Cut Corporate Tax Rates--Remove Loopholes

[GHook93]

And when I say a flat tax of 10% would be enough for the government to take people recoil in horror.

How on earth can the government take care of us on only a 10% tax? My god we'll all just die

I agree the flat tax is a lazy man's solution! I prefer obviously the fair tax, but I will take the progressive tax any day over the flat tax!

 

[Tech_Esq]

Just under 22%

you need to see an accountant, you are doing something wrong.

 

[Skull Pilot]

It would work if they were making enough money to begin with.

It won't work because the rich want to keep making all the fucking money, Skull.

How do the rich make all their fucking money? they provide in one way or another something to the market place. something that other people place value on. That something can be a product or a service or it can be a capital investment in stocks and bonds. it doesn't matter how they make their money.

Think I'm wrong?

Okay, what is the top pay rate you think anyone should make?

As much as one can possibly make with no limits.

And what is the bottom rate you think anyone should make?

It doesn't matter what minimum wage is. In a free market, all employment is structured as a ladder not a bed. Everyone has an opportunity to climb the ladder. If they choose not to, then so be it.

You think those questions don't make sense, don't you?

Well then, you're just going to have to accept the fact that in order for there to be multibillionaires, there's going to have to be a whole forking lot of people who don't make enough to pay ANY federal income taxes.

Shouldn't everyone pay their "fair share" Ed? Why should one person not pay anything but still receive all the protections and benefits of society.

Economic freedom means exactly that. It means that people are free to be unequal. Would you call a society free if that society told you your maximum income allowed was $X per year no more?

Most of those people are paying a higher percentage of their incomes in all taxes, than most billionaires, anyway.

Can't have it both ways, amigo.

OK Ed. let's do it your way.

Let's have everyone carry a federally issued ID that states your income for the past year.

Every time you buy something, the price is based on your income.

If you made 20K, you would pay $50 for a DVD player. If I made 100K, I would pay $250 for the same DVD player.

And furthermore the additional revenue the DVD manufacturer would make on my DVD player would be taxed 100% by the government because it's not fair that the company make profit when so many people can't afford a DVD player and every person who makes less than 20K will get a free DVD player.

Better yet let's all just work for the government. We can have 100% of the fruits of our labor confiscated and we can be paid in trans fat free food and live in cookie cutter 800 square foot houses with equally sized postage stamp yards and drive minuscule shoe box on wheels cars that are designed not to exceed 55 mph.

We will all be 100% equally cared for and live a blissful life of fairness and equality.

 

[Skull Pilot]

Just under 22%

Now consider that some people pay less than 10% of their income. Why should they pay less than you?

you need to see an accountant, you are doing something wrong.

True

 

[Skull Pilot]

I agree the flat tax is a lazy man's solution! I prefer obviously the fair tax, but I will take the progressive tax any day over the flat tax!

Fair tax is a good program. It's just easier to use fixed percentages in this forum.

 

[Ravi]

Now consider that some people pay less than 10% of their income. Why should they pay less than you?



True

Because they make less. I could to, but I choose not to.

And anyone that is paying 6% needs to quit whining.

 

[Tech_Esq]

Because they make less. I could to, but I choose not to.

And anyone that is paying 6% needs to quit whining.

Did I whine at some point? At 6% I don't feel that I'm being excessively taxed. I'm sure I would if I was paying an effective tax rate of 22%. Seriously, what, you don't have any deductions?

 

[Ravi]

I used on online calculator and came up with 15.7%. I'm not real good with math, lol. But I think the effective tax rate should be figured on gross, not adjusted gross.

 

[Tech_Esq]

I used on online calculator and came up with 15.7%. I'm not real good with math, lol. But I think the effective tax rate should be figured on gross, not adjusted gross.

Right, it's the amount money you make and actual taxes you paid, after all the smoke clears, on the money you made.

 

[Skull Pilot]

Because they make less. I could to, but I choose not to.

And anyone that is paying 6% needs to quit whining.

but you're paying a higher percentage. if you both paid the same percentage you would pay more if you make more so why should the government take a higher percentage?

and in the fair tax system, you would probably buy more than someone who makes less and you would still pay more. so why not have a tax that is truly equitable?

 

[GHook93]

Great perhaps you should join Halliburton Corporation and move there, then.

AFter all, Dubai is a monarchy.

And people who prefer corporative power above representational governments are probably more comfortable under an extremely paternal fascist monarchical goverment than living in something messy like a democracy, anyway.

And just think, no corporate taxes, either.

