BOEHNER/CANTOR blink on Killing Medicare

[The Rabbi]

As Bill Press put it, Ryan mixed the Kool Aid and the GOP all drank it.
Now, they will have to live with it when time comes to be reelected. They're all on record for voting to abolish Medicare as we know it.

No one will remember or care.
Obama OTOH will have to run on the record of cutting funds for Medicare and instituting health care rationing.

 

[EriktheRed]

WASHINGTON – The GOP plan to replace Medicare with vouchers probably will have to wait, party leaders acknowledged Thursday as lawmakers and the White House bowed to political realities in pursuing a deal to allow more government borrowing in exchange for big spending cuts.

Both sides hinted at movement and Vice President Joe Biden reported progress from an initial negotiating session.

Spending cuts and increasing the amount of money the government can keep borrowing to pay its bills are "practically and politically connected," Biden said at the start of budget meetings with lawmakers at Blair House, the guest residence across Pennsylvania Avenue from the White House.

The House Republican whose committee oversees Medicare said he's open to other approaches besides the voucher plan that recently passed by the House after a contentious debate that appears to have hurt the party with older voters.

Michigan Rep. Dave Camp, the House Ways and Means Committee chairman, said he supports the GOP approach, but isn't willing to go to the mat for legislation that has no prospects of becoming law.

"I'm not interested in laying down more markers," said Camp. "I'm interested in solutions. ... Let's figure out where there is common ground and let's get there as soon as we can."

Asked about Camp's comments, House Speaker John Boehner, R-Ohio, said they are "a recognition of the political realities that we face." Nonetheless, Boehner said the GOP Medicare remake remains on the table.


GOP concedes Medicare vouchers unlikely to advance - Yahoo! News


And in other news......

Water is wet and the sun rises in the morning.

The hole $4Trillion in cuts didn't have legs. The dems have no honest desire to cut spending to lower the debt. They need another bill clinton at the helm

You mean the Bill Clinton who raised taxes?

 

[EriktheRed]

So if the GOP doesn't compromise they are the "party of no." If they do compromise then "they blinked."
Is this all that matters to the Dums? Stupid score cards of "winning and losing"? I have news for them: We are all losers if we cannot get this deficit under some kind of control. We will see our debt ratings down-graded, cost of borrowing soar, and the U.S. relegated to a 3rd rate power like Argentina. Which is probably what Obama wants anyway.

No, that's what'll happen if we don't have a vote to raise the debt ceiling, which is right now in the House GOP's court. The way they're screwing around about having the vote on it, they're obviously not serious at all about the deficit reduction they suddenly care about.

 

[EriktheRed]

Obama OTOH will have to run on the record of cutting funds for Medicare and instituting health care rationing.

How's that again?

 

[Trajan]

they never said it would balance the budget even by 2027...*shrugs*


so, lets see the democratic plan....bueller?

 

[Trajan]

Obama OTOH will have to run on the record of cutting funds for Medicare and instituting health care rationing.

How's that again?

this is news?

Obama defends Medicare cuts


Obama defends Medicare cuts | BenefitsPro

 

[Trajan]

So if the GOP doesn't compromise they are the "party of no." If they do compromise then "they blinked."
Is this all that matters to the Dums? Stupid score cards of "winning and losing"? I have news for them: We are all losers if we cannot get this deficit under some kind of control. We will see our debt ratings down-graded, cost of borrowing soar, and the U.S. relegated to a 3rd rate power like Argentina. Which is probably what Obama wants anyway.

No, that's what'll happen if we don't have a vote to raise the debt ceiling, which is right now in the House GOP's court. The way they're screwing around about having the vote on it, they're obviously not serious at all about the deficit reduction they suddenly care about.

and how does raising the debt. ceiling trim the deficit?

 

[Quantum Windbag]

So if the GOP doesn't compromise they are the "party of no." If they do compromise then "they blinked."
Is this all that matters to the Dums? Stupid score cards of "winning and losing"? I have news for them: We are all losers if we cannot get this deficit under some kind of control. We will see our debt ratings down-graded, cost of borrowing soar, and the U.S. relegated to a 3rd rate power like Argentina. Which is probably what Obama wants anyway.

