Birth Cert stuff

[AllieBaba]

And into the conspiracy theory zone this goes............

Only the ignorant, those with agendas, and racists (or a combination of all three) obsess about the BC issue.

The state of Hawaii has verified his birth per their state laws which satisfies the legal requirement.

That's the end of the story, as much as the birthers would like to have everyone believe differently.

I don't think anything exemplifies ignorant, agenda-driven, bigotry than your post. Thank you.

And this doesn't belong in the conspiracy theory forum, since it's not even about whether or not Obama has a birth certificate, but about the concept of the topic being treated as a conspiracy when it's being discussed openly and intelligently everywhere else.

 

[AllieBaba]

Obama COULD prove his legitimacy by showing the live birth document. Why won't he? Does he perceive the issue, in some way, beneficial to him? And if so, how?

Personally I don't like the man and greatly disagree with his fiscal policies.

That said he is a Chicago politician, I think he has the goods but has seen no political advantage in releasing them in an official manner (no a .jpg on a web site is not an official release).

During the 2008 election season it wasn't that big a deal, yes there was a vocal minority, but it was just that a vocal fringe group and it did not seem to impact his poll numbers greatly or at all. Since then birthers have continued as a fringe group moving deeper and deeper into improbable and impossible levels of conspiracy - which makes them appear even more fringe and extremist. As such there was no reason to release official records.

I firmly believe that if it ever got to the point where it appeared the election then (2008) or the the upcoming one in 2012 hinges on release of the birth document from Hawaii, I think he's fully prepared to release such a document.

His advantage then will be to paint his political opponent (or his/her party) as extremist, vindictive, and petty and he feels he will reap rewards at the polls for being the underdog, hounded and wrongfully accused by them when in fact they were wrong - he will appear as the victim.


Just my thoughts.


>>>>

As I always said, starting when this nonsense first began: Would a legitimate journalist or candidate really want to go out on that limb, only to have Obama saw that limb off?

The Donald is crawling out on that limb, sure enough. But he's not a legitimate candidate yet, so Obama's keeping the saw in the toolbox for now.

Mainstream, i.e., leftist, media is dealing with this issue by pretending only a "fringe" element want to know.

It's a lie, as most anything they perpetuate.

I don't know or even care where Obama was born. However I find his reluctance to produce his bc troubling, as do most people. It's indicative of an attitude of being above any questioning, and not being accountable to the people.

But then, given the fact that he blatantly ignores the law and the will of the people in all other aspects of his presidency, it's not surprising.

 

[AllieBaba]

If I was Obama, I would publish a copy of the birth certificate in every newspaper in the country.

As I just pointed out, it may not exist and/or he cannot obtain it. I have the same problem. My original one which the hospital gave my mother was lost in a prairie fire in 2006 along with most of my other personal possessions. The courthouse here does not have a copy of that, so they gave me a COLB. The COLB is an official document and is accepted as legitimate identification and proof of birth, everywhere in the US.

It's not a uncommon issue to have.

Let's remember Obama's mother was a globetrotter, dragging little Barack along. She was not the most stable of home providers. Obama's childhood was chaotic by all accounts. It's not surprising he doesn't have his 50 year old original BC.

The president of the United States can get his birth certificate.

I require people who are unstable to dig up their birth certificates all the time. You don't have to get the SAME ONE that was produced at your birth. There are duplicate long forms, and I've never had someone be "unable" to get a copy of it unless they were born in another country.

 

[Midnight Marauder]

If I was Obama, I would publish a copy of the birth certificate in every newspaper in the country.

As I just pointed out, it may not exist and/or he cannot obtain it. I have the same problem. My original one which the hospital gave my mother was lost in a prairie fire in 2006 along with most of my other personal possessions. The courthouse here does not have a copy of that, so they gave me a COLB. The COLB is an official document and is accepted as legitimate identification and proof of birth, everywhere in the US.

It's not a uncommon issue to have.

Let's remember Obama's mother was a globetrotter, dragging little Barack along. She was not the most stable of home providers. Obama's childhood was chaotic by all accounts. It's not surprising he doesn't have his 50 year old original BC.

The president of the United States can get his birth certificate.

Not if it doesn't exist. How can he get something that doesn't exist? Magic?

 

[AllieBaba]

I thought you were theorizing that it existed but was lost.

If he was born in the US, of course, there's a birth cert somewhere. The thing is, he traveled the world and I'm not sure that he could do that as a kid without showing a birth certificate at some point.

Though his dad was a high-up official in Kenya.

 

[Baruch Menachem]

The birth certificate (as it exists) has been shown repeatedly.

I had a photostatic copy of mine, but I lost it years ago. Any time I go to the state of Oregon for a copy, they give me a certificate much like Obama has shown. The physical piece of paper no longer exists. And would not exist in any state.

 

[Midnight Marauder]

I thought you were theorizing that it existed but was lost.

If he was born in the US, of course, there's a birth cert somewhere. The thing is, he traveled the world and I'm not sure that he could do that as a kid without showing a birth certificate at some point.

Though his dad was a high-up official in Kenya.

No, I was telling you I cannot get my own. It is gone, it released its carbon in the fire and is in the ether, part of global warming now. And it's not at all unusual for folks to not be able to obtain a copy of their original birth certificate, especially if they have any age on them, older than age 30. I cannot get a copy of mine, because it does not exist.

There is every bit as much reason to believe this is the case for Obama, as there is to believe otherwise.

