CDZ Evolution: Valid Science, or Hoax?

[orogenicman]

If evolution is real why did it stop and why has it never been observed? It's just a theory

Au contraire.

Five Major Misconceptions about Evolution

 

[SassyIrishLass]

If evolution is real why did it stop and why has it never been observed? It's just a theory

Au contraire.

Five Major Misconceptions about Evolution

It's theory, nothing more and nothing less.

 

[usfan]

It's theory, nothing more and nothing less.

..and a bad theory, at that. The actual evidence does not support it. There is no mechanism that forces or even allows the jumps in the genetic code that are asserted.

 

[usfan]

Links & youtube videos are not evidence. They do not rebut anything. They can be sources if you are making a point, but posting links & videos is not an argument. If you know of any real evidence that supports the theory, post it, with the data sets & conditions of the tests. But all i have seen on this thread, for 11 pages, is assertions about the claim, not any evidence to support it.

 

[orogenicman]

If evolution is real why did it stop and why has it never been observed? It's just a theory

Au contraire.

Five Major Misconceptions about Evolution

It's theory, nothing more and nothing less.

Proving that you didn't even bother to read the article because you prefer to be willfully ignorant. Congratulations.

 

[SassyIrishLass]

If evolution is real why did it stop and why has it never been observed? It's just a theory

Au contraire.

Five Major Misconceptions about Evolution

It's theory, nothing more and nothing less.

Proving that you didn't even bother to read the article because you prefer to be willfully ignorant. Congratulations.

Dude for every article you post and I can post one refuting it. I'm not going into that BS. It's a theory

 

[usfan]

You aren't interested in evidence at all. You are only interested in making your religious stance against something you not only don't understand, but of which you are apparently afraid because to accept it would meaning giving up your own religious convictions. You do have my sympathies.

Damn, you can't even be man enough to admit that you made a mistake. Man up, dude.

Proving that you didn't even bother to read the article because you prefer to be willfully ignorant. Congratulations.

Still no evidence. Just ad hominem. Dodging the issue, deflecting from the topic, & ignoring the real problems of science & logic. I can point this out from time to time, but it does NOT contribute anything to the discussion. It evades it.

 

[orogenicman]

Links & youtube videos are not evidence. They do not rebut anything. They can be sources if you are making a point, but posting links & videos is not an argument. If you know of any real evidence that supports the theory, post it, with the data sets & conditions of the tests. But all i have seen on this thread, for 11 pages, is assertions about the claim, not any evidence to support it.

Translation: Evidence is not evidence because the bible told me so.

Listen pal, if you want to have an informal, honest discussion about the science of evolution, we can do that. If you want real hard scientific data on the subject, I suggest you take a class, subscribe to a peer reviewed scientific journal, or get a degree and do your own research, because this is not the place where you are going to get it. The evidence is out there for anyone who actually cares enough to find it. It isn't like it is being hidden by some mass conspiracy of the world's scientists. All it takes is a fucking visit to the library. Otherwise, I don't give a damn what you think I should do for you.

 

[orogenicman]

If evolution is real why did it stop and why has it never been observed? It's just a theory

Au contraire.

Five Major Misconceptions about Evolution

It's theory, nothing more and nothing less.

Proving that you didn't even bother to read the article because you prefer to be willfully ignorant. Congratulations.

Dude for every article you post and I can post one refuting it. I'm not going into that BS. It's a theory

Great. Let's play that game.

Epigenetics and Evolution

Epigenetics and Evolution Accumulating Glitches Learn Science at Scitable

We share most of our genome with our closest relatives, the other great apes, and yet each species looks and acts quite different from the others. How is this possible? If humans, chimps, and bonobos share around 99% of our DNA, how come we're so different?

An explanation that has emerged over the last several years is that the differences between great apes don't come solely from differences in what genes we have, but also in how they're regulated. Extremely similar genomes can still give rise to different organisms if the genes are activated at different times and strengths. Genes are generally activated when a specific protein binds to their promoter, a short stretch of DNA just before the start of each gene; the protein then reads the DNA that constitutes the gene and makes an RNA "working copy" which is used by the cell. Cells can regulate the activity of a particular gene by controlling when and how these proteins bind to its promoter.

Cells use an abundance of methods to accomplish this, from managing which proteins have access to the nucleus to changing the structure of proteins to control or destroy them. While those are fascinating and important processes (and the subject of a whole field of study!), they're not the subject of this post. Instead, I'd like to focus on epigenetic modifications, adjustments to the DNA which don't change the sequence itself (the string of A,T,G, and C) but still affect how it gets read. Epigenetic modifications are a bit like ornaments on a Christmas tree; the tree (the DNA sequence) is still the same, but the decorations (epigenetic modifications) change how it's perceived.