No, that's what'll happen if we don't have a vote to raise the debt ceiling, which is right now in the House GOP's court. The way they're screwing around about having the vote on it, they're obviously not serious at all about the deficit reduction they suddenly care about.

What does raising the non existent debt ceiling have to do with lowering the deficit?

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

The dems have no honest desire to cut spending to lower the debt.

Neither do the republicans. Behind the façade of ‘fiscal responsibility’ the GOP will try to dismantle the hated social programs dating back to FDR. For the GOP it’s about political dogma, not what’s best for the nation.

If Ryan's plan for Medicare is so bad why is Obamacare so good anyway? Could it possibly be because Ryan has an (R) behind his name, and Obama has a (D)?

No, it’s because the Reform enhances Medicare and provides for its fiscal solvency in the future.

Health Insurance Reform Solution:

Eliminate the overpayments. Eliminating excessive government subsidies to Medicare Advantage plans could save the Federal government, taxpayers, and Medicare beneficiaries well over $100 billion over the next 10 years.10 This will extend the life of the Medicare Trust Fund and make sure that Medicare is always there for America’s seniors. Reform will also ensure that the dollars in the Trust Fund go toward improving the quality of care for all seniors, rather than to support the operations and profits of private insurance companies.

Health insurance reform will close the coverage gap in Medicare Part D over time, so seniors do not have to worry about losing coverage for their drug costs. While the closure is phased in, health insurance reform will also provide seniors with a discount of 50 percent for their brand-name medication costs in the coverage gap, saving thousands of dollars for some seniors.

Introduction

Beats the hell out of vouchers.

 

[Trajan]

The dems have no honest desire to cut spending to lower the debt.

Neither do the republicans. Behind the façade of ‘fiscal responsibility’ the GOP will try to dismantle the hated social programs dating back to FDR. For the GOP it’s about political dogma, not what’s best for the nation.

If Ryan's plan for Medicare is so bad why is Obamacare so good anyway? Could it possibly be because Ryan has an (R) behind his name, and Obama has a (D)?

No, it’s because the Reform enhances Medicare and provides for its fiscal solvency in the future.

Health Insurance Reform Solution:

Eliminate the overpayments. Eliminating excessive government subsidies to Medicare Advantage plans could save the Federal government, taxpayers, and Medicare beneficiaries well over $100 billion over the next 10 years.10 This will extend the life of the Medicare Trust Fund and make sure that Medicare is always there for America’s seniors. Reform will also ensure that the dollars in the Trust Fund go toward improving the quality of care for all seniors, rather than to support the operations and profits of private insurance companies.

Health insurance reform will close the coverage gap in Medicare Part D over time, so seniors do not have to worry about losing coverage for their drug costs. While the closure is phased in, health insurance reform will also provide seniors with a discount of 50 percent for their brand-name medication costs in the coverage gap, saving thousands of dollars for some seniors.

Introduction

Beats the hell out of vouchers.

Neither do the republicans. Behind the façade of ‘fiscal responsibility’ the GOP will try to dismantle the hated social programs dating back to FDR. For the GOP it’s about political dogma, not what’s best for the nation.

inverse logic is not your friend.

oh please this has been so proposed and 'done' before and it NEVER got done nor will it ever, and yes of course MORE gov. mgt. will reduce inefficiency...when I get my third set of teeth it will.

Eliminate the overpayments. Eliminating excessive government subsidies to Medicare Advantage plans could save the Federal government, taxpayers, and Medicare beneficiaries well over $100 billion over the next 10 years

 

[Quantum Windbag]

The dems have no honest desire to cut spending to lower the debt.

Neither do the republicans. Behind the façade of ‘fiscal responsibility’ the GOP will try to dismantle the hated social programs dating back to FDR. For the GOP it’s about political dogma, not what’s best for the nation.

If Ryan's plan for Medicare is so bad why is Obamacare so good anyway? Could it possibly be because Ryan has an (R) behind his name, and Obama has a (D)?

No, it’s because the Reform enhances Medicare and provides for its fiscal solvency in the future.

Health Insurance Reform Solution:

Eliminate the overpayments. Eliminating excessive government subsidies to Medicare Advantage plans could save the Federal government, taxpayers, and Medicare beneficiaries well over $100 billion over the next 10 years.10 This will extend the life of the Medicare Trust Fund and make sure that Medicare is always there for America’s seniors. Reform will also ensure that the dollars in the Trust Fund go toward improving the quality of care for all seniors, rather than to support the operations and profits of private insurance companies.

