A liberals view of "Conservatism".

[daveman]

Nope. Unlike the SUPPOSED conservatives on this board I REALLY believe in Individual Liberty.

Not if you vote Democrat, you don't.

Wow. What a rock solid, iron clad argument. I guess you sure told me!!

I did, actually. You're just not bright enough to recognize it.

Democrat policies do not support individual liberties. They don't even recognize the individual. They deal solely with the collective.

 

[DiamondDave]

Okay, he has it all wrong. Fair enough. Then please explain what exactly is "wrong" about these statements then? If todays conservatives do not feel this way now is the perfect time to prove him wrong and make him eat his words.

1) Equalized tax rates on every dollar earned for all... and having everyone into the 'game' and eliminating the problem of ~50% paying no federal income tax... go ahead, keep the 'rich' rate at 38%, as long as everyone else has it too on every dollar earned... but the funny thing is, I bet you will hear people yelling from the rooftops about tax cuts and cutting govt spending
2) Funny, you want your morals legislated, and you never seem to complain about that
3) This has never been stated or put into place... but nice try by both of you fucking wingers
4) Please state where "rebuilding America" is frowned upon (as general a statement as it is)... and please understand that powers not specifically granted to the federal government within the constitution are reserved for the states and citizens
5) Please show where it is stated that prayer is supposed to take the place of taking care of yourself...

You fucking ignorant bastard

Tax rates are equalized. That is everyone pay the same rate for the first 8,375 dollars taxable income (10%) Between 8,376 and 34,000 everyone pays 15%. Next bracket is between 34,000 and 82,400 (25%). 82,401 to 171,850 pays 28%. 171,850 to 373,650 pays 33%. Finally taxable income over 373,650 pays 35%

I think the Bush era (should that be error) tax cuts should expire.

But then again I think we need a balanced budget amendment with a plan to pay down the huge debt the politicians have given the country.

Progressive tax rates are not equal tax rates.... what next... Person A gets a gallon of milk for $1 while person B for $40 because he makes more??

A flat tax with zero deductions and zero exceptions on every dollar earned by every citizen is equalized... when ~47% - ~50% of the citizenry pays ZERO in income tax, you can see it is not 'equalized'

We do, however, need a balanced budget amendment and huge spending cuts across the board

 

[Chris]

Not if you vote Democrat, you don't.

Wow. What a rock solid, iron clad argument. I guess you sure told me!!

I did, actually. You're just not bright enough to recognize it.

Democrat policies do not support individual liberties. They don't even recognize the individual. They deal solely with the collective.

Not the collective, but the common good.

Taking care of the old and the sick is the right thing to do.

 

[Chris]

1) Equalized tax rates on every dollar earned for all... and having everyone into the 'game' and eliminating the problem of ~50% paying no federal income tax... go ahead, keep the 'rich' rate at 38%, as long as everyone else has it too on every dollar earned... but the funny thing is, I bet you will hear people yelling from the rooftops about tax cuts and cutting govt spending
2) Funny, you want your morals legislated, and you never seem to complain about that
3) This has never been stated or put into place... but nice try by both of you fucking wingers
4) Please state where "rebuilding America" is frowned upon (as general a statement as it is)... and please understand that powers not specifically granted to the federal government within the constitution are reserved for the states and citizens
5) Please show where it is stated that prayer is supposed to take the place of taking care of yourself...

You fucking ignorant bastard

Tax rates are equalized. That is everyone pay the same rate for the first 8,375 dollars taxable income (10%) Between 8,376 and 34,000 everyone pays 15%. Next bracket is between 34,000 and 82,400 (25%). 82,401 to 171,850 pays 28%. 171,850 to 373,650 pays 33%. Finally taxable income over 373,650 pays 35%

I think the Bush era (should that be error) tax cuts should expire.

But then again I think we need a balanced budget amendment with a plan to pay down the huge debt the politicians have given the country.

Progressive tax rates are not equal tax rates.... what next... Person A gets a gallon of milk for $1 while person B for $40 because he makes more??

A flat tax with zero deductions and zero exceptions on every dollar earned by every citizen is equalized... when ~47% - ~50% of the citizenry pays ZERO in income tax, you can see it is not 'equalized'

We do, however, need a balanced budget amendment and huge spending cuts across the board

 

[daveman]

Wow. What a rock solid, iron clad argument. I guess you sure told me!!

I did, actually. You're just not bright enough to recognize it.

Democrat policies do not support individual liberties. They don't even recognize the individual. They deal solely with the collective.

Not the collective, but the common good.

Taking care of the old and the sick in the right thing to do.

How does being hostile to business and driving them overseas benefit the common good?

You don't care about the old and the sick as people. You care about them as voting blocs.

