Conservative versus Liberal

[TakeAStepBack]

Employment is optional. there is no one holding you at a job. Don't like the boss/rules/pay?
You're free to go look for another. As for those not making enough money. Get two jobs, get three or find a way to get educated for better employment. Sitting around whining isn't anyone problem but yor own.

The same does not apply to the rules mandated by authoritarians. Your choice is comply, or face violence or coercion. The state is the true and only long standing tyranny.


Dumb fucks; by the boat load.

 

[occupied]

In the most important matters for a nation, rigid is the only way to be. There is no compromising with tyranny anf authoritarian rulers.

In your LOLberal fantasyland, I'm sure that there is room to compromise with the king. As long as he gives yo a piece of fruit and some coins. The groveling isn't all that bad, right?

Rigidity is the highway to tyranny, a failure to compromise with the needs and wishes of the citizens is the road to revolution. Rigid inflexible rulers always fail, we are not discussing so much the attitude we should have for the government so much as how the government should act towards us and rigid idealism IS authoritarianism.

 

[TakeAStepBack]

Yeah, sure. When the foolish citizens want free this and that and we can't afford it, we should give it to them anyway. Lest they revolt! it's the reason why our founders knew that govt. had to be extremely limited. Or this would be the consequence. We're already living under totalitarian rule. As it was put by John Locke:

"Whenever the legislators endeavour to take away and destroy the property of the people, or to reduce them to slavery under arbitrary power, they put themselves into a state of war with the people, who are thereupon absolved from any further obedience, and are left to the common refuge which God hath provided for all men against force and violence."


Numb skull.

 

[Uncensored2008]

So, when do you begin LOLberal education, Corky?

Whattayamean?

Occupied has been in college for the last 19 years. 12 more and he'll get his BA in "Ethnic Macrame Studies."

 

[occupied]

Yeah, sure. When the foolish citizens want free this and that and we can't afford it, we should give it to them anyway. Lest they revolt! it's the reason why our founders knew that govt. had to be extremely limited. Or this would be the consequence. We're already living under totalitarian rule. As it was put by John Locke:

"Whenever the legislators endeavour to take away and destroy the property of the peopl, or to reduce them to slavery under arbitrary power, they put themselves into a state of war with the people, who are thereupon absolved from any further obedience, adn are left to the common refuge which God hath provided for all men against force and violence."


Numb skull.

In the absence is widespread prosperity you either have to feed the hungry, lock them up or kill them in wars or in the streets. Guess I know what your solution to poverty is. Conservatives seem to love income inequality and will not do a damned thing to mitigate it so that only leaves the option of using force to keep the rabble in line.

 

[beretta304]

Yeah, sure. When the foolish citizens want free this and that and we can't afford it, we should give it to them anyway. Lest they revolt! it's the reason why our founders knew that govt. had to be extremely limited. Or this would be the consequence. We're already living under totalitarian rule. As it was put by John Locke:

"Whenever the legislators endeavour to take away and destroy the property of the peopl, or to reduce them to slavery under arbitrary power, they put themselves into a state of war with the people, who are thereupon absolved from any further obedience, adn are left to the common refuge which God hath provided for all men against force and violence."


Numb skull.

In the absence is widespread prosperity you either have to feed the hungry, lock them up or kill them in wars or in the streets. Guess I know what your solution to poverty is. Conservatives seem to love income inequality and will not do a damned thing to mitigate it so that only leaves the option of using force to keep the rabble in line.

"Conservatives seem to love income inequality..."


That's quite a stretch to say they love it. Did your college professor teach you that all Conservatives are rich? Ever think it's unequal for conservatives because maybe they earn it while libs like you sit around waiting for it to be redistributed to you?

BTW, where's those numbers from the 2 threads earlier today?

 

[Liberal]

I thought it was well done.

Of course, some people will get mad because they feel left out and some will try to attack based on it.

This is why we can't have nice things.

 

[occupied]

Yeah, sure. When the foolish citizens want free this and that and we can't afford it, we should give it to them anyway. Lest they revolt! it's the reason why our founders knew that govt. had to be extremely limited. Or this would be the consequence. We're already living under totalitarian rule. As it was put by John Locke:

"Whenever the legislators endeavour to take away and destroy the property of the peopl, or to reduce them to slavery under arbitrary power, they put themselves into a state of war with the people, who are thereupon absolved from any further obedience, adn are left to the common refuge which God hath provided for all men against force and violence."