Two major kinds of epigenetic modifications are methylation, where a chemical group (a methyl) is attached to the DNA in specific locations, and histone modification, chemical modifications of a histone, a scaffolding protein in the nucleus which acts as a spool around which DNA is wound. Methylation usually reduces the activity of a gene, either by blocking proteins from binding to its promoter or by recruiting other proteins that wrap the DNA up and make it inactive. Histone modifications can affect how accessible a region of DNA is, making a gene more or less active. One way to understand how these modifications can alter gene expression without changing the DNA sequence is to think of the effect font has on text. Precisely the same letters arranged into the same series of words can have a different impact if the font emphasizes certain words:

My mistress' eyes are nothing like the sun;
My mistress' eyes are nothing like the sun;
My mistress' eyes are nothing like the sun;

Over the past few years, several studies have compared the epigenetic modifications of our genome with that of other great apes, leading to an emerging picture of the importance of epigenetics in our recent evolutionary history. Last year, Shulha et al compared the prevalence of a specific histone modification in DNA from human, chimpanzee, and macaque neurons; they found nearly 500 genes with a human-specific modification pattern. Draft versions of the gorilla and bonobo genome published last year enabled researchers to expand their analysis to include a wider range of great apes. Hernando-Herraez et al did just that in a paper published this month. By comparing the methylation patterns in the genomes of all great ape species, they discovered that each one had a distinct pattern, including 171 genes specifically methylated in humans, 101 in Pan species (chimps and bonobos), 101 in Gorilla species, and nearly 450 in Pongo species.

The role of epigenetics in evolution (particularly primate evolution) is an active and exciting area of research; these are just two examples that I've picked from a wide range of papers on the topic. If you're interested in learning more, have a look at the (open access!) papers below and the references they cite. In evolution, as in everything else, it's not what you've got; it's what you do with it.

Further reading
Shulha HP, Crisci JL, Reshetov D, Tushir JS, Cheung I, et al. (2012) Human-Specific Histone Methylation Signatures at Transcription Start Sites in Prefrontal Neurons. PLoS Biology 10(11): e1001427. doi:10.1371/journal.pbio.1001427

Hernando-Herraez I, Prado-Martinez J, Garg P, Fernandez-Callejo M, Heyn H, et al. (2013) Dynamics of DNA Methylation in Recent Human and Great Ape Evolution. PLoS Genetics 9(9): e1003763. doi:10.1371/journal.pgen.1003763

Be sure to include references in your rebuttal.

Your turn.

 

[SassyIrishLass]

If evolution is real why did it stop and why has it never been observed? It's just a theory

Au contraire.

Five Major Misconceptions about Evolution

It's theory, nothing more and nothing less.

Proving that you didn't even bother to read the article because you prefer to be willfully ignorant. Congratulations.

Dude for every article you post and I can post one refuting it. I'm not going into that BS. It's a theory

Great. Let's play that game.

Epigenetics and Evolution

Epigenetics and Evolution Accumulating Glitches Learn Science at Scitable

We share most of our genome with our closest relatives, the other great apes, and yet each species looks and acts quite different from the others. How is this possible? If humans, chimps, and bonobos share around 99% of our DNA, how come we're so different?

An explanation that has emerged over the last several years is that the differences between great apes don't come solely from differences in what genes we have, but also in how they're regulated. Extremely similar genomes can still give rise to different organisms if the genes are activated at different times and strengths. Genes are generally activated when a specific protein binds to their promoter, a short stretch of DNA just before the start of each gene; the protein then reads the DNA that constitutes the gene and makes an RNA "working copy" which is used by the cell. Cells can regulate the activity of a particular gene by controlling when and how these proteins bind to its promoter.

Cells use an abundance of methods to accomplish this, from managing which proteins have access to the nucleus to changing the structure of proteins to control or destroy them. While those are fascinating and important processes (and the subject of a whole field of study!), they're not the subject of this post. Instead, I'd like to focus on epigenetic modifications, adjustments to the DNA which don't change the sequence itself (the string of A,T,G, and C) but still affect how it gets read. Epigenetic modifications are a bit like ornaments on a Christmas tree; the tree (the DNA sequence) is still the same, but the decorations (epigenetic modifications) change how it's perceived.

