An open debate.

[Daniyel]

Hello,

I'd like to ask all those supporting the Palestinian cause regardless of their general position about certain situations, Do you support rocket fire against Israel?



Thanks in advance.

 

[P F Tinmore]

No, I think both sides should disarm.

 

[there4eyeM]

The entire Middle East is an enormous 'clusterphuque' thanks primarily to the age of European Colonialism and the efforts to resolve things as those powers bailed out. This was only exacerbated by the unfortunate rise of dependence on the reserves of cheap oil, much of which happens to be found there. By developing alternatives, we would save enormously in lives and treasure.
There was never a country of Palestine. That population group happened by the practice of excluding them from various other areas.
And that happened largely because of the huge mistake of forming the modern state of Israel. The totally unrealistic concept that people today have a claim on a geographic area because thousands of years ago another people with whom they associate lived there is just as absurd as claiming a nation for a people that never existed. If we applied that logic generally, no modern country would belong to its present majority population. Anyway, we are all related directly to everyone who existed two thousand years ago (according to the science of genetics, as well as good, human sense).
All the violence and sacrifice going on there is because of the lack of original good will and rationality combined with even more of the same today.
The resolution seems distant, and most likely very violent. Israel will probably, unfortunately, be obliterated.

 

[aris2chat]

I've work for the palestinians trying to help them and I've suffered their violence and lies.
Firing rocket or attacking jews is in no way going to help them. It has delayed and set back their cause for years and decades. They cannot get rid if Israel, nor is Israel the cause of their hardship. Being a refugee does not give them the right to attack their hosts or neighbors.
Lying and abusing the people who try to help makes it harder for anyone to trust them, no matter how sympathetic they are to the palestinians, their causes or the chance for peace and statehood.
Many do not even know the truth any more. They have been told stories by leaders, clerics, militants and even the groups that try to provide services for them. Most have no direct knowledge of event and their parent and grandparent are dead or very old by now. They are struggling on the believe of myths and exaggeration. They are fighting the wrong enemy and inciting more hate. A vicious cycle constantly turning with no end.
They have to face the realty of the now, not what they believed happened more than 60 yrs ago, of what they were told by their arab hosts and those who attacked Israel. Nor the stories of nations that manipulate them and the 'palestinian issue' for their own power gains and struggle of dominant status in the region.
Violence and threat against Israel or anyone, even each other, is not the answer. A believe in peace, brotherhood and acceptance of those around them and their fellow palestinian. A cooperation to build a nation, not to attack other national and try to take them. What is not is that they do not own Israel, but perhaps they can build homes elsewhere and find goo jobs so they and their family don't live on donation or through the abuse of their own.

The clock cannot be turn back, but they can move forward if they seek an amicable cooperation. They want freedom and statehood, they can't be dependent on charity or their arab brothers to pay their way in the world. They have to work for the country and stability they seek. Destruction and death will not force it to happen.

It really depends on how much they want a place of their own and how much work they are willing to put in to make it happen

 

[eagle1462010]

List of Caliphs - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia

Whether or not Israel is there is not important to the Cluster Fuck of the Middle East...............Some fanatical group hell bent on spreading Islam by the Sword would emerge..............As has been the case for a very long time....................

And other countries and religions would eventually stand against it...............As has been the case throughout time.......................As would nations who have stood up to the Napoleon's, the Hitlers of this world..................

People say it's the fault of the Europeans and those that fought to end the domination of the Ottomans in this region.................yet the Ottomans slaughtered Christians wholesale before WWI............and stopped the Germans in their attempt to conquer others...................The Ottomans were Germany's allies then...................and so REAPED WHAT THEY SEWED...................Yet some dumb asses will still claim the problem was the Europeans fault for the Islamic Fanatics wanting to spill blood........................Which is BS.

 

[Darkwind]

The entire Middle East is an enormous 'clusterphuque' thanks primarily to the age of European Colonialism and the efforts to resolve things as those powers bailed out. This was only exacerbated by the unfortunate rise of dependence on the reserves of cheap oil, much of which happens to be found there. By developing alternatives, we would save enormously in lives and treasure.
There was never a country of Palestine. That population group happened by the practice of excluding them from various other areas.
And that happened largely because of the huge mistake of forming the modern state of Israel. The totally unrealistic concept that people today have a claim on a geographic area because thousands of years ago another people with whom they associate lived there is just as absurd as claiming a nation for a people that never existed. If we applied that logic generally, no modern country would belong to its present majority population. Anyway, we are all related directly to everyone who existed two thousand years ago (according to the science of genetics, as well as good, human sense).
All the violence and sacrifice going on there is because of the lack of original good will and rationality combined with even more of the same today.
The resolution seems distant, and most likely very violent. Israel will probably, unfortunately, be obliterated.

