- From Atheism to Believing in God -

[Marie888]

life is not an endless cycle of guilt and shame.

i've always thought that was silliness.

I think I understand what you are saying. Does that also mean perhaps you've had a background in some sort of church upbringing, perhaps a "works based" church, if it's ok to ask? (Like RCC, or something else?) Just wondering.

Being "rightly" convicted of our wrong doing may hurt our human pride; but that isn't a bad thing, it helps us grow. "Pruning" hurts. It's part of the trials in growing in in live and faith in God... and where humility comes in alot of times. We may take some falls because of our pride in even all areas of our lives, but we learn from them which is good. I think most people would agree that humility is a good thing.

The trouble (false guilt, false shame) can happen because there is an actual spiritual battle going on with Satan. I realize you do not believe this at all, nor can I make you believe, but just wanted to try to reply according to my understanding so far...

Alot of times what happens is a "false guilt" in which the enemy, Satan, likes to hold over people's heads. Things like, "I don't do enough "good works", "God would never accept me", or "God would never forgive me." Those things are a lie from the pit of hell. When someone truly starts seeking Jesus Christ, many times people are attacked somehow by the enemy. Our own thoughts get in the way like above, (instead of listening to the Lord first and Who HE says He is, not our own thinking) or perhaps tempations come our way, or, "worldly life" gets in the way. Satan wants to keep us from God, because after we know the truth, the truth sets us free. Once we know the truth of Jesus, who He is, we never go back. "It is finished", like Jesus said on the Cross. So Satan is attacking as much as he can in whatever way possible before that can happen.

Yes, the Lord wants us to repent, but it's not just for the sake of some "obligation". It's entirely and totally out of love, and it's for our own good and others good... so we don't hurt (or try not to hurt) ourselves or others, but rather learn to love Him, and love one another.


.

 

[jillian]

life is not an endless cycle of guilt and shame.

i've always thought that was silliness.

I think I understand what you are saying. Does that also mean perhaps you've had a background in some sort of church upbringing, perhaps a "works based" church, if it's ok to ask? (Like RCC, or something else?) Just wondering.

Being "rightly" convicted of our wrong doing may hurt our human pride; but that isn't a bad thing, it helps us grow. "Pruning" hurts. It's part of the trials in growing in in live and faith in God... and where humility comes in alot of times. We may take some falls because of our pride in even all areas of our lives, but we learn from them which is good. I think most people would agree that humility is a good thing.

The trouble (false guilt, false shame) can happen because there is an actual spiritual battle going on with Satan. I realize you do not believe this at all, nor can I make you believe, but just wanted to try to reply according to my understanding so far...

Alot of times what happens is a "false guilt" in which the enemy, Satan, likes to hold over people's heads. Things like, "I don't do enough "good works", "God would never accept me", or "God would never forgive me." Those things are a lie from the pit of hell. When someone truly starts seeking Jesus Christ, many times people are attacked somehow by the enemy. Our own thoughts get in the way like above, (instead of listening to the Lord first and Who HE says He is, not our own thinking) or perhaps tempations come our way, or, "worldly life" gets in the way. Satan wants to keep us from God, because after we know the truth, the truth sets us free. Once we know the truth of Jesus, who He is, we never go back. "It is finished", like Jesus said on the Cross. So Satan is attacking as much as he can in whatever way possible before that can happen.

Yes, the Lord wants us to repent, but it's not just for the sake of some "obligation". It's entirely and totally out of love, and it's for our own good and others good... so we don't hurt (or try not to hurt) ourselves or others, but rather learn to love Him, and love one another.


.

i'm not christian. i'm a jew. i don't believe in hell or fire and brimstone. i think *when* the messiah comes there will be a huge change.

i am a firm believer in treating one another as we wish to be treated, fwiw.

I understand what you believe, and if it gives you comfort and doesn't hurt anyone else, well, then, more power to you...

 

[Lonestar_logic]

life is not an endless cycle of guilt and shame.

i've always thought that was silliness.

I think I understand what you are saying. Does that also mean perhaps you've had a background in some sort of church upbringing, perhaps a "works based" church, if it's ok to ask? (Like RCC, or something else?) Just wondering.

Being "rightly" convicted of our wrong doing may hurt our human pride; but that isn't a bad thing, it helps us grow. "Pruning" hurts. It's part of the trials in growing in in live and faith in God... and where humility comes in alot of times. We may take some falls because of our pride in even all areas of our lives, but we learn from them which is good. I think most people would agree that humility is a good thing.

The trouble (false guilt, false shame) can happen because there is an actual spiritual battle going on with Satan. I realize you do not believe this at all, nor can I make you believe, but just wanted to try to reply according to my understanding so far...

Alot of times what happens is a "false guilt" in which the enemy, Satan, likes to hold over people's heads. Things like, "I don't do enough "good works", "God would never accept me", or "God would never forgive me." Those things are a lie from the pit of hell. When someone truly starts seeking Jesus Christ, many times people are attacked somehow by the enemy. Our own thoughts get in the way like above, (instead of listening to the Lord first and Who HE says He is, not our own thinking) or perhaps tempations come our way, or, "worldly life" gets in the way. Satan wants to keep us from God, because after we know the truth, the truth sets us free. Once we know the truth of Jesus, who He is, we never go back. "It is finished", like Jesus said on the Cross. So Satan is attacking as much as he can in whatever way possible before that can happen.

Yes, the Lord wants us to repent, but it's not just for the sake of some "obligation". It's entirely and totally out of love, and it's for our own good and others good... so we don't hurt (or try not to hurt) ourselves or others, but rather learn to love Him, and love one another.