 

[DaGoose]

1) Equalized tax rates on every dollar earned for all... and having everyone into the 'game' and eliminating the problem of ~50% paying no federal income tax... go ahead, keep the 'rich' rate at 38%, as long as everyone else has it too on every dollar earned... but the funny thing is, I bet you will hear people yelling from the rooftops about tax cuts and cutting govt spending
2) Funny, you want your morals legislated, and you never seem to complain about that
3) This has never been stated or put into place... but nice try by both of you fucking wingers
4) Please state where "rebuilding America" is frowned upon (as general a statement as it is)... and please understand that powers not specifically granted to the federal government within the constitution are reserved for the states and citizens
5) Please show where it is stated that prayer is supposed to take the place of taking care of yourself...

You fucking ignorant bastard

Tax rates are equalized. That is everyone pay the same rate for the first 8,375 dollars taxable income (10%) Between 8,376 and 34,000 everyone pays 15%. Next bracket is between 34,000 and 82,400 (25%). 82,401 to 171,850 pays 28%. 171,850 to 373,650 pays 33%. Finally taxable income over 373,650 pays 35%

I think the Bush era (should that be error) tax cuts should expire.

But then again I think we need a balanced budget amendment with a plan to pay down the huge debt the politicians have given the country.

Progressive tax rates are not equal tax rates.... what next... Person A gets a gallon of milk for $1 while person B for $40 because he makes more??

A flat tax with zero deductions and zero exceptions on every dollar earned by every citizen is equalized... when ~47% - ~50% of the citizenry pays ZERO in income tax, you can see it is not 'equalized'

We do, however, need a balanced budget amendment and huge spending cuts across the board

If the Flat Tax was applied to capital gains as well as payroll taxes then maybe, just maybe you could start to consider it fair. Until then you're just whistling in the wind.

 

[DaGoose]

I did, actually. You're just not bright enough to recognize it.

Democrat policies do not support individual liberties. They don't even recognize the individual. They deal solely with the collective.

Not the collective, but the common good.

Taking care of the old and the sick in the right thing to do.

How does being hostile to business and driving them overseas benefit the common good?

You don't care about the old and the sick as people. You care about them as voting blocs.

And you NEW conservatives don't care about them at all.

 

[daveman]

Not the collective, but the common good.

Taking care of the old and the sick in the right thing to do.

How does being hostile to business and driving them overseas benefit the common good?

You don't care about the old and the sick as people. You care about them as voting blocs.

And you NEW conservatives don't care about them at all.

More leftist horseshit repeated as fact by someone unable to think for himself.

I'd be shocked, but I've read your posts before.

 

[eflatminor]

Taking care of the old and the sick is the right thing to do.

Then you should start or donate to a charity. Stealing from some citizens, even if you think it's for the common good, is NOT the right thing to do...and it's unconstitutional at the federal level. If your statement is true, you should have no problem collecting voluntary contributions. That your ideas are so damn good that they have to be enforced with the threat of incarceration speaks volumes about those ideas.

 

[daveman]

Taking care of the old and the sick is the right thing to do.

Then you should start or donate to a charity. Stealing from some citizens, even if you think it's for the common good, is NOT the right thing to do...and it's unconstitutional at the federal level. If your statement is true, you should have no problem collecting voluntary contributions. That your ideas are so damn good that they have to be enforced with the threat of incarceration speaks volumes about those ideas.

 

[DiamondDave]

Taking care of the old and the sick is the right thing to do.

Then you should start or donate to a charity. Stealing from some citizens, even if you think it's for the common good, is NOT the right thing to do...and it's unconstitutional at the federal level. If your statement is true, you should have no problem collecting voluntary contributions. That your ideas are so damn good that they have to be enforced with the threat of incarceration speaks volumes about those ideas.

Their idea of "right" is the only one that matters... if the same excuse of "righteousness" is used in government from a stance outside their view, it is complained about as originating from the 'Christian Right' or "legislating morality" or whatever else.....

It is easy for one like Chrissypoo to be generous with the monies of others... not so much so when it has to be a voluntary act by him

 

[Chris]

Taking care of the old and the sick is the right thing to do.

Then you should start or donate to a charity. Stealing from some citizens, even if you think it's for the common good, is NOT the right thing to do...and it's unconstitutional at the federal level. If your statement is true, you should have no problem collecting voluntary contributions. That your ideas are so damn good that they have to be enforced with the threat of incarceration speaks volumes about those ideas.

Their idea of "right" is the only one that matters... if the same excuse of "righteousness" is used in government from a stance outside their view, it is complained about as originating from the 'Christian Right' or "legislating morality" or whatever else.....

It is easy for one like Chrissypoo to be generous with the monies of others... not so much so when it has to be a voluntary act by him

All you have is a personal attack. Pretty lame.

Taking care of the old and the sick is the right thing to do.

The richest country in the world should be able to do it.

You get a check from the government every month.

You only hate entitlements if they are someone else's,

 

[Soggy in NOLA]

Nope. Unlike the SUPPOSED conservatives on this board I REALLY believe in Individual Liberty.

You know, society has the right and does, decide what is deemed acceptable. You are not at liberty to do whatever the hell you fee like, you know, like euthanizing people or marrying goats.

Sorry to have to break it to you.

And sorry to break it to you but if you support banning the things I listed then you support a big, intrusive government. You can't have it both ways.