Two major kinds of epigenetic modifications are methylation, where a chemical group (a methyl) is attached to the DNA in specific locations, and histone modification, chemical modifications of a histone, a scaffolding protein in the nucleus which acts as a spool around which DNA is wound. Methylation usually reduces the activity of a gene, either by blocking proteins from binding to its promoter or by recruiting other proteins that wrap the DNA up and make it inactive. Histone modifications can affect how accessible a region of DNA is, making a gene more or less active. One way to understand how these modifications can alter gene expression without changing the DNA sequence is to think of the effect font has on text. Precisely the same letters arranged into the same series of words can have a different impact if the font emphasizes certain words:

My mistress' eyes are nothing like the sun;
My mistress' eyes are nothing like the sun;
My mistress' eyes are nothing like the sun;

Over the past few years, several studies have compared the epigenetic modifications of our genome with that of other great apes, leading to an emerging picture of the importance of epigenetics in our recent evolutionary history. Last year, Shulha et al compared the prevalence of a specific histone modification in DNA from human, chimpanzee, and macaque neurons; they found nearly 500 genes with a human-specific modification pattern. Draft versions of the gorilla and bonobo genome published last year enabled researchers to expand their analysis to include a wider range of great apes. Hernando-Herraez et al did just that in a paper published this month. By comparing the methylation patterns in the genomes of all great ape species, they discovered that each one had a distinct pattern, including 171 genes specifically methylated in humans, 101 in Pan species (chimps and bonobos), 101 in Gorilla species, and nearly 450 in Pongo species.

The role of epigenetics in evolution (particularly primate evolution) is an active and exciting area of research; these are just two examples that I've picked from a wide range of papers on the topic. If you're interested in learning more, have a look at the (open access!) papers below and the references they cite. In evolution, as in everything else, it's not what you've got; it's what you do with it.

Further reading
Shulha HP, Crisci JL, Reshetov D, Tushir JS, Cheung I, et al. (2012) Human-Specific Histone Methylation Signatures at Transcription Start Sites in Prefrontal Neurons. PLoS Biology 10(11): e1001427. doi:10.1371/journal.pbio.1001427

Hernando-Herraez I, Prado-Martinez J, Garg P, Fernandez-Callejo M, Heyn H, et al. (2013) Dynamics of DNA Methylation in Recent Human and Great Ape Evolution. PLoS Genetics 9(9): e1003763. doi:10.1371/journal.pgen.1003763

Be sure to include references in your rebuttal.

Your turn.

What part of "I'm not getting into that" did you miss? You have your opinion on the THEORY of evolution and I have mine. Have a good day

 

[orogenicman]

You aren't interested in evidence at all. You are only interested in making your religious stance against something you not only don't understand, but of which you are apparently afraid because to accept it would meaning giving up your own religious convictions. You do have my sympathies.

Damn, you can't even be man enough to admit that you made a mistake. Man up, dude.

Proving that you didn't even bother to read the article because you prefer to be willfully ignorant. Congratulations.

Still no evidence. Just ad hominem. Dodging the issue, deflecting from the topic, & ignoring the real problems of science & logic. I can point this out from time to time, but it does NOT contribute anything to the discussion. It evades it.

Projecting, once again. You made a mistake, and rather than being a man and admitting to it, you are DODGING the issue. You thought donkeys were hybrids that could not produce viable offspring instead of being a true species. You are wrong, and you know it. Fess up like a man or resolve yourself to the fact that you are a woos.

 

[orogenicman]

Au contraire.

Five Major Misconceptions about Evolution

It's theory, nothing more and nothing less.

Proving that you didn't even bother to read the article because you prefer to be willfully ignorant. Congratulations.

Dude for every article you post and I can post one refuting it. I'm not going into that BS. It's a theory

Great. Let's play that game.

Epigenetics and Evolution

Epigenetics and Evolution Accumulating Glitches Learn Science at Scitable

We share most of our genome with our closest relatives, the other great apes, and yet each species looks and acts quite different from the others. How is this possible? If humans, chimps, and bonobos share around 99% of our DNA, how come we're so different?

An explanation that has emerged over the last several years is that the differences between great apes don't come solely from differences in what genes we have, but also in how they're regulated. Extremely similar genomes can still give rise to different organisms if the genes are activated at different times and strengths. Genes are generally activated when a specific protein binds to their promoter, a short stretch of DNA just before the start of each gene; the protein then reads the DNA that constitutes the gene and makes an RNA "working copy" which is used by the cell. Cells can regulate the activity of a particular gene by controlling when and how these proteins bind to its promoter.

Cells use an abundance of methods to accomplish this, from managing which proteins have access to the nucleus to changing the structure of proteins to control or destroy them. While those are fascinating and important processes (and the subject of a whole field of study!), they're not the subject of this post. Instead, I'd like to focus on epigenetic modifications, adjustments to the DNA which don't change the sequence itself (the string of A,T,G, and C) but still affect how it gets read. Epigenetic modifications are a bit like ornaments on a Christmas tree; the tree (the DNA sequence) is still the same, but the decorations (epigenetic modifications) change how it's perceived.

