Cost of Illegal Immigration, By State

[Liquid Reigns]

I buy a $300,000 home with $60,000 down.
The bank lends me $240,000.

The value of my home increases to $400,000.
My loan is still $240,000.

Teach me your banking wisdom by explaining how the bank can suddenly lend more money.

Here is your lesson:

Using your example, if I bought that house for $300,000 and put $60,000 down, I owe the bank $240,000.

So, I hire the good old USDA approved, licensed, background checked, insured, bonded, Americans and invest another $20,000 in this home. It's value rises from $300,000 to $340,000. So, when the home is flipped, it is worth more money and the bank loans out more since they are now holding more in assets.

I can take that same $20,000 and hire a cheaper crew, and the value of the home rises to $360,000 and I get more things done in the remodel job. I flip that home and that's another $20,000 the bank gets to loan out over the first crew's bid.

So, I have a house worth more money - more dollars in my pocket. The bank gets more money - more they can charge in interest. Now, here is what is wrong with your argument:

Your USDA approved, licensed, background checked, insured, bonded guy charges more and when he's paid, he is still paying his laborers the same as the guy who charged me less. Then the American contractor goes out and spends that profit he made on shit made in China, Japan, Korea, etc. There is no advantage for me or the bank to pay more for a remodel job given those parameters.

The best solution is for people to realize that an American contractor is not worth the wages you'd pay to a surgeon. If your surgeon screws up, it's your life. If the cheaper re modeler screws up, you sue in civil court and get the job finished or your money back. But, in no event does it make sense to cut a cheaper competitor out of the equation over human registration papers issued by a corrupt government.

Now, if the American contractor offers competitive bids, only spends his money with American companies selling made in America goods and pays his employees a realistic wage, I gladly and deliberately support him.

So, when the home is flipped, it is worth more money and the bank loans out more since they are now holding more in assets.

I still own the home.
The bank can't lend more.

Thanks. LOL!

If all I have is a $340,000 house that is all it is going to sell for... tops. a $360,000 will sell for more and the bank will make more when the house is flipped.

The bank doesn't make anything on your house at either value, it is nothing more than a ledger item and has no bearing on handing out loans.

Not so.

Read this very carefully

Behind The Scenes Of Your Mortgage

A Beginner's Guide to Hedging

Which doesn't conflict with anything I stated nor does it claim/back-up anything Humorme stated. SHRUG

 

[Liquid Reigns]

Well, if is says so in the Federalist Papers Project, blog, it must be true! I depend on them for all my extremist RW rants!

What about the CBO report that pretty much backs up the OP?

 

[Care4all]

There are two sides to every accounting ledger. Can you cite the figures for the credit side of the ledger on the issue of undocumented workers?

Well, they do pay a bit in sales taxes.

and property tax if they own a home, or they pay the property tax of their landlord's in their rent payment....and if one of the DACA or a legal card holding immigrant, they pay both federal and state income taxes (and payroll taxes I believe?) ....plus they buy lottery tickets, and they pay tobacco/cigarette taxes both federal and state and liquor taxes....sin taxes, and if they drive they pay gas taxes both federal and state,,,,

 

[Liquid Reigns]

There are two sides to every accounting ledger. Can you cite the figures for the credit side of the ledger on the issue of undocumented workers?

Well, they do pay a bit in sales taxes.

and property tax if they own a home, or they pay the property tax of their landlord's in their rent payment....and if one of the DACA or a legal card holding immigrant, they pay both federal and state income taxes (and payroll taxes I believe?) ....plus they buy lottery tickets, and they pay tobacco/cigarette taxes both federal and state and liquor taxes....sin taxes, and if they drive they pay gas taxes both federal and state,,,,

Sales and user taxes everybody pays along with property tax whether you own or rent. the issue is the taxes they pay don't cover their local/state costs. Payroll taxes are with held, when they file their tax forms they usually get much more back then they had with held (they are eligible for all tax credits), thus it becomes a negative tax rate.

The only people that benefit from those illegal workers are the illegal workers themselves and the employer.

 

[toobfreak]

There is this big movement of sorts that think it's cool to yell and scream, demanding that we deport the so - called "illegals."

Few, if any, of these extremists stop to consider the costs of their actions.