Yeah? Like claiming what you are claiming then claiming the moral high ground by supporting Obamacare under the guise of "it's the right thing to do".

Gimme me a fucking break.

 

[eflatminor]

The richest country in the world should be able to do it.

Here's what you're missing: We became the richest country in the world precisely because we did NOT enable our citizens with handouts. Freedom, to fail or succeed, is why we're so successful economically and why relative to other countries, we have no true poverty. It is also the reason why we have so many ultra wealthy citizens.

But hey, I'm sure you know what's best for everyone else.

 

[Bern80]

Taking care of the old and the sick is the right thing to do.

Then you should start or donate to a charity. Stealing from some citizens, even if you think it's for the common good, is NOT the right thing to do...and it's unconstitutional at the federal level. If your statement is true, you should have no problem collecting voluntary contributions. That your ideas are so damn good that they have to be enforced with the threat of incarceration speaks volumes about those ideas.

Well I know no one has taken me up on my offer yet. I came up with a change to the tax code that would allow liberals to put their own money where their mouth is. If liberals believe our government STILL doesn't have enough money why don't we just make it so they can give them more if they feel like it. A simple line added to your federal tax returns that simply says 'donation'. Here you can allocate any amount of money you want to give to the fed above and beyond your tax liability. I'm sure there are plenty of liberals that feel the same way so I wouldn't think it would be too tough for those that want to give more to add a few extra milliion in tax revenue. That way those of us who don't think it's any of government's business don't have to worry about it coming out of our pockets and the libs get what they want (as long as they choose to fund it out of their own pockets of course).

 

[Bern80]

The richest country in the world should be able to do it.

Here's what you're missing: We became the richest country in the world precisely because we did NOT enable our citizens with handouts. Freedom, to fail or succeed, is why we're so successful economically and why relative to other countries, we have no true poverty. It is also the reason why we have so many ultra wealthy citizens.

But hey, I'm sure you know what's best for everyone else.

Why do people say dumb shit like this? Nevermind I know why. Anyone who would say the richest country in the world should ________ (fill in the blank) is a person that does not believe peope are responsible for their outcomes. It has to come from the moronic belief that wealth must be divided equally regardless of value to society.

 

[Sky Dancer]

You may want to read this essay, What Is Conservatism and What Is Wrong with It? which I have used to open up a discussion on another thread about what conservatism does to people.

Here's a clip:

The opposite of conservatism is democracy, and contempt for democracy is a constant thread in the history of conservative argument. Instead, conservatism has argued that society ought to be organized in a hierarchy of orders and classes and controlled by its uppermost hierarchical stratum, the aristocracy. Many of these arguments against egalitarianism are ancient, and most of them are routinely heard on the radio. One tends to hear the arguments in bits and pieces, for example the emphatic if vague claim that people are different. Of course, most of these arguments, if considered rationally, actually argue for meritocracy rather than for aristocracy. Meritocracy is a democratic principle. George Bush, however, was apparently scarred for life by having been one of the last students admitted to Yale under its old aristocratic admissions system, and having to attend classes with students admitted under the meritocratic system who considered themselves to be smarter than him. Although he has lately claimed to oppose the system of legacy admissions from which he benefitted, that is a tactic, part of a package deal to eliminate affirmative action, thereby allowing conservative social hierarchies to be reaffirmed in other ways.

 

[daveman]

Taking care of the old and the sick is the right thing to do.

Then you should start or donate to a charity. Stealing from some citizens, even if you think it's for the common good, is NOT the right thing to do...and it's unconstitutional at the federal level. If your statement is true, you should have no problem collecting voluntary contributions. That your ideas are so damn good that they have to be enforced with the threat of incarceration speaks volumes about those ideas.

Well I know no one has taken me up on my offer yet. I came up with a change to the tax code that would allow liberals to put their own money where their mouth is. If liberals believe our government STILL doesn't have enough money why don't we just make it so they can give them more if they feel like it. A simple line added to your federal tax returns that simply says 'donation'. Here you can allocate any amount of money you want to give to the fed above and beyond your tax liability. I'm sure there are plenty of liberals that feel the same way so I wouldn't think it would be too tough for those that want to give more to add a few extra milliion in tax revenue. That way those of us who don't think it's any of government's business don't have to worry about it coming out of our pockets and the libs get what they want (as long as they choose to fund it out of their own pockets of course).

There is already a means for people to donate money to the government above their taxes.

Gifts to the United States Government: Questions and Answers: Financial Management Service

I doubt if many leftists have donated.

 

[daveman]

You may want to read this essay, What Is Conservatism and What Is Wrong with It? which I have used to open up a discussion on another thread about what conservatism does to people.

Here's a clip:

The opposite of conservatism is democracy...

When it starts off with an absolutely ridiculous statement, the rest can be safely dismissed.

 

[Sky Dancer]

It can be safely assumed, daveman. That you won't read ANYTHING that challenges conservatism. FF represents EXACTLY the kind of conservative the author writes about. The Aristocrat. That's her attitude. Contempt for common folk.