Two major kinds of epigenetic modifications are methylation, where a chemical group (a methyl) is attached to the DNA in specific locations, and histone modification, chemical modifications of a histone, a scaffolding protein in the nucleus which acts as a spool around which DNA is wound. Methylation usually reduces the activity of a gene, either by blocking proteins from binding to its promoter or by recruiting other proteins that wrap the DNA up and make it inactive. Histone modifications can affect how accessible a region of DNA is, making a gene more or less active. One way to understand how these modifications can alter gene expression without changing the DNA sequence is to think of the effect font has on text. Precisely the same letters arranged into the same series of words can have a different impact if the font emphasizes certain words:

My mistress' eyes are nothing like the sun;
My mistress' eyes are nothing like the sun;
My mistress' eyes are nothing like the sun;

Over the past few years, several studies have compared the epigenetic modifications of our genome with that of other great apes, leading to an emerging picture of the importance of epigenetics in our recent evolutionary history. Last year, Shulha et al compared the prevalence of a specific histone modification in DNA from human, chimpanzee, and macaque neurons; they found nearly 500 genes with a human-specific modification pattern. Draft versions of the gorilla and bonobo genome published last year enabled researchers to expand their analysis to include a wider range of great apes. Hernando-Herraez et al did just that in a paper published this month. By comparing the methylation patterns in the genomes of all great ape species, they discovered that each one had a distinct pattern, including 171 genes specifically methylated in humans, 101 in Pan species (chimps and bonobos), 101 in Gorilla species, and nearly 450 in Pongo species.

The role of epigenetics in evolution (particularly primate evolution) is an active and exciting area of research; these are just two examples that I've picked from a wide range of papers on the topic. If you're interested in learning more, have a look at the (open access!) papers below and the references they cite. In evolution, as in everything else, it's not what you've got; it's what you do with it.

Further reading
Shulha HP, Crisci JL, Reshetov D, Tushir JS, Cheung I, et al. (2012) Human-Specific Histone Methylation Signatures at Transcription Start Sites in Prefrontal Neurons. PLoS Biology 10(11): e1001427. doi:10.1371/journal.pbio.1001427

Hernando-Herraez I, Prado-Martinez J, Garg P, Fernandez-Callejo M, Heyn H, et al. (2013) Dynamics of DNA Methylation in Recent Human and Great Ape Evolution. PLoS Genetics 9(9): e1003763. doi:10.1371/journal.pgen.1003763

Be sure to include references in your rebuttal.

Your turn.

What part of "I'm not getting into that" did you miss? You have your opinion on the THEORY of evolution and I have mine. Have a good day

You don't have an opinion. You have a dogmatic fundamentalist religious belief. Did you know that the majority of Christians accept the theory of evolution? So what does that make you?

But hey, I knew that you would make a boast about your intellectual prowess and then pussy out when the shit hit the fan. It is what you people are best at. Congratulations.

 

[SassyIrishLass]

It's theory, nothing more and nothing less.

Proving that you didn't even bother to read the article because you prefer to be willfully ignorant. Congratulations.

Dude for every article you post and I can post one refuting it. I'm not going into that BS. It's a theory

Great. Let's play that game.

Epigenetics and Evolution

Epigenetics and Evolution Accumulating Glitches Learn Science at Scitable

We share most of our genome with our closest relatives, the other great apes, and yet each species looks and acts quite different from the others. How is this possible? If humans, chimps, and bonobos share around 99% of our DNA, how come we're so different?

An explanation that has emerged over the last several years is that the differences between great apes don't come solely from differences in what genes we have, but also in how they're regulated. Extremely similar genomes can still give rise to different organisms if the genes are activated at different times and strengths. Genes are generally activated when a specific protein binds to their promoter, a short stretch of DNA just before the start of each gene; the protein then reads the DNA that constitutes the gene and makes an RNA "working copy" which is used by the cell. Cells can regulate the activity of a particular gene by controlling when and how these proteins bind to its promoter.

Cells use an abundance of methods to accomplish this, from managing which proteins have access to the nucleus to changing the structure of proteins to control or destroy them. While those are fascinating and important processes (and the subject of a whole field of study!), they're not the subject of this post. Instead, I'd like to focus on epigenetic modifications, adjustments to the DNA which don't change the sequence itself (the string of A,T,G, and C) but still affect how it gets read. Epigenetic modifications are a bit like ornaments on a Christmas tree; the tree (the DNA sequence) is still the same, but the decorations (epigenetic modifications) change how it's perceived.