 

[AllieBaba]

It doesn't matter if it burned up, there are ways to get it replaced.
And as I said before, nobody expects people to have the same piece of paper that was issued at birth. I ordered birth certs for myself and my kids when I moved, and I have the stamped, certified long form sitting in a safety deposit box in the bank. Nobody expects Obama to pull out the actual birth cert that was issued at his birth or shortly thereafter. All they expect is a long form, not the cheesy short form.

 

[Midnight Marauder]

It doesn't matter if it burned up, there are ways to get it replaced.

Yes, that's called a COLB. When the original document does not exist in their records, they issue a COLB and it is just as legitimate as the original document.

 

[Midnight Marauder]

And as I said before, nobody expects people to have the same piece of paper that was issued at birth. I ordered birth certs for myself and my kids when I moved, and I have the stamped, certified long form sitting in a safety deposit box in the bank. Nobody expects Obama to pull out the actual birth cert that was issued at his birth or shortly thereafter. All they expect is a long form, not the cheesy short form.

I see now you do not understand the issue.

Back in 1961, hospitals gave mothers their child's birth certificate. A copy of this was also registered at the courthouse of the locality.

If at some point the mother or child loses this original document, and if the courthouse does not for whatever reason still have the original copy, they issue a COLB.

Fires, floods, misplacement while moving into a new courts building or transferring records to microfiche in the 70s, all kinds of things can happen over 50 years to birth records. And the older you are, the likelihood of something like this being the case is far greater.

 

[AllieBaba]

I've actually used one of those funky hawaiian short forms before to verify citizenship. They are, indeed, quite funky. But our policy says they're ok, so we use them EVEN THOUGH they're pretty much illegible.

 

[AllieBaba]

Except that's pretty much exactly what I said..nobody expects him to produce the actual original doc.

However, there have been no claims (oh wait, except by the registrar) that the birth cert doesnt' exist or was lost.

 

[rightwinger]

If I was Obama, I would publish a copy of the birth certificate in every newspaper in the country.

As I just pointed out, it may not exist and/or he cannot obtain it. I have the same problem. My original one which the hospital gave my mother was lost in a prairie fire in 2006 along with most of my other personal possessions. The courthouse here does not have a copy of that, so they gave me a COLB. The COLB is an official document and is accepted as legitimate identification and proof of birth, everywhere in the US.

It's not a uncommon issue to have.

Let's remember Obama's mother was a globetrotter, dragging little Barack along. She was not the most stable of home providers. Obama's childhood was chaotic by all accounts. It's not surprising he doesn't have his 50 year old original BC.

The president of the United States can get his birth certificate.

I require people who are unstable to dig up their birth certificates all the time. You don't have to get the SAME ONE that was produced at your birth. There are duplicate long forms, and I've never had someone be "unable" to get a copy of it unless they were born in another country.

What information could you get off the birth certificate that you cannot get off the State certified COLB?

And how does that relate to his eligibility for president?

 

[AllieBaba]

That's too stupid to respond to.

 

[HUGGY]

And as I said before, nobody expects people to have the same piece of paper that was issued at birth. I ordered birth certs for myself and my kids when I moved, and I have the stamped, certified long form sitting in a safety deposit box in the bank. Nobody expects Obama to pull out the actual birth cert that was issued at his birth or shortly thereafter. All they expect is a long form, not the cheesy short form.

I see now you do not understand the issue.

Back in 1961, hospitals gave mothers their child's birth certificate. A copy of this was also registered at the courthouse of the locality.

If at some point the mother or child loses this original document, and if the courthouse does not for whatever reason still have the original copy, they issue a COLB.

Fires, floods, misplacement while moving into a new courts building or transferring records to microfiche in the 70s, all kinds of things can happen over 50 years to birth records. And the older you are, the likelihood of something like this being the case is far greater.

He has not been proven to be from some other country. THAT is the only reason why there is that stipulation in the Constitution. What if for some reason there was NO birth certificate? Just word of mouth...Many children were born at home many years ago. I doubt there is a birth certificate for George Washington.

 

[Midnight Marauder]

Except that's pretty much exactly what I said..nobody expects him to produce the actual original doc.

However, there have been no claims (oh wait, except by the registrar) that the birth cert doesnt' exist or was lost.

No one's asserted that anyone expects him to produce the original. That's never been in the argument.

I am merely explaining how this happens. It happened to me, it could have happened to Mr. Obama. It's a far more likely explanation than the conspiracy nutters have.

 

[rightwinger]

That's too stupid to respond to.

You are the one demanding the additional information provided on the original birth certificate

What is that information and how does it pertain to his eligibility to be president? If you cannot answer then you have no right to ask for the information

 

[AllieBaba]

I KNOW how it happens.

And people to whom it happens can STILL get an acceptable birth cert. The thing is, there's been no claim that this has happened in the case of Obama. He claims it exists, but refuses to produce it.

 

[AllieBaba]

That's too stupid to respond to.

You are the one demanding the additional information provided on the original birth certificate

What is that information and how does it pertain to his eligibility to be president? If you cannot answer then you have no right to ask for the information

 

[Midnight Marauder]

That's too stupid to respond to.

You are the one demanding the additional information provided on the original birth certificate

What is that information and how does it pertain to his eligibility to be president? If you cannot answer then you have no right to ask for the information

My original BC had my little footprints on it, and my mother's thumbprints. It had sworn affidavits by the attending physician and nurses, and both my parent's signatures. The COLBs of course, lack this documentation. They are merely a certification by the entity in authority that the birth did indeed occur in their jurisdiction, and legally, just as valid as the original BC.