Einstein on Corporations

[peach174]

I agree.

Until congress changes the corruption will only increase as the money is concentrated into fewer and fewer hands with each passing generation.

Republicans AND Democrats are currently wholly owned subsidiaries of Wall Street.

I don't believe it's possible change the way congress does business by "choosing" between Republican OR Democrat in the voting booth.

If 100 incumbents (or more) are FLUSHED from DC in November 2012 and replaced by Greens and Libertarians, Wall Street and the richest 5% of Americans and the Pentagon will face the same nightmare they've been inflicting upon the rest of us for the last 30 years.

IMHO, Republicans AND Democrats have outlived their usefulness to this Republic, and that Republic will vanish from the page of time unless Dems AND Reps disappear first.

Yes we can, we are the ones who hire and fire them. If they don't keep the campaign promises we fire them and get new ones who will. When they start to see that the old way of doing things will get them fired,it will start to change things. We will see how the 80new ones do, it has already started a few new things, like cutting spending, which never even would have been debated at all had they not been hired by the voters.
It is going to take maybe 2 or 3 more elections in order for things to start changing but I think that we will be able to do so.

 

[georgephillip]

Without capital how does one start a business?

You already appreciate the answer to your question far more than I.

How do you start a business without labor.

"Labor is prior to, and independent of, capital. Capital is only the fruit of labor, and could never have existed if labor had not first existed. Labor is the superior of capital, and deserves much the higher consideration.
Abraham Lincoln

Labor is prior to, and... at BrainyQuote

I started every one of my corporations without labor. I WAS THE DAMN LABOR.
Then I grew.
If someone wants a job with me they shut the fuck up, go to work and then I will determine if they are worthy of another weeks work.
If they do not like it, FUCK THEM.
Let them go find another job.
Most of my few employees are long time employees, well paid with profit sharing and love the environment.
NO CRY BABIES.

As I'm sure you've noticed:

"The political axiom at work is 'Big fish eat little fish.'

"There’s not enough tax money to continue swelling the fortunes of the super-rich pretending to save enough to pay the pensions and related social support that North American and European employees have been promised. Something must give – and the rich have shown themselves sufficiently foresighted to seize the initiative..."

If Goldman Sachs decides to stick its money funnel into your corporations, you won't last as long as Lehman Brothers did.

How much will your hard work be worth at that point?

Michael Hudson: Obama's Greatest Betrayal

 

[georgephillip]

I agree.

Until congress changes the corruption will only increase as the money is concentrated into fewer and fewer hands with each passing generation.

Republicans AND Democrats are currently wholly owned subsidiaries of Wall Street.

I don't believe it's possible change the way congress does business by "choosing" between Republican OR Democrat in the voting booth.

If 100 incumbents (or more) are FLUSHED from DC in November 2012 and replaced by Greens and Libertarians, Wall Street and the richest 5% of Americans and the Pentagon will face the same nightmare they've been inflicting upon the rest of us for the last 30 years.

IMHO, Republicans AND Democrats have outlived their usefulness to this Republic, and that Republic will vanish from the page of time unless Dems AND Reps disappear first.

Yes we can, we are the ones who hire and fire them. If they don't keep the campaign promises we fire them and get new ones who will. When they start to see that the old way of doing things will get them fired,it will start to change things. We will see how the 80new ones do, it has already started a few new things, like cutting spending, which never even would have been debated at all had they not been hired by the voters.
It is going to take maybe 2 or 3 more elections in order for things to start changing but I think that we will be able to do so.

How many more millionaires will get elected to congress over the next 2 or 3 elections?

How much wider will the gap between the richest 1% and the other 99% of Americans become?

How many newly elected Republicans OR Democrats are likely to investigate the fraud and corruption at the Pentagon? Few if any of the newly elected "budget cutters", apparently:

"In their first months in Washington, the armed services freshmen have, for the most part, checked their anti-Washington attitudes at the door and adopted the ways of the insiders.

Nothing of substance changes in DC as long as we continue "choosing" between Democrat OR Republican.