So you can't answer the question, or won't answer the question?

 

[there4eyeM]

The entire Middle East is an enormous 'clusterphuque' thanks primarily to the age of European Colonialism and the efforts to resolve things as those powers bailed out. This was only exacerbated by the unfortunate rise of dependence on the reserves of cheap oil, much of which happens to be found there. By developing alternatives, we would save enormously in lives and treasure.
There was never a country of Palestine. That population group happened by the practice of excluding them from various other areas.
And that happened largely because of the huge mistake of forming the modern state of Israel. The totally unrealistic concept that people today have a claim on a geographic area because thousands of years ago another people with whom they associate lived there is just as absurd as claiming a nation for a people that never existed. If we applied that logic generally, no modern country would belong to its present majority population. Anyway, we are all related directly to everyone who existed two thousand years ago (according to the science of genetics, as well as good, human sense).
All the violence and sacrifice going on there is because of the lack of original good will and rationality combined with even more of the same today.
The resolution seems distant, and most likely very violent. Israel will probably, unfortunately, be obliterated.

So you can't answer the question, or won't answer the question?

It was the debate that was addressed; skipped over the question/answer.
No.

 

[Penelope]

If Israel is hell bent on keeping destroying their homes and replacing them with their own, stealing land, uprooting their olive tress with they make a living on, shooting at fishermen, shooting their kids for throwing stones or rocks, keeping them fenced in, jailed them without trials and abusing them while in their prisons, continuous threats of how all the land belongs to the Jews, then yes I do think they have a right to defend themselves,

and it was the Zionist who moved in like hoards, with full intent on ridding the land of their presence. I am never for violence but in this case they need to defend themselves.

I am only sorry that Gaza does not have a stronger military, and seem to be at the mercy of Israel and Israel's propaganda and state of the art weapons and as PM Bibi calls it their "fighting spirit". This is not the OT times.

 

[eagle1462010]

If Israel is hell bent on keeping destroying their homes and replacing them with their own, stealing land, uprooting their olive tress with they make a living on, shooting at fishermen, shooting their kids for throwing stones or rocks, keeping them fenced in, jailed them without trials and abusing them while in their prisons, continuous threats of how all the land belongs to the Jews, then yes I do think they have a right to defend themselves,

and it was the Zionist who moved in like hoards, with full intent on ridding the land of their presence. I am never for violence but in this case they need to defend themselves.

I am only sorry that Gaza does not have a stronger military, and seem to be at the mercy of Israel and Israel's propaganda and state of the art weapons and as PM Bibi calls it their "fighting spirit". This is not the OT times.

aka As always you want the destruction of Israel................It's not about the land..........never has been..............It is about the Radical Islamic movement to destroy Israel..................always has been and always will be...............

As long as they continue to be ruled by Terrorist Orgs like Hamas............then there will be perpetual War..............and the Pali's are being used as cannon fodder by their so called leaders.

 

[Penelope]

If Israel is hell bent on keeping destroying their homes and replacing them with their own, stealing land, uprooting their olive tress with they make a living on, shooting at fishermen, shooting their kids for throwing stones or rocks, keeping them fenced in, jailed them without trials and abusing them while in their prisons, continuous threats of how all the land belongs to the Jews, then yes I do think they have a right to defend themselves,

and it was the Zionist who moved in like hoards, with full intent on ridding the land of their presence. I am never for violence but in this case they need to defend themselves.

I am only sorry that Gaza does not have a stronger military, and seem to be at the mercy of Israel and Israel's propaganda and state of the art weapons and as PM Bibi calls it their "fighting spirit". This is not the OT times.

aka As always you want the destruction of Israel................It's not about the land..........never has been..............It is about the Radical Islamic movement to destroy Israel..................always has been and always will be...............

As long as they continue to be ruled by Terrorist Orgs like Hamas............then there will be perpetual War..............and the Pali's are being used as cannon fodder by their so called leaders.

Hamas a terrorist org. I see Israel as a terrorist org.

 

[eagle1462010]

If Israel is hell bent on keeping destroying their homes and replacing them with their own, stealing land, uprooting their olive tress with they make a living on, shooting at fishermen, shooting their kids for throwing stones or rocks, keeping them fenced in, jailed them without trials and abusing them while in their prisons, continuous threats of how all the land belongs to the Jews, then yes I do think they have a right to defend themselves,

and it was the Zionist who moved in like hoards, with full intent on ridding the land of their presence. I am never for violence but in this case they need to defend themselves.