1) From a purely economic standpoint, undocumented foreigners create jobs and stimulate the economy. That is why big business tolerates them

2) Just because a foreigner is deported does not mean that a job opening will exist. My father owned a business once and when they voted to go union, the old man shut his company down and moved on to greener pastures

3) Deporting millions of people in the manner that the extremists want means that millions of homes and apartments will now be vacant. That will drive the price of houses down (something to think about when you own your own home) and then taxes have to go up. Government don't like laying off bureaucrats

4) The build the wall - deport 'em all advocates refuse at every opportunity to have a constructive discussion about the Rights and Liberties we're being asked to forfeit in order to accommodate this questionable extremism

5) The build the wall - deport 'em all advocates refuse to acknowledge that an employer owns the job he / she creates. So, if the jobs belong to Americans, we have adopted National Socialism. I'm not in favor of it

6) There are ways to resolve this issue without a wall; it won't require mass deportations; it would not require forfeiting our Liberties and Freedoms for the sake of appeasing misguided white supremacists and the legions of people they've duped that act without thinking

7) Getting back to the OP, while there are "costs" to undocumented foreigners being here, there are also dollars to be put into the credit column of the ledger. All NON-PARTISAN studies conclude the costs v benefits ends in either a wash where it all balances out to the undocumented foreigners being a net benefit to the states.

Whether they stay or go is of no major concern of mine. But, if the extremists think they are going take a giant dump on my Rights and Liberties in the process, they are sorely mistaken.

I see there is some debate on the value and cost of illegal aliens. I submit the best way to resolve the dispute is to throw all of them out of the country! That way, it immediately solves the matter of how many billions they cost us at the state and federal level---- we bring that immediately to ZERO. As to their benefit, I would offer that illegal alien labor is the most fleetingly gossamer thing----- if the USA cannot replace that labor some other way, unemployed, welfare people, kids looking for work and criminals in jail, there is something wrong with us. We can survive without all those precious illegal aliens.

 

[Care4all]

There are two sides to every accounting ledger. Can you cite the figures for the credit side of the ledger on the issue of undocumented workers?

Well, they do pay a bit in sales taxes.

and property tax if they own a home, or they pay the property tax of their landlord's in their rent payment....and if one of the DACA or a legal card holding immigrant, they pay both federal and state income taxes (and payroll taxes I believe?) ....plus they buy lottery tickets, and they pay tobacco/cigarette taxes both federal and state and liquor taxes....sin taxes, and if they drive they pay gas taxes both federal and state,,,,

Sales and user taxes everybody pays along with property tax whether you own or rent. the issue is the taxes they pay don't cover their local/state costs. Payroll taxes are with held, when they file their tax forms they usually get much more back then they had with held (they are eligible for all tax credits), thus it becomes a negative tax rate.

The only people that benefit from those illegal workers are the illegal workers themselves and the employer.

if the employers were fined heavily and even jailed if necessary, as Reagan wanted but R's in congress dropped out of their immigration bill, then we would not have this illegal immigration problem today.

Reagan did not mess up with his immigraton amnesty, the R's in congress were lobbied by the small business association to drop the penalties on the employers, that Reagan wanted.

 

[Liquid Reigns]

There are two sides to every accounting ledger. Can you cite the figures for the credit side of the ledger on the issue of undocumented workers?

Well, they do pay a bit in sales taxes.

and property tax if they own a home, or they pay the property tax of their landlord's in their rent payment....and if one of the DACA or a legal card holding immigrant, they pay both federal and state income taxes (and payroll taxes I believe?) ....plus they buy lottery tickets, and they pay tobacco/cigarette taxes both federal and state and liquor taxes....sin taxes, and if they drive they pay gas taxes both federal and state,,,,

Sales and user taxes everybody pays along with property tax whether you own or rent. the issue is the taxes they pay don't cover their local/state costs. Payroll taxes are with held, when they file their tax forms they usually get much more back then they had with held (they are eligible for all tax credits), thus it becomes a negative tax rate.

The only people that benefit from those illegal workers are the illegal workers themselves and the employer.

if the employers were fined heavily and even jailed if necessary, as Reagan wanted but R's in congress dropped out of their immigration bill, then we would not have this illegal immigration problem today.

Reagan did not mess up with his immigraton amnesty, the R's in congress were lobbied by the small business association to drop the penalties on the employers, that Reagan wanted.

It's more in the wording of the law itself: knowingly hire
The other issue being many times it is the HR Department/managers that hires not necessarily the business owner. The HR departments/managers were found guilty under Bush for knowingly hiring illegals, Obama used tax fraud and evasion charges to go after the employer and didn't do much with the illegal workers.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

There are two sides to every accounting ledger. Can you cite the figures for the credit side of the ledger on the issue of undocumented workers?