Armed services frosh in balancing act - Marin Cogan - POLITICO.com

 

[initforme]

We have to get the big money out of campaigns. Until we do the hard working people(that excludes the ultra wealthy) will control everything no matter the party. The system is so corrupt now it doesnt resemble anything like a democratic republic. It looks like a plutocracy. I am having my grand daughter write a paper for her history class about how america is becoming a plutocracy. We have found much to go on. Scary.

 

[georgephillip]

I don't think that there's one person here who doesn't want our business community to succeed. That is a falsehood that the Conservative spin masters love to throw out there, but very far from the truth.

The truth is, what Progressives want is for Corporations to realize that all of their antics are hurting the very people they depend upon to buy their shit. But either they don't realize it... or because of globalization and all the cheap labor readily available... they don't care. Because while they can gouge the US citizen to the breaking point(in other words..."ride the horse till she bucks you"), they can also sell their wares to lesser countries at a much cheaper price and still make a profit(cheap labor).

The problem I see is that there are no solutions other than for these big entities to grow a sense of conscience or for the American worker to work for virtually nothing(factoring the cost of living).

So yeah, we want our Businesses to be successful, but they have to remember that it's our wages that are making them successful, our country that allows them to be successful, and that in this country there is such a thing as "one person/one vote". That's their biggest fear. We can topple the profiteers if we so choose. We can, on one November day, wipe the floor with them and demand a better way of doing things.

It's time to stop asking these entities NICELY to please, PLEASE trickle down like you are supposed to and not hoard it all for yourselves.... and start DEMANDING them to. Why in THE HELL do you think they are going after organized labor so hard? Sure, it's easy to start a propaganda war against unions... and I will freely admit, SOME of their accusations have some merit. But that's not the motivation... the motivation is to get more control and give less to the people.

So many of you on here think that this whole thing is Capitalism vs. Socialism. That's the Propaganda machine. The truth is, it's more like a hybrid of the two. We want our Corporations to succeed and at the same time have a sense of responsibility when it comes down to the people of the country.

They are smart people.... they know what to do, but they are so drunk on money and power that they refuse to do it.

EASTERN AIRLINES.
The unions purposefully wanted them to fail.
And they did.

You're forgetting the role Frank Lorenzo and junk bonds played in Eastern's demise:

"The inside account of how Frank Lorenzo took over a sputtering Eastern Airlines and flew it into the ground. With access to the major players -- the guarded Lorenzo and his inner circle, former Eastern Airlines president Frank Borman, Peter Ueberroth, and union boss Charlie Bryan -- author Aaron Bernstein explains how Lorenzo brought a corporate raider's mentality to running a business, and how its failure marked a watershed in the 1980s 'Age of Greed.'"

Grounded: Frank Lorenzo and the Destruction of Eastern Airlines

 

[georgephillip]

We have to get the big money out of campaigns. Until we do the hard working people(that excludes the ultra wealthy) will control everything no matter the party. The system is so corrupt now it doesnt resemble anything like a democratic republic. It looks like a plutocracy. I am having my grand daughter write a paper for her history class about how america is becoming a plutocracy. We have found much to go on. Scary.

"For the last 500 years the only thing worse for any politician than getting caught doing business with organized crime was losing control of the revenue streams that criminal activity produces."

This was one of the first quotes by Catherine Austin Fitts that I came across.

If you and your grand-daughter are serious about understanding just how deep the corruption goes in America, I would suggest starting with Catherine's site, solari.com

I enclosing a link to missing billion$ in HUD (where Catherine worked during Bush I)

There are trillion$ in total missing from HUD and the Pentagon.

You might also take a look at "Dillon Read & the Aristocracy of Stock Profits" for a sense of just how far back the housing bubble really started.

Deja Vu View - $59 Billion Missing from HUD at The Solari Report Blog

You're absolutely right, imho, about the corruption big money produces.
That's why many of the wealthy are completely oblivious to the misery their fortunes depend on.
The only word they truly understand is M-O-R-E.

 

[code1211]

"Unequal Protection": The People's Masters | Truthout

"The results of these developments is an oligarchy of private capital the enormous power of which cannot be effectively checked even by democratically organized political society."

