Do you feel we should end Medicare, Social Security and Medicaid?

[Mac1958]

Mac., are you for socialized medical care? Health care for everyone. With a coupld of twists?

If so, cool. You always do seem a little reasonable. But your buddies are gonna be mad.

I generally end up pissing off both ends of the spectrum at some point, which I consider to be a very good sign.



What I want is to significantly lower the cost of health care delivery, maximize access and maintain quality. And a public/private partnership can do that.

Those who scream about "socialized medicine" and "freedom" either don't or won't understand how much extra they are paying for their "freedom" because Rush doesn't get into that. The inability of millions of Americans to access preventive and diagnostic services is costing us a ton and damaging the system.

.

Total lie.

They have all the access they want...Nobody is physically preventing anyone from getting anything....They merely have to pay for services rendered.

A lot of this would go away if the pimps for socialized medical services would just admit that they're total cheapskates.

"They just have to pay for services rendered." Oh, that's all.

Okay, so we're going to pretend that millions of Americans don't avoid getting preventive and diagnostic services done because they can't afford it. We're going to ignorethat many people can't get health insurance because they can't afford it, can't pass underwriting or both. We're going to pretend that these people can just write a check for services rendered.

We're also going to ignore the fact that the diseases and conditions that many people have could have been treated much more cost-effectively if they had been caught earlier if those people could have had access to preventive and diagnostic services.

You're goddamn right I'm a cheapskate. I'm sick and tired of paying vastly inflated health care premiums and costs, inflated due to the fact that I'm paying for other people's treatment. Inflated due to the fact that so many people can't afford preventive and diagnostic services and end up costing system and me far more than they should.

If you want to keep chanting "socialism", quoting Rush and paying a shitload more than you should be for health care, that's your call. I'm a cheapskate, and I think this simple-minded lunacy.

.

 

[Greenbeard]

No, the question becomes: How does the staggering litany of evidence that your "in vogue" progressive/socialistic welfare dependence state is an absolute towering failure, exist as proof that even more of your know-it-all authoritarian central planner do-goodery is going to make the situation any better?

The situation has already improved markedly since the Medicare reforms were passed two and a half years ago.

The Obama administration should be broadcasting the news: Medicare spending is no longer growing at an unsustainable rate. Wednesday, Bloomberg columnist Peter Orszag commented on the “sharp deceleration” in Medicare’s outlays. A common way to evaluate the growth in spending for Medicare is to compare the increase per beneficiary to income per capita,” the former director of the Office of Management and Budget (OMB) wrote. “Over the past 30 years, this excess cost growth for Medicare has averaged about 2 percent a year. The goal of many policy proposals, including provisions in the 2010 Affordable Care Act, is to reduce the future excess cost growth to about 1 percent annually.”

What is astonishing is that Medicare is now exceeding that goal. Over the past year, “excess cost growth has been much less than the target of 1 percent,” Orszag reports. “According to the most recent figures from the Congressional Budget Office, total Medicare spending this year through June rose 4 percent from the previous year. Meanwhile, the number of Medicare beneficiaries rose by almost 4 percent, too, and income per capita rose by about 3 percent. So excess cost growth has been significantly below zero let alone below the target of 1 percent a year.”

 

[Oddball]

I generally end up pissing off both ends of the spectrum at some point, which I consider to be a very good sign.



What I want is to significantly lower the cost of health care delivery, maximize access and maintain quality. And a public/private partnership can do that.

Those who scream about "socialized medicine" and "freedom" either don't or won't understand how much extra they are paying for their "freedom" because Rush doesn't get into that. The inability of millions of Americans to access preventive and diagnostic services is costing us a ton and damaging the system.

.

Total lie.

They have all the access they want...Nobody is physically preventing anyone from getting anything....They merely have to pay for services rendered.

A lot of this would go away if the pimps for socialized medical services would just admit that they're total cheapskates.

"They just have to pay for services rendered." Oh, that's all.

Okay, so we're going to pretend that millions of Americans don't avoid getting preventive and diagnostic services done because they can't afford it. We're going to ignorethat many people can't get health insurance because they can't afford it, can't pass underwriting or both. We're going to pretend that these people can just write a check for services rendered.

