Beware of the FAIRtax 2022 Candidate Pledge

johnwk

Gold Member
May 24, 2009
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Once again, the ringleaders of the alleged fairtax are trying to con the American people. The latest tactic is The FAIRtax 2022 Candidate Pledge

The authors of the “FairTax” suggest under their proposal the IRS will be closed down and federal income taxes will be no more. But what actually would happen is, in place of the IRS, the FairTax creates two new tax collecting agencies, the “Excise Tax Bureau” and a “Sales Tax Bureau”, not to mention H.R. 25 (its current House legislation) keeps the “Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms” open for business.

Additionally, under the FairTax, tax returns are still required to be filed by taxpayers, and twelve times a year, and Congress has power to require any type of record keeping it wants, regardless of how burdensome doing so may be to the taxpayer.

Also keep in mind the FairTax, which imposes a 23 percent tax on “all consumption of goods and services in the United States” will tax the necessities of life. To make taxing the necessities of life with an outrageous 23 percent tax tolerable, the plan creates a new federal entitlement called the “Family Consumption Allowance”. This is a monthly check sent out to every “qualified family”, which would allow them to purchase a rationed supply of tax-free articles each month.

But the Family Consumption Allowance subtility makes a large segment of society absolutely dependent on a new federal entitlement, and thus opens the door for socialists and progressives in Congress to rant and rave about the “poor” every election cycle and promise an increase in the monthly government check every time an election comes around.

While the alleged FairTax ringleaders boast it would close down the IRS and end federal income taxes, the fact is, it does not withdraw Congress’ power to lay and collect excise taxes, such as the Corporate Excise Tax of 1909, which was calculated from profits and upheld by the S.C. in Flint vs Stone Tracy ___ long before the adoption of the Sixteenth Amendment! Likewise, the FairTax does not prevent Congress from laying and collecting various other types of excise taxes on individuals, which can also be calculated from profits, gains, salaries, business sales and other “income”.

The bottom line is, the FairTax is a clever rope-a-dope plan to actually increase the federal government’s iron fisted power of taxation, and the shiny object used to delude the people is the illusion that it ends the miseries connected to the IRS, and likewise ends federal taxes calculated from profits, gains, salaries, and other types of “income” when in fact it does not!

Take for example how this tax affects an ordinary married couple. Let us look at Mary and Joe, who have two children and find it necessary to earn extra money to pay their bills. Mary baby sits for neighbors in the community and cleans homes on weekends to raise extra money while Joe, who works for a plumbing company as a full-time job, also provides the same plumbing service on his own time to people living in his community to raise extra cash.

Under the alleged FairTax, Mary and Joe’s inalienable right to sell the property they have in their labor becomes a taxable event. In fact, they must first register with government to sell the property they have in their labor, and then collect a 23 percent federal tax for Congress when selling their labor, file federal sales tax returns under the penalty of perjury 12 times a year, and they will be compelled to keep any records Congress may dream up. In addition, let us not forget to mention the threat of audits will constantly haunt them if they dare to sell the property they have in their labor, and federal tax audits are still a threat to political opponents, which is exactly how American citizens now live under existing federal taxation.

So, as it turns out, the FairTax is not what it is cranked up to be and actually keeps Congress’ power to lay and collect taxes calculated from profits, gains, and other types of incomes alive, along with federal audits, and, federal taxation can still be used as a political weapon against political opponents ... all this in addition to creating a new 23 percent tax on “all consumption of goods and services in the United States” and a brand new federal entitlement making people dependent upon our federal government.

The remarkable thing is, adding the following words to our Constitution would actually accomplish what the ringleaders suggest they are trying to accomplish. The question is, why do the not add the following words to H.R. 25?

The Sixteenth Amendment is hereby repealed, and Congress is henceforth forbidden to lay ``any`` tax or burden calculated from profits, gains, interest, salaries, wages, tips, inheritances or any other lawfully realized money.

NOTE: these words would return us to our Founding Father's original tax plan as they intended it to operate! They would also end the experiment with allowing Congress to lay and collect taxes calculated from lawfully earned "incomes" which now oppresses Americas' economic engine and robs the bread which working people have earned when selling the property each has in their own labor!
 
The big print giveth & the small print taketh away.
And there's always more small print than you can possibly read.

I'm all for repealing the 16th & doing away with the progressive tax system.
Everybody should have skin in the tax game or the pols will always use Peter to pay off Paul for votes
 
Most people pay more than 23% of their income in taxes.

Also, since your income is no longer taxed, you get the entire amount you earn. Make $20 and hour and work a 40 hour week? Your check will be $800.

Also, if you buy a used car or used appliance, it is tax free.

The Fair Tax also taxes drug dealers, hookers, and those who work for cash under-the-table.


What it will also do is reduce what we spend on tax compliance. In the US we spend $500 Billion on figuring out how much tax we have to pay. Not paying taxes, but just trying to navigate the unduly complicated system.
 
The big print giveth & the small print taketh away.
And there's always more small print than you can possibly read.

I'm all for repealing the 16th & doing away with the progressive tax system.
Everybody should have skin in the tax game or the pols will always use Peter to pay off Paul for votes

I'm with you on that. Unfortunately, the FairTax keeps Congress' power to calculate taxes from incomes alive, and adds an additional 23 percent tax on “all consumption of goods and services in the United States”
 
Most people pay more than 23% of their income in taxes.

Also, since your income is no longer taxed, you get the entire amount you earn. Make $20 and hour and work a 40 hour week? Your check will be $800.

Also, if you buy a used car or used appliance, it is tax free.

The Fair Tax also taxes drug dealers, hookers, and those who work for cash under-the-table.


What it will also do is reduce what we spend on tax compliance. In the US we spend $500 Billion on figuring out how much tax we have to pay. Not paying taxes, but just trying to navigate the unduly complicated system.

You apparently have not read the actual proposed legislation. I have. Stop making crap up.

JWK
 
I'm with you on that. Unfortunately, the FairTax keeps Congress' power to calculate taxes from incomes alive, and adds an additional 23 percent tax on “all consumption of goods and services in the United States”

It is "additional" only if there are state and local taxes on goods and services. The Fair Tax act would be the only federal tax levied against us.
 
You apparently have not read the actual proposed legislation. I have. Stop making crap up.

JWK

You are obviously making assumptions based on what opponents write about it.

I have the book written by John Linder and Neal Boortz. The men who created the Fair Tax Act.

Feel free to point out anything I said that was inaccurate.
 
Also, there is another huge advantage.

The tax is 23%, for everyone. No more different levels of taxation for different incomes.

So if a politician wants to raise taxes, they have to do it for every single citizen. Know any politicians that have the balls to do that?
 
You are obviously making assumptions based on what opponents write about it.

I have the book written by John Linder and Neal Boortz. The men who created the Fair Tax Act.

Feel free to point out anything I said that was inaccurate.
Stick that book where the sun dont shine. I posted a link to the actual legislation. The so-called fair tax does not end taxes calculated from profits, gains and other incomes. See the OP.
 
Stick that book where the sun dont shine. I posted a link to the actual legislation. The so-called fair tax does not end taxes calculated from profits, gains and other incomes. See the OP.

Look asshole, maybe you do not grasp the way these forums work. If you don't want to discuss a topic, don't post it.

I'll be here as long as it interests me.
 
Look asshole, maybe you do not grasp the way these forums work. If you don't want to discuss a topic, don't post it.

I'll be here as long as it interests me.
You posted nonsense taken from propaganda put into book form, and you failed to dispute anything in the OP.
 
The big print giveth & the small print taketh away.
And there's always more small print than you can possibly read.

I'm all for repealing the 16th & doing away with the progressive tax system.
Everybody should have skin in the tax game or the pols will always use Peter to pay off Paul for votes

I'm with you and the solution is found in the "fair share balanced budget amendment".



“SECTION 1. The Sixteenth Amendment is hereby repealed, and Congress is henceforth forbidden to lay ``any`` tax or burden calculated from profits, gains, interest, salaries, wages, tips, inheritances or any other lawfully realized money.



NOTE: these words would return us to our founding father’s original tax plan as they intended it to operate! They would also end the experiment with allowing Congress to lay and collect taxes calculated from lawfully earned "incomes" which now oppresses Americas' economic engine and robs the bread which working people have earned when selling the property each has in their own labor!

"SECTION 2. Congress ought not raise money by borrowing, but when the money arising from imposts duties and excise taxes are insufficient to meet the public exigencies, and Congress has raised money by borrowing during the course of a fiscal year, Congress shall then lay a direct tax at the beginning of the next fiscal year for an amount sufficient to extinguish the preceding fiscal year's deficit, and apply the revenue so raised to extinguishing said deficit."


NOTE: Congress is to raise its primary revenue from imposts and duties, [taxes at our water’s edge], and may also lay miscellaneous internal excise taxes on specifically chosen articles of consumption. But if Congress borrows and spends more than is brought in from imposts, duties and miscellaneous excise taxes during the course of a fiscal year, then, and only then, is the apportioned tax to be laid.


"SECTION 3. When Congress is required to lay a direct tax in accordance with Section 1 of this Article, the Secretary of the United States Treasury shall, in a timely manner, calculate each State's apportioned share of the total sum being raised by dividing its total population size by the total population of the united states and multiplying that figure by the total being raised by Congress, and then provide the various State Congressional Delegations with a Bill notifying their State’s Executive and Legislature of its share of the total tax being collected and a final date by which said tax shall be paid into the United States Treasury."


In reference to the above Section see: FIRST DIRECT TAX LAID BY CONGRESS, 1798



NOTE: our founder’s fair share formula to extinguish an annual deficit would be:

States’ population

---------------------------- X SUM TO BE RAISED = STATE’S FAIR SHARE

Total U.S. Population


The above formula, as intended by our founding fathers, is to ensure that each state’s share towards extinguishing an annual deficit is proportionately equal to its representation in Congress, i.e., representation with a proportional financial obligation! And if the tax is laid directly upon the people by Congress, then everybody across the United States pays the exact same amount!


Note also that each State’s number or Representatives, under our Constitution is determined by the rule of apportionment:


State`s Pop.
------------------- X House size (435) = State`s No. of Representatives
U.S. Pop.



"SECTION 4. Each State shall be free to assume and pay its quota of the direct tax into the United States Treasury by a final date set by Congress, but if any State shall refuse or neglect to pay its quota, then Congress shall send forth its officers to assess and levy such State's proportion against the real property within the State with interest thereon at the rate of ((?)) per cent per annum, and against the individual owners of the taxable property. Provision shall be made for a 15% discount for those States paying their share by ((?))of the fiscal year in which the tax is laid, and a 10% discount for States paying by the final date set by Congress, such discount being to defray the States' cost of collection."


NOTE: This section respects the Tenth Amendment and allows each state to raise its share in its own chosen way in a time period set by Congress, but also allows the federal government to enter a state and collect the tax if a state is delinquent in meeting its obligation.


"SECTION 5. This Amendment to the Constitution, when ratified by the required number of States, shall take effect no later than (?) years after the required number of States have ratified it.

So, the real solution is returning to our Constitution’s original tax plan which is promoted in “Prosperity Restored by the State Rate Tax Plan” [published in 1985, no longer in print] But see Jefferson Rising » The Founding Fathers Original Tax Plan
 
What exactly did I post that was inaccurate? I asked that once before but you didn't answer.
You wrote:

"The Fair Tax act would be the only federal tax levied against us."

That is a fricken lie. Why do you think H.R. 25 creates two new tax collecting agencies?
 
Also keep in mind the FairTax, which imposes a 23 percent tax on “all consumption of goods and services in the United States” will tax the necessities of life. To make taxing the necessities of life with an outrageous 23 percent tax tolerable, the plan creates a new federal entitlement called the “Family Consumption Allowance”. This is a monthly check sent out to every “qualified family”, which would allow them to purchase a rationed supply of tax-free articles each month.
Did you write all that yourself? I suspect not, but if you did, well done. I'll answer one point only, unless you're sure it is your original work:

That's horrible about taxing the necessities of life. But all taxes reduce a family's available money for the necessities of life.
 
You wrote:

"The Fair Tax act would be the only federal tax levied against us."

That is a fricken lie. Why do you think H.R. 25 creates two new tax collecting agencies?

Two agencies collecting taxes? What two agencies?
 
Two agencies collecting taxes? What two agencies?
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So, you haven't even read the OP which contain the answer.

JWK
 
Not at all. The excise tax surprised me, since the actual Fair Tax Act used only the federal consumption tax as the basis.

The fairtax does not end taxes calculated from income!

So, are you finally convinced that in addition to the 23 percent tax created by the fairtax, the supporters of the alleged faitax would soon be surprised and stunned to find out Congress may lay and collect excise taxes calculated from income which is a power Congress had even before the 16th Amendment was adopted?

To verify the fact Congress had power to lay and collect an excise tax calculated from income before the adoption of the 16th Amendment see Flint v. Stone Tracy Co., 220 U.S. 107 (1911)

The whole nonsense about the fairtax closing down the IRS is an illusion that laying and collecting taxes calculated from income is ended. Yes, the fairTax does close down the IRS, but in its place two new tax collecting agencies are created, one of which is the “Excise Tax Bureau” and nowhere is it restricted in the language of the fairtax from laying and collecting excise taxes calculated from income, which liberals need to fund their socialist spending spree which never ends.

As I correctly pointed out elsewhere, the shiny object used to delude fairtax supporters is the illusion that the fairtax ends the miseries connected to the IRS and taxes calculated from income, when in fact it does not!

JWK
 

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