Health insurance reform will close the coverage gap in Medicare Part D over time, so seniors do not have to worry about losing coverage for their drug costs. While the closure is phased in, health insurance reform will also provide seniors with a discount of 50 percent for their brand-name medication costs in the coverage gap, saving thousands of dollars for some seniors.

Introduction

Beats the hell out of vouchers.

Didn't Obama promise not to do business as usual when he was running for president? Why does everyone point to the same tired promises to eliminate waste and abuse as proof that he wants to change the way things are done? Can you give any type of realistic numbers about how much money the mythical plan Obama proposed will save? Why is saiving the government money a bad thing? Do you realize that the CBO consistently underestimates how much a government program will cost, and consistently overestimates how much money private enterprise will drive up costs? Can you actually defend Obama's plan on its merits, or attack Ryan's plan on its merits?

 

[Political Junky]

A provision of U.S. Rep. Paul Ryan's House budget proposal that would overhaul Medicare could be on the ropes as Republicans begin negotiating with Democrats on deficit reduction.

House Majority Leader Eric Cantor, R-Va., told the Washington Post that Republicans may have to consider other ways to achieve savings, saying President Obama “excoriated us” over the Medicare proposal passed in the House GOP budget.

Cantor's office also told Politico that he still backs Ryan's plan but that it is a starting point, since "(w)hether the Democrats will agree to the proposals we've outlined is yet to be seen."

Ryan, R-Janesville, acknowledged this week that "we're not going to get a grand-slam agreement," and said some aspects of his budget could achieve savings without consensus on Medicare or Social Security.

DC Wrap: WisPolitics coverage of news from the nation's capital

 

[The Rabbi]

The dems have no honest desire to cut spending to lower the debt.

Neither do the republicans. Behind the façade of ‘fiscal responsibility’ the GOP will try to dismantle the hated social programs dating back to FDR. For the GOP it’s about political dogma, not what’s best for the nation.

.

You don't just suppose that "what's best for the nation" in fact is dismantling the entitlement programs that are bankrupting this country?
Nah.....

The Dums are all in denial. They think if they raise taxes on some tiny minority then they can eliminate the deficit. Wrong. They are playing politics with our future. If we are to avoid a Greek melt-down we need to reform these entitlements. Otherwise no one will get anything.

 

[The Rabbi]

The dems have no honest desire to cut spending to lower the debt.

Neither do the republicans. Behind the façade of ‘fiscal responsibility’ the GOP will try to dismantle the hated social programs dating back to FDR. For the GOP it’s about political dogma, not what’s best for the nation.

No, it’s because the Reform enhances Medicare and provides for its fiscal solvency in the future.

Health Insurance Reform Solution:

Eliminate the overpayments. Eliminating excessive government subsidies to Medicare Advantage plans could save the Federal government, taxpayers, and Medicare beneficiaries well over $100 billion over the next 10 years.10 This will extend the life of the Medicare Trust Fund and make sure that Medicare is always there for America’s seniors. Reform will also ensure that the dollars in the Trust Fund go toward improving the quality of care for all seniors, rather than to support the operations and profits of private insurance companies.

Health insurance reform will close the coverage gap in Medicare Part D over time, so seniors do not have to worry about losing coverage for their drug costs. While the closure is phased in, health insurance reform will also provide seniors with a discount of 50 percent for their brand-name medication costs in the coverage gap, saving thousands of dollars for some seniors.

Introduction

Beats the hell out of vouchers.

Didn't Obama promise not to do business as usual when he was running for president? Why does everyone point to the same tired promises to eliminate waste and abuse as proof that he wants to change the way things are done? Can you give any type of realistic numbers about how much money the mythical plan Obama proposed will save? Why is saiving the government money a bad thing? Do you realize that the CBO consistently underestimates how much a government program will cost, and consistently overestimates how much money private enterprise will drive up costs? Can you actually defend Obama's plan on its merits, or attack Ryan's plan on its merits?

No, he cannot. No one can. Because on the merits Obama's plan(s) sucks, promising "savings" at 10 years down the road.