We're also going to ignore the fact that the diseases and conditions that many people have could have been treated much more cost-effectively if they had been caught earlier if those people could have had access to preventive and diagnostic services.

You're goddamn right I'm a cheapskate. I'm sick and tired of paying vastly inflated health care premiums and costs, inflated due to the fact that I'm paying for other people's treatment. Inflated due to the fact that so many people can't afford preventive and diagnostic services and end up costing system and me far more than they should.

If you want to keep chanting "socialism", quoting Rush and paying a shitload more than you should be for health care, that's your call. I'm a cheapskate, and I think this simple-minded lunacy.

.

Boo-fucking-hoo.

Get up off your wallet and quit expecting third parties to pay your way for everything.

 

[Mac1958]

.

Yes, we should end Medicare and Medicaid. They should be replaced with (1) a Medicare-For-All health care delivery chassis that provides low-cost or no-cost preventive and diagnostic services to keep the populace healthier and therefore dramatically reduce the overall cost of health care delivery in America, (2) a robust and competitive free market-based insurance supplement menu based roughly on the current Medicare Supplement and Medicare Advantage systems, opening up a massive 300 million-plus market to the insurance companies at lower operating costs due to (1), (3) the creation and utilization of other obvious cost-cutting measures such as tort reform, national supplemental plans, Value-Based Insurance Design and global, coast to coast electronic records, and (4) low income subsidies for (2) above which will keep costs down in the long run due to decreased utilization by the demographic that historically is significantly less healthy.

Yeah, so get rid of Medicare and Medicaid and replace them.

No, we should not end Social Security. And anyone who thinks we should is so completely blinded by simplistic partisan ideology that they simply cannot see the damage it would do, top to bottom, across the country. Eliminating or significantly increasing the current Social Security income cap for payroll deductions (currently around $110,000) would create a de facto means testing apparatus and make Social Security solvent for a very long time.

Easiest freakin' question I'll answer all day.

.

Quoted because it is one of the best, most well thought out answers I've seen in a long time on this board. I wish I could give rep more than once.

Well, I just couldn't agree more!



.

 

[Full-Auto]

I generally end up pissing off both ends of the spectrum at some point, which I consider to be a very good sign.



What I want is to significantly lower the cost of health care delivery, maximize access and maintain quality. And a public/private partnership can do that.

Those who scream about "socialized medicine" and "freedom" either don't or won't understand how much extra they are paying for their "freedom" because Rush doesn't get into that. The inability of millions of Americans to access preventive and diagnostic services is costing us a ton and damaging the system.

.

Total lie.

They have all the access they want...Nobody is physically preventing anyone from getting anything....They merely have to pay for services rendered.

A lot of this would go away if the pimps for socialized medical services would just admit that they're total cheapskates.

"They just have to pay for services rendered." Oh, that's all.

Okay, so we're going to pretend that millions of Americans don't avoid getting preventive and diagnostic services done because they can't afford it. We're going to ignorethat many people can't get health insurance because they can't afford it, can't pass underwriting or both. We're going to pretend that these people can just write a check for services rendered.

We're also going to ignore the fact that the diseases and conditions that many people have could have been treated much more cost-effectively if they had been caught earlier if those people could have had access to preventive and diagnostic services.

You're goddamn right I'm a cheapskate. I'm sick and tired of paying vastly inflated health care premiums and costs, inflated due to the fact that I'm paying for other people's treatment. Inflated due to the fact that so many people can't afford preventive and diagnostic services and end up costing system and me far more than they should.

If you want to keep chanting "socialism", quoting Rush and paying a shitload more than you should be for health care, that's your call. I'm a cheapskate, and I think this simple-minded lunacy.

.

The people cant afford it.......................So we as a collective must steal from others to pay for it.

Well isnt that damn impressive. We need an affordable care act.............


Oh wait!!!! One that actually makes it affordable............

 

[Oddball]

No, the question becomes: How does the staggering litany of evidence that your "in vogue" progressive/socialistic welfare dependence state is an absolute towering failure, exist as proof that even more of your know-it-all authoritarian central planner do-goodery is going to make the situation any better?

The situation has already improved markedly since the Medicare reforms were passed two and a half years ago.