Numb skull.

In the absence is widespread prosperity you either have to feed the hungry, lock them up or kill them in wars or in the streets. Guess I know what your solution to poverty is. Conservatives seem to love income inequality and will not do a damned thing to mitigate it so that only leaves the option of using force to keep the rabble in line.

"Conservatives seem to love income inequality..."


That's quite a stretch to say they love it. Ever think it's unequal for conservatives because maybe they earn while libs like you sit around waiting for it to be redistributed to you?

BTW, where's those numbers from 2 threads earlier today?

Stereotype much?

 

[Liberty]

Both support government control.
If Conservatives really believed in the definition of conservatism, they would be libertarian.
If liberals really believed in the definition of liberalism, they would be libertarian.

The MSM and the bankster puppetmasters that dance your two false choice candidates in front of you have made this country fall to its knees in stupidity and servitude.

 

[occupied]

Both support government control.
If Conservatives really believed in the definition of conservatism, they would be libertarian.
If liberals really believed in the definition of liberalism, they would be libertarian.

The MSM and the bankster puppetmasters that dance your two false choice candidates in front of you have made this country fall to its knees in stupidity and servitude.

American libertarians are not libertarians in the definitive sense of the word, more like screwed-up anarchists.

 

[jillian]

Conservative vs. Liberal Beliefs | Student News Daily

That is a pretty fair representation of the liberal and conservative viewpoints on many important issues without being too burdened with strawmen.

.

actually, yes.. .and no...

on the abortion issue... we want roe v wade to be enforced. nothing more, nothing less. that is not limitless abortion for limitless time... late term is only appropriate and only occurs in extraordinary circumstances.

 

[midcan5]

Conservatism in a Nutshell

A man is lost in the woods and it starts snowing, off in the distance he sees a cabin. Slowly he makes his way only to find a locked gate, he rings the bell and a voice asks what he wants. He tells the voice his plight and is told by the voice that there is a church down the road and that they will pray for him.

Libertarianism in a Nutshell

The snow continues and growing more tired and cold, the man sees another cabin, struggling he barely makes it, he knocks and finally opens the door to warm himself. There is a full kettle of hot soup, he helps himself. Soon out of a back room comes a man, he scolds the man and tells him to leave as this is private property. The man stumbles out the door.

Liberalism in a Nutshell

Nearly exhausted the man sees a third cabin. Slowly he makes his way, opens the door and warms himself. There is soup in a kettle and he helps himself. From a back room a woman enters, she sits down next to him and they talk. He sleeps the night on the floor and the next morning goes on his way.

http://www.usmessageboard.com/politics/50872-use-this-handy-parable-to-understand-politics.html
http://www.usmessageboard.com/writing/50779-end-of-democracy.html
http://www.usmessageboard.com/politics/88682-a-conservative-wakes-up.html
http://www.usmessageboard.com/the-f...-be-a-liberal-if-post1936599.html#post1936599


"Liberals demand that the social order should in principle be capable of explaining itself at the tribunal of each person's understanding." Jeremy Waldron

 

[OKTexas]

Pretty general representation of the polar opposites on various issues but I doubt that it accurately reflects the beliefs of any individual who calls themselves a liberal or conservative, at least not one who has put some actual thought and self education into their beliefs.

Didn't think we would ever agree, but I found it a bit too simplistic for some complex issues, that being said, it is for students and hopefull would be used as just a starting point.

 

[OohPooPahDoo]

"We all want the same things in life. We want freedom; we want the chance for prosperity; we want as few people suffering as possible; we want healthy children; we want to have crime-free streets. The argument is how to achieve them…"




Conservative vs. Liberal Beliefs | Student News Daily

The difference is simple.

Liberals wonder what its like to walk in someone else's shoes.

Conservatives wonder why others don't walk in theirs.



Hey everyone - just borrow money from your parents if you wanna start a business!

 

[TakeAStepBack]

Yeah, sure. When the foolish citizens want free this and that and we can't afford it, we should give it to them anyway. Lest they revolt! it's the reason why our founders knew that govt. had to be extremely limited. Or this would be the consequence. We're already living under totalitarian rule. As it was put by John Locke:

"Whenever the legislators endeavour to take away and destroy the property of the peopl, or to reduce them to slavery under arbitrary power, they put themselves into a state of war with the people, who are thereupon absolved from any further obedience, adn are left to the common refuge which God hath provided for all men against force and violence."


