Your Congressman Takes Bribes

[Mr. Jones]

Perhaps if the little money got together, (the average citizen), instead of bickering over the BS they want us to, to distract us and separate us, we would have a better chance of advancing candidates, and causes that would benefit the average person instead of the elite. Or perhaps disallow the PACS loophole, and enforce the caps on campaign donations.

That's just tinkering. I think we need a complete overhaul. Tinkering in the past has often made things worse, e.g. unlimited PAC money.

I tend to agree with you on that, problem is HTF do we overhaul anything without agreeing how bad things are? I mean we have people still stuck in the left/right paradigm, arguing over bottom tier issues, while everything including our rights are being eroded at the hands of both party's, which is just a two headed snake..

Once we understand that the petty decisive issues coming out of the TV psyop box are just a way of distracting, and dividing us, the country would have a chance at being saved by an overhaul/revolution, mainly by having strength in a larger, hopefully unified voice.

 

[CausingPAIN]

If you're willing to give up, that's you. What's cuckoo about wanting a government that isn't bought by the highest bidder? Got any solutions?

What's cuckoo, is entertaining any hope of change now or in future. Not possible, see our past history. No way will the so called 1 % be giving anything up or back, that is the reality of the future. When a civil war breaks out, I will entertain thinking over any possible new outcomes or possible changes to this reality of government. As for giving up, or wanting new government. Hmm. Not wasting my time with unrealistic thoughts of impossible changes in the future. These fantasy are not a part of my understanding what the reality is now and into the future! So please keep dreaming and enjoy wasting your time.

Isn't that what we're all doing here or are you just here to be a douchebag? Might as well just give up, I guess.

I don't read any change here, just bitch and whine about issues. Or simply one side is right and the other side careless to grow or compromise on any level on just about anything. These threads may change a few minds now a then, but will not change politic overall. This site would have to have 30 million plus in devotees both R & D’s to vote one way that demands change. Isn’t going to happen and not here by any means.

Ref: As this is a sample below of history, and if we can’t control it we can’t make it change. Just back and forth crap as always. And will not touch the electoral college anyhow as this is the BAD key that needs to be re-cut. We are about 56% Democrat country now and growing, and not for the good.

Voter Turnout in Presidential Elections
Dave Leip's Atlas of U.S. Presidential Elections
United States Elections Project
President Map - Election Results 2008 - The New York Times

 

[Spectre13]

Looks like you have been targeted by the right here on the rep side.

Dont think anything of it, it means nothing.

Yes the money needs to be heaved out of the process or we will lose this country

We have already lost this country. It has not been a democracy in many years. We play at pretending to be a democracy, but it has not been anything but rich men's play toy.

 

[Spectre13]

Yeah right, short sighted lefties think we should outlaw lobbyists until they want to save the earth. What they mean is that they want to outlaw conservative lobbyists. Dishonest lefties are a dime a dozen. They took civics 101 and now they want to outlaw everything they disagree with. "Moderate" republican John McCain teamed up with left wing Russ Feingold and announced that they fixed the "campaign finance law". Dumb assed McCain didn't realize that Feingold fixed it so that left wingers like George Soros would now be tax exempt to pump liberal propaganda through "media matters" and a dozen other venues. Meanwhile Americans would be restricted from buying air-time to support the candidate they liked during a period McCain and Feingold decided was too close to the election. If left wingers get their way everything but liberal propaganda will be outlawed. Lobbyists...R...us. We have a Constitutional right to petition the government. The left only becomes hysterical about it when it seems that they might lose an election.

This is NOT a Left v. Right issue. Shirley, there is enough lobbying from the Left to make everyone sick, including the most moonbat of liberal pansies.

The point is that there is no Left v. Right anymore, not as far as the average citizen is concerned. All of our elected officials are beholden to upper class nabobs who employ lobbying firms to get whatever they want, over the interests of the middle class citizen, whether he be liberal, conservative, or somewhere in between.

The middle class vote doesn't count anymore! Don't you get it?

Sig, no matter how realistic and logical your arguments are, Whitehall will never get it, because she doesn't want to. When someone falls back to name calling as an argument, as she has, ABSOLUTELY NOTHING will change her mind. Logic or real events don't count. Don't waste your breathe or your time.

Finally! I have been yelling this for years. We have to reboot the entire system. Presidential election is discrimintory against the non-wealthy and we allow it. The ONLY choice we have is one or the other rich guy, who can't even relate to us.
We allow the career politicians to run amock and we wonder what the hell happened.
We need term limits and get rid of the legal money laundering operations, (PACs). Serving in Congress should be like serving in the military. If you want to make money get out and go do it in the private sector.

 

[konradv]

Perhaps if the little money got together, (the average citizen), instead of bickering over the BS they want us to, to distract us and separate us, we would have a better chance of advancing candidates, and causes that would benefit the average person instead of the elite. Or perhaps disallow the PACS loophole, and enforce the caps on campaign donations.

That's just tinkering. I think we need a complete overhaul. Tinkering in the past has often made things worse, e.g. unlimited PAC money.

I tend to agree with you on that, problem is HTF do we overhaul anything without agreeing how bad things are? I mean we have people still stuck in the left/right paradigm, arguing over bottom tier issues, while everything including our rights are being eroded at the hands of both party's, which is just a two headed snake..

Once we understand that the petty decisive issues coming out of the TV psyop box are just a way of distracting, and dividing