I am only sorry that Gaza does not have a stronger military, and seem to be at the mercy of Israel and Israel's propaganda and state of the art weapons and as PM Bibi calls it their "fighting spirit". This is not the OT times.

aka As always you want the destruction of Israel................It's not about the land..........never has been..............It is about the Radical Islamic movement to destroy Israel..................always has been and always will be...............

As long as they continue to be ruled by Terrorist Orgs like Hamas............then there will be perpetual War..............and the Pali's are being used as cannon fodder by their so called leaders.

Hamas a terrorist org. I see Israel as a terrorist org.

And you are not willing to budge...........Nor am I..................

When neither side can come to a Peaceful compromise or agreement......................we have.................

WAR................

 

[Penelope]

List of Caliphs - Wikipedia the free encyclopedia

Whether or not Israel is there is not important to the Cluster Fuck of the Middle East...............Some fanatical group hell bent on spreading Islam by the Sword would emerge..............As has been the case for a very long time....................

And other countries and religions would eventually stand against it...............As has been the case throughout time.......................As would nations who have stood up to the Napoleon's, the Hitlers of this world..................

People say it's the fault of the Europeans and those that fought to end the domination of the Ottomans in this region.................yet the Ottomans slaughtered Christians wholesale before WWI............and stopped the Germans in their attempt to conquer others...................The Ottomans were Germany's allies then...................and so REAPED WHAT THEY SEWED...................Yet some dumb asses will still claim the problem was the Europeans fault for the Islamic Fanatics wanting to spill blood........................Which is BS.

Some say it was the young Turks, mainly Jews sent from Britain to cause upheaval in the Ottoman empire which they did and caused all the unrest. They did it in Russia and tried in Germany. That is what the Zionist do, go into a country and tear it apart from the inside, Trojan horse style.

 

[Penelope]

If Israel is hell bent on keeping destroying their homes and replacing them with their own, stealing land, uprooting their olive tress with they make a living on, shooting at fishermen, shooting their kids for throwing stones or rocks, keeping them fenced in, jailed them without trials and abusing them while in their prisons, continuous threats of how all the land belongs to the Jews, then yes I do think they have a right to defend themselves,

and it was the Zionist who moved in like hoards, with full intent on ridding the land of their presence. I am never for violence but in this case they need to defend themselves.

I am only sorry that Gaza does not have a stronger military, and seem to be at the mercy of Israel and Israel's propaganda and state of the art weapons and as PM Bibi calls it their "fighting spirit". This is not the OT times.

aka As always you want the destruction of Israel................It's not about the land..........never has been..............It is about the Radical Islamic movement to destroy Israel..................always has been and always will be...............

As long as they continue to be ruled by Terrorist Orgs like Hamas............then there will be perpetual War..............and the Pali's are being used as cannon fodder by their so called leaders.

Hamas a terrorist org. I see Israel as a terrorist org.

And you are not willing to budge...........Nor am I..................

When neither side can come to a Peaceful compromise or agreement......................we have.................

WAR................

Well appears so, if the Pals would ignore the daily abuse and bow down and worship the gods in Israel, then perhaps they might be able to continue living like animals in a cage , but fed a little better.

 

[eagle1462010]

If Israel is hell bent on keeping destroying their homes and replacing them with their own, stealing land, uprooting their olive tress with they make a living on, shooting at fishermen, shooting their kids for throwing stones or rocks, keeping them fenced in, jailed them without trials and abusing them while in their prisons, continuous threats of how all the land belongs to the Jews, then yes I do think they have a right to defend themselves,

and it was the Zionist who moved in like hoards, with full intent on ridding the land of their presence. I am never for violence but in this case they need to defend themselves.

I am only sorry that Gaza does not have a stronger military, and seem to be at the mercy of Israel and Israel's propaganda and state of the art weapons and as PM Bibi calls it their "fighting spirit". This is not the OT times.

aka As always you want the destruction of Israel................It's not about the land..........never has been..............It is about the Radical Islamic movement to destroy Israel..................always has been and always will be...............

As long as they continue to be ruled by Terrorist Orgs like Hamas............then there will be perpetual War..............and the Pali's are being used as cannon fodder by their so called leaders.

Hamas a terrorist org. I see Israel as a terrorist org.

And you are not willing to budge...........Nor am I..................

When neither side can come to a Peaceful compromise or agreement......................we have.................

