Zionism And Its Impact

[fanger]

The Zionist movement has maintained a striking continuity in its aims and methods over the past century. From the start, the movement sought to achieve a Jewish majority in Palestine and to establish a Jewish state on as much of the LAND as possible. The methods included promoting mass Jewish immigration and acquiring tracts of land that would become the inalienable property of the Jewish people. This policy inevitably prevented the indigenous Arab residents from attaining their national goals and establishing a Palestinian state. It also necessitated displacing Palestinians from their lands and jobs when their presence conflicted with Zionist interests.

The Zionist movement—and subsequently the state of ISRAEL—failed to develop a positive approach to the Palestinian presence and aspirations. Although many Israelis recognized the moral dilemma posed by the Palestinians, the majority either tried to ignore the issue or to resolve it by force majeure. Thus, the Palestine problem festered and grew, instead of being resolved.
The Jewish community (yishuv) rose from 6 percent of Palestine's population in 1880 to 10 percent by 1914. Although the numbers were insignificant, the settlers were outspoken enough to arouse the opposition of Arab leaders and induce them to exert counter pressure on the Ottoman regime to prohibit Jewish immigration and land buying.


Special Topics: Zionism and Its Impact

The Immigrants took over (For now)

 

[Boston1]

Hold on right there

Indigenous Arab residents ?

The term Arab refers to a people using a language group that didn't widely disseminate from where it originated on the the Arab peninsula until about the late 7th century CE. The Judaic language group and its people date back approximately to the middle bronze age within the area that is now Israel.

So tell us all about the "indigenous" Arab residents ?

And if you could, why are you pretending the Arab speaking residents of Judea are somehow "indigenous" and what is your definition of the term indigenous ?

Also what exactly is
"a positive approach to the Palestinian presence and aspirations"
The Arab people in the areas allotted to the creation of a Jewish homeland have made it clear their aspirations are to "drive the Jews into the sea and bath in their blood" <--- how'd I do, did I get the wording right ? I didn't really feel like reading the charter again.

So just a couple questions
What exactly is it you are expecting as a positive approach ? Lay down and die ?
Why is there a Arab presence in Judea when the Jews were expelled from so many Arab countries ? Why shouldn't the Judaic people treat the Arabs exactly as the Arabs have treated the Jews ?
What would you call a positive approach to a group who has vowed to, and continued to, commit one act of senseless violence after another ?

Just curious
;-)

 

[rylah]

Pan-Arabism and its' impact on the ME?

Arab aspirations were to continue be Syrians, not to have any independent state.
They didn't hide it then, and they don't today.

Pan-Arabism is subjugation of the indigenous peoples in the ME. Bedouins, Egyptians and Saudis are not indigenous to Levant.

 

[Boston1]

Do the Syrians know about this ?

 

[rylah]

Do the Syrians know about this ?

Is there a difference betwen Syrians and 'Palestinian' Arabs?
Arabs say they're the same people.

1st Arab Congress 1919 Jerusalem:

1 . We consider Palestine as part of Arab Syria as it has never been separated from it at any time. We are connected with it by national, religious, linguistic, natural, economic and geographic bonds.

2. The Declaration made by M. Pichon, Minister for Foreig Affairs for France, that France had rights in our country based on the desires and aspirations of the inhabitants has no foundation and we reject all the declarations made in his speech of 29th December 1918, as our wishes and aspirations are only in Arab unity and complete independence.

3. In view of the above we desire that one district Southern Syria or Palestine should not be separated from the Independent Arab Syrian Government and to be free from all foreign influence and protection.

4. In accordance with the rule laid down by President Wilson and approved by most of the Great Powers we consider that every promise or treaty concluded in respect of our country and its future as null and void and reject the same.

5. The Government of the country will apply for help to its friend Great Britain in case of need for the improvement and development of the country provided that this will not affect its independence and Arab unity in any way and will keep good relations with the Allied Powers.

The Palestine Conference also decided to send a delegation to Damascus 'to inform Arab patriots there of the decision to call Palestine Southern Syria and unite it with Northern Syria

 

[Shusha]

Palestinians say the same today. There is no difference between Syrians, Jordanians and Arab Palestinians.

 

[rylah]

Palestinians say the same today. There is no difference between Syrians, Jordanians and Arab Palestinians.

There're also polls saying that Palestinian Arabs want to be a part of Jordan.

"Interestingly, a 46 percent plurality said that in place of an independent Palestinian state, they would prefer confederation with neighboring Jordan, where a majority of the population is “Palestinian” Arab."