The Obama administration should be broadcasting the news: Medicare spending is no longer growing at an unsustainable rate. Wednesday, Bloomberg columnist Peter Orszag commented on the “sharp deceleration” in Medicare’s outlays. A common way to evaluate the growth in spending for Medicare is to compare the increase per beneficiary to income per capita,” the former director of the Office of Management and Budget (OMB) wrote. “Over the past 30 years, this excess cost growth for Medicare has averaged about 2 percent a year. The goal of many policy proposals, including provisions in the 2010 Affordable Care Act, is to reduce the future excess cost growth to about 1 percent annually.”

What is astonishing is that Medicare is now exceeding that goal. Over the past year, “excess cost growth has been much less than the target of 1 percent,” Orszag reports. “According to the most recent figures from the Congressional Budget Office, total Medicare spending this year through June rose 4 percent from the previous year. Meanwhile, the number of Medicare beneficiaries rose by almost 4 percent, too, and income per capita rose by about 3 percent. So excess cost growth has been significantly below zero let alone below the target of 1 percent a year.”

Right...Because they have absolutely gutted reimbursements.

Really easy to claim that you're a success when you pay out pennies on the dollar.

 

[DontBeStupid]

I addressed your concern.

Right. With this little gem.

You are responsible for you, and you have no right to impose on others to take care of you.

But, you see, you didn't address my concern. Because if a generation of retirees get their retirement accounts wiped out in a stock market crash, they will either retire with no money (not good for the economy) or they won't retire until later, which will keep younger workers from getting jobs (not good for the economy).

The question was about the economic impact, something none of you are addressing.

 

[Mac1958]

Total lie.

They have all the access they want...Nobody is physically preventing anyone from getting anything....They merely have to pay for services rendered.

A lot of this would go away if the pimps for socialized medical services would just admit that they're total cheapskates.

"They just have to pay for services rendered." Oh, that's all.

Okay, so we're going to pretend that millions of Americans don't avoid getting preventive and diagnostic services done because they can't afford it. We're going to ignorethat many people can't get health insurance because they can't afford it, can't pass underwriting or both. We're going to pretend that these people can just write a check for services rendered.

We're also going to ignore the fact that the diseases and conditions that many people have could have been treated much more cost-effectively if they had been caught earlier if those people could have had access to preventive and diagnostic services.

You're goddamn right I'm a cheapskate. I'm sick and tired of paying vastly inflated health care premiums and costs, inflated due to the fact that I'm paying for other people's treatment. Inflated due to the fact that so many people can't afford preventive and diagnostic services and end up costing system and me far more than they should.

If you want to keep chanting "socialism", quoting Rush and paying a shitload more than you should be for health care, that's your call. I'm a cheapskate, and I think this simple-minded lunacy.

.

Boo-fucking-hoo.

Get up off your wallet and quit expecting third parties to pay your way for everything.

Ah, yet another carefully reasoned, deep, intellectual response from a dittohead.

.

 

[Katzndogz]

The federal programs cannot be ended quickly enough to suit me.

If the states want to pick up the functions that these programs coverm that's up to them - I would personally oppose any such initiative in my state.

You, and no one else, are responsible for you; expecting others to take care of you is the most hideous excample of self-important narcissism I can think of.

And the second part of the OP’s question…?

You are aware that there are millions of Americans – through not fault of their own – who indeed lack the resources to afford medical care or to be self-sufficient, such as age or disability.

There are also states unwilling or unable to implement their own programs.

Anyone who through age or disability cannot be self sufficient should be able to go to any one of innumerable charities and get the medical services they need.

 

[Oddball]

"They just have to pay for services rendered." Oh, that's all.

Okay, so we're going to pretend that millions of Americans don't avoid getting preventive and diagnostic services done because they can't afford it. We're going to ignorethat many people can't get health insurance because they can't afford it, can't pass underwriting or both. We're going to pretend that these people can just write a check for services rendered.

We're also going to ignore the fact that the diseases and conditions that many people have could have been treated much more cost-effectively if they had been caught earlier if those people could have had access to preventive and diagnostic services.

You're goddamn right I'm a cheapskate. I'm sick and tired of paying vastly inflated health care premiums and costs, inflated due to the fact that I'm paying for other people's treatment. Inflated due to the fact that so many people can't afford preventive and diagnostic services and end up costing system and me far more than they should.

