Delta staff tell California couple they could be jailed if 2 yr old doesn't give up his seat

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

On what basis are you going to sue? Can you sue because you were being an asshole and think you do not have to follow the rules you agreed to when you bought the ticket?

Threatening one with jail time and how they're kids will be taken away if they don't do what you say is considered an extreme form of harassment. Since the FA works for the airline, and since people are money hungry in American, naturally they'll sue the airline too, and probably win since the airline has deeper pockets than the FA does.

Disrupting a flight is a Federal offense. What about that was incorrect? The truth is not harassment.

And you sat here and talked about know-it-alls, lol.

"Accordingly, the FAA can impose civil penalties (fines) for interfering with a crewmember who is performing official duties aboard an aircraft that is being operated." (49 U.S.C. § 46318.) maximum fine is $25,000.

Interfering With a Flight Attendant or Crewmember | Criminal Law

Indeed you are incorrect sir. Please try again.

So please explain how I am wrong if you just proved me right. Did you not read your own website for which you provided a link?

Smart one, do you not know the difference between a civil wrong and a criminal wrong?

Do I have to teach you the difference...?

Who cares what the difference is? The fact remains that interfering with the flight crew is a Federal offense, which I believe is exactly what I said. You are simply trying to mince words that I never said.

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

I don't blame the parents for not wanting to give up the kids seat. That plane hits Turbulence that kid is going to be airborne if he's sitting on his parents lap. What I don't understand other than the concept of having to give up a seat you paid for and are already in is who gets to decide who's the more important passenger? Apparently Delta didn't feel it was the kid. Doesn't say much for Delta.

Then there's the threat of losing their child to foster care. Delta employee's should be fired for using Gestapo tactic's.
FTR I would think the Department of Children and Families would be more upset if the kids wasn't belted in. You get in big trouble if that kid isn't strapped into a car seat while you're driving, why would a plane be any different?

Airlines should just add to the FAA child policy and state that every child has to be buckled in or in a booster seat. When you do that, the child now has a ticket with their name on it. Problem solved.

Nobody is going to give up extra seats that they, passenger paid for, especially when they showed up for the flight and want to utilize it. It's pretty fucking stupid that there needs to be individual names for tickets instead of just having all of the tickets be placed under one name.

The whole overbooking thing is ridiculous. If the seat is bought and paid for there is no reason why anyone should be kicked off a flight in favor of another person. What other industry does this? In the computer age it should be easier to track how many seats are filled. If I buy a concert ticket it says I've bought seat 32 row 7 on 6-7-17 6:00 pm, my name doesn't need to be on it,the ticket is it's own proof that is my seat. This man bought the ticket and a member of his family was sitting in that seat, I agree, to require anything more is stupid.

The child sitting in that seat did not have a ticket of any kind. Thank you for ignoring that little tidbit entirely.

 

[busybee01]

LOL. Really? I'd sue this airline. Did they not learn anything from United?

What makes Delta employees the police or lawyers?

On what basis are you going to sue? Can you sue because you were being an asshole and think you do not have to follow the rules you agreed to when you bought the ticket?

Threatening one with jail time and how they're kids will be taken away if they don't do what you say is considered an extreme form of harassment. Since the FA works for the airline, and since people are money hungry in American, naturally they'll sue the airline too, and probably win since the airline has deeper pockets than the FA does.

Disrupting a flight is a Federal offense. What about that was incorrect? The truth is not harassment.

It was Delta employees who were disrupting the flight not the customer. A customer demands the seat he paid for and you want to jail him. You are nothing but a toady for big business.

I don't blame the parents for not wanting to give up the kids seat. That plane hits Turbulence that kid is going to be airborne if he's sitting on his parents lap. What I don't understand other than the concept of having to give up a seat you paid for and are already in is who gets to decide who's the more important passenger? Apparently Delta didn't feel it was the kid. Doesn't say much for Delta.

Then there's the threat of losing their child to foster care. Delta employee's should be fired for using Gestapo tactic's.
FTR I would think the Department of Children and Families would be more upset if the kids wasn't belted in. You get in big trouble if that kid isn't strapped into a car seat while you're driving, why would a plane be any different?

Airlines should just add to the FAA child policy and state that every child has to be buckled in or in a booster seat. When you do that, the child now has a ticket with their name on it. Problem solved.

