Fighting poverty could make it difficult to fight "climate change"

[TNHarley]

http://www.sciencemag.org/news/2017/10/fighting-poverty-might-make-it-harder-fight-climate-change

Lifting people out of poverty is a noble goal, but it could make it harder to fight climate change. That’s the conclusion of a new study, which finds that elevating the world’s poorest individuals into the middle class would significantly increase carbon emissions, requiring greater efforts to combat global warming.
To see whether the United Nations’s goal to eliminate poverty and stay within 2°C of warming could both be achieved, the researchers modeled two scenarios: one that just brought the world’s poorest out of extreme poverty, and the other raised them to a modest level of income. Then they calculated the carbon footprints for each income group before and after, based on the World Bank’s Global Consumption Database.
The study implies that climate and human development goals are not necessarily inconsistent, but “It really kind of depends on what level of poverty we’re OK with,” says Steve Davis, an earth systems scientist at the University of California, Irvine, who was not involved with the work. The bottom line, he adds: “If we’re really trying to consider getting people not just out of extreme poverty, but into the middle class, then maybe we do have more of a challenge.”

Do we focus on fact or fiction?

 

[ScienceRocks]

Solar, wind, nuclear and soon fusion will allow us to do both.

 

[TNHarley]

Solar, wind, nuclear and soon fusion will allow us to do both.

How?
Might help if you read the article instead of sounding like a broken record.

 

[OldLady]

Solar, wind, nuclear and soon fusion will allow us to do both.

How?
Might help if you read the article instead of sounding like a broken record.

BECAUSE when the middle class lifestyle is fueled by renewable energy, and the wants of the new middle class are manufactured using renewable energy, they won't be raising the carbon footprint as much as this study cites. The predictions are based on our current fossil-fuel based energy sources.

 

[LordBrownTrout]

After we pave all the land with windmills and solar panels, we'll take on that cool death star look.

 

[TNHarley]

Solar, wind, nuclear and soon fusion will allow us to do both.

How?
Might help if you read the article instead of sounding like a broken record.

BECAUSE when the middle class lifestyle is fueled by renewable energy, and the wants of the new middle class are manufactured using renewable energy, they won't be raising the carbon footprint as much as this study cites. The predictions are based on our current fossil-fuel based energy sources.

so we focus on renewables instead of the poor?

 

[Peach]

As people earn more money, they spend it on things like travel that increase the amount of carbon dioxide and other greenhouse gasses pumped into the atmosphere. Climate change and poverty—“these are really the two most important questions humanity faces,” he says.

I do not believe this can be discounted. we cannot have it all, extreme poverty is lack of basic water and food needs.

 

[TNHarley]

Lifting everyone to the global middle class would require a 27% increase in efforts to reduce carbon emissions, compared with the 4% per year required without poverty reduction goals. But even the most ambitious countries, such as Sweden, have achieved little more than a 4% reduction per year, doing so by replacing fossil fuels with nuclear energy and hydropower.

 

[OldLady]

Solar, wind, nuclear and soon fusion will allow us to do both.

How?
Might help if you read the article instead of sounding like a broken record.

BECAUSE when the middle class lifestyle is fueled by renewable energy, and the wants of the new middle class are manufactured using renewable energy, they won't be raising the carbon footprint as much as this study cites. The predictions are based on our current fossil-fuel based energy sources.

so we focus on renewables instead of the poor?

Why can't we do both?

 

[OldLady]

Lifting everyone to the global middle class would require a 27% increase in efforts to reduce carbon emissions, compared with the 4% per year required without poverty reduction goals. But even the most ambitious countries, such as Sweden, have achieved little more than a 4% reduction per year, doing so by replacing fossil fuels with nuclear energy and hydropower.

They're not finished yet, are they?

 

[cnelsen]

http://www.sciencemag.org/news/2017/10/fighting-poverty-might-make-it-harder-fight-climate-change

Lifting people out of poverty is a noble goal, but it could make it harder to fight climate change. That’s the conclusion of a new study, which finds that elevating the world’s poorest individuals into the middle class would significantly increase carbon emissions, requiring greater efforts to combat global warming.
To see whether the United Nations’s goal to eliminate poverty and stay within 2°C of warming could both be achieved, the researchers modeled two scenarios: one that just brought the world’s poorest out of extreme poverty, and the other raised them to a modest level of income. Then they calculated the carbon footprints for each income group before and after, based on the World Bank’s Global Consumption Database.
The study implies that climate and human development goals are not necessarily inconsistent, but “It really kind of depends on what level of poverty we’re OK with,” says Steve Davis, an earth systems scientist at the University of California, Irvine, who was not involved with the work. The bottom line, he adds: “If we’re really trying to consider getting people not just out of extreme poverty, but into the middle class, then maybe we do have more of a challenge.”

Do we focus on fact or fiction?

The single greatest thing we could do to reduce carbon emissions is stop moving people from low carbon emitting equatorial regions to high carbon-emitting arctic climes. But hey, white genocide trumps climate change.

 

[OldLady]

As people earn more money, they spend it on things like travel that increase the amount of carbon dioxide and other greenhouse gasses pumped into the atmosphere. Climate change and poverty—“these are really the two most important questions humanity faces,” he says.