Well, they do pay a bit in sales taxes.

and property tax if they own a home, or they pay the property tax of their landlord's in their rent payment....and if one of the DACA or a legal card holding immigrant, they pay both federal and state income taxes (and payroll taxes I believe?) ....plus they buy lottery tickets, and they pay tobacco/cigarette taxes both federal and state and liquor taxes....sin taxes, and if they drive they pay gas taxes both federal and state,,,,

and property tax if they own a home,

Illegal aliens buy homes with stolen Social Security numbers?

Give them all the boot.

 

[Vandalshandle]

Well, if is says so in the Federalist Papers Project, blog, it must be true! I depend on them for all my extremist RW rants!

Do you think the parents of the "Dreamers" paid enough taxes to cover the cost of their schooling?

Is there some reason that you don't think they have? I mean, some reason other than some obscure RW blog?

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Well, if is says so in the Federalist Papers Project, blog, it must be true! I depend on them for all my extremist RW rants!

Do you think the parents of the "Dreamers" paid enough taxes to cover the cost of their schooling?

Is there some reason that you don't think they have? I mean, some reason other than some obscure RW blog?

Is there some reason that you don't think they have?

Well, here in Chicago, we spend about $15,000 per student per year.
You think there are a lot of illegal aliens paying $15,000 in state and local taxes per year per kid?

 

[Vandalshandle]

Why not just cut to the chase? I have a cousin who pays no property tax, state or federal income tax, liquor or tobacco taxes, no gasoline tax. In fact, I would be hard pressed to name a single tax he pays, above and beyond telephone taxes. That makes him a leach, by GOP standards. Accordingly, even though he served as a career military officer, I guess that the GOP should roust him out of his hospice bed and send him out of the country somewhere.

 

[Vandalshandle]

Well, if is says so in the Federalist Papers Project, blog, it must be true! I depend on them for all my extremist RW rants!

Do you think the parents of the "Dreamers" paid enough taxes to cover the cost of their schooling?

Is there some reason that you don't think they have? I mean, some reason other than some obscure RW blog?

Is there some reason that you don't think they have?

Well, here in Chicago, we spend about $15,000 per student per year.
You think there are a lot of illegal aliens paying $15,000 in state and local taxes per year per kid?

Do you think that the US citizens on the Chicago South Side pay that much?

 

[Humorme]

There are two sides to every accounting ledger. Can you cite the figures for the credit side of the ledger on the issue of undocumented workers?

Well, they do pay a bit in sales taxes.

and property tax if they own a home, or they pay the property tax of their landlord's in their rent payment....and if one of the DACA or a legal card holding immigrant, they pay both federal and state income taxes (and payroll taxes I believe?) ....plus they buy lottery tickets, and they pay tobacco/cigarette taxes both federal and state and liquor taxes....sin taxes, and if they drive they pay gas taxes both federal and state,,,,

Let's be blunt here:

Undocumented foreigners pay all the taxes that the rest of society does. The only tax in dispute is the income tax.

Frankly, I don't give two hoots in Hell about the income tax. The 16th Amendment was illegally ratified; it isn't necessary; it is unwarranted; it is socialism and stealing from the American workers. Yet those who hate the little brown people from across the southern border would subject you to that tax just to get rid of the foreigners.

Adding insult to injury, the undocumented foreigners pay roughly $12 BILLION DOLLARS per year into Socialist Security and cannot draw out one thin dime in retirement. That is a figure that comes from the Chief Actuary of the Social Security Administration.

The last thing this issue is about is taxes. If it weren't for the anti-immigrant lobby, the constitutionalists had the income tax issue all but won and that wouldn't even be a factor. But, like professional race pimps that need the racism issue, the anti-immigrants have to create a tax issue so they prop up an unconstitutional, immoral, illegal, unconscionable, indefensible tax like the income tax (which is also a plank out of the Communist Manifesto.) But, what the Hell, if outright communism will get rid of the people from south of the border, the anti-immigrant lobby is game.

 

[Humorme]

There is this big movement of sorts that think it's cool to yell and scream, demanding that we deport the so - called "illegals."

Few, if any, of these extremists stop to consider the costs of their actions.