Nobody is going to give up extra seats that they, passenger paid for, especially when they showed up for the flight and want to utilize it. It's pretty fucking stupid that there needs to be individual names for tickets instead of just having all of the tickets be placed under one name.

The whole overbooking thing is ridiculous. If the seat is bought and paid for there is no reason why anyone should be kicked off a flight in favor of another person. What other industry does this? In the computer age it should be easier to track how many seats are filled. If I buy a concert ticket it says I've bought seat 32 row 7 on 6-7-17 6:00 pm, my name doesn't need to be on it,the ticket is it's own proof that is my seat. This man bought the ticket and a member of his family was sitting in that seat, I agree, to require anything more is stupid.

The child sitting in that seat did not have a ticket of any kind. Thank you for ignoring that little tidbit entirely.

The family bought and paid for that seat. Thank you for ignoring that little tidbit entirely.

 

[Marianne]

I don't blame the parents for not wanting to give up the kids seat. That plane hits Turbulence that kid is going to be airborne if he's sitting on his parents lap. What I don't understand other than the concept of having to give up a seat you paid for and are already in is who gets to decide who's the more important passenger? Apparently Delta didn't feel it was the kid. Doesn't say much for Delta.

Then there's the threat of losing their child to foster care. Delta employee's should be fired for using Gestapo tactic's.
FTR I would think the Department of Children and Families would be more upset if the kids wasn't belted in. You get in big trouble if that kid isn't strapped into a car seat while you're driving, why would a plane be any different?

Airlines should just add to the FAA child policy and state that every child has to be buckled in or in a booster seat. When you do that, the child now has a ticket with their name on it. Problem solved.

Nobody is going to give up extra seats that they, passenger paid for, especially when they showed up for the flight and want to utilize it. It's pretty fucking stupid that there needs to be individual names for tickets instead of just having all of the tickets be placed under one name.

The whole overbooking thing is ridiculous. If the seat is bought and paid for there is no reason why anyone should be kicked off a flight in favor of another person. What other industry does this? In the computer age it should be easier to track how many seats are filled. If I buy a concert ticket it says I've bought seat 32 row 7 on 6-7-17 6:00 pm, my name doesn't need to be on it,the ticket is it's own proof that is my seat. This man bought the ticket and a member of his family was sitting in that seat, I agree, to require anything more is stupid.

The child sitting in that seat did not have a ticket of any kind. Thank you for ignoring that little tidbit entirely.

I saw the footage on TV the guy clearly said he paid for the seat.

"Initially the two youngest children were going to sit on their parents' laps, but when their teenage son opted to travel on another flight - having had a seat booked - they seated Grayson in his seat instead."

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

LOL. Really? I'd sue this airline. Did they not learn anything from United?

What makes Delta employees the police or lawyers?

On what basis are you going to sue? Can you sue because you were being an asshole and think you do not have to follow the rules you agreed to when you bought the ticket?

Threatening one with jail time and how they're kids will be taken away if they don't do what you say is considered an extreme form of harassment. Since the FA works for the airline, and since people are money hungry in American, naturally they'll sue the airline too, and probably win since the airline has deeper pockets than the FA does.

Disrupting a flight is a Federal offense. What about that was incorrect? The truth is not harassment.

It was Delta employees who were disrupting the flight not the customer. A customer demands the seat he paid for and you want to jail him. You are nothing but a toady for big business.

I don't blame the parents for not wanting to give up the kids seat. That plane hits Turbulence that kid is going to be airborne if he's sitting on his parents lap. What I don't understand other than the concept of having to give up a seat you paid for and are already in is who gets to decide who's the more important passenger? Apparently Delta didn't feel it was the kid. Doesn't say much for Delta.

Then there's the threat of losing their child to foster care. Delta employee's should be fired for using Gestapo tactic's.
FTR I would think the Department of Children and Families would be more upset if the kids wasn't belted in. You get in big trouble if that kid isn't strapped into a car seat while you're driving, why would a plane be any different?

Airlines should just add to the FAA child policy and state that every child has to be buckled in or in a booster seat. When you do that, the child now has a ticket with their name on it. Problem solved.

