Attack on Roma camp leaves one dead

[Mortimer]

A far-right government sponsored group, masked men attack roma camp. Kill one, injured several including little children. Hardly makes it in the news.



Ukraine Roma camp attack leaves one dead One person has been killed in an attack on a Roma camp in Ukraine late on Saturday night.A masked group armed with batons and other weapons targeted the camp on the outskirts of the western city of Lviv, according to local police. Seven people have been arrested.A 24-year-old man died of stab wounds, while four others - including a 10-year-old boy - were injured. It is the latest in a series of attacks on Ukraine's Roma community.In April, the far-right group C14 burnt down tents in a Roma camp in the capital Kiev and chased women and children. In a joint letter earlier this month, human rights groups including Amnesty International and Human Rights Watch warned against the increase in attacks by far-right groups on minorities in Ukraine. They said that authorities had "failed" to respond to most incidents, leading to "an atmosphere of near total impunity that cannot but embolden these groups to commit more attacks".The last Ukrainian census in 2001 estimated the Roma population to be around 40,000, although rights groups say the figure could be as high as 260,000.The Roma face discrimination in many countries, with the UN describing them as being "among Europe's most excluded groups".On Tuesday, Italy's right-wing populist Interior Minister Matteo Salvini caused an outcry after calling for a census of the Roma community. He said that Roma with no right to remain in Italy would be deported, but "unfortunately" those with Italian citizenship would have to stay. His coalition ally and leader of the anti-establishment Five Star movement, Luigi di Maio, later rebutted his comments, making it clear that a census was unconstitutional.

 

[BULLDOG]

A far-right government sponsored group, masked men attack roma camp. Kill one, injured several including little children. Hardly makes it in the news.



Ukraine Roma camp attack leaves one dead One person has been killed in an attack on a Roma camp in Ukraine late on Saturday night.A masked group armed with batons and other weapons targeted the camp on the outskirts of the western city of Lviv, according to local police. Seven people have been arrested.A 24-year-old man died of stab wounds, while four others - including a 10-year-old boy - were injured. It is the latest in a series of attacks on Ukraine's Roma community.In April, the far-right group C14 burnt down tents in a Roma camp in the capital Kiev and chased women and children. In a joint letter earlier this month, human rights groups including Amnesty International and Human Rights Watch warned against the increase in attacks by far-right groups on minorities in Ukraine. They said that authorities had "failed" to respond to most incidents, leading to "an atmosphere of near total impunity that cannot but embolden these groups to commit more attacks".The last Ukrainian census in 2001 estimated the Roma population to be around 40,000, although rights groups say the figure could be as high as 260,000.The Roma face discrimination in many countries, with the UN describing them as being "among Europe's most excluded groups".On Tuesday, Italy's right-wing populist Interior Minister Matteo Salvini caused an outcry after calling for a census of the Roma community. He said that Roma with no right to remain in Italy would be deported, but "unfortunately" those with Italian citizenship would have to stay. His coalition ally and leader of the anti-establishment Five Star movement, Luigi di Maio, later rebutted his comments, making it clear that a census was unconstitutional.

I'm sure the attackers felt justified in their actions. They might have even used their religion as an excuse. That's what happens when hateful groups are allowed to flourish.

 

[Vastator]

It’s also what happens to unwelcome groups of people who don’t leave...

 

[Mortimer]

It’s also what happens to unwelcome groups of people who don’t leave...

They have no right to demand them to leave. They are there for centuries.

 

[Mortimer]

A far-right government sponsored group, masked men attack roma camp. Kill one, injured several including little children. Hardly makes it in the news.



Ukraine Roma camp attack leaves one dead One person has been killed in an attack on a Roma camp in Ukraine late on Saturday night.A masked group armed with batons and other weapons targeted the camp on the outskirts of the western city of Lviv, according to local police. Seven people have been arrested.A 24-year-old man died of stab wounds, while four others - including a 10-year-old boy - were injured. It is the latest in a series of attacks on Ukraine's Roma community.In April, the far-right group C14 burnt down tents in a Roma camp in the capital Kiev and chased women and children. In a joint letter earlier this month, human rights groups including Amnesty International and Human Rights Watch warned against the increase in attacks by far-right groups on minorities in Ukraine. They said that authorities had "failed" to respond to most incidents, leading to "an atmosphere of near total impunity that cannot but embolden these groups to commit more attacks".The last Ukrainian census in 2001 estimated the Roma population to be around 40,000, although rights groups say the figure could be as high as 260,000.The Roma face discrimination in many countries, with the UN describing them as being "among Europe's most excluded groups".On Tuesday, Italy's right-wing populist Interior Minister Matteo Salvini caused an outcry after calling for a census of the Roma community. He said that Roma with no right to remain in Italy would be deported, but "unfortunately" those with Italian citizenship would have to stay. His coalition ally and leader of the anti-establishment Five Star movement, Luigi di Maio, later rebutted his comments, making it clear that a census was unconstitutional.

