Due Process: for noncitizens but not for citizens?

Discussion in 'Law and Justice System' started by Amelia, Oct 1, 2011.

  1. Amelia
    Offline

    Amelia BANNED

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2011
    Messages:
    21,830
    Thanks Received:
    5,105
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Location:
    Packerland!
    Ratings:
    +5,119
    Do you think that noncitizens such as terrorist suspects from other countries and illegal aliens deserve due process under the Constitution of the United States?

    I find it ironic that some of the people who are so concerned for the rights of those who are living here illegally are not concerned about the precedent set by targeting an American citizen for death without so much as an indictment much less a conviction.






    Please note: the fifth amendment is a series of independent clauses which address different aspects of the kinds of legal proceedings the government can take against its citizens.

    The first clause is about the right to a grand jury. That clause gives an exception which says that members of the U.S. military may not be entitled to a grand jury in times of war or public danger. That is not applicable to the case of Awlaki. He was not a U.S. service member.

    The due process clause is a separate issue. Just like the double jeopardy clause is a separate issue. Etc.
     
  2. waltky
    Online

    waltky Wise ol' monkey Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2011
    Messages:
    20,817
    Thanks Received:
    1,789
    Trophy Points:
    215
    Location:
    Okolona, KY
    Ratings:
    +3,871
    He was a known traitor, even flaunted it publicly...
    :cool:
    Most Successful Drone Strike Ever: Were Three Al Qaeda Leaders Killed?
    Oct. 1, 2011 - The CIA drone strike that killed Al Qaeda leader Anwar al-Awlaki and chief propagandist Samir Khan may also have taken out the terror organization's top bombmaker.
    See also:

    NATO captures senior Haqqani leader in Afghanistan
    1 Oct.`11 – NATO captured a senior leader of the al-Qaeda- and Taliban-allied Haqqani network active inside Afghanistan, the alliance said Saturday, describing it as a "significant milestone" in disrupting the terror group's operations.
     
  3. geauxtohell
    Offline

    geauxtohell Choose your weapon.

    Joined:
    Jun 27, 2009
    Messages:
    15,125
    Thanks Received:
    2,153
    Trophy Points:
    48
    Location:
    Out here in the middle.
    Ratings:
    +2,155
    I am glad we keep winnowing down on the Haqquanni network. I didn't think I'd ever see that day.

    A few months ago, they rocked them in my old AO, the Paktika Province, and killed 50 members. I'd been through the district where the raid was conducted many times. I am surprised that is where it went down.
     
  4. geauxtohell
    Offline

    geauxtohell Choose your weapon.

    Joined:
    Jun 27, 2009
    Messages:
    15,125
    Thanks Received:
    2,153
    Trophy Points:
    48
    Location:
    Out here in the middle.
    Ratings:
    +2,155
    Due process is a consideration after combatants are removed from the battlefield.

    I guess you could argue that this was an "illegal search and seizure", with killing being the ultimate form of seizure, but it's kind of hard to argue that a smoking carcass in Yeman was denied his right to trial.
     
  5. Mustang
    Offline

    Mustang Gold Member

    Joined:
    Jan 15, 2010
    Messages:
    7,218
    Thanks Received:
    1,300
    Trophy Points:
    190
    Location:
    39° 44 mins 21 secs N, 104° 59 mins 5 secs W
    Ratings:
    +1,792
    Illegal aliens are on our soil. Al-Awlaki was not. If al-Awlaki was on American soil, I would have a very serious problem with him being targeted for elimination because, at least theoretically, he could be captured by any number of law enforcement agencies from Federal agencies like the FBI to individual State's police force, and municiple police forces. However, he was overseas in a country where our laws do not apply, and he was actively plotting and planning attacks against Americans and American interests, both here and abroad. It would be the equivalent of an American fighting with the Nazis even if he wasn't wearing their uniform.
     
  6. C_Clayton_Jones
    Offline

    C_Clayton_Jones Diamond Member

    Joined:
    Apr 28, 2011
    Messages:
    41,543
    Thanks Received:
    8,933
    Trophy Points:
    2,030
    Location:
    In a Republic, actually
    Ratings:
    +23,869
    The Supreme Court does. In Boumediene v. Bush (2008), the Court ruled that non-citizen detainees held at Guantanamo Bay were entitled to due process rights:



    Prior to that ruling, in Hamdi v. Rumsfeld (2004), the Court held that an American accused of being an ‘enemy combatant’ was entitled to due process rights:

    Clearly the killing of Anwar al-Awlaki denied him ‘a fair opportunity to rebut the Government’s factual assertions before a neutral decisionmaker’ that he was indeed an ‘enemy of the state.’

    Consequently the arguments by some that al-Awlaki forfeited his due process rights or rights as an American citizen because he advocated the destruction of America, joined al-Qaeda, or otherwise declared himself a ‘terrorist’ has no factual basis in Constitutional case law.
     
  7. Mustang
    Offline

    Mustang Gold Member

    Joined:
    Jan 15, 2010
    Messages:
    7,218
    Thanks Received:
    1,300
    Trophy Points:
    190
    Location:
    39° 44 mins 21 secs N, 104° 59 mins 5 secs W
    Ratings:
    +1,792


    If he wanted his "due process" rights, he should have surrendered to whatever legal authority was nearest and requested extradition to the US.
     
    • Thank You! Thank You! x 2
  8. francoHFW
    Offline

    francoHFW Platinum Member

    Joined:
    Sep 5, 2011
    Messages:
    33,390
    Thanks Received:
    2,174
    Trophy Points:
    1,115
    Location:
    NY 26th FINALLY DEM!
    Ratings:
    +5,594
    The brainwashed idiocy of dittoheads reaches new heights...
     
  9. Amelia
    Offline

    Amelia BANNED

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2011
    Messages:
    21,830
    Thanks Received:
    5,105
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Location:
    Packerland!
    Ratings:
    +5,119
    People don't lose due process just because they are not on American soil.

    We can't just target any expatriate.

    They have rights under our Constitution no matter where they travel.
     
    • Thank You! Thank You! x 2
  10. chikenwing
    Offline

    chikenwing Guest

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2010
    Messages:
    7,389
    Thanks Received:
    830
    Trophy Points:
    190
    Ratings:
    +1,960
    We can't just target any expatriate.

    This guy didn't meet that description,he wasn't just anything but willing to kill anyone one of us,posters on this board included.
     

Share This Page