Ian they are not an esoteric physics model. They are a factor in any studies involving subatomic particles and their interaction with other bodies or particles. Quantum mechanics is not an esoteric study, its the reason we have microwave ovens and the reason they can even make a claim for CO2 induced warming at all.
And as far as my honesty, I am being completely honest. The dishonesty here resides in the asinine claim that all heat transfers from a CO2 molecule will radiate straight down. Its a complete fallacy and that is one of the reasons the climate models are usually wrong.
You cannot deny sub-atomic particles in greenhouse effect or pretend they are bound by regular physics and thats it. Quantum mechanics is the reason there is a heat transfer at all.
a while back you linked to some sort of google search of EM field vectors that talked about an esoteric quantum effect that couldnt even be accurately be measured. that was your proof that there actually WAS something by that name. it didnt match up with what wirebender was claiming it was.
no one is claiming all radiation from excited CO2 molecules goes straight down to earth but some does and even more comes down at an angle that intersects with the earth's surface. if ten units of radiation go up and three come back that is the equivilent of seven going up. more ghg simply changes the ratio.
Now who is being dishonest? I linked to a webpage explaining a basic concept of Quantum Mechanics, you likening it to "some google search" is BULLSHIT!
You just flat out lied your ass off... It was an explanation of the very basics of Quantum mechanics as it would pertain to electromagnetic fields and interactions.
The climate models do not accurately predict because they for one do not use all of the factors involved, two, cannot quantify all of the complexities involved in the radiation effects, third, they cannot accurately show or relate the actual warming as it would happen in the real world. They take an oversimplification (a gross one) and make vast all en-composing assumptions which are not only unsound scientifically but unrealistic by their own inaccuracies. They in-effect might as well be claiming the heat radiates straight down because that about as accurate as they are currently.
Ian I don't know what your issue with this is, and frankly I don't care. The simple fact is these things exist, they are not made up nor someones twisted concept. You tried to imply they were made up before I showed you they were not, then you tried to claim he was misusing an esoteric concept or factor and that is not true either.
Like it or not, agree with it or not it is a very real, very relevant factor and study. Quantum Mechanics is a very real science and as of yet they understand very little of it. That does not make any less legitimate or any less applicable.
You just called me dishonest in a previous post, and here in this post you flat out lied and did so deliberately...
let me make an analogy. wirebender took a shit into a waffle cone and called it ice cream. you defended him by saying ice cream cones are real. but shit and ice cream arent the same thing. I am against bullshit no matter who says it. I dont want to hear bullshit from either side of the global warming situation. I agree with a lot of what wirebender says but he has a strange flaw in his understanding when it comes to his precious EM vector fields.
now you are calling me a liar for saying your list of links was googled. you may have used a different search engine but the list was just an unfocused group of sites that had peripheral connections to EM vector fields. at least one of your citations was about poorly understood quantum effects otherwise I probably wouldnt remember your feeble attempt to prop up wirebender while calling konradv a retard. It was churlish behaviour then and you resort to churlish behaviour now by calling me a liar.