Nobody is going to give up extra seats that they, passenger paid for, especially when they showed up for the flight and want to utilize it. It's pretty fucking stupid that there needs to be individual names for tickets instead of just having all of the tickets be placed under one name.

The whole overbooking thing is ridiculous. If the seat is bought and paid for there is no reason why anyone should be kicked off a flight in favor of another person. What other industry does this? In the computer age it should be easier to track how many seats are filled. If I buy a concert ticket it says I've bought seat 32 row 7 on 6-7-17 6:00 pm, my name doesn't need to be on it,the ticket is it's own proof that is my seat. This man bought the ticket and a member of his family was sitting in that seat, I agree, to require anything more is stupid.

The child sitting in that seat did not have a ticket of any kind. Thank you for ignoring that little tidbit entirely.

The family bought and paid for that seat. Thank you for ignoring that little tidbit entirely.

The family bought and paid for a seat for their other son who was not on the flight. That means the airline gets the seat back to do with as they wish.

Just ignoring the rules doesn't win the argument for you.

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

I don't blame the parents for not wanting to give up the kids seat. That plane hits Turbulence that kid is going to be airborne if he's sitting on his parents lap. What I don't understand other than the concept of having to give up a seat you paid for and are already in is who gets to decide who's the more important passenger? Apparently Delta didn't feel it was the kid. Doesn't say much for Delta.

Then there's the threat of losing their child to foster care. Delta employee's should be fired for using Gestapo tactic's.
FTR I would think the Department of Children and Families would be more upset if the kids wasn't belted in. You get in big trouble if that kid isn't strapped into a car seat while you're driving, why would a plane be any different?

Airlines should just add to the FAA child policy and state that every child has to be buckled in or in a booster seat. When you do that, the child now has a ticket with their name on it. Problem solved.

Nobody is going to give up extra seats that they, passenger paid for, especially when they showed up for the flight and want to utilize it. It's pretty fucking stupid that there needs to be individual names for tickets instead of just having all of the tickets be placed under one name.

The whole overbooking thing is ridiculous. If the seat is bought and paid for there is no reason why anyone should be kicked off a flight in favor of another person. What other industry does this? In the computer age it should be easier to track how many seats are filled. If I buy a concert ticket it says I've bought seat 32 row 7 on 6-7-17 6:00 pm, my name doesn't need to be on it,the ticket is it's own proof that is my seat. This man bought the ticket and a member of his family was sitting in that seat, I agree, to require anything more is stupid.

The child sitting in that seat did not have a ticket of any kind. Thank you for ignoring that little tidbit entirely.

I saw the footage on TV the guy clearly said he paid for the seat.

"Initially the two youngest children were going to sit on their parents' laps, but when their teenage son opted to travel on another flight - having had a seat booked - they seated Grayson in his seat instead."

He paid for the seat, but his son was not on board, meaning the seat was empty.

The airline gets the seat back if you don't show up. Read the ticket's fine print.

 

[Slashsnake]

Threatening one with jail time and how they're kids will be taken away if they don't do what you say is considered an extreme form of harassment. Since the FA works for the airline, and since people are money hungry in American, naturally they'll sue the airline too, and probably win since the airline has deeper pockets than the FA does.

Disrupting a flight is a Federal offense. What about that was incorrect? The truth is not harassment.

And you sat here and talked about know-it-alls, lol.

"Accordingly, the FAA can impose civil penalties (fines) for interfering with a crewmember who is performing official duties aboard an aircraft that is being operated." (49 U.S.C. § 46318.) maximum fine is $25,000.

Interfering With a Flight Attendant or Crewmember | Criminal Law

Indeed you are incorrect sir. Please try again.

So please explain how I am wrong if you just proved me right. Did you not read your own website for which you provided a link?

Smart one, do you not know the difference between a civil wrong and a criminal wrong?

Do I have to teach you the difference...?

Who cares what the difference is? The fact remains that interfering with the flight crew is a Federal offense, which I believe is exactly what I said. You are simply trying to mince words that I never said.

You said someone can be arrested for it. You can only be arrested under certain circumstances, so the flight attendant did lie and should be fired.

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

Disrupting a flight is a Federal offense. What about that was incorrect? The truth is not harassment.

And you sat here and talked about know-it-alls, lol.