If you want to keep chanting "socialism", quoting Rush and paying a shitload more than you should be for health care, that's your call. I'm a cheapskate, and I think this simple-minded lunacy.

.

Boo-fucking-hoo.

Get up off your wallet and quit expecting third parties to pay your way for everything.

Ah, yet another carefully reasoned, deep, intellectual response from a dittohead.

.

So you're a cheapskate moocher and proud of it...What am I supposed to say?

 

[freedombecki]

We need to make it work better because the programs are broken and broke. The democrat solution is to confiscate assets and property from the private sector and throw money at the problem. What else do you expect from a former community activist who hires a treasury secretary who is so dumb that he doesn't know how to fill out an IRS form? You have a republican candidate who knows how to make money and radicals hate him. The world is upside down to liberals.

Shooting the boss and killing the messengers has never worked very well historically, but that seems to be the gist of the leftist lockstep press and its self-serving appointees these days.

 

[Mac1958]

Total lie.

They have all the access they want...Nobody is physically preventing anyone from getting anything....They merely have to pay for services rendered.

A lot of this would go away if the pimps for socialized medical services would just admit that they're total cheapskates.

"They just have to pay for services rendered." Oh, that's all.

Okay, so we're going to pretend that millions of Americans don't avoid getting preventive and diagnostic services done because they can't afford it. We're going to ignorethat many people can't get health insurance because they can't afford it, can't pass underwriting or both. We're going to pretend that these people can just write a check for services rendered.

We're also going to ignore the fact that the diseases and conditions that many people have could have been treated much more cost-effectively if they had been caught earlier if those people could have had access to preventive and diagnostic services.

You're goddamn right I'm a cheapskate. I'm sick and tired of paying vastly inflated health care premiums and costs, inflated due to the fact that I'm paying for other people's treatment. Inflated due to the fact that so many people can't afford preventive and diagnostic services and end up costing system and me far more than they should.

If you want to keep chanting "socialism", quoting Rush and paying a shitload more than you should be for health care, that's your call. I'm a cheapskate, and I think this simple-minded lunacy.

.

The people cant afford it.......................So we as a collective must steal from others to pay for it.

Well isnt that damn impressive. We need an affordable care act.............


Oh wait!!!! One that actually makes it affordable............

My four-part approach is above. If you can refrain from the standard partisan rhetoric, read it, think about it and respond to its points like a mature, rational, clear-thinking adult, go ahead.

.

 

[mudwhistle]

Just give everyone a one time choice to opt in or out of these programs.

Ok, but again, how do you address a generation of retirees who have their retirement accounts wiped out in a stock market crash?

If they left it alone it should be back up almost where it was before the crash.

 

[Wry Catcher]

People who paid into the system should receive the benefit of what they paid for or get their money back plus interest.

Workers who are entering the system should have the option of investing their own funds however they see fit, including the social security system.

I'm ROTFLMAO at this response.

 

[Mac1958]

Boo-fucking-hoo.

Get up off your wallet and quit expecting third parties to pay your way for everything.

Ah, yet another carefully reasoned, deep, intellectual response from a dittohead.

.

So you're a cheapskate moocher and proud of it...What am I supposed to say?

Okay, I'll bite.

Tell me precisely how I'm a "moocher."

.

 

[Oddball]

"They just have to pay for services rendered." Oh, that's all.

Okay, so we're going to pretend that millions of Americans don't avoid getting preventive and diagnostic services done because they can't afford it. We're going to ignorethat many people can't get health insurance because they can't afford it, can't pass underwriting or both. We're going to pretend that these people can just write a check for services rendered.

We're also going to ignore the fact that the diseases and conditions that many people have could have been treated much more cost-effectively if they had been caught earlier if those people could have had access to preventive and diagnostic services.

You're goddamn right I'm a cheapskate. I'm sick and tired of paying vastly inflated health care premiums and costs, inflated due to the fact that I'm paying for other people's treatment. Inflated due to the fact that so many people can't afford preventive and diagnostic services and end up costing system and me far more than they should.