 

[EriktheRed]

Obama OTOH will have to run on the record of cutting funds for Medicare and instituting health care rationing.

How's that again?

this is news?

Obama defends Medicare cuts


Obama defends Medicare cuts | BenefitsPro

That's a pretty misleading title for that article. It hardly talks about medicare at all until the end, where it says this:

•Health care: The president’s framework builds on the Affordable Care Act by including new reforms aimed at further reducing the growth of health care spending – a major driver of long-term deficits. The president opposes any plan that would simply shift costs to seniors and the vulnerable by undermining Medicare and Medicaid. Building on the foundation of the historic deficit reduction achieved through the Affordable Care Act, the framework would save an additional $340 billion by 2021, $480 billion by 2023, and at least an additional $1 trillion in the subsequent decade. These savings complement the new patient safety initiative that could lower Medicare costs by another $50 billion over the next decade by providing better care. The president’s framework includes initiatives that will:

•Bend the long-term cost curve by setting a more ambitious target of holding Medicare cost growth per beneficiary to GDP per capita plus 0.5 percent beginning in 2018, through strengthening the Independent Payment Advisory Board (IPAB).

•Make Medicaid more flexible, efficient and accountable without resorting to block granting the program, ending our partnership with States or reducing health care coverage for seniors in nursing homes, the most economically vulnerable and people with disabilities. Combined Medicaid savings of at least $100 billion over 10 years.

•Reduce Medicare’s excessive spending on prescription drugs and lower drug premiums for beneficiaries without shifting costs to seniors or privatizing Medicare. Combined Medicare savings of at least $200 billion over 10 years.

I suppose if Republicans want to spin this to mean that the Prez is "cutting Medicare", they can try, but given the budget proposal that they put forward and are now running away from, I don't see it working for them.

 

[Steelplate]

The problem with this and all the other Conservative proposals is.... They want everyone to go on a diet and sacrifice for their country's well being... except... their corporate buddies.

I'd be willing to bet that if the cuts were tempered with tax increases to our most wealthy people, it would be much more palatable to the everyday people. But the way it's written, it's virtually one sided.

 

[jillian]

The problem with this and all the other Conservative proposals is.... They want everyone to go on a diet and sacrifice for their country's well being... except... their corporate buddies.

I'd be willing to bet that if the cuts were tempered with tax increases to our most wealthy people, it would be much more palatable to the everyday people. But the way it's written, it's virtually one sided.

that's exactly correct. it's not reasonable to ask the middle class (what's left of it) to cover the costs of corporate welfare.

 

[sparky]

You don't just suppose that "what's best for the nation" in fact is dismantling the entitlement programs that are bankrupting this country?
Nah.....

depends on the definiton of entitlement programs Rabbi

for instance, don't you find it a tad self defeating that we continually take $$$ from poor people in a rich country to give to rich people in a poor country?

one could well argue, we're rather good at that sort of entitlement here>

any insight on greasing these ingrates over and above our own citizens appreciated Rabbi>

 

[The Rabbi]

The problem with this and all the other Conservative proposals is.... They want everyone to go on a diet and sacrifice for their country's well being... except... their corporate buddies.

I'd be willing to bet that if the cuts were tempered with tax increases to our most wealthy people, it would be much more palatable to the everyday people. But the way it's written, it's virtually one sided.

that's exactly correct. it's not reasonable to ask the middle class (what's left of it) to cover the costs of corporate welfare.

What is this "corporate welfare" you speak about?
Oh yeah. You don't have a fucking clue. It's just a sound-good bumper sticker.

 

[The Rabbi]

You don't just suppose that "what's best for the nation" in fact is dismantling the entitlement programs that are bankrupting this country?
Nah.....

depends on the definiton of entitlement programs Rabbi

for instance, don't you find it a tad self defeating that we continually take $$$ from poor people in a rich country to give to rich people in a poor country?

one could well argue, we're rather good at that sort of entitlement here>

any insight on greasing these ingrates over and above our own citizens appreciated Rabbi>

Hey jerk-off. You realize youve been had by your Jew-hating buddies, right? They spew about all this aid to Israel etc and guess what? You'lre looking at $3B. Total aid is 19B. That isn't enough to run Obamacare for a year.
Anyone who points to foreign aid as a major problem has been brain washed. Assuming they had a brain to begin with.