial killer or violence any of us might deal with. Instead, they have so much more to avoid.

THAT infringes on their rights, and THAT is just one example of what makes this legislation not only NECESSARY, but important, not to "punish free speech" (whatta crock), but to protect others from infringements on their constitutional rights, because your right to do anything ends where it impinges mine to breathe free.

you'll excuse me for not believing this little anecdote.

You're calling this poster a liar?

The "forget what backwater" is pretty much a give away.

 

[catzmeow]

You're implying this poster is lying?

I think his post was fairly clear.

 

[del]

So sez you. Not likely to be a victim of such, are you?

My daughters boyfriend was driving somewhere last night, forget what backwater it was, but there was a sign at a rest stop the boys were going to stop at: "Whites only"

They didn't stop, they were afraid to. Two young kids on the road alone.

That shouldn't be in today's America. They shouldn't have anything more to fear besides the random serial killer or violence any of us might deal with. Instead, they have so much more to avoid.

THAT infringes on their rights, and THAT is just one example of what makes this legislation not only NECESSARY, but important, not to "punish free speech" (whatta crock), but to protect others from infringements on their constitutional rights, because your right to do anything ends where it impinges mine to breathe free.

you'll excuse me for not believing this little anecdote.

You're implying this poster is lying?

can't fool you for long, huh?

 

[catzmeow]

The "forget what backwater" is pretty much a give away.

Don't forget the "happened last night" part. How convenient that it happened RIGHT BEFORE Barb breathlessly entered this discussion.

 

[Sky Dancer]

The question should be, is hate a crime?

Hate is not a crime. Violence motivated by hatred to a targeted group in order to intimidate others is hate crime.

It's the actions and the effects on not only the victim but the entire group that the perpetrator has targeted for violence that makes it a hate crim.

Actions are conscionable.

Key point. The KKK and skinheads targeted the black community in Portland for violence. Mulageta Seraw was murdered. Skinheads went into a black neighborhood and beat this ethiopian immigrant to death.

The entire community was affected. I know, because I lived near where the murder occurred.

The skinheads were members of the Aryan Resistaance, a hate group started by Tom Metzger, a former grand wizard of the KKK.

However, how many people truly fear these morons who commit the atrocities? Is there some huge hidden portion of the population that is hiding out in fear all the time? What I see is when such a crime is committed more people stand up and fight back now than ever, even those targeted. It's makes more of a message when the public stands up like that than to just tack on a few more years of thousands in bail (life is life, you can't make it longer).

Why not ask people if they feel intimidated when they hear about hate crime and happen to be a member of the minority group.

Matthew Shephard's murder affected the gay community deeply. It also offended every American who despises bias motivated crime.

You are right that there is always a silver lining in a cloud. Matthew Shephard did not intend to be a civil rights martyr. These movements are always interdependent.

The gay civil rights movement benefited from the murder of Harvey Milk. If Dan White had murdered Harvey and Mayor Moscone now, you can bet he would have had a stiffer sentence. He only served five years in prison for his hate motivated double assassination.

 

[Barb]

Then hate crime legislation is unnecessary.

So sez you. Not likely to be a victim of such, are you?

My daughters boyfriend was driving somewhere last night, forget what backwater it was, but there was a sign at a rest stop the boys were going to stop at: "Whites only"

They didn't stop, they were afraid to. Two young kids on the road alone.

That shouldn't be in today's America. They shouldn't have anything more to fear besides the random serial killer or violence any of us might deal with. Instead, they have so much more to avoid.

THAT infringes on their rights, and THAT is just one example of what makes this legislation not only NECESSARY, but important, not to "punish free speech" (whatta crock), but to protect others from infringements on their constitutional rights, because your right to do anything ends where it impinges mine to breathe free.

you'll excuse me for not believing this little anecdote.

What have I ever said here to make you assume I'm a liar? My daughter is black, her boyfriend and the other kid he was driving with is also.

I suppose you don't think traffic stops are a whole different experience either. They are, I've seen them from both ends:
(blond, blue eyes, alone in the car:maam, did you know hour left headlight's out? Get that fixed, ok?)
(same mom, with family:two cop cars, flashlights, demands for ID [my daughter was 15] where were you going and where have you been, 20 minutes on the side of the road, and a ticket).

So listen Del, especially if your avatar is your picture and you really don't have the first clue, don't call me a liar. Its ignorant, and I hate that shit.