If you want to keep chanting "socialism", quoting Rush and paying a shitload more than you should be for health care, that's your call. I'm a cheapskate, and I think this simple-minded lunacy.

.

The people cant afford it.......................So we as a collective must steal from others to pay for it.

Well isnt that damn impressive. We need an affordable care act.............


Oh wait!!!! One that actually makes it affordable............

My four-part approach is above. If you can refrain from the standard partisan rhetoric, read it, think about it and respond to its points like a mature, rational, clear-thinking adult, go ahead.

.

Yeah...A mature, rational, clear-thinking adult moocher, who wants everyone else to pay for serviced rendered to him.

You ain't nothing new.

 

[Full-Auto]

"They just have to pay for services rendered." Oh, that's all.

Okay, so we're going to pretend that millions of Americans don't avoid getting preventive and diagnostic services done because they can't afford it. We're going to ignorethat many people can't get health insurance because they can't afford it, can't pass underwriting or both. We're going to pretend that these people can just write a check for services rendered.

We're also going to ignore the fact that the diseases and conditions that many people have could have been treated much more cost-effectively if they had been caught earlier if those people could have had access to preventive and diagnostic services.

You're goddamn right I'm a cheapskate. I'm sick and tired of paying vastly inflated health care premiums and costs, inflated due to the fact that I'm paying for other people's treatment. Inflated due to the fact that so many people can't afford preventive and diagnostic services and end up costing system and me far more than they should.

If you want to keep chanting "socialism", quoting Rush and paying a shitload more than you should be for health care, that's your call. I'm a cheapskate, and I think this simple-minded lunacy.

.

The people cant afford it.......................So we as a collective must steal from others to pay for it.

Well isnt that damn impressive. We need an affordable care act.............


Oh wait!!!! One that actually makes it affordable............

My four-part approach is above. If you can refrain from the standard partisan rhetoric, read it, think about it and respond to its points like a mature, rational, clear-thinking adult, go ahead.

.

No need. I responded quite accurately.


You can take it personal or not.


We must steal by majority vote to pay for others whether it was through laziness or misfortune.

The majority voted for the theft so I feel righteous......

That message was clear.

 

[Mac1958]

The people cant afford it.......................So we as a collective must steal from others to pay for it.

Well isnt that damn impressive. We need an affordable care act.............


Oh wait!!!! One that actually makes it affordable............

My four-part approach is above. If you can refrain from the standard partisan rhetoric, read it, think about it and respond to its points like a mature, rational, clear-thinking adult, go ahead.

.

Yeah...A mature, rational, clear-thinking adult moocher, who wants everyone else to pay for serviced rendered to him.

You ain't nothing new.

As expected. Perhaps the paragraph to which I refer was a bit complicated. I understand.

.

 

[ScreamingEagle]

.

Yes, we should end Medicare and Medicaid. They should be replaced with (1) a Medicare-For-All health care delivery chassis that provides low-cost or no-cost preventive and diagnostic services to keep the populace healthier and therefore dramatically reduce the overall cost of health care delivery in America, (2) a robust and competitive free market-based insurance supplement menu based roughly on the current Medicare Supplement and Medicare Advantage systems, opening up a massive 300 million-plus market to the insurance companies at lower operating costs due to (1), (3) the creation and utilization of other obvious cost-cutting measures such as tort reform, national supplemental plans, Value-Based Insurance Design and global, coast to coast electronic records, and (4) low income subsidies for (2) above which will keep costs down in the long run due to decreased utilization by the demographic that historically is significantly less healthy.

Yeah, so get rid of Medicare and Medicaid and replace them.

No, we should not end Social Security. And anyone who thinks we should is so completely blinded by simplistic partisan ideology that they simply cannot see the damage it would do, top to bottom, across the country. Eliminating or significantly increasing the current Social Security income cap for payroll deductions (currently around $110,000) would create a de facto means testing apparatus and make Social Security solvent for a very long time.

Easiest freakin' question I'll answer all day.

.

Quoted because it is one of the best, most well thought out answers I've seen in a long time on this board. I wish I could give rep more than once.

Well, I just couldn't agree more!



.

"medicare for all"......? ....just another name for socialized medicine....

 

[Mac1958]

.

Good grief. Has there every been a more shallow, simplistic string of responses to a post?

.