Two major kinds of epigenetic modifications are methylation, where a chemical group (a methyl) is attached to the DNA in specific locations, and histone modification, chemical modifications of a histone, a scaffolding protein in the nucleus which acts as a spool around which DNA is wound. Methylation usually reduces the activity of a gene, either by blocking proteins from binding to its promoter or by recruiting other proteins that wrap the DNA up and make it inactive. Histone modifications can affect how accessible a region of DNA is, making a gene more or less active. One way to understand how these modifications can alter gene expression without changing the DNA sequence is to think of the effect font has on text. Precisely the same letters arranged into the same series of words can have a different impact if the font emphasizes certain words:

My mistress' eyes are nothing like the sun;
My mistress' eyes are nothing like the sun;
My mistress' eyes are nothing like the sun;

Over the past few years, several studies have compared the epigenetic modifications of our genome with that of other great apes, leading to an emerging picture of the importance of epigenetics in our recent evolutionary history. Last year, Shulha et al compared the prevalence of a specific histone modification in DNA from human, chimpanzee, and macaque neurons; they found nearly 500 genes with a human-specific modification pattern. Draft versions of the gorilla and bonobo genome published last year enabled researchers to expand their analysis to include a wider range of great apes. Hernando-Herraez et al did just that in a paper published this month. By comparing the methylation patterns in the genomes of all great ape species, they discovered that each one had a distinct pattern, including 171 genes specifically methylated in humans, 101 in Pan species (chimps and bonobos), 101 in Gorilla species, and nearly 450 in Pongo species.

The role of epigenetics in evolution (particularly primate evolution) is an active and exciting area of research; these are just two examples that I've picked from a wide range of papers on the topic. If you're interested in learning more, have a look at the (open access!) papers below and the references they cite. In evolution, as in everything else, it's not what you've got; it's what you do with it.

Further reading
Shulha HP, Crisci JL, Reshetov D, Tushir JS, Cheung I, et al. (2012) Human-Specific Histone Methylation Signatures at Transcription Start Sites in Prefrontal Neurons. PLoS Biology 10(11): e1001427. doi:10.1371/journal.pbio.1001427

Hernando-Herraez I, Prado-Martinez J, Garg P, Fernandez-Callejo M, Heyn H, et al. (2013) Dynamics of DNA Methylation in Recent Human and Great Ape Evolution. PLoS Genetics 9(9): e1003763. doi:10.1371/journal.pgen.1003763

Be sure to include references in your rebuttal.

Your turn.

What part of "I'm not getting into that" did you miss? You have your opinion on the THEORY of evolution and I have mine. Have a good day

You don't have an opinion. You have a dogmatic fundamentalist religious belief. Did you know that the majority of Christians accept the theory of evolution? So what does that make you?

But hey, I knew that you would make a boast about your intellectual prowess and then pussy out when the shit hit the fan. It is what you people are best at. Congratulations.

Bleh, you don't know me so cease pretending you do

 

[usfan]

Translation: Evidence is not evidence because the bible told me so.
Listen pal, if you want to have an informal, honest discussion about the science of evolution, we can do that. If you want real hard scientific data on the subject, I suggest you take a class, subscribe to a peer reviewed scientific journal, or get a degree and do your own research, because this is not the place where you are going to get it. The evidence is out there for anyone who actually cares enough to find it. It isn't like it is being hidden by some mass conspiracy of the world's scientists. All it takes is a fucking visit to the library. Otherwise, I don't give a damn what you think I should do for you.

Ooo.. is that some real righteous indignation? Yet you accuse me of being religious?

Projecting, once again. You made a mistake, and rather than being a man and admitting to it, you are DODGING the issue. You thought donkeys were hybrids that could not produce viable offspring instead of being a true species. You are wrong, and you know it. Fess up like a man or resolve yourself to the fact that you are a woos.

You don't have an opinion. You have a dogmatic fundamentalist religious belief. Did you know that the majority of Christians accept the theory of evolution? So what does that make you?
But hey, I knew that you would make a boast about your intellectual prowess and then pussy out when the shit hit the fan. It is what you people are best at. Congratulations.

Still dogmatic religious assertions, without any scientific evidence. It is sad, really. You want to deflect with a flame war, & are doing your best to provoke me. That can be done in another thread, if you wish, but this is the CDZ, & it supposed to be a place for rational debate.

Still no evidence. Just ad hominem. Dodging the issue, deflecting from the topic, & ignoring the real problems of science & logic. I can point this out from time to time, but it does NOT contribute anything to the discussion. It evades it.

 

[usfan]

Since there seems to be a drift from the topic, i though i would remind what it is, & call for actual rebuttal on the points listed, instead of handwaving assertions.

I propose a scientific debate on the topic of evolution.
Does evolution provide a scientific & logical explanation for the origins & complexity of life?

I say it does not. Here are my reasons:
1. Micro evolution, or natural selection, explains how species adapt to their environment. The result of this adaptation is a decrease in diversity in the species, as the gene pool promotes those traits that are favorable to the environment. This is dark moths adapting to dark bark on trees, white rabbits doing better in the snow, & other natural selection processes. This kind of evolution does not increase complexity, but decreases it, as fewer genetic traits become available to the species. There is no known mechanism that causes an increase in genetic complexity. Mutations are aberrations in the genetic code, seldom produce anything positive for the species, & do not increase the complexity of the life form. It does not indicate macro evolution.