"Accordingly, the FAA can impose civil penalties (fines) for interfering with a crewmember who is performing official duties aboard an aircraft that is being operated." (49 U.S.C. § 46318.) maximum fine is $25,000.

Interfering With a Flight Attendant or Crewmember | Criminal Law

Indeed you are incorrect sir. Please try again.

So please explain how I am wrong if you just proved me right. Did you not read your own website for which you provided a link?

Smart one, do you not know the difference between a civil wrong and a criminal wrong?

Do I have to teach you the difference...?

Who cares what the difference is? The fact remains that interfering with the flight crew is a Federal offense, which I believe is exactly what I said. You are simply trying to mince words that I never said.

You said someone can be arrested for it. You can only be arrested under certain circumstances, so the flight attendant did lie and should be fired.

There was a police officer standing right there. Disorderly conduct is also an offense for which you can be arrested. I guarantee you the local cops will not hesitate to slap the cuffs on you should it be warranted.

Even if you were correct, which you are not, why should a flight attendant be fired for stating something which she might have misinterpreted?

I'll bet I could find something you do every day that could lead to your arrest.

 

[Marianne]

I don't blame the parents for not wanting to give up the kids seat. That plane hits Turbulence that kid is going to be airborne if he's sitting on his parents lap. What I don't understand other than the concept of having to give up a seat you paid for and are already in is who gets to decide who's the more important passenger? Apparently Delta didn't feel it was the kid. Doesn't say much for Delta.

Then there's the threat of losing their child to foster care. Delta employee's should be fired for using Gestapo tactic's.
FTR I would think the Department of Children and Families would be more upset if the kids wasn't belted in. You get in big trouble if that kid isn't strapped into a car seat while you're driving, why would a plane be any different?

Airlines should just add to the FAA child policy and state that every child has to be buckled in or in a booster seat. When you do that, the child now has a ticket with their name on it. Problem solved.

Nobody is going to give up extra seats that they, passenger paid for, especially when they showed up for the flight and want to utilize it. It's pretty fucking stupid that there needs to be individual names for tickets instead of just having all of the tickets be placed under one name.

The whole overbooking thing is ridiculous. If the seat is bought and paid for there is no reason why anyone should be kicked off a flight in favor of another person. What other industry does this? In the computer age it should be easier to track how many seats are filled. If I buy a concert ticket it says I've bought seat 32 row 7 on 6-7-17 6:00 pm, my name doesn't need to be on it,the ticket is it's own proof that is my seat. This man bought the ticket and a member of his family was sitting in that seat, I agree, to require anything more is stupid.

The child sitting in that seat did not have a ticket of any kind. Thank you for ignoring that little tidbit entirely.

I saw the footage on TV the guy clearly said he paid for the seat.

"Initially the two youngest children were going to sit on their parents' laps, but when their teenage son opted to travel on another flight - having had a seat booked - they seated Grayson in his seat instead."

He paid for the seat, but his son was not on board, meaning the seat was empty.

The airline gets the seat back if you don't show up. Read the ticket's fine print.

That's stupid. If I buy a concert ticket for Harry and Harry has to work that night and I take John instead does the venue take the ticket back? What other industry does that? You buy something it's generally considered yours. He didn't give the seat to a stranger he gave the seat to his other child. Seriously I wish Congress would step in and stop the Gestapo tactic's of airlines. They have dragged people off planes, held people on the tarmac for hours without food,water and use of bathrooms and not allowing them to deplane thus causing there to be a passenger bill of rights that obviously doesn't go far enough. I won't fly Delta or United anymore. Maybe if they lose enough business this bullshit will stop.

 

[airplanemechanic]

That's stupid. If I buy a concert ticket for Harry and Harry has to work that night and I take John instead does the venue take the ticket back? What other industry does that? You buy something it's generally considered yours. He didn't give the seat to a stranger he gave the seat to his other child. Seriously I wish Congress would step in and stop the Gestapo tactic's of airlines. They have dragged people off planes, held people on the tarmac for hours without food,water and use of bathrooms and not allowing them to deplane thus causing there to be a passenger bill of rights that obviously doesn't go far enough. I won't fly Delta or United anymore. Maybe if they lose enough business this bullshit will stop.