1) From a purely economic standpoint, undocumented foreigners create jobs and stimulate the economy. That is why big business tolerates them

2) Just because a foreigner is deported does not mean that a job opening will exist. My father owned a business once and when they voted to go union, the old man shut his company down and moved on to greener pastures

3) Deporting millions of people in the manner that the extremists want means that millions of homes and apartments will now be vacant. That will drive the price of houses down (something to think about when you own your own home) and then taxes have to go up. Government don't like laying off bureaucrats

4) The build the wall - deport 'em all advocates refuse at every opportunity to have a constructive discussion about the Rights and Liberties we're being asked to forfeit in order to accommodate this questionable extremism

5) The build the wall - deport 'em all advocates refuse to acknowledge that an employer owns the job he / she creates. So, if the jobs belong to Americans, we have adopted National Socialism. I'm not in favor of it

6) There are ways to resolve this issue without a wall; it won't require mass deportations; it would not require forfeiting our Liberties and Freedoms for the sake of appeasing misguided white supremacists and the legions of people they've duped that act without thinking

7) Getting back to the OP, while there are "costs" to undocumented foreigners being here, there are also dollars to be put into the credit column of the ledger. All NON-PARTISAN studies conclude the costs v benefits ends in either a wash where it all balances out to the undocumented foreigners being a net benefit to the states.

Whether they stay or go is of no major concern of mine. But, if the extremists think they are going take a giant dump on my Rights and Liberties in the process, they are sorely mistaken.

I see there is some debate on the value and cost of illegal aliens. I submit the best way to resolve the dispute is to throw all of them out of the country! That way, it immediately solves the matter of how many billions they cost us at the state and federal level---- we bring that immediately to ZERO. As to their benefit, I would offer that illegal alien labor is the most fleetingly gossamer thing----- if the USA cannot replace that labor some other way, unemployed, welfare people, kids looking for work and criminals in jail, there is something wrong with us. We can survive without all those precious illegal aliens.

Your problem is that:

A) They are a net gain for our economy. THAT is why big business is not on your side on this one

B) Disrupting people's lives over an infraction of federal law that is the equivalent of an improper U Turn will eventually be deemed to be cruel and unusual punishment by the United States Supreme Court

C) If you wanted to solve any problem related to labor, you would offer employers incentives to hire an all American staff, take people off welfare, unemployment, and disability. Lobby for tax breaks.

Don't try to pee down my neck and tell me it's raining. This is about a war against foreigners. I'm not taking sides on your fight. I'm telling you that your STRATEGIES are costing Americans more than any promised benefit.

 

[Humorme]

There are two sides to every accounting ledger. Can you cite the figures for the credit side of the ledger on the issue of undocumented workers?

Well, they do pay a bit in sales taxes.

and property tax if they own a home, or they pay the property tax of their landlord's in their rent payment....and if one of the DACA or a legal card holding immigrant, they pay both federal and state income taxes (and payroll taxes I believe?) ....plus they buy lottery tickets, and they pay tobacco/cigarette taxes both federal and state and liquor taxes....sin taxes, and if they drive they pay gas taxes both federal and state,,,,

Sales and user taxes everybody pays along with property tax whether you own or rent. the issue is the taxes they pay don't cover their local/state costs. Payroll taxes are with held, when they file their tax forms they usually get much more back then they had with held (they are eligible for all tax credits), thus it becomes a negative tax rate.

The only people that benefit from those illegal workers are the illegal workers themselves and the employer.

if the employers were fined heavily and even jailed if necessary, as Reagan wanted but R's in congress dropped out of their immigration bill, then we would not have this illegal immigration problem today.

Reagan did not mess up with his immigraton amnesty, the R's in congress were lobbied by the small business association to drop the penalties on the employers, that Reagan wanted.

Asked and answered a hundred times, but for the record:

You don't have the constitutional authority to tell an employer who to hire.

Throw the employer in jail and the job may disappear. Threaten the employer and not give them the Right to give the job they created to the candidate they want, the business might leave for another country.

You're not offering solutions. You're advocating bankrupting America, turning it into a POLICE STATE, and screwing the Constitution.

 

[Humorme]

There are two sides to every accounting ledger. Can you cite the figures for the credit side of the ledger on the issue of undocumented workers?

Well, they do pay a bit in sales taxes.

and property tax if they own a home, or they pay the property tax of their landlord's in their rent payment....and if one of the DACA or a legal card holding immigrant, they pay both federal and state income taxes (and payroll taxes I believe?) ....plus they buy lottery tickets, and they pay tobacco/cigarette taxes both federal and state and liquor taxes....sin taxes, and if they drive they pay gas taxes both federal and state,,,,

and property tax if they own a home,

Illegal aliens buy homes with stolen Social Security numbers?