The oligarchs certainly need corporations in their world.

I'm not sure humanity does.

I, on the ohter hand, am quite certain that humanity does. The world population, in, truth, even the comparitively sparse population of the USA, needs corporations to feed itself.

Without corporations, humanity perishes in worldwide famine.

 

[code1211]

Without capital how does one start a business?

You already appreciate the answer to your question far more than I.

How do you start a business without labor.

"Labor is prior to, and independent of, capital. Capital is only the fruit of labor, and could never have existed if labor had not first existed. Labor is the superior of capital, and deserves much the higher consideration.
Abraham Lincoln

Labor is prior to, and... at BrainyQuote

I started every one of my corporations without labor. I WAS THE DAMN LABOR.
Then I grew.
If someone wants a job with me they shut the fuck up, go to work and then I will determine if they are worthy of another weeks work.
If they do not like it, FUCK THEM.
Let them go find another job.
Most of my few employees are long time employees, well paid with profit sharing and love the environment.
NO CRY BABIES.

Well said. I learned a long time ago that the best way to get anything done is to start doing it. I've done allot of volunteer work. I knew how to do it before I knew how to spell it.

After the first several go rounds with volunteers milling around waiting for someone to tell them what to do, it finally occurred to me to just start doing it. Paint the house or clear the lot or pick up the rocks or lay down the gravel. Just do something.

If one guy is working, someone else will join in and pretty soon, everyone is doing something and the job is getting done.

What a concept! Work works!.

 

[code1211]

I still say that we the people need to elect house and senate Representatives who will change the laws in how congress does business. We have to get the money out of the hands of lobbyists.The Campaign laws need to be changed. Unions should not be able to give to campaigns just like corporations can't. They can run ads for who they would like to be elected but not be able to give.
We also need to change our tax laws.
These three things are what is causing the corruption in Washington.
What is it you want ? To get rid of corporations? Then what, have a barter and trade system? Some are already starting to do that.
But It would not change the corruption in our government until we change the way congress does it's business.

We already have an organization dedicated to the removal of money from the lobbyists.

It's called Congress.

 

[initforme]

"I started every one of my corporations without labor. I WAS THE DAMN LABOR.
Then I grew.
If someone wants a job with me they shut the fuck up, go to work and then I will determine if they are worthy of another weeks work.
If they do not like it, FUCK THEM.
Let them go find another job.
Most of my few employees are long time employees, well paid with profit sharing and love the environment.
NO CRY BABIES."


Ok GOD. Why hire when you can do it yourself? Makes no sense.

 

[georgephillip]

I, on the ohter hand, am quite certain that humanity does. The world population, in, truth, even the comparitively sparse population of the USA, needs corporations to feed itself.

Without corporations, humanity perishes in worldwide famine.

Once upon a time corporations were ruled by citizens and their elected representatives.

"States also limited corporate charters to a set number of years. Unless a legislature renewed an expiring charter, the corporation was dissolved and its assets were divided among shareholders.

"Citizen authority clauses limited capitalization, debts, land holdings, and sometimes, even profits. They required a company's accounting books to be turned over to a legislature upon request.

"The power of large shareholders was limited by scaled voting, so that large and small investors had equal voting rights. Interlocking directorates were outlawed. Shareholders had the right to remove directors at will.

"In Europe, charters protected directors and stockholders from liability for debts and harms caused by their corporations. American legislators explicitly rejected this corporate shield. The penalty for abuse or misuse of the charter was not a plea bargain and a fine, but dissolution of the corporation."

History of Corporations (United States)

Since at least 1819, judicial activists like Thomas, Scalia, and Roberts have served their masters' interests by steadily enlarging the power of corporations and big government.

Humanity won't survive another century of corporate pursuit of infinite growth on a planet of finite resources.

 

[peach174]

I still say that we the people need to elect house and senate Representatives who will change the laws in how congress does business. We have to get the money out of the hands of lobbyists.The Campaign laws need to be changed. Unions should not be able to give to campaigns just like corporations can't. They can run ads for who they would like to be elected but not be able to give.
We also need to change our tax laws.
These three things are what is causing the corruption in Washington.
What is it you want ? To get rid of corporations? Then what, have a barter and trade system? Some are already starting to do that.
But It would not change the corruption in our government until we change the way congress does it's business.