Stupid? Yea. But it's also the rules. You can't compare buying concert tickets to airline tickets. Apples to torque wrenches comparison. Concert tickets are purchased for a seat, airline tickets for a specific person. If that person doesn't show up or is late, the seat goes to someone else. It's the way life is and every airline does it.

Holding people on the tarmac has nothing to do with purchasing a ticket for someone who doesn't show up.

You can avoid Delta or United but they all do the same thing. You can run but you can't hide.

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

Airlines should just add to the FAA child policy and state that every child has to be buckled in or in a booster seat. When you do that, the child now has a ticket with their name on it. Problem solved.

Nobody is going to give up extra seats that they, passenger paid for, especially when they showed up for the flight and want to utilize it. It's pretty fucking stupid that there needs to be individual names for tickets instead of just having all of the tickets be placed under one name.

The whole overbooking thing is ridiculous. If the seat is bought and paid for there is no reason why anyone should be kicked off a flight in favor of another person. What other industry does this? In the computer age it should be easier to track how many seats are filled. If I buy a concert ticket it says I've bought seat 32 row 7 on 6-7-17 6:00 pm, my name doesn't need to be on it,the ticket is it's own proof that is my seat. This man bought the ticket and a member of his family was sitting in that seat, I agree, to require anything more is stupid.

The child sitting in that seat did not have a ticket of any kind. Thank you for ignoring that little tidbit entirely.

I saw the footage on TV the guy clearly said he paid for the seat.

"Initially the two youngest children were going to sit on their parents' laps, but when their teenage son opted to travel on another flight - having had a seat booked - they seated Grayson in his seat instead."

He paid for the seat, but his son was not on board, meaning the seat was empty.

The airline gets the seat back if you don't show up. Read the ticket's fine print.

That's stupid. If I buy a concert ticket for Harry and Harry has to work that night and I take John instead does the venue take the ticket back? What other industry does that? You buy something it's generally considered yours. He didn't give the seat to a stranger he gave the seat to his other child. Seriously I wish Congress would step in and stop the Gestapo tactic's of airlines. They have dragged people off planes, held people on the tarmac for hours without food,water and use of bathrooms and not allowing them to deplane thus causing there to be a passenger bill of rights that obviously doesn't go far enough. I won't fly Delta or United anymore. Maybe if they lose enough business this bullshit will stop.

Did you have to show your driver;s license to get in the concert? Why not try a valid comparison versus apples to watermelon?

 

[EverCurious]

They should have changed the name on the ticket, problem solved. Though frankly, I think it's a stupid as fuck PR move by the airlines to be that petty at this point in time given that the family had bought the ticket.

In any event, my airline of choice requires 2 year olds to have their own seat ~shrug~

 

[airplanemechanic]

As I've said before, it's not petty. It's in case the airplane crashes. They do crash, not often, but they do.

 

[EverCurious]

... Dude, trying to put another paid ass in a seat a family has already paid for has almost nothing to do with crashes. Especially since the baby was registered on the flight and the elder son was already at the destination and could verify his personage as not MIA. That's a BS excuse sorry.

I agree the folks should have changed the name on the ticket, not saying the name thing is a bad deal in the event of a crash either, but they did this solely for monetary reasons and you know it so don't try to pretend it was "safety" related.

 

[airplanemechanic]

Dude, it is very much to do with knowing who is on the plane in the event of an emergency.

I never said it was safety related. Where did I say that? I said its so they know who is on the plane in the event of a crash. Its paperwork related, not safety related. The FAA mandates that you know who is on your plane before you take off if you fly under Part 121.

How much direct experience do you have working for, with and around airlines?

 

[EverCurious]

Dude, I don't give a rats ass about the law. I'm a consumer, a passenger, and if I decide to buy a row for my fam and sit in 7A when my ticket says 7C then the stewardess can kiss my damned ass. You're talking about a family traveling as a group, not some random guy that didn't show up on the flight - and I damn near guarantee you the ticket booking confirms that the /family/ bought those tickets together. It's petty hair-splitting for profit, not safety, not for ID purposes, it's just bullshit.

I don't fly so much anymore cause I retired, but when I flew a lot I'd buy a full row and sleep on the flight. This was back when there was only one airline flying out of Alaska - not /once/ was I ever asked to give up one of my seats. Not once have I /ever/ had anyone approach me to take away seats when I was flying with my babies, even when it was a full flight.