WAR................

Well appears so, if the Pals would ignore the daily abuse and bow down and worship the gods in Israel, then perhaps they might be able to continue living like animals in a cage , but fed a little better.

Over 6 decades of trying to destroy Israel in the region...............

They caged themselves.

 

[Penelope]

If Israel is hell bent on keeping destroying their homes and replacing them with their own, stealing land, uprooting their olive tress with they make a living on, shooting at fishermen, shooting their kids for throwing stones or rocks, keeping them fenced in, jailed them without trials and abusing them while in their prisons, continuous threats of how all the land belongs to the Jews, then yes I do think they have a right to defend themselves,

and it was the Zionist who moved in like hoards, with full intent on ridding the land of their presence. I am never for violence but in this case they need to defend themselves.

I am only sorry that Gaza does not have a stronger military, and seem to be at the mercy of Israel and Israel's propaganda and state of the art weapons and as PM Bibi calls it their "fighting spirit". This is not the OT times.

aka As always you want the destruction of Israel................It's not about the land..........never has been..............It is about the Radical Islamic movement to destroy Israel..................always has been and always will be...............

As long as they continue to be ruled by Terrorist Orgs like Hamas............then there will be perpetual War..............and the Pali's are being used as cannon fodder by their so called leaders.

Hamas a terrorist org. I see Israel as a terrorist org.

And you are not willing to budge...........Nor am I..................

When neither side can come to a Peaceful compromise or agreement......................we have.................

WAR................

Well appears so, if the Pals would ignore the daily abuse and bow down and worship the gods in Israel, then perhaps they might be able to continue living like animals in a cage , but fed a little better.

Over 6 decades of trying to destroy Israel in the region...............

They caged themselves.

The Zionist encroached on their territory, what do you expect? Lay down and die, say here is our land and leave. You have to give the Pals credit , for all the wars there, they are the people who stayed, while the Jews fled before 1AD and had to be paid and begged to come back in the 1950's, of course the Zionist had already been fighting there. No, the Ashkenazis have no more right to that land, even less, than the Pals.

There never was an Israel there, and the Zionist had no intention of becoming friends with the Pals.

 

[eagle1462010]

aka As always you want the destruction of Israel................It's not about the land..........never has been..............It is about the Radical Islamic movement to destroy Israel..................always has been and always will be...............

As long as they continue to be ruled by Terrorist Orgs like Hamas............then there will be perpetual War..............and the Pali's are being used as cannon fodder by their so called leaders.

Hamas a terrorist org. I see Israel as a terrorist org.

And you are not willing to budge...........Nor am I..................

When neither side can come to a Peaceful compromise or agreement......................we have.................

WAR................

Well appears so, if the Pals would ignore the daily abuse and bow down and worship the gods in Israel, then perhaps they might be able to continue living like animals in a cage , but fed a little better.

Over 6 decades of trying to destroy Israel in the region...............

They caged themselves.

The Zionist encroached on their territory, what do you expect? Lay down and die, say here is our land and leave.

Israel made the mistake..................................

Of not shoving the asshats into Jordan and Syria after the entire arab world attacked them on 3 different occasions..................

If their goal is the destruction of Israel............which it is.............then they can die.............which is War...............Your starting to understand aren't you...............

You go and punch a big guy in the face.........and the next thing you see is tweetie birds.......your fault.

 

[Penelope]

Hamas a terrorist org. I see Israel as a terrorist org.

And you are not willing to budge...........Nor am I..................

When neither side can come to a Peaceful compromise or agreement......................we have.................

WAR................

Well appears so, if the Pals would ignore the daily abuse and bow down and worship the gods in Israel, then perhaps they might be able to continue living like animals in a cage , but fed a little better.

Over 6 decades of trying to destroy Israel in the region...............

They caged themselves.

The Zionist encroached on their territory, what do you expect? Lay down and die, say here is our land and leave.

Israel made the mistake..................................

Of not shoving the asshats into Jordan and Syria after the entire arab world attacked them on 3 different occasions..................

If their goal is the destruction of Israel............which it is.............then they can die.............which is War...............Your starting to understand aren't you...............

You go and punch a big guy in the face.........and the next thing you see is tweetie birds.......your fault.

You would try and get rid of roaches as well wouldn't you, for fear they'd multiply and kill you. According to you, its quite alright for the Zionist to do whatever is needed to have control over the area and defend themselves, but not for the pals. Like I said the little gods of Israel had no right to be there, except given by Britain, and with the understanding that they would go slowly and not encroach on the rights of the people living there.