2. To say that micro evolution proves 'macro' evolution is a leap of logic. It is like saying that since people can travel easily between towns, they can travel easily between planets. There is a major difference between natural selection, which is a scientifically observable phenomenon used in breeding & hybridization, and the increase in complexity in a life form.

3. There is no mechanism that can explain why or how life can become more complex through evolution. It is assumed, & that is a faulty assumption. It is not good science, nor good logic. Neither mutation nor millions of years provide any mechanism or even explanation of HOW, but it is erroneously extrapolated based on natural selection. But just asserting that a species adapted over millions of years does not make it true, nor is it based on any scientific or logical constructs. It is speculation & fantasy.

4. One of the most basic concepts in science is that of entropy, or the tendency of all things to move to less complexity. Unless acted upon by an outside source, all of the universe is moving toward equilibrium & a simpler state. There is no known mechanism that explains HOW or WHAT is causing life to increase in complexity. If anything, in recorded history, life is decreasing in complexity & diversity. Unique species are lost, and distinct new ones are not being added. We have variation within a life form's genetic limitations, but no moving into more complexity. This is what you would expect with entropy, & it brings a major difficulty to those claiming an increase in complexity through evolution.

5. As to origins, there is no mechanism or procedure that can create life.. real, reproducing life, not just some amino acids or 'building blocks' of life. There is nothing that can be measured, repeated, falsified, or even theorized. It is a leap of faith to believe life began spontaneously & increased in complexity for millions of years. There is no valid scientific explanation for this, even though it is asserted as fact in many spheres.

I am not making an argument for special creation, or alien seeding, or any other theories or speculations of origins. I am including evolution with the others. Our origins are a mystery, which science & logic have not been able to explain to this point. Macro evolution, or the increase in complexity in life forms, is an unproven speculation & fantasy. It is a leap of faith.. a religious opinion.. not science.

 

[orogenicman]

Proving that you didn't even bother to read the article because you prefer to be willfully ignorant. Congratulations.

Dude for every article you post and I can post one refuting it. I'm not going into that BS. It's a theory

Great. Let's play that game.

Epigenetics and Evolution

Epigenetics and Evolution Accumulating Glitches Learn Science at Scitable

We share most of our genome with our closest relatives, the other great apes, and yet each species looks and acts quite different from the others. How is this possible? If humans, chimps, and bonobos share around 99% of our DNA, how come we're so different?

An explanation that has emerged over the last several years is that the differences between great apes don't come solely from differences in what genes we have, but also in how they're regulated. Extremely similar genomes can still give rise to different organisms if the genes are activated at different times and strengths. Genes are generally activated when a specific protein binds to their promoter, a short stretch of DNA just before the start of each gene; the protein then reads the DNA that constitutes the gene and makes an RNA "working copy" which is used by the cell. Cells can regulate the activity of a particular gene by controlling when and how these proteins bind to its promoter.

Cells use an abundance of methods to accomplish this, from managing which proteins have access to the nucleus to changing the structure of proteins to control or destroy them. While those are fascinating and important processes (and the subject of a whole field of study!), they're not the subject of this post. Instead, I'd like to focus on epigenetic modifications, adjustments to the DNA which don't change the sequence itself (the string of A,T,G, and C) but still affect how it gets read. Epigenetic modifications are a bit like ornaments on a Christmas tree; the tree (the DNA sequence) is still the same, but the decorations (epigenetic modifications) change how it's perceived.

Two major kinds of epigenetic modifications are methylation, where a chemical group (a methyl) is attached to the DNA in specific locations, and histone modification, chemical modifications of a histone, a scaffolding protein in the nucleus which acts as a spool around which DNA is wound. Methylation usually reduces the activity of a gene, either by blocking proteins from binding to its promoter or by recruiting other proteins that wrap the DNA up and make it inactive. Histone modifications can affect how accessible a region of DNA is, making a gene more or less active. One way to understand how these modifications can alter gene expression without changing the DNA sequence is to think of the effect font has on text. Precisely the same letters arranged into the same series of words can have a different impact if the font emphasizes certain words:

My mistress' eyes are nothing like the sun;
My mistress' eyes are nothing like the sun;
My mistress' eyes are nothing like the sun;

Over the past few years, several studies have compared the epigenetic modifications of our genome with that of other great apes, leading to an emerging picture of the importance of epigenetics in our recent evolutionary history. Last year, Shulha et al compared the prevalence of a specific histone modification in DNA from human, chimpanzee, and macaque neurons; they found nearly 500 genes with a human-specific modification pattern. Draft versions of the gorilla and bonobo genome published last year enabled researchers to expand their analysis to include a wider range of great apes. Hernando-Herraez et al did just that in a paper published this month. By comparing the methylation patterns in the genomes of all great ape species, they discovered that each one had a distinct pattern, including 171 genes specifically methylated in humans, 101 in Pan species (chimps and bonobos), 101 in Gorilla species, and nearly 450 in Pongo species.

