"Good kid with a gun fatally shoots 9 month old"

[Yurt]

great, then compared by the hour of use, nukes pose less risk than cars using your logic

How many times have nukes been used?

How else can you compare something used daily by most people to something most people will never need to use? The death count shouldn't be at all close.

like i said, you believe nukes are less dangerous than cars based on hours of use.

such logic is absurd.

and obviously people use guns to defend themselves on a daily basis. again, your logic is absurd.

No it is not. When was the last time a nuke was used? I would be more worried about being shot or in a car accident than being nuked.

Most people won't use a gun for defense daily, but most do use a car. Most people won't ever use a gun for defense.

the issue is not worry, rather the DANGER and DEATH amount posed. it doesn't matter if most people don't use it, that is wholly irrelevant. most people won't use nukes either. yet, we can agree that a nuke is far more devastating than either a gun or a car.

you guys claim to care about the deaths, yet you don't give a shit about auto deaths.

Nukes have more potential, but cars and guns are killing way more people. If nukes aren't being used then cars and guns are bringing way more death.

It's not a matter of don't care, but it needs to be a fair comparison. Of course cars kill more than guns, they are used far more. And we do a lot to make them safer.

oh ok, well, since scooters are used less than cars......

 

[Brain357]

How many times have nukes been used?

How else can you compare something used daily by most people to something most people will never need to use? The death count shouldn't be at all close.

like i said, you believe nukes are less dangerous than cars based on hours of use.

such logic is absurd.

and obviously people use guns to defend themselves on a daily basis. again, your logic is absurd.

No it is not. When was the last time a nuke was used? I would be more worried about being shot or in a car accident than being nuked.

Most people won't use a gun for defense daily, but most do use a car. Most people won't ever use a gun for defense.

the issue is not worry, rather the DANGER and DEATH amount posed. it doesn't matter if most people don't use it, that is wholly irrelevant. most people won't use nukes either. yet, we can agree that a nuke is far more devastating than either a gun or a car.

you guys claim to care about the deaths, yet you don't give a shit about auto deaths.

Nukes have more potential, but cars and guns are killing way more people. If nukes aren't being used then cars and guns are bringing way more death.

It's not a matter of don't care, but it needs to be a fair comparison. Of course cars kill more than guns, they are used far more. And we do a lot to make them safer.

oh ok, well, since scooters are used less than cars......

They also go slow compared to cars.

 

[Brain357]

230.....we'll go with that number....which shows that with over 40 million gun owners, 11.1 million concealed carry permit holders and 1.6 million defensive gun uses each year on average.....only 230 times have law abiding citizens been forced to use their guns to kill their attackers....which shows the incredible restraint, and control of regular citizens in the face of violent, aggressive criminal attack....

600 accidental deaths.....in a country of over 310 million people......tragic, each one, but a tiny, tiny number....and as more people have bought, own and carried guns....the gun murder rate has gone down, not up, and the gun accident rate has gone down, not up......

So about 3x more innocent people are accidently killed than criminals are intentionally killed. That's what I was saying.

So.....600 accidents out of over 310 million people.....really?

And as to 230....again....one of the primary memes of the irrational anti gunners is that regular, law abiding citizens cannot control guns in a self defense situation....that they will be unable to use the gun, or they will be irrational and just start shooting uncontrollably.....this number shows that under the extreme stress of a surprise, violent criminal attack....gun owners, some carrying the guns in public, only kill when they are absolutely required to to save their lives......this number should be praised, not condemned.....

And it shows there are far less defenses by the law abiding than you claim.

No....it just shows that they only have to kill 230 criminals...the rest....as the studies show...are scared off, held for police or shot and injured, and not killed........why is it that you irrational anti gunners always think that regular, law abiding citizens who just want to live their lives just can't wait to kill a stranger.........or that most criminals won't run away rather than attack an armed victim........?

Well it does show most aren't blood thirsty killers. As you know I think there are around 100k defenses and with that number still a low head count.

As you know I think there are around 100k defenses and with that number still a low head count

Yes....you feel that, not think it, since you haven't done any research on your own......whereas 19 other groups have actually researched the topic.....


Here are the studies cited from kleck's report....note.....only the National Crime Victimization Survey is as low as 108,000 per year....all the rest, and these aren't even all of the studies, are way over that number....

A quick guide to the studies and the numbers.....the full lay out of what was studied by each study is in the links....
GunCite-Gun Control-How Often Are Guns Used in Self-Defense

GunCite Frequency of Defensive Gun Use in Previous Surveys
Field...1976....3,052,717
DMIa 1978...2,141,512
L.A. TIMES...1994...3,609,68
Kleck...2.5 million
Obama's CDC....2013....500,000--3million

--------------------


Bordua...1977...1,414,544
DMIb...1978...1,098,409
Hart...1981...1.797,461
Mauser...1990...1,487,342
Gallup...1993...1,621,377
DEPT. OF JUSTICE...1994...1.5 million
Journal of Quantitative Criminology--- 989,883 times per year."
-------------------------------------------
Ohio...1982...771,043
Gallup...1991...777,152
Tarrance... 1994... 764,036
Lawerence Southwich Jr. 400,000 fewer violent crimes and at least 800,000 violent crimes deterred..



NCVS (National Crime Victimization Survey)....108,000


Notice, the 3 different groupings of stats from the research listed so far.....not one of them approaches the NCVS number of 100,000.....yet you claim to know that is the correct number....[/QUOTE]

I use the ncvs numbers. And it's the only one that would weed out criminals defending against criminals.