.

i'm not christian. i'm a jew. i don't believe in hell or fire and brimstone. i think *when* the messiah comes there will be a huge change.

i am a firm believer in treating one another as we wish to be treated, fwiw.

I understand what you believe, and if it gives you comfort and doesn't hurt anyone else, well, then, more power to you...

So you believe the Messiah will come again?

 

[AVG-JOE]

life is not an endless cycle of guilt and shame.

i've always thought that was silliness.

The truth is closer to life being an endless cycle of getting away with boo-boo's or paying for them on the one hand while simultaneously justifying every purposed action based on its cost versus its profit. And let's face it..... it doesn't take much profit for humans to justify some NASTY shit done to each other and the home our children will share.

God's image, I reckon.

 

[jillian]

I think I understand what you are saying. Does that also mean perhaps you've had a background in some sort of church upbringing, perhaps a "works based" church, if it's ok to ask? (Like RCC, or something else?) Just wondering.

Being "rightly" convicted of our wrong doing may hurt our human pride; but that isn't a bad thing, it helps us grow. "Pruning" hurts. It's part of the trials in growing in in live and faith in God... and where humility comes in alot of times. We may take some falls because of our pride in even all areas of our lives, but we learn from them which is good. I think most people would agree that humility is a good thing.

The trouble (false guilt, false shame) can happen because there is an actual spiritual battle going on with Satan. I realize you do not believe this at all, nor can I make you believe, but just wanted to try to reply according to my understanding so far...

Alot of times what happens is a "false guilt" in which the enemy, Satan, likes to hold over people's heads. Things like, "I don't do enough "good works", "God would never accept me", or "God would never forgive me." Those things are a lie from the pit of hell. When someone truly starts seeking Jesus Christ, many times people are attacked somehow by the enemy. Our own thoughts get in the way like above, (instead of listening to the Lord first and Who HE says He is, not our own thinking) or perhaps tempations come our way, or, "worldly life" gets in the way. Satan wants to keep us from God, because after we know the truth, the truth sets us free. Once we know the truth of Jesus, who He is, we never go back. "It is finished", like Jesus said on the Cross. So Satan is attacking as much as he can in whatever way possible before that can happen.

Yes, the Lord wants us to repent, but it's not just for the sake of some "obligation". It's entirely and totally out of love, and it's for our own good and others good... so we don't hurt (or try not to hurt) ourselves or others, but rather learn to love Him, and love one another.


.

i'm not christian. i'm a jew. i don't believe in hell or fire and brimstone. i think *when* the messiah comes there will be a huge change.

i am a firm believer in treating one another as we wish to be treated, fwiw.

I understand what you believe, and if it gives you comfort and doesn't hurt anyone else, well, then, more power to you...

So you believe the Messiah will come again?

i believe he will come for the FIRST time.

if he'd already been here, the prophesies would have been fulfilled.

 

[jillian]

life is not an endless cycle of guilt and shame.

i've always thought that was silliness.

The truth is closer to life being an endless cycle of getting away with boo-boo's or paying for them on the one hand while simultaneously justifying every purposed action based on its cost versus its profit. And let's face it..... it doesn't take much profit for humans to justify some NASTY shit done to each other and the home our children will share.

God's image, I reckon.

no. people have free will. we can screw up as much as we want.

we can also do as much good as we choose.

i prefer to think most of us fall in between.

 

[AVG-JOE]

life is not an endless cycle of guilt and shame.

i've always thought that was silliness.

You're right. Life is an endless cycle of suffering.

thank goodness, i haven't found that either. i find it's normal. sometimes it's great. sometimes not so great.... sometimes stuff sucks. i have no shame and i feel no guilt... unless i do something specifically to feel guilty or shameful about.

and even then, i tend to live by the philosophy, don't do things you think you'll regret (which doesn't always work) and don't regret things you've already done.

Thank (insert your preferred Deity here) that MOST humans have always had a hard time justifying stomping on their brothers and sisters - even in the hey-days of industrial slavery it was a minority of bosses and hired gangs of thugs who could justify in their hearts the true costs of their business.

Turning the thugs who collected taxes and protected the ego of the politicians into professional soldiers who simply keep peace in the market place gives us hope. (Insert your preferred Deity here) bless term limits on the Commander in Chief and (insert your preferred Deity here) bless The United States Marines.

 

[AVG-JOE]

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G-CNOFFud9k]YouTube - Two and a half men - Who cut the cheese[/ame]

 

[AVG-JOE]

life is not an endless cycle of guilt and shame.

i've always thought that was silliness.

The truth is closer to life being an endless cycle of getting away with boo-boo's or paying for them on the one hand while simultaneously justifying every purposed action based on its cost versus its profit. And let's face it..... it doesn't take much profit for humans to justify some NASTY shit done to each other and the home our children will share.

God's image, I reckon.

no. people have free will. we can screw up as much as we want.

we can also do as much good as we choose.

i prefer to think most of us fall in between.

Absolutely true. I spoke in a gross characterization of humanity when I implied that the powerful minority through out history represents humans.

Let's face it though... Alexander the Thug and his ilk got a whole lot more press than peace ever did.

 

[jillian]

The truth is closer to life being an endless cycle of getting away with boo-boo's or paying for them on the one hand while simultaneously justifying every purposed action based on its cost versus its profit. And let's face it..... it doesn't take much profit for humans to justify some NASTY shit done to each other and the home our children will share.

God's image, I reckon.

no. people have free will. we can screw up as much as we want.

we can also do as much good as we choose.

i prefer to think most of us fall in between.

Absolutely true. I spoke in a gross characterization of humanity when I implied that the powerful minority through out history represents humans.

Let's face it though... Alexander the Thug and his ilk got a whole lot more press than peace ever did.

Amen to that, brother!