Numb skull.

In the absence is widespread prosperity you either have to feed the hungry, lock them up or kill them in wars or in the streets. Guess I know what your solution to poverty is. Conservatives seem to love income inequality and will not do a damned thing to mitigate it so that only leaves the option of using force to keep the rabble in line.

in the absence of what? Tyranny? Jeebus.

The reality is there is no solution to income inequality. No matter how much you steal to provide, you only create a larger amount of needy. The war on poverty should prove that and remove any doubt. it's a failure. the best thing to do is allow a free market to reign where anyone can participate on the fruits of their labor free from coercion. That's as good as it gets. You can't mitigate income inequality. Never will be able to mitigate it and the idea that anyone can is proposterous.

A massive wealth gap is another story. That gap we have is the result of government intervention and favoritism. Not capitalism or any other organic human social construct. Only the artificial means of central planner "do-gooders" that fuck shit up and blame it on others.

 

[emilynghiem]

"We all want the same things in life. We want freedom; we want the chance for prosperity; we want as few people suffering as possible; we want healthy children; we want to have crime-free streets. The argument is how to achieve them…"

Conservative vs. Liberal Beliefs | Student News Daily

Dear Beretta: Still in the middle of an argument with a friend, over why I work with the Democrat Party, trying to bring in sustainable reforms from the Greens and based on the Constitution, but am leaning toward voting for Romney (or voting for the Greens, since I'm in Texas where the outcome is pretty much locked in anyway).

I told him in the end, it is my duty to uphold the Constitution first and foremost above party politics or platforms, and above any of my own personal views and preferences. And any candidates or officials in govt should be held to that same standard, putting the Constitution first and using that as the basis for judging laws and policies through the govt systems.

So none of his arguments about why he feels voting for the Democrat Party could hold any water, because none of that was based on the Constitution. It was all based on fear that the GOP would take away or oppose things, that I argued were protected by the Constitution NOT by voting for Democrats to "protect these for you against threats blaming the GOP.

If we made decisions based on the Constitution, and equal protection/inclusion/representation of diverse views, where differences had to be resolved by consensus and accommodate all the issues and interests in solutions by agreement so NOBODY was oppressed or discriminated against by political or religious position or group,
then we wouldn't HAVE these issues of trying to vote for the bigger bully to stop the other from bullying, etc.

And I told my friend, that as a Democrat who has WORKED with constituents among the Democrat, Green, Republican and independent, I've had more success with Republicans resolving differences based on the CONSTITUTION rather than Democrats who depend on voting people in they feel "represent" those values they want to enforce. The Democrats teach dependency on party and govt instead of enforcing the Constitution directly.

I align also more with the Greens promoting solutions that work independent of the current system, such as local currency, consensus-based decision making, and proportional representation. I normally lean toward voting Green, but have voted for Bush and McCain where I would have preferred a Democrat VP to balance the ticket and represent the whole country (but didn't have that choice).

I would consider voting Green, except for my total disdain for the health care bill as unconstitutional. This distracts from the fact that the budget and authority for health care reform belongs on the STATE level, because it is tied in with the need for massive state prison reforms, cleaning up the criminal justice system including crimes and trafficking tied to illegal immigrations, and saving resources for law-abiding citizens instead of penalizing citizens for the costs of crimes for which the wrongdoers are NOT being held accountable for paying back. So I see a real need to enforce the Constitution, and organize responsibility on the STATE and local levels to get rid of overreliance on govt bureaucracy, and pay back taxpayers by investing in sustainable solutions that can accommodate diversity on local levels, instead of trying to mandate these through federal govt.

I really would have to see that Obama acknowledges the health care bill is AT LEAST as unconstitutional as the AZ immigration bill he publicly opposed, if not more so, since the AZ bill was more easily corrected because the conflicts with Constitutional law were in specific clauses that could be remedied; while with the health care bill, the whole opt out clause would have to be made optional so the federal govt isn't regulating religious exemptions.