 

[catzmeow]

Why not ask people if they feel intimidated when they hear about hate crime and happen to be a member of the minority group.

That's part of the problem. Gay people are far more likely to be victims of DOMESTIC VIOLENCE assaults committed by another gay person than they are to be a victim of a hate crime. African Americans are a hundred thousand times more likely to be killed by another African American than to be targeted by some crazy white supremacist.

THAT IS THE REALITY OF THE WORLD WE LIVE IN.

Hate crime legislation presupposes that other races are the problems, and serves as a distraction from the REAL problems.

Hate crime legislation actually EXACERBATES racial and gender violence by sending the message that we are enemies.

The fact is that crime and violence are far more complex than many of us would like to believe. It's easy to believe in an imaginary bogeyman who is responsible for our problems and our fear. it's hard to deal with the problem in our own home/neighborhood.

 

[del]

So sez you. Not likely to be a victim of such, are you?

My daughters boyfriend was driving somewhere last night, forget what backwater it was, but there was a sign at a rest stop the boys were going to stop at: "Whites only"

They didn't stop, they were afraid to. Two young kids on the road alone.

That shouldn't be in today's America. They shouldn't have anything more to fear besides the random serial killer or violence any of us might deal with. Instead, they have so much more to avoid.

THAT infringes on their rights, and THAT is just one example of what makes this legislation not only NECESSARY, but important, not to "punish free speech" (whatta crock), but to protect others from infringements on their constitutional rights, because your right to do anything ends where it impinges mine to breathe free.

you'll excuse me for not believing this little anecdote.

What have I ever said here to make you assume I'm a liar? My daughter is black, her boyfriend and the other kid he was driving with is also.

I suppose you don't think traffic stops are a whole different experience either. They are, I've seen them from both ends:
(blond, blue eyes, alone in the car:maam, did you know hour left headlight's out? Get that fixed, ok?)
(same mom, with family:two cop cars, flashlights, demands for ID [my daughter was 15] where were you going and where have you been, 20 minutes on the side of the road, and a ticket).

So listen Del, especially if your avatar is your picture and you really don't have the first clue, don't call me a liar. Its ignorant, and I hate that shit.

tough break for you.

i don't believe you. get over it.

and, no, that's not me in my avitar.

 

[KittenKoder]

The "forget what backwater" is pretty much a give away.

Don't forget the "happened last night" part. How convenient that it happened RIGHT BEFORE Barb breathlessly entered this discussion.

That's the connection I was making.

 

[Barb]

The "forget what backwater" is pretty much a give away.

Don't forget the "happened last night" part. How convenient that it happened RIGHT BEFORE Barb breathlessly entered this discussion.

It happened "right before" I went to WORK last night, they were on the phone. You know what though? You aren't worth the time to explain anything to. This is a sad little place, and you're sad little people.

 

[del]

The "forget what backwater" is pretty much a give away.

Don't forget the "happened last night" part. How convenient that it happened RIGHT BEFORE Barb breathlessly entered this discussion.

It happened "right before" I went to WORK last night, they were on the phone. You know what though? You aren't worth the time to explain anything to. This is a sad little place, and you're sad little people.

oooh. that stung.

 

[catzmeow]

What have I ever said here to make you assume I'm a liar? My daughter is black, her boyfriend and the other kid he was driving with is also.

Please feel free to provide the name of the business and the location....


to your state State Attorney General's office.

This experience does not relate to the topic of this thread, and thankfully, there are already statutes in place to address these types of events.

72. Most states have state civil rights or human rights commissions or offices that administer and enforce state laws prohibiting discrimination in areas such as employment, education, housing, and access to public accommodations. These offices generally investigate complaints and ensure, where appropriate, that charges are filed and cases are heard. They generally also have advisory and educational functions, informing residents of the state about enforcement of their civil rights. The few states that do not have designated civil rights or human rights offices or commissions administer their civil rights laws through their Attorney General’s Offices.

I've seen this occur within 50 miles of the town where I live, and I also saw our state Attorney General file charges against the restaurant/bar where it occurred.

 

[Sky Dancer]

The "forget what backwater" is pretty much a give away.

Don't forget the "happened last night" part. How convenient that it happened RIGHT BEFORE Barb breathlessly entered this discussion.