Give them all the boot.

You don't need an SSN to buy a house.

 

[Liquid Reigns]

Let's be blunt here:

Undocumented foreigners pay all the taxes that the rest of society does. The only tax in dispute is the income tax.

Frankly, I don't give two hoots in Hell about the income tax. The 16th Amendment was illegally ratified; it isn't necessary; it is unwarranted; it is socialism and stealing from the American workers. Yet those who hate the little brown people from across the southern border would subject you to that tax just to get rid of the foreigners.

Adding insult to injury, the undocumented foreigners pay roughly $12 BILLION DOLLARS per year into Socialist Security and cannot draw out one thin dime in retirement. That is a figure that comes from the Chief Actuary of the Social Security Administration.

That $12B is based on illegal workers (women who never changed their SS number to match their name change after marriage or divorce, mismatched numbers by either an employer or the employee themselves, etc), not just illegal immigrants. 1/2 of that money is paid by the employer, thus actual illegal immigrants may have paid into the SS Earnings Suspense File, which is not part of SS. https://www.ssa.gov/oact/NOTES/pdf_notes/note151.pdf
Some illegals can get SS benefits when they retire via Totalization Agreements, DACA is also eligible for SS benefits.

The last thing this issue is about is taxes. If it weren't for the anti-immigrant lobby, the constitutionalists had the income tax issue all but won and that wouldn't even be a factor. But, like professional race pimps that need the racism issue, the anti-immigrants have to create a tax issue so they prop up an unconstitutional, immoral, illegal, unconscionable, indefensible tax like the income tax (which is also a plank out of the Communist Manifesto.) But, what the Hell, if outright communism will get rid of the people from south of the border, the anti-immigrant lobby is game.

Your anti-tax rants and Tax Protestor idiocy has no bearing here. Sovereign Citizen ignorance.

 

[Liquid Reigns]

Your problem is that:

A) They are a net gain for our economy. THAT is why big business is not on your side on this one

B) Disrupting people's lives over an infraction of federal law that is the equivalent of an improper U Turn will eventually be deemed to be cruel and unusual punishment by the United States Supreme Court

C) If you wanted to solve any problem related to labor, you would offer employers incentives to hire an all American staff, take people off welfare, unemployment, and disability. Lobby for tax breaks.

Don't try to pee down my neck and tell me it's raining. This is about a war against foreigners. I'm not taking sides on your fight. I'm telling you that your STRATEGIES are costing Americans more than any promised benefit.

And yet you haven't gave one single cite that makes the claim that illegals are a "net gain" to the economy.

Improper Entry is Federal Misdemeanor, much more than a "infraction equivalent to a U-turn". SMFH Deportation will not be deemed cruel and unusual punishment by SCOTUS. LMFAO shear stupidity.

You shouldn't pee into the wind and claim to be taking a shower. The rest of your comment is hyperbole. YAWN

 

[Liquid Reigns]

Asked and answered a hundred times, but for the record:

You don't have the constitutional authority to tell an employer who to hire.

There is nothing in the USC that says anything about hiring people. Since business is allowed in society, business gets to abide by societies rules.

Throw the employer in jail and the job may disappear. Threaten the employer and not give them the Right to give the job they created to the candidate they want, the business might leave for another country.

You're not offering solutions. You're advocating bankrupting America, turning it into a POLICE STATE, and screwing the Constitution.

And yet none of that is happening. SHRUG

 

[Liquid Reigns]

There are two sides to every accounting ledger. Can you cite the figures for the credit side of the ledger on the issue of undocumented workers?

Well, they do pay a bit in sales taxes.

and property tax if they own a home, or they pay the property tax of their landlord's in their rent payment....and if one of the DACA or a legal card holding immigrant, they pay both federal and state income taxes (and payroll taxes I believe?) ....plus they buy lottery tickets, and they pay tobacco/cigarette taxes both federal and state and liquor taxes....sin taxes, and if they drive they pay gas taxes both federal and state,,,,

and property tax if they own a home,

Illegal aliens buy homes with stolen Social Security numbers?

Give them all the boot.

You don't need an SSN to buy a house.

You either need an SS number or an actual passport and other forms of ID along with credit and a credit history, even if you pay with cash.