Poll: Palestinians Prefer Federation With Jordan

Better be ruled by Arabian royalty than have an independent state.

 

[montelatici]

Hold on right there

Indigenous Arab residents ?

The term Arab refers to a people using a language group that didn't widely disseminate from where it originated on the the Arab peninsula until about the late 7th century CE. The Judaic language group and its people date back approximately to the middle bronze age within the area that is now Israel.

So tell us all about the "indigenous" Arab residents ?

And if you could, why are you pretending the Arab speaking residents of Judea are somehow "indigenous" and what is your definition of the term indigenous ?

Also what exactly is
"a positive approach to the Palestinian presence and aspirations"
The Arab people in the areas allotted to the creation of a Jewish homeland have made it clear their aspirations are to "drive the Jews into the sea and bath in their blood" <--- how'd I do, did I get the wording right ? I didn't really feel like reading the charter again.

So just a couple questions
What exactly is it you are expecting as a positive approach ? Lay down and die ?
Why is there a Arab presence in Judea when the Jews were expelled from so many Arab countries ? Why shouldn't the Judaic people treat the Arabs exactly as the Arabs have treated the Jews ?
What would you call a positive approach to a group who has vowed to, and continued to, commit one act of senseless violence after another ?

Just curious
;-)

The Arab speaking people of Palestine are just as indigenous to Palestine as the Arab speaking Berbers are indigenous to Algeria. Just because the ancestors of the Palestinians (that practiced Judaism, Samaritanis, Paganism etc.) converted to Christianity by the 5th century, and then most to Islam afterwards did not change who their ancestors were.

 

[Hollie]

Hold on right there

Indigenous Arab residents ?

The term Arab refers to a people using a language group that didn't widely disseminate from where it originated on the the Arab peninsula until about the late 7th century CE. The Judaic language group and its people date back approximately to the middle bronze age within the area that is now Israel.

So tell us all about the "indigenous" Arab residents ?

And if you could, why are you pretending the Arab speaking residents of Judea are somehow "indigenous" and what is your definition of the term indigenous ?

Also what exactly is
"a positive approach to the Palestinian presence and aspirations"
The Arab people in the areas allotted to the creation of a Jewish homeland have made it clear their aspirations are to "drive the Jews into the sea and bath in their blood" <--- how'd I do, did I get the wording right ? I didn't really feel like reading the charter again.

So just a couple questions
What exactly is it you are expecting as a positive approach ? Lay down and die ?
Why is there a Arab presence in Judea when the Jews were expelled from so many Arab countries ? Why shouldn't the Judaic people treat the Arabs exactly as the Arabs have treated the Jews ?
What would you call a positive approach to a group who has vowed to, and continued to, commit one act of senseless violence after another ?

Just curious
;-)

The Arab speaking people of Palestine are just as indigenous to Palestine as the Arab speaking Berbers are indigenous to Algeria. Just because the ancestors of the Palestinians (that practiced Judaism, Samaritanis, Paganism etc.) converted to Christianity by the 5th century, and then most to Islam afterwards did not change who their ancestors were.

It's odd how the invading / colonizing Turks and the invading / colonizing European Christian Crusaders magically became indigenous Arabs.

Magical events magically happen in the Magical Kingdom of Disney Pally'land.

 

[Boston1]

LOL Monte is still hard at it. So the Judaic people who Judea is named after and who founded Jerusalem over 5 thousand years ago, aren't the "indigenous" people, thats a laugh.

Now its a group of Arab militia left over from the Arab conquest in the late 7th century CE and immigrants arriving in the early 20th century as a response to the return of the Judaic people.

Brilliant argument, simply brilliant.

Say didn't I block you for presenting just that kind of ludicrous argument earlier. Does the blocking thing expire or something ?

 

[MJB12741]

I have to agree Zionism & its impact have kept this conflict forever ending. What kind of people make peace offerings to Palestinians, build a security fence & concede Palestinians their own land? And then those Zionists just can't seem to understand why they are thanked with a rocket missile base in Gaza to kill Israeli's.

Want peace you Zionists? First this entire Zionist agenda has to go & Israel has to learn from king Hussein how to deal with Palestinians for a lasting peace. LET THERE BE PEACE ALREADY!

 

[Divine Wind]

The Zionist movement has maintained a striking continuity in its aims and methods over the past century. From the start, the movement sought to achieve a Jewish majority in Palestine and to establish a Jewish state on as much of the LAND as possible. The methods included promoting mass Jewish immigration and acquiring tracts of land that would become the inalienable property of the Jewish people. This policy inevitably prevented the indigenous Arab residents from attaining their national goals and establishing a Palestinian state. It also necessitated displacing Palestinians from their lands and jobs when their presence conflicted with Zionist interests.