Otherwise, I cannot justify keeping someone in office who does not respect and uphold the Constitution as the office of President requires. Sorry, I just have a problem with that. I even see that President Bush and the GOP are more open to admitting overreaching, and adjusting to accommodate opposing views Constitutionally, while this seems foreign to the Democrat Party. I have almost given up trying to establish Constitutional principles among Democrat constituents and leadership who keep putting party politics first for elections. Maybe this is just because I am in Texas, where the Dems face an uphill battle constantly that they do this. That's where I disagree and believe in putting the Constitution first, especially if you want to work out policy issues with GOP: use the Constitution to make your arguments and build reforms on a solid foundation, not bullying based on partisanship!

 

[TakeAStepBack]

Conservatism in a Nutshell

A man is lost in the woods and it starts snowing, off in the distance he sees a cabin. Slowly he makes his way only to find a locked gate, he rings the bell and a voice asks what he wants. He tells the voice his plight and is told by the voice that there is a church down the road and that they will pray for him.

Libertarianism in a Nutshell

The snow continues and growing more tired and cold, the man sees another cabin, struggling he barely makes it, he knocks and finally opens the door to warm himself. There is a full kettle of hot soup, he helps himself. Soon out of a back room comes a man, he scolds the man and tells him to leave as this is private property. The man stumbles out the door.

Liberalism in a Nutshell

Nearly exhausted the man sees a third cabin. Slowly he makes his way, opens the door and warms himself. There is soup in a kettle and he helps himself. From a back room a woman enters, she sits down next to him and they talk. He sleeps the night on the floor and the next morning goes on his way.

http://www.usmessageboard.com/politics/50872-use-this-handy-parable-to-understand-politics.html
http://www.usmessageboard.com/writing/50779-end-of-democracy.html
http://www.usmessageboard.com/politics/88682-a-conservative-wakes-up.html
http://www.usmessageboard.com/the-f...-be-a-liberal-if-post1936599.html#post1936599


"Liberals demand that the social order should in principle be capable of explaining itself at the tribunal of each person's understanding." Jeremy Waldron

You are seriously lacking understanding on political ideology in relation to pseronal compassion. But you're a LOLberal, so i repeat myself.

 

[copsnrobbers]

Conservatism is what made this country great while liberalism is destroying it. The down trodden and takers should not be deciding what our future should be.

 

[DiamondDave]

Conservatism in a Nutshell

A man is lost in the woods and it starts snowing, off in the distance he sees a cabin. Slowly he makes his way only to find a locked gate, he rings the bell and a voice asks what he wants. He tells the voice his plight and is told by the voice that there is a church down the road and that they will pray for him.

Libertarianism in a Nutshell

The snow continues and growing more tired and cold, the man sees another cabin, struggling he barely makes it, he knocks and finally opens the door to warm himself. There is a full kettle of hot soup, he helps himself. Soon out of a back room comes a man, he scolds the man and tells him to leave as this is private property. The man stumbles out the door.

Liberalism in a Nutshell

Nearly exhausted the man sees a third cabin. Slowly he makes his way, opens the door and warms himself. There is soup in a kettle and he helps himself. From a back room a woman enters, she sits down next to him and they talk. He sleeps the night on the floor and the next morning goes on his way.

http://www.usmessageboard.com/politics/50872-use-this-handy-parable-to-understand-politics.html
http://www.usmessageboard.com/writing/50779-end-of-democracy.html
http://www.usmessageboard.com/politics/88682-a-conservative-wakes-up.html
http://www.usmessageboard.com/the-f...-be-a-liberal-if-post1936599.html#post1936599


"Liberals demand that the social order should in principle be capable of explaining itself at the tribunal of each person's understanding." Jeremy Waldron

Ahh.. your liberalism in a nutshells assumes that person has the right to invade private property, take as they want from those who earn and build, and think that you deserve a place in their graces simply because you fucking exist

And as for the conservatism part... they have every right to do that, because nobody is owed anything of yours... but you seem to forget that it is the conservative that is generally more giving and generous, except when they are being forced to be so without choice by the likes of you

 

[rightwinger]

Conservatism is what made this country great while liberalism is destroying it. The down trodden and takers should not be deciding what our future should be.

This country was founded by Liberals and every major initiative was progressed by the Liberals of the day. Without Liberals, Abolition, Worker Rights, Womens Rights, Civil Rights, Environmental Protections and Gay Rights would still be opposed by Conservatives