It's a swell place as you can read here; Dubai - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Shall I book your flight today?

Fine you want to compare state-side! Why is Texas have the largest amount of incoming and relocating corporations in America! Because they have a 1% corporate flat tax!

http://www.taxfoundation.org/files/statecorpincomerates-20080321.swf

 

[Tech_Esq]

but you're paying a higher percentage. if you both paid the same percentage you would pay more if you make more so why should the government take a higher percentage?

and in the fair tax system, you would probably buy more than someone who makes less and you would still pay more. so why not have a tax that is truly equitable?

The effective tax rate has little to do with the amount of money you make. It wouldn't surprise me if I made more than Ravi, but my tax rate is lower because of the deductions and tax planning we've done.

 

[Ravi]

The effective tax rate has little to do with the amount of money you make. It wouldn't surprise me if I made more than Ravi, but my tax rate is lower because of the deductions and tax planning we've done.

That could be true...but that's besides the point. We all pay a lower tax rate than we are led to believe just by going by the tax brackets. And corporations often pay no tax at all.

As for flat tax, I've never seen a credible breakdown of how it would work and if it would really be fair. Progressive tax doesn't bother me. What bothers me more is that religious organizations enjoy tax free status.

 

[Tech_Esq]

That could be true...but that's besides the point. We all pay a lower tax rate than we are led to believe just by going by the tax brackets. And corporations often pay no tax at all.

As for flat tax, I've never seen a credible breakdown of how it would work and if it would really be fair. Progressive tax doesn't bother me. What bothers me more is that religious organizations enjoy tax free status.

I don't think a flat tax on people would be functional. There are too many things the government wants to encourage people to do.

On the corporate side, that probably remains true as well, but a flat tax could work. We would probably be better off with a small flat tax on corporations and VAT tax on people. Say 20% VAT, 5% to the state government and 15% to the feds. That way you get to choose how much you get taxed and when.

 

[Toro]

Great idea.

Too bad our whorish political system won't allow it to happen.

 

[DavidS]

Great idea.

Too bad our whorish political system won't allow it to happen.

If you keep cutting taxes, how the hell are you going to pay for anything? Small government only works in a tiny country like Ireland whose population is about 4 million. We have 300 million. There's a bit of a difference. Also, while Ireland's corporate taxes are low, Ireland's personal taxes are through the roof. 41% on all income over $30,000. Only America's absolute richest have our highest tax rate - 36%.

 

[Toro]

If you keep cutting taxes, how the hell are you going to pay for anything? Small government only works in a tiny country like Ireland whose population is about 4 million. We have 300 million. There's a bit of a difference. Also, while Ireland's corporate taxes are low, Ireland's personal taxes are through the roof. 41% on all income over $30,000. Only America's absolute richest have our highest tax rate - 36%.

First, from how I read the OP, the argument is meant to be tax neutral, i.e. you lower tax rates and get rid of loopholes. America already has one of the lowest effective corporate tax rates in the world but that's because there are so many loopholes so the lawyers and accountants stay employed.

Second, generally, lower corporate tax rates generally do support higher levels of economic activity that lead to higher tax revenues all around. I'm not a supporter of that ridiculous Laffer Curve theory, but corporate taxes are merely taxes on productivity.

 

[DavidS]

First, from how I read the OP, the argument is meant to be tax neutral, i.e. you lower tax rates and get rid of loopholes. America already has one of the lowest effective corporate tax rates in the world but that's because there are so many loopholes so the lawyers and accountants stay employed.

Second, generally, lower corporate tax rates generally do support higher levels of economic activity that lead to higher tax revenues all around. I'm not a supporter of that ridiculous Laffer Curve theory, but corporate taxes are merely taxes on productivity.

Great, hire more people so they can barely make a living. Sounds like the worst case of class warfare to me. Profit from a business goes to its owners... corporate taxes in the mid teens means their pockets are lined with gold while they employees suffer only making $15,000 a year net.

 

[Toro]

Great, hire more people so they can barely make a living. Sounds like the worst case of class warfare to me. Profit from a business goes to its owners... corporate taxes in the mid teens means their pockets are lined with gold while they employees suffer only making $15,000 a year net.

I'm not arguing it from a fairness perspective. I am arguing it from an efficiency perspective. Cutting corporate taxes creates more jobs. Whether this distribution of income is fair is another issue. But you must understand the costs involved.

 

[oreo]

Corporate tax rates in the United States are the 2nd highest in the world.

And we wonder why corporations out-source & move their operations to different countries.