 

[eagle1462010]

And you are not willing to budge...........Nor am I..................

When neither side can come to a Peaceful compromise or agreement......................we have.................

WAR................

Well appears so, if the Pals would ignore the daily abuse and bow down and worship the gods in Israel, then perhaps they might be able to continue living like animals in a cage , but fed a little better.

Over 6 decades of trying to destroy Israel in the region...............

They caged themselves.

The Zionist encroached on their territory, what do you expect? Lay down and die, say here is our land and leave.

Israel made the mistake..................................

Of not shoving the asshats into Jordan and Syria after the entire arab world attacked them on 3 different occasions..................

If their goal is the destruction of Israel............which it is.............then they can die.............which is War...............Your starting to understand aren't you...............

You go and punch a big guy in the face.........and the next thing you see is tweetie birds.......your fault.

You would try and get rid of roaches as well wouldn't you, for fear they'd multiply and kill you. According to you, its quite alright for the Zionist to do whatever is needed to have control over the area and defend themselves, but not for the pals. Like I said the little gods of Israel had no right to be there, except given by Britain, and with the understanding that they would go slowly and not encroach on the rights of the people living there.

And were offed a country as well................Chose War and lost...............broke the deal..............got what they asked for..............WAR..................

And now they bitch and moan because they can't win on the battlefield............so they hire BS artists like you to try and get the world to abandon Israel...................la de da.

 

[Humanity]

Hello,

I'd like to ask all those supporting the Palestinian cause regardless of their general position about certain situations, Do you support rocket fire against Israel?

Thanks in advance.

I think you needed to word your question differently!

You cannot ask the question and then preface it with "regardless of their general position about certain situations"...

Regardless of the oppression and blockade of Gaza?
Regardless of the occupied territories?
Regardless of the restrictions of movement?
Regardless of the resistance of Israel to allow a Palestinian state?
Regardless of incursions into Gaza?
Regardless of illegal settlements?
And on, and on, and on....

You cannot just take "rocket fire" in isolation.... It could be considered a retaliation, a reaction to an action...

I do not support violence in any form so, in isolation, my answer to your question has to be "No"!

As I have said many times before...

Israel must take steps, as the 'occupying power', as the 'stronger force', to start taking steps to remove the blockade, to allow the Palestinians to 'feel' that they can make steps to creating a Palestinian state...

To preempt your 'security of Israel' response...

Israel has the 4th most powerful military in the world... You cannot seriously believe that Hamas can trouble Israel with attacks? Using this argument for not lifting blockades etc etc is a pretty lame one these days...

Here's a view point for you....

Lift the blockades, start removing the illegal settlers and then, should rocket fire continue, Israel should REQUEST that a 3rd party, a military 'peace keeping' force, enter Gaza in an attempt to quash the terrorist activities within.

 

[ForeverYoung436]

Hello,

I'd like to ask all those supporting the Palestinian cause regardless of their general position about certain situations, Do you support rocket fire against Israel?

Thanks in advance.

I think you needed to word your question differently!

You cannot ask the question and then preface it with "regardless of their general position about certain situations"...

Regardless of the oppression and blockade of Gaza?
Regardless of the occupied territories?
Regardless of the restrictions of movement?
Regardless of the resistance of Israel to allow a Palestinian state?
Regardless of incursions into Gaza?
Regardless of illegal settlements?
And on, and on, and on....

You cannot just take "rocket fire" in isolation.... It could be considered a retaliation, a reaction to an action...

I do not support violence in any form so, in isolation, my answer to your question has to be "No"!

As I have said many times before...

Israel must take steps, as the 'occupying power', as the 'stronger force', to start taking steps to remove the blockade, to allow the Palestinians to 'feel' that they can make steps to creating a Palestinian state...

To preempt your 'security of Israel' response...

Israel has the 4th most powerful military in the world... You cannot seriously believe that Hamas can trouble Israel with attacks? Using this argument for not lifting blockades etc etc is a pretty lame one these days...

Here's a view point for you....

Lift the blockades, start removing the illegal settlers and then, should rocket fire continue, Israel should REQUEST that a 3rd party, a military 'peace keeping' force, enter Gaza in an attempt to quash the terrorist activities within.

While it might be true that Israel has the 4th most powerful army in the world, the lives of its citizens would be continually disrupted by terror. You probably don't have family or friends in Israel, so you wouldn't be aware of them constantly going into bomb shelters. Perhaps Hamas doesn't represent an existential threat, but they would be an extreme liability in the everyday lives of Israelis.