I do not believe this can be discounted. we cannot have it all, extreme poverty is lack of basic water and food needs.

Maybe we can't do both overnight, but I don't see why it has to be one or the other. I read the article. I didn't see much of an argument there at all, tbh.

 

[WillMunny]

The other day I stubbed my toe hard enough to crack a nail and yes, I somehow blame climate change for that.

 

[irosie91]

Solar, wind, nuclear and soon fusion will allow us to do both.

you are overly optimistic------- "AN ENDLESS REPLICATOR
IN EVERY HUT"

 

[TNHarley]

Solar, wind, nuclear and soon fusion will allow us to do both.

How?
Might help if you read the article instead of sounding like a broken record.

BECAUSE when the middle class lifestyle is fueled by renewable energy, and the wants of the new middle class are manufactured using renewable energy, they won't be raising the carbon footprint as much as this study cites. The predictions are based on our current fossil-fuel based energy sources.

so we focus on renewables instead of the poor?

Why can't we do both?

Lol right? First environmental thing we can do is plant money trees.
Here is a question : How can a lower/middle middle class person afford renewables? Give everyone a loan?

 

[TNHarley]

Lifting everyone to the global middle class would require a 27% increase in efforts to reduce carbon emissions, compared with the 4% per year required without poverty reduction goals. But even the most ambitious countries, such as Sweden, have achieved little more than a 4% reduction per year, doing so by replacing fossil fuels with nuclear energy and hydropower.

They're not finished yet, are they?

Lol, how much more do they have to go? Got a link or anything?

 

[TNHarley]

http://www.sciencemag.org/news/2017/10/fighting-poverty-might-make-it-harder-fight-climate-change

Lifting people out of poverty is a noble goal, but it could make it harder to fight climate change. That’s the conclusion of a new study, which finds that elevating the world’s poorest individuals into the middle class would significantly increase carbon emissions, requiring greater efforts to combat global warming.
To see whether the United Nations’s goal to eliminate poverty and stay within 2°C of warming could both be achieved, the researchers modeled two scenarios: one that just brought the world’s poorest out of extreme poverty, and the other raised them to a modest level of income. Then they calculated the carbon footprints for each income group before and after, based on the World Bank’s Global Consumption Database.
The study implies that climate and human development goals are not necessarily inconsistent, but “It really kind of depends on what level of poverty we’re OK with,” says Steve Davis, an earth systems scientist at the University of California, Irvine, who was not involved with the work. The bottom line, he adds: “If we’re really trying to consider getting people not just out of extreme poverty, but into the middle class, then maybe we do have more of a challenge.”

Do we focus on fact or fiction?

The single greatest thing we could do to reduce carbon emissions is stop moving people from low carbon emitting equatorial regions to high carbon-emitting arctic climes. But hey, white genocide trumps climate change.

you know, that is a fair point!

 

[Peach]

As people earn more money, they spend it on things like travel that increase the amount of carbon dioxide and other greenhouse gasses pumped into the atmosphere. Climate change and poverty—“these are really the two most important questions humanity faces,” he says.

I do not believe this can be discounted. we cannot have it all, extreme poverty is lack of basic water and food needs.

Maybe we can't do both overnight, but I don't see why it has to be one or the other. I read the article. I didn't see much of an argument there at all, tbh.

Accept both outcomes, plan ahead.

 

[OldLady]

Solar, wind, nuclear and soon fusion will allow us to do both.

How?
Might help if you read the article instead of sounding like a broken record.

BECAUSE when the middle class lifestyle is fueled by renewable energy, and the wants of the new middle class are manufactured using renewable energy, they won't be raising the carbon footprint as much as this study cites. The predictions are based on our current fossil-fuel based energy sources.

so we focus on renewables instead of the poor?

Why can't we do both?

Lol right? First environmental thing we can do is plant money trees.
Here is a question : How can a lower/middle middle class person afford renewables? Give everyone a loan?

Harley.
Are you imagining third worlders putting solar panels on their huts? I don't think that's what we're talking about here. The infrastructure to provide renewable power to people will be there if we get off our lazy asses and do something about it. Then the lower/middle class will earn an income to afford the lifestyle. It is so simple. Your article is a big grumble about climate change, as usual.

 

[TNHarley]

How?
Might help if you read the article instead of sounding like a broken record.

BECAUSE when the middle class lifestyle is fueled by renewable energy, and the wants of the new middle class are manufactured using renewable energy, they won't be raising the carbon footprint as much as this study cites. The predictions are based on our current fossil-fuel based energy sources.

so we focus on renewables instead of the poor?

Why can't we do both?

Lol right? First environmental thing we can do is plant money trees.
Here is a question : How can a lower/middle middle class person afford renewables? Give everyone a loan?

Harley.
Are you imagining third worlders putting solar panels on their huts? I don't think that's what we're talking about here. The infrastructure to provide renewable power to people will be there if we get off our lazy asses and do something about it. Then the lower/middle class will earn an income to afford the lifestyle. It is so simple. Your article is a big grumble about climate change, as usual.

No I'm talking about here. Do you understand how much solar panels are?
A big grumble? Lol please explain.