We already have an organization dedicated to the removal of money from the lobbyists.

It's called Congress.

Yes,I have been known to that sometimes - say things ass backwards.
I still laugh though when I do do it.

 

[Mr.Fitnah]

According to my uncle, who knew and worked with him, Einstein's political opinions were essentially those of the last person to speak to him on a topic. You will find his opinions to be all over the map, and not particularly strongly held.

 

[peach174]

Einstein never bothered with what he thought were trivial matters like politics.
He didn't care if his socks matched or if his hair was combed, all too small of things to think about.

 

[georgephillip]

Einstein's thoughts on Evil:

"The economic anarchy of capitalist society as it exists today is, in my opinion, the real source of the evil.

"We see before us a huge community of producers the members of which are unceasingly striving to deprive each other of the fruits of their collective labor - not by force, but on the whole in faithful compliance with legally established rules.

"I am convinced there is only one way to eliminate these grave evils, namely through the establishment of a socialist economy, accompanied by an educational system which would be oriented toward social goals."

Einstein Quotes on Society, Politics: What were Einstein's Political Beliefs? Einstein's Freethought Impacted his Social, Political, Economic Ideas

 

[Gadawg73]

The people who know how to create wealth can move wherever they want. If they don't pay their workers a living wage, there will be very few to buy whatever it is they produce.

Much of today's FIRE sector incomes doesn't involve creating anything of productive value. Wall Street functions like a casino with the taxpayers waiting to bail out the "too big to lose" losers. Big government, Wall Street and the richest 5% of Americans have recently proven government's ability to create wealth for a fortunate few while taxing the homes and pensions of millions of productive Americans into extinction.

Brother, you have it ass backwards.
It is up to the EMPLOYEE to educate themselves to find work where the market is for their skills.
If they do not have those skills that the market demands then they need to train and educate themselves for what the market demands.

Really? You do realize that On the job training was the mainstay of the majority of our workforce at one time right? Nowadays you need at least an Associate's degree to work in a Walmart auto center... a Bachelor's if you hope to run it one day.

You see the idea is to get our children $100K in debt before they start their lives... nothing like a good motivated employee that you can push around, right? There is a collusion going on in this country. The Corporate spoke out against Health Care, not because of "Socialism", but because it reduces their power. They Love the "employer based" health care system... much like they love graduates in debt.

Follow the money, think critically...even in your own direction.

I mean, I've been on this Earth 46 years, and in that time I've seen what pure Communism and Socialism can do. But over the past 20 years or so, I'm seeing how ugly Capitalism can become too.

You do not need any college degree to work in any auto center.
You NEED vocational auto mechanics training.
You do not know the difference between education and training.
On the job training? Hate to inform you there my man but we NOW comptete with India, China and many other countries that graduate literate teenagers that are already trained. We don't. They worked hard and learned what they needed to know BEFORE entering the job market. On the job training is a thing of the past. The global economy ended that decades ago.
Please join us in the real world. Your post is La La land. I am 56 and have a graduate degree, self employed and own 3 corporations. Degrees do not mean shit.
Preparation, perserverance and performance.

 

[Gadawg73]

You already appreciate the answer to your question far more than I.

How do you start a business without labor.

"Labor is prior to, and independent of, capital. Capital is only the fruit of labor, and could never have existed if labor had not first existed. Labor is the superior of capital, and deserves much the higher consideration.
Abraham Lincoln

Labor is prior to, and... at BrainyQuote

I started every one of my corporations without labor. I WAS THE DAMN LABOR.
Then I grew.
If someone wants a job with me they shut the fuck up, go to work and then I will determine if they are worthy of another weeks work.
If they do not like it, FUCK THEM.
Let them go find another job.
Most of my few employees are long time employees, well paid with profit sharing and love the environment.
NO CRY BABIES.

As I'm sure you've noticed:

"The political axiom at work is 'Big fish eat little fish.'