I'm sure the attackers felt justified in their actions. They might have even used their religion as an excuse. That's what happens when hateful groups are allowed to flourish.

Sure they felt justified. But were they? And your country brought those people to power in Ukraine. USA and EU back them up. First they only killed Russians now also Roma.

 

[BULLDOG]

A far-right government sponsored group, masked men attack roma camp. Kill one, injured several including little children. Hardly makes it in the news.



Ukraine Roma camp attack leaves one dead One person has been killed in an attack on a Roma camp in Ukraine late on Saturday night.A masked group armed with batons and other weapons targeted the camp on the outskirts of the western city of Lviv, according to local police. Seven people have been arrested.A 24-year-old man died of stab wounds, while four others - including a 10-year-old boy - were injured. It is the latest in a series of attacks on Ukraine's Roma community.In April, the far-right group C14 burnt down tents in a Roma camp in the capital Kiev and chased women and children. In a joint letter earlier this month, human rights groups including Amnesty International and Human Rights Watch warned against the increase in attacks by far-right groups on minorities in Ukraine. They said that authorities had "failed" to respond to most incidents, leading to "an atmosphere of near total impunity that cannot but embolden these groups to commit more attacks".The last Ukrainian census in 2001 estimated the Roma population to be around 40,000, although rights groups say the figure could be as high as 260,000.The Roma face discrimination in many countries, with the UN describing them as being "among Europe's most excluded groups".On Tuesday, Italy's right-wing populist Interior Minister Matteo Salvini caused an outcry after calling for a census of the Roma community. He said that Roma with no right to remain in Italy would be deported, but "unfortunately" those with Italian citizenship would have to stay. His coalition ally and leader of the anti-establishment Five Star movement, Luigi di Maio, later rebutted his comments, making it clear that a census was unconstitutional.

I'm sure the attackers felt justified in their actions. They might have even used their religion as an excuse. That's what happens when hateful groups are allowed to flourish.

Sure they felt justified. But were they? And your country brought those people to power in Ukraine. USA and EU back them up. First they only killed Russians now also Roma.

Like most Americans, I have no idea what happened, or who caused it. I do know murdering children is evil, no matter who does it, or why.

 

[Vastator]

It’s also what happens to unwelcome groups of people who don’t leave...

They have no right to demand them to leave. They are there for centuries.

The reality in life is that might makes right. And in that time, and that place the Romas don't have it.
If they been there for centuries why are they in, camps; and not established towns and cities?

 

[Mortimer]

It’s also what happens to unwelcome groups of people who don’t leave...

They have no right to demand them to leave. They are there for centuries.

The reality in life is that might makes right. And in that time, and that place the Romas don't have it.
If they been there for centuries why are they in, camps; and not established towns and cities?

I dont agree with might makes right. Thats the philosophy of a criminal. I could beat up a old woman, if thats true. They are in camps doesnt mean they are not there since centuries.

 

[Mortimer]

A far-right government sponsored group, masked men attack roma camp. Kill one, injured several including little children. Hardly makes it in the news.



Ukraine Roma camp attack leaves one dead One person has been killed in an attack on a Roma camp in Ukraine late on Saturday night.A masked group armed with batons and other weapons targeted the camp on the outskirts of the western city of Lviv, according to local police. Seven people have been arrested.A 24-year-old man died of stab wounds, while four others - including a 10-year-old boy - were injured. It is the latest in a series of attacks on Ukraine's Roma community.In April, the far-right group C14 burnt down tents in a Roma camp in the capital Kiev and chased women and children. In a joint letter earlier this month, human rights groups including Amnesty International and Human Rights Watch warned against the increase in attacks by far-right groups on minorities in Ukraine. They said that authorities had "failed" to respond to most incidents, leading to "an atmosphere of near total impunity that cannot but embolden these groups to commit more attacks".The last Ukrainian census in 2001 estimated the Roma population to be around 40,000, although rights groups say the figure could be as high as 260,000.The Roma face discrimination in many countries, with the UN describing them as being "among Europe's most excluded groups".On Tuesday, Italy's right-wing populist Interior Minister Matteo Salvini caused an outcry after calling for a census of the Roma community. He said that Roma with no right to remain in Italy would be deported, but "unfortunately" those with Italian citizenship would have to stay. His coalition ally and leader of the anti-establishment Five Star movement, Luigi di Maio, later rebutted his comments, making it clear that a census was unconstitutional.