The Zionist movement—and subsequently the state of ISRAEL—failed to develop a positive approach to the Palestinian presence and aspirations. Although many Israelis recognized the moral dilemma posed by the Palestinians, the majority either tried to ignore the issue or to resolve it by force majeure. Thus, the Palestine problem festered and grew, instead of being resolved.
The Jewish community (yishuv) rose from 6 percent of Palestine's population in 1880 to 10 percent by 1914. Although the numbers were insignificant, the settlers were outspoken enough to arouse the opposition of Arab leaders and induce them to exert counter pressure on the Ottoman regime to prohibit Jewish immigration and land buying.


Special Topics: Zionism and Its Impact

The Immigrants took over (For now)

So what's your plan? Build a lot of ovens? Arm the Jihadists with nukes?

 

[fanger]

The Palestinians' responses to Jewish immigration, land purchases, and political demands were remarkably consistent. They insisted that Palestine remain an Arab country, with the same right of self-determination and independence as Egypt, Transjordan, and Iraq. Britain granted those countries independence without a violent struggle since their claims to self-determination were not contested by European settlers. The Palestinians argued that Palestinian territory COULD NOT AND SHOULD NOT be used to solve the plight of the Jews in Europe, and that Jewish national aspirations should not override their own rights.

Palestinian opposition peaked in the late 1930s: the six-month general strike in 1936 was followed the next year by a widespread rural revolt. This rebellion welled up from the bottom of Palestinian society—unemployed urban workers, displaced peasants crowded into towns, and debt-ridden villagers. It was supported by most merchants and professionals in the towns, who feared competition from the yishuv. Members of the elite families acted as spokesmen before the British administration through the ARAB HIGHER COMMITTEE, which was formed during the 1936 strike. However, the British banned the committee in October 1937 and arrested its members, on the eve of the revolt.

Only one of the Palestinian political parties was willing to limit its aims and accept the principle of territorial partition: The NATIONAL DEFENSE PARTY, led by RAGHIB AL-NASHASHIBI (mayor of JERUSALEM from 1920 to 1934), was willing to accept partition in 1937 so long as the Palestinians obtained sufficient land and could merge with Transjordan to form a larger political entity. However, the British PEEL COMMISSION's plan, announced in July 1937, would have forced the Palestinians to leave the olive- and grain- growing areas of Galilee, the orange groves on the Mediterranean coast, and the urban port cities of HAIFA and ACRE. That was too great a loss for even the National Defense Party to accept, and so it joined in the general denunciations of partition.

from the OP link

 

[Hollie]

The Palestinians' responses to Jewish immigration, land purchases, and political demands were remarkably consistent. They insisted that Palestine remain an Arab country, with the same right of self-determination and independence as Egypt, Transjordan, and Iraq. Britain granted those countries independence without a violent struggle since their claims to self-determination were not contested by European settlers. The Palestinians argued that Palestinian territory COULD NOT AND SHOULD NOT be used to solve the plight of the Jews in Europe, and that Jewish national aspirations should not override their own rights.

Palestinian opposition peaked in the late 1930s: the six-month general strike in 1936 was followed the next year by a widespread rural revolt. This rebellion welled up from the bottom of Palestinian society—unemployed urban workers, displaced peasants crowded into towns, and debt-ridden villagers. It was supported by most merchants and professionals in the towns, who feared competition from the yishuv. Members of the elite families acted as spokesmen before the British administration through the ARAB HIGHER COMMITTEE, which was formed during the 1936 strike. However, the British banned the committee in October 1937 and arrested its members, on the eve of the revolt.

Only one of the Palestinian political parties was willing to limit its aims and accept the principle of territorial partition: The NATIONAL DEFENSE PARTY, led by RAGHIB AL-NASHASHIBI (mayor of JERUSALEM from 1920 to 1934), was willing to accept partition in 1937 so long as the Palestinians obtained sufficient land and could merge with Transjordan to form a larger political entity. However, the British PEEL COMMISSION's plan, announced in July 1937, would have forced the Palestinians to leave the olive- and grain- growing areas of Galilee, the orange groves on the Mediterranean coast, and the urban port cities of HAIFA and ACRE. That was too great a loss for even the National Defense Party to accept, and so it joined in the general denunciations of partition.

from the OP link

The response of the Arab-Moslem colonists to the "Jewish immigration, land purchases, and political demands" was consistent with the historical response of muhammedans to even the mere presence of Jews: fear and loathing.