"There’s not enough tax money to continue swelling the fortunes of the super-rich pretending to save enough to pay the pensions and related social support that North American and European employees have been promised. Something must give – and the rich have shown themselves sufficiently foresighted to seize the initiative..."

If Goldman Sachs decides to stick its money funnel into your corporations, you won't last as long as Lehman Brothers did.

How much will your hard work be worth at that point?

Michael Hudson: Obama's Greatest Betrayal

My businesses have nothing to do with Lehman Brothers, are not structured that way, do not have the corporate structure they have, are not leveraged financially the same, do not market the same way, do not seek employees the same, do not offer the same benefits and in no way resemble them.
I do not do business with Goldman Sachs.
Is that the best you can do? My businesses are sound and do not borrow $$.
WE have the $$$.

 

[georgephillip]

"What you need to know is the big picture: If America is circling the drain, Goldman Sachs has found a way to be that drain — an extremely unfortunate loophole in the system of Western democratic capitalism, which never foresaw that in a society governed passively by free markets and free elections, organized greed always defeats disorganized democracy."

What happens to your sound businesses if the US dollar ceases to function as the world's reserve currency?

How much of your wealth is held in non-dollar denominated assets?

For "Government" Sachs alums like Hank Paulson, Robert Rubin, Robert Steel, Joshua Bolten, Mark Patterson and Ed Liddy, who hold much of their wealth in assets not based on the US dollar, inflation becomes an attractive way to make national debt disappear.

How do your businesses fare if inflation turns every $5 bill in this country into a $1?

Are you really arrogant enough to believe you will survive Great Depression 2.0 untouched?

The Great American Bubble Machine | Rolling Stone Politics

 

[bripat9643]

Once upon a time corporations were ruled by citizens and their elected representatives.

"States also limited corporate charters to a set number of years. Unless a legislature renewed an expiring charter, the corporation was dissolved and its assets were divided among shareholders.

"Citizen authority clauses limited capitalization, debts, land holdings, and sometimes, even profits. They required a company's accounting books to be turned over to a legislature upon request.

"The power of large shareholders was limited by scaled voting, so that large and small investors had equal voting rights. Interlocking directorates were outlawed. Shareholders had the right to remove directors at will.

"In Europe, charters protected directors and stockholders from liability for debts and harms caused by their corporations. American legislators explicitly rejected this corporate shield. The penalty for abuse or misuse of the charter was not a plea bargain and a fine, but dissolution of the corporation."

History of Corporations (United States)

Since at least 1819, judicial activists like Thomas, Scalia, and Roberts have served their masters' interests by steadily enlarging the power of corporations and big government.

Humanity won't survive another century of corporate pursuit of infinite growth on a planet of finite resources.

Your source is www.reclaimdemocracy.org That's about as credible as "The Daily Worker." Everything you posted is pure horseshit. American corporations never had "scaled voting" and shareholders have always had the right to remove directors, even now. Corporations have always had to make their books available to their shareholders, which means they are public information.

However, Democrats made it much harder for the directors to be removed when they passed all manner of laws to prevent so-called "corporate raiders" from buy a controlling interest in the company.

If corporations were dissolved every time they committed some infraction of the 146,000 pages of federal regulations, there wouldn't be any corporations. Certainly, no one would invest in a crap shoot with such terrible odds.

Pull your head out of the Kool-Aid jug.

 

[bripat9643]

Einstein's thoughts on Evil:

"The economic anarchy of capitalist society as it exists today is, in my opinion, the real source of the evil.

"We see before us a huge community of producers the members of which are unceasingly striving to deprive each other of the fruits of their collective labor - not by force, but on the whole in faithful compliance with legally established rules.

"I am convinced there is only one way to eliminate these grave evils, namely through the establishment of a socialist economy, accompanied by an educational system which would be oriented toward social goals."

Einstein Quotes on Society, Politics: What were Einstein's Political Beliefs? Einstein's Freethought Impacted his Social, Political, Economic Ideas

As I explained previously, if you want some expert opinion on economics, Einstein made a great physicist.