The role of epigenetics in evolution (particularly primate evolution) is an active and exciting area of research; these are just two examples that I've picked from a wide range of papers on the topic. If you're interested in learning more, have a look at the (open access!) papers below and the references they cite. In evolution, as in everything else, it's not what you've got; it's what you do with it.

Further reading
Shulha HP, Crisci JL, Reshetov D, Tushir JS, Cheung I, et al. (2012) Human-Specific Histone Methylation Signatures at Transcription Start Sites in Prefrontal Neurons. PLoS Biology 10(11): e1001427. doi:10.1371/journal.pbio.1001427

Hernando-Herraez I, Prado-Martinez J, Garg P, Fernandez-Callejo M, Heyn H, et al. (2013) Dynamics of DNA Methylation in Recent Human and Great Ape Evolution. PLoS Genetics 9(9): e1003763. doi:10.1371/journal.pgen.1003763

Be sure to include references in your rebuttal.

Your turn.

What part of "I'm not getting into that" did you miss? You have your opinion on the THEORY of evolution and I have mine. Have a good day

You don't have an opinion. You have a dogmatic fundamentalist religious belief. Did you know that the majority of Christians accept the theory of evolution? So what does that make you?

But hey, I knew that you would make a boast about your intellectual prowess and then pussy out when the shit hit the fan. It is what you people are best at. Congratulations.

Bleh, you don't know me so cease pretending you do

I don't have to know you to know what you are doing here. It isn't like you are taking pains to hide your motives.

 

[SassyIrishLass]

Dude for every article you post and I can post one refuting it. I'm not going into that BS. It's a theory

Great. Let's play that game.

Epigenetics and Evolution

Epigenetics and Evolution Accumulating Glitches Learn Science at Scitable

We share most of our genome with our closest relatives, the other great apes, and yet each species looks and acts quite different from the others. How is this possible? If humans, chimps, and bonobos share around 99% of our DNA, how come we're so different?

An explanation that has emerged over the last several years is that the differences between great apes don't come solely from differences in what genes we have, but also in how they're regulated. Extremely similar genomes can still give rise to different organisms if the genes are activated at different times and strengths. Genes are generally activated when a specific protein binds to their promoter, a short stretch of DNA just before the start of each gene; the protein then reads the DNA that constitutes the gene and makes an RNA "working copy" which is used by the cell. Cells can regulate the activity of a particular gene by controlling when and how these proteins bind to its promoter.

Cells use an abundance of methods to accomplish this, from managing which proteins have access to the nucleus to changing the structure of proteins to control or destroy them. While those are fascinating and important processes (and the subject of a whole field of study!), they're not the subject of this post. Instead, I'd like to focus on epigenetic modifications, adjustments to the DNA which don't change the sequence itself (the string of A,T,G, and C) but still affect how it gets read. Epigenetic modifications are a bit like ornaments on a Christmas tree; the tree (the DNA sequence) is still the same, but the decorations (epigenetic modifications) change how it's perceived.

Two major kinds of epigenetic modifications are methylation, where a chemical group (a methyl) is attached to the DNA in specific locations, and histone modification, chemical modifications of a histone, a scaffolding protein in the nucleus which acts as a spool around which DNA is wound. Methylation usually reduces the activity of a gene, either by blocking proteins from binding to its promoter or by recruiting other proteins that wrap the DNA up and make it inactive. Histone modifications can affect how accessible a region of DNA is, making a gene more or less active. One way to understand how these modifications can alter gene expression without changing the DNA sequence is to think of the effect font has on text. Precisely the same letters arranged into the same series of words can have a different impact if the font emphasizes certain words:

My mistress' eyes are nothing like the sun;
My mistress' eyes are nothing like the sun;
My mistress' eyes are nothing like the sun;

Over the past few years, several studies have compared the epigenetic modifications of our genome with that of other great apes, leading to an emerging picture of the importance of epigenetics in our recent evolutionary history. Last year, Shulha et al compared the prevalence of a specific histone modification in DNA from human, chimpanzee, and macaque neurons; they found nearly 500 genes with a human-specific modification pattern. Draft versions of the gorilla and bonobo genome published last year enabled researchers to expand their analysis to include a wider range of great apes. Hernando-Herraez et al did just that in a paper published this month. By comparing the methylation patterns in the genomes of all great ape species, they discovered that each one had a distinct pattern, including 171 genes specifically methylated in humans, 101 in Pan species (chimps and bonobos), 101 in Gorilla species, and nearly 450 in Pongo species.

The role of epigenetics in evolution (particularly primate evolution) is an active and exciting area of research; these are just two examples that I've picked from a wide range of papers on the topic. If you're interested in learning more, have a look at the (open access!) papers below and the references they cite. In evolution, as in everything else, it's not what you've got; it's what you do with it.