I'm sure the attackers felt justified in their actions. They might have even used their religion as an excuse. That's what happens when hateful groups are allowed to flourish.

Sure they felt justified. But were they? And your country brought those people to power in Ukraine. USA and EU back them up. First they only killed Russians now also Roma.

Like most Americans, I have no idea what happened, or who caused it. I do know murdering children is evil, no matter who does it, or why.

Sounds as if you make excuses for those fascists, Sad considering you introduced yourself as somehow progressive or liberal before to me. Or I had only impression?

 

[Picaro]

A far-right government sponsored group, masked men attack roma camp. Kill one, injured several including little children. Hardly makes it in the news.

Eastern Europe is a region known for its routine cruelties and mass murders, like Africa and most of SE and Central Asia and the ME, so it's just not 'news' in the West, just normal for the savages.

 

[Vastator]

It’s also what happens to unwelcome groups of people who don’t leave...

They have no right to demand them to leave. They are there for centuries.

The reality in life is that might makes right. And in that time, and that place the Romas don't have it.
If they been there for centuries why are they in, camps; and not established towns and cities?

I dont agree with might makes right. Thats the philosophy of a criminal. I could beat up a old woman, if thats true. They are in camps doesnt mean they are not there since centuries.

It’s also what happens to unwelcome groups of people who don’t leave...

They have no right to demand them to leave. They are there for centuries.

The reality in life is that might makes right. And in that time, and that place the Romas don't have it.
If they been there for centuries why are they in, camps; and not established towns and cities?

I dont agree with might makes right. Thats the philosophy of a criminal. I could beat up a old woman, if thats true. They are in camps doesnt mean they are not there since centuries.

It shouldn't. But in a given time and place; it does... It's the way the world has always been.
Now... Why are they in camps after being there centuries?

 

[cnm]

I dont agree with might makes right.

Hmmmm.

I hope one day it will be possible that roma can be right wing for themselfes, but not until they have a solid country of their own.

To me a right winger is a law and order type militarist and chauvinist etc. Someone in the police uniform or military working for the government etc. a fascist.

 

[pismoe]

It’s also what happens to unwelcome groups of people who don’t leave...

They have no right to demand them to leave. They are there for centuries.

The reality in life is that might makes right. And in that time, and that place the Romas don't have it.
If they been there for centuries why are they in, camps; and not established towns and cities?

I dont agree with might makes right. Thats the philosophy of a criminal. I could beat up a old woman, if thats true. They are in camps doesnt mean they are not there since centuries.

It’s also what happens to unwelcome groups of people who don’t leave...

They have no right to demand them to leave. They are there for centuries.

The reality in life is that might makes right. And in that time, and that place the Romas don't have it.
If they been there for centuries why are they in, camps; and not established towns and cities?

I dont agree with might makes right. Thats the philosophy of a criminal. I could beat up a old woman, if thats true. They are in camps doesnt mean they are not there since centuries.

It shouldn't. But in a given time and place; it does... It's the way the world has always been.
Now... Why are they in camps after being there centuries?

---------------------------- Roma are Gypsy , they have always been just moving about from what i hear . No roots as they are Gypsy and gypsies don't put down roots from what i hear . I think that they are a mixture of free spirits and criminal as they live off established rooted society .

 

[Mortimer]

It’s also what happens to unwelcome groups of people who don’t leave...

They have no right to demand them to leave. They are there for centuries.

The reality in life is that might makes right. And in that time, and that place the Romas don't have it.
If they been there for centuries why are they in, camps; and not established towns and cities?

I dont agree with might makes right. Thats the philosophy of a criminal. I could beat up a old woman, if thats true. They are in camps doesnt mean they are not there since centuries.

It’s also what happens to unwelcome groups of people who don’t leave...

They have no right to demand them to leave. They are there for centuries.

The reality in life is that might makes right. And in that time, and that place the Romas don't have it.
If they been there for centuries why are they in, camps; and not established towns and cities?

I dont agree with might makes right. Thats the philosophy of a criminal. I could beat up a old woman, if thats true. They are in camps doesnt mean they are not there since centuries.

It shouldn't. But in a given time and place; it does... It's the way the world has always been.
Now... Why are they in camps after being there centuries?

Because they were put there for centuries. They are a marginalised, discriminated and persecuted group since centuries.

 

[Mortimer]

It’s also what happens to unwelcome groups of people who don’t leave...

They have no right to demand them to leave. They are there for centuries.

The reality in life is that might makes right. And in that time, and that place the Romas don't have it.
If they been there for centuries why are they in, camps; and not established towns and cities?