You understand this from you koranology lessons at the madrassah. Just try and make a half-hearted attempt at being honest.

 

[Boston1]

LOL "palestinian territory" I think you meant Southern Syria. The area actually was the British Mandate after Syria gave it up in the settlement. So when did it suddenly become someone else's territory ? And lets get real, the Arabs simply want it all.

So tell me again how the Jews are taking all the Arab Lands ;-)

The fact is the Arabs have vowed since about the late 7th century CE to subjugate the Jews and they're still kicking and screaming that there's a few left.

 

[montelatici]

LOL "palestinian territory" I think you meant Southern Syria. The area actually was the British Mandate after Syria gave it up in the settlement. So when did it suddenly become someone else's territory ? And lets get real, the Arabs simply want it all.

So tell me again how the Jews are taking all the Arab Lands ;-)

The fact is the Arabs have vowed since about the late 7th century CE to subjugate the Jews and they're still kicking and screaming that there's a few left.

There were no Jews to subjugate in Palestine in the 7th century. Palestine was a Christian land in the 7th Century, only Christians could live there under Roman law. Christianity was the state religion of Rome. Plus, when did Turkey, Iran, Pakistan etc. become Arab. That's the trouble with posting propaganda, it reveals the fact that you are a moron that does not think things through.

 

[Hollie]

LOL "palestinian territory" I think you meant Southern Syria. The area actually was the British Mandate after Syria gave it up in the settlement. So when did it suddenly become someone else's territory ? And lets get real, the Arabs simply want it all.

So tell me again how the Jews are taking all the Arab Lands ;-)

The fact is the Arabs have vowed since about the late 7th century CE to subjugate the Jews and they're still kicking and screaming that there's a few left.

There were no Jews to subjugate in Palestine in the 7th century. Palestine was a Christian land in the 7th Century, only Christians could live there under Roman law. Christianity was the state religion of Rome. Plus, when did Turkey, Iran, Pakistan etc. become Arab. That's the trouble with posting propaganda, it reveals the fact that you are a moron that does not think things through.

Well that's interesting. So then, when did the invading / colonizing Turks and the invading / colonizing European Christian Crusaders magically become "indigenous Arab Pal'istanians"?

 

[fanger]

LOL "palestinian territory" I think you meant Southern Syria. The area actually was the British Mandate after Syria gave it up in the settlement. So when did it suddenly become someone else's territory ? And lets get real, the Arabs simply want it all.

So tell me again how the Jews are taking all the Arab Lands ;-)

The fact is the Arabs have vowed since about the late 7th century CE to subjugate the Jews and they're still kicking and screaming that there's a few left.

Palestine was part of the Ottoman (Turkish) Empire as was Syria, when Turkey was defeated in the First world war, it's Empire was divided up syria going to french control, and Palestine going to British control, Syria had no control to give up, Turkey did. the people under the rule did not change their Race overnight due to a settlement, they were and still are Arabs.

Oh by the way in that pretty little map you posted everything east and including Iran are not Arabs
I apologize if that is too much reality for you to handle all in one go

 

[fanger]

LOL "palestinian territory" I think you meant Southern Syria. The area actually was the British Mandate after Syria gave it up in the settlement. So when did it suddenly become someone else's territory ? And lets get real, the Arabs simply want it all.

So tell me again how the Jews are taking all the Arab Lands ;-)

The fact is the Arabs have vowed since about the late 7th century CE to subjugate the Jews and they're still kicking and screaming that there's a few left.

There were no Jews to subjugate in Palestine in the 7th century. Palestine was a Christian land in the 7th Century, only Christians could live there under Roman law. Christianity was the state religion of Rome. Plus, when did Turkey, Iran, Pakistan etc. become Arab. That's the trouble with posting propaganda, it reveals the fact that you are a moron that does not think things through.

Well that's interesting. So then, when did the invading / colonizing Turks and the invading / colonizing European Christian Crusaders magically become "indigenous Arab Pal'istanians"?

There might be a clue in the word "invading" now here's a bonus question Who were they invading?

 

[Boston1]

LOL looks like Monty is at it again

Ok I'll bite

Arab is predominantly defined by language group. Its not a race or a culture. Iran's predominant language is Arabic ;-) Pakistan is officially an Islamist republic ;-) so by numerous measures, as usual, you have no idea what your talking about Monty,

Do you want to go over any of the other countries in the map depicted ? LOL