Plus, no matter how you want to shake it, it is a /stupid/ business decision to push this petty envelope right now, their PR is going to suffer hard and there is /way/ to much competition in the airline business these days.

 

[airplanemechanic]

Dude, I don't give a rats ass about the law.

And I rest my case.

FAA Notice on Domestic Passenger Manifest Information 3/97

Families and loved ones of the victims of aviation disasters want
to know, as quickly as possible, whether their family member was on
board the flight. There have, however, been difficulties in the
aftermath of past aviation disasters in immediately determining who was
on the airplane and in notifying family members. Air carriers usually
have on hand records that identify those passengers that actually
boarded the aircraft listed by their surnames and first initials, and
these records must be matched with associated ticket information in
order to compile a verified manifest.

 

[EverCurious]

FAA Notice on Domestic Passenger Manifest Information 3/97

Families and loved ones of the victims of aviation disasters want
to know, as quickly as possible, whether their family member was on
board the flight. There have, however, been difficulties in the
aftermath of past aviation disasters in immediately determining who was
on the airplane and in notifying family members. Air carriers usually
have on hand records that identify those passengers that actually
boarded the aircraft listed by their surnames and first initials, and
these records must be matched with associated ticket information in
order to compile a verified manifest.

And their manifest would say 'nope so and so wasn't on the flight' - question answered. In fact, their database would show that said so n so was on an earlier flight. Not a problem.

Rigid adherence to stupid fucking rules does not overpower dumbassery.

I could arrest a fucking moose for walking down my street, JS.

 

[airplanemechanic]

Rigid adherence to stupid rules is called flying under the FAA regulations. Just because they're stupid doesn't mean you can break them.

I think it's stupid that I have to pass a physical every 6 months to carry passengers. Do I just say fuck it?

You still gonna claim that what they did had nothing to do with crashing? Or you gonna keep namecalling and not man up and admit you know nothing about this?

The Aviation Disaster Family Assistance Act of 1996 (Pub. L. 104-
264, October 9, 1996) was passed to address the difficulties of the
notification of families in the aftermath of domestic aviation crashes.
It directs the Secretary to form a task force to, among other things,
improve the timeliness of the notification provided by air carriers to
the families of passengers involved in an aircraft accident. Further,
one section of the Act, codified at 49 USC 41113, requires an air
carrier to develop a plan for addressing family needs in the event of a
major crash, including providing a list of passengers to the NTSB. This
ANPRM will provide information to the task force needed to make the
recommendations required in the legislation.

 

[EverCurious]

Rigid adherence to stupid rules is called flying under the FAA regulations. Just because they're stupid doesn't mean you can break them.

I think it's stupid that I have to pass a physical every 6 months to carry passengers. Do I just say fuck it?

You still gonna claim that what they did had nothing to do with crashing? Or you gonna keep namecalling and not man up and admit you know nothing about this?

The Aviation Disaster Family Assistance Act of 1996 (Pub. L. 104-
264, October 9, 1996) was passed to address the difficulties of the
notification of families in the aftermath of domestic aviation crashes.
It directs the Secretary to form a task force to, among other things,
improve the timeliness of the notification provided by air carriers to
the families of passengers involved in an aircraft accident. Further,
one section of the Act, codified at 49 USC 41113, requires an air
carrier to develop a plan for addressing family needs in the event of a
major crash, including providing a list of passengers to the NTSB. This
ANPRM will provide information to the task force needed to make the
recommendations required in the legislation.

Namecalling? Where? "Man up"? No I'm not going to "man up" cause I'm a woman, but whatever. Again, this is a family traveling together, not some random joe that didn't show up to claim his seat. When I fly with my kids, my mother, my grandparents, I can exchange seats with them all I want, in fact I regularly do cause one wants to look out the window or whatever. Saying that only named butts can be in "family purchased" seats is stupid and petty regardless of the rule you keep posting.

Again as I said at least three times, they should have changed the name on the ticket. However, the fact that they didn't should not mean the airline /should/ steal the seat they paid for and were clearly using from them. You argue a rigid rule that really doesn't justify the bad PR. If you can't see that then you're clearly not a consumer.