Further reading
Shulha HP, Crisci JL, Reshetov D, Tushir JS, Cheung I, et al. (2012) Human-Specific Histone Methylation Signatures at Transcription Start Sites in Prefrontal Neurons. PLoS Biology 10(11): e1001427. doi:10.1371/journal.pbio.1001427

Hernando-Herraez I, Prado-Martinez J, Garg P, Fernandez-Callejo M, Heyn H, et al. (2013) Dynamics of DNA Methylation in Recent Human and Great Ape Evolution. PLoS Genetics 9(9): e1003763. doi:10.1371/journal.pgen.1003763

Be sure to include references in your rebuttal.

Your turn.

What part of "I'm not getting into that" did you miss? You have your opinion on the THEORY of evolution and I have mine. Have a good day

You don't have an opinion. You have a dogmatic fundamentalist religious belief. Did you know that the majority of Christians accept the theory of evolution? So what does that make you?

But hey, I knew that you would make a boast about your intellectual prowess and then pussy out when the shit hit the fan. It is what you people are best at. Congratulations.

Bleh, you don't know me so cease pretending you do

I don't have to know you to know what you are doing here. It isn't like you are taking pains to hide your motives.

Motives? Pulease old man, you're simply not important. I know that's crushing to your ego and how you feel about yourself but the fact is I think you're a loon

 

[orogenicman]

Translation: Evidence is not evidence because the bible told me so.
Listen pal, if you want to have an informal, honest discussion about the science of evolution, we can do that. If you want real hard scientific data on the subject, I suggest you take a class, subscribe to a peer reviewed scientific journal, or get a degree and do your own research, because this is not the place where you are going to get it. The evidence is out there for anyone who actually cares enough to find it. It isn't like it is being hidden by some mass conspiracy of the world's scientists. All it takes is a fucking visit to the library. Otherwise, I don't give a damn what you think I should do for you.

Ooo.. is that some real righteous indignation? Yet you accuse me of being religious?

Projecting, once again. You made a mistake, and rather than being a man and admitting to it, you are DODGING the issue. You thought donkeys were hybrids that could not produce viable offspring instead of being a true species. You are wrong, and you know it. Fess up like a man or resolve yourself to the fact that you are a woos.

You don't have an opinion. You have a dogmatic fundamentalist religious belief. Did you know that the majority of Christians accept the theory of evolution? So what does that make you?
But hey, I knew that you would make a boast about your intellectual prowess and then pussy out when the shit hit the fan. It is what you people are best at. Congratulations.

Still dogmatic religious assertions, without any scientific evidence. It is sad, really. You want to deflect with a flame war, & are doing your best to provoke me. That can be done in another thread, if you wish, but this is the CDZ, & it supposed to be a place for rational debate.

Still no evidence. Just ad hominem. Dodging the issue, deflecting from the topic, & ignoring the real problems of science & logic. I can point this out from time to time, but it does NOT contribute anything to the discussion. It evades it.

Still dodging the mistake you made because you aren't man enough to admit your faults and that you are blatantly anti-science. How sad for you.

 

[orogenicman]

Great. Let's play that game.

Epigenetics and Evolution

Epigenetics and Evolution Accumulating Glitches Learn Science at Scitable

Be sure to include references in your rebuttal.

Your turn.

What part of "I'm not getting into that" did you miss? You have your opinion on the THEORY of evolution and I have mine. Have a good day

You don't have an opinion. You have a dogmatic fundamentalist religious belief. Did you know that the majority of Christians accept the theory of evolution? So what does that make you?

But hey, I knew that you would make a boast about your intellectual prowess and then pussy out when the shit hit the fan. It is what you people are best at. Congratulations.

Bleh, you don't know me so cease pretending you do

I don't have to know you to know what you are doing here. It isn't like you are taking pains to hide your motives.

Motives? Pulease old man, you're simply not important. I know that's crushing to your ego and how you feel about yourself but the fact is I think you're a loon

And yet here you are...

 

[usfan]

Translation: Evidence is not evidence because the bible told me so.
Listen pal, if you want to have an informal, honest discussion about the science of evolution, we can do that. If you want real hard scientific data on the subject, I suggest you take a class, subscribe to a peer reviewed scientific journal, or get a degree and do your own research, because this is not the place where you are going to get it. The evidence is out there for anyone who actually cares enough to find it. It isn't like it is being hidden by some mass conspiracy of the world's scientists. All it takes is a fucking visit to the library. Otherwise, I don't give a damn what you think I should do for you.

Translation: I don't have any evidence, so i'll deflect with indignation & provide logical fallacies to hide the impotence of my arguments.

Is that how this game is played? ..kind of lame, if you ask me. I think i will bow out of this 'game', & wait for some rational posters who want to discuss the issue..