It happened "right before" I went to WORK last night, they were on the phone. You know what though? You aren't worth the time to explain anything to. This is a sad little place, and you're sad little people.

Barb--

You just happened to run into a few 'sad, little people'. It's not the forum. It's the times we live in. Just stick to your guns and enjoy this interesting topic.
Thanks for telling the story. What state had the sign 'whites only' posted?

 

[catzmeow]

It happened "right before" I went to WORK last night, they were on the phone.

If you say it in all caps, i'll definitely believe you.

You know what though? You aren't worth the time to explain anything to. This is a sad little place, and you're sad little people.

Translation: I can't prove my claims and I've been called publicly on my bullshit.

 

[KittenKoder]

The "forget what backwater" is pretty much a give away.

Don't forget the "happened last night" part. How convenient that it happened RIGHT BEFORE Barb breathlessly entered this discussion.

It happened "right before" I went to WORK last night, they were on the phone. You know what though? You aren't worth the time to explain anything to. This is a sad little place, and you're sad little people.

... and yet you "forget the backwater" town? You're allowed to work with that kind of memory? I hope it's not brain surgery, might get the hands and feet rewired by you.

 

[Tech_Esq]

So sez you. Not likely to be a victim of such, are you?

My daughters boyfriend was driving somewhere last night, forget what backwater it was, but there was a sign at a rest stop the boys were going to stop at: "Whites only"

They didn't stop, they were afraid to. Two young kids on the road alone.

That shouldn't be in today's America. They shouldn't have anything more to fear besides the random serial killer or violence any of us might deal with. Instead, they have so much more to avoid.

THAT infringes on their rights, and THAT is just one example of what makes this legislation not only NECESSARY, but important, not to "punish free speech" (whatta crock), but to protect others from infringements on their constitutional rights, because your right to do anything ends where it impinges mine to breathe free.

you'll excuse me for not believing this little anecdote.

What have I ever said here to make you assume I'm a liar? My daughter is black, her boyfriend and the other kid he was driving with is also.

I suppose you don't think traffic stops are a whole different experience either. They are, I've seen them from both ends:
(blond, blue eyes, alone in the car:maam, did you know hour left headlight's out? Get that fixed, ok?)
(same mom, with family:two cop cars, flashlights, demands for ID [my daughter was 15] where were you going and where have you been, 20 minutes on the side of the road, and a ticket).

So listen Del, especially if your avatar is your picture and you really don't have the first clue, don't call me a liar. Its ignorant, and I hate that shit.

Guess what? I'm afraid to go to Anacostia too. I'm not sure if there's a sign somewhere that says African-Americans only, but I'm not likely too walk around trying to find out.

This violates my "freedom to travel" please tell me to whom I appeal for redress of this grievance? Shall we prosecute the violent violators as perpetrators of hate crimes should the recipient of the beatings or bullets be white? Is that really what you are asking for?

 

[KittenKoder]

you'll excuse me for not believing this little anecdote.

What have I ever said here to make you assume I'm a liar? My daughter is black, her boyfriend and the other kid he was driving with is also.

I suppose you don't think traffic stops are a whole different experience either. They are, I've seen them from both ends:
(blond, blue eyes, alone in the car:maam, did you know hour left headlight's out? Get that fixed, ok?)
(same mom, with family:two cop cars, flashlights, demands for ID [my daughter was 15] where were you going and where have you been, 20 minutes on the side of the road, and a ticket).

So listen Del, especially if your avatar is your picture and you really don't have the first clue, don't call me a liar. Its ignorant, and I hate that shit.

Guess what? I'm afraid to go to Anacostia too. I'm not sure if there's a sign somewhere that says African-Americans only, but I'm not likely too walk around trying to find out.

This violates my "freedom to travel" please tell me to whom I appeal for redress of this grievance? Shall we prosecute the violent violators as perpetrators of hate crimes should the recipient of the beatings or bullets be white? Is that really what you are asking for?

I'm afraid of Western Indianapolis, lived there for a bit, worked there, and got no raise because I was white .... I should sue!

Meh, I just moved to a more "comfortable" area instead.

 

[catzmeow]

Barb--

You just happened to run into a few 'sad, little people'. It's not the forum. It's the times we live in. Just stick to your guns and enjoy this interesting topic.
Thanks for telling the story. What state had the sign 'whites only' posted?

Translation: Facts aren't necessary as long as you feed my paradigm.