I dont agree with might makes right. Thats the philosophy of a criminal. I could beat up a old woman, if thats true. They are in camps doesnt mean they are not there since centuries.

It’s also what happens to unwelcome groups of people who don’t leave...

They have no right to demand them to leave. They are there for centuries.

The reality in life is that might makes right. And in that time, and that place the Romas don't have it.
If they been there for centuries why are they in, camps; and not established towns and cities?

I dont agree with might makes right. Thats the philosophy of a criminal. I could beat up a old woman, if thats true. They are in camps doesnt mean they are not there since centuries.

It shouldn't. But in a given time and place; it does... It's the way the world has always been.
Now... Why are they in camps after being there centuries?

---------------------------- Roma are Gypsy , they have always been just moving about from what i hear . No roots as they are Gypsy and gypsies don't put down roots from what i hear . I think that they are a mixture of free spirits and criminal as they live off established rooted society .

No they arrived in Europe in aristocratic formations with kings and dukes and lords. Look up Lords of little Egypt. They arrived with nobility, paid for food and shelter. Later they were killed sometimes given a pass for a while but then again persecuted and killed. And there are lots of myths about them. For example in Italy some Roma were burned for false rape allegations. Italian gipsy camp burned down by vigilantes after false rape claim

Also most roma in ottoman empire were settled always and registered to pay taxes. They were organised in family units and had a gypsy head of them. They lived in gypsy quarters of town. They were not nomadic, they took up a travelling lifestyle only western europe as free spirits. But so did some irish, after potatoe famine, many irish left ireland, and in the ancient past some irish and british took up nomadic way of life they are called irish travellers. Gypsies are a persecuted group and marginalised, nothing special about them. That they are inherently "free spirits" or criminal.

 

[Picaro]

It’s also what happens to unwelcome groups of people who don’t leave...

They have no right to demand them to leave. They are there for centuries.

The reality in life is that might makes right. And in that time, and that place the Romas don't have it.
If they been there for centuries why are they in, camps; and not established towns and cities?

I dont agree with might makes right. Thats the philosophy of a criminal. I could beat up a old woman, if thats true. They are in camps doesnt mean they are not there since centuries.

It’s also what happens to unwelcome groups of people who don’t leave...

They have no right to demand them to leave. They are there for centuries.

The reality in life is that might makes right. And in that time, and that place the Romas don't have it.
If they been there for centuries why are they in, camps; and not established towns and cities?

I dont agree with might makes right. Thats the philosophy of a criminal. I could beat up a old woman, if thats true. They are in camps doesnt mean they are not there since centuries.

It shouldn't. But in a given time and place; it does... It's the way the world has always been.
Now... Why are they in camps after being there centuries?

They self-segregate, for one, and don't abide by any of the customary norms; they deliberately choose 'Outsider' status and being perpetual aliens. And, the larger population does indeed act as a cover for the professional criminals, so it's not like their rep is entirely undeserved.

 

[Mortimer]

It’s also what happens to unwelcome groups of people who don’t leave...

They have no right to demand them to leave. They are there for centuries.

The reality in life is that might makes right. And in that time, and that place the Romas don't have it.
If they been there for centuries why are they in, camps; and not established towns and cities?

I dont agree with might makes right. Thats the philosophy of a criminal. I could beat up a old woman, if thats true. They are in camps doesnt mean they are not there since centuries.

It’s also what happens to unwelcome groups of people who don’t leave...

They have no right to demand them to leave. They are there for centuries.

The reality in life is that might makes right. And in that time, and that place the Romas don't have it.
If they been there for centuries why are they in, camps; and not established towns and cities?

I dont agree with might makes right. Thats the philosophy of a criminal. I could beat up a old woman, if thats true. They are in camps doesnt mean they are not there since centuries.

It shouldn't. But in a given time and place; it does... It's the way the world has always been.
Now... Why are they in camps after being there centuries?

They self-segregate, for one, and don't abide by any of the customary norms; they deliberately choose 'Outsider' status and being perpetual aliens.

No. No one chooses that. Thats a lie. They were segregated historically. Now they are traumatised and start from a historically inherited position of poverty and discrimination.

 

[Picaro]

They have no right to demand them to leave. They are there for centuries.

The reality in life is that might makes right. And in that time, and that place the Romas don't have it.
If they been there for centuries why are they in, camps; and not established towns and cities?

I dont agree with might makes right. Thats the philosophy of a criminal. I could beat up a old woman, if thats true. They are in camps doesnt mean they are not there since centuries.

They have no right to demand them to leave. They are there for centuries.

The reality in life is that might makes right. And in that time, and that place the Romas don't have it.
If they been there for centuries why are they in, camps; and not established towns and cities?

I dont agree with might makes right. Thats the philosophy of a criminal. I could beat up a old woman, if thats true. They are in camps doesnt mean they are not there since centuries.

It shouldn't. But in a given time and place; it does... It's the way the world has always been.
Now... Why are they in camps after being there centuries?

They self-segregate, for one, and don't abide by any of the customary norms; they deliberately choose 'Outsider' status and being perpetual aliens.

No. No one chooses that. Thats a lie. They were segregated historically. Now they are traumatised and start from a historically inherited position of poverty and discrimination.

Actually, people do choose that; just ask the hard core racists ultra-Orthodox and Orthodox Jews, and how that worked out for them in Europe, or anywhere else outside the U.S., for that matter.

 

[Mortimer]

The reality in life is that might makes right. And in that time, and that place the Romas don't have it.
If they been there for centuries why are they in, camps; and not established towns and cities?

I dont agree with might makes right. Thats the philosophy of a criminal. I could beat up a old woman, if thats true. They are in camps doesnt mean they are not there since centuries.

The reality in life is that might makes right. And in that time, and that place the Romas don't have it.
If they been there for centuries why are they in, camps; and not established towns and cities?

I dont agree with might makes right. Thats the philosophy of a criminal. I could beat up a old woman, if thats true. They are in camps doesnt mean they are not there since centuries.

It shouldn't. But in a given time and place; it does... It's the way the world has always been.
Now... Why are they in camps after being there centuries?

They self-segregate, for one, and don't abide by any of the customary norms; they deliberately choose 'Outsider' status and being perpetual aliens.

No. No one chooses that. Thats a lie. They were segregated historically. Now they are traumatised and start from a historically inherited position of poverty and discrimination.

Actually, people do choose that; just ask the hard core racists ultra-Orthodox and Orthodox Jews, and how that worked out for them in Europe, or anywhere else outside the U.S., for that matter.

They maybe choose to preserve their culture. But they dont choose discrimination, or poverty or to be killed etc. Orthodox Jews are the ones who keep real Judaism alife, but they dont want or choose anti-semitism.

 

[BULLDOG]

A far-right government sponsored group, masked men attack roma camp. Kill one, injured several including little children. Hardly makes it in the news.



Ukraine Roma camp attack leaves one dead One person has been killed in an attack on a Roma camp in Ukraine late on Saturday night.A masked group armed with batons and other weapons targeted the camp on the outskirts of the western city of Lviv, according to local police. Seven people have been arrested.A 24-year-old man died of stab wounds, while four others - including a 10-year-old boy - were injured. It is the latest in a series of attacks on Ukraine's Roma community.In April, the far-right group C14 burnt down tents in a Roma camp in the capital Kiev and chased women and children. In a joint letter earlier this month, human rights groups including Amnesty International and Human Rights Watch warned against the increase in attacks by far-right groups on minorities in Ukraine. They said that authorities had "failed" to respond to most incidents, leading to "an atmosphere of near total impunity that cannot but embolden these groups to commit more attacks".The last Ukrainian census in 2001 estimated the Roma population to be around 40,000, although rights groups say the figure could be as high as 260,000.The Roma face discrimination in many countries, with the UN describing them as being "among Europe's most excluded groups".On Tuesday, Italy's right-wing populist Interior Minister Matteo Salvini caused an outcry after calling for a census of the Roma community. He said that Roma with no right to remain in Italy would be deported, but "unfortunately" those with Italian citizenship would have to stay. His coalition ally and leader of the anti-establishment Five Star movement, Luigi di Maio, later rebutted his comments, making it clear that a census was unconstitutional.

I'm sure the attackers felt justified in their actions. They might have even used their religion as an excuse. That's what happens when hateful groups are allowed to flourish.

Sure they felt justified. But were they? And your country brought those people to power in Ukraine. USA and EU back them up. First they only killed Russians now also Roma.

Like most Americans, I have no idea what happened, or who caused it. I do know murdering children is evil, no matter who does it, or why.

Sounds as if you make excuses for those fascists, Sad considering you introduced yourself as somehow progressive or liberal before to me. Or I had only impression?

I'm making excuses for no one. I regret that I don't know the history of the conflict. If I did, I could make an informed decision about what is happening. Taking your description of what happened with no further explanation would be as bad as siding with the group you call C14 with no supporting evidence. I do condemn the deaths of children from any source, but .I prefer to know what I'm talking about before I "take sides" in any unfamiliar conflict. I'm sorry you disapprove of my indecisive remark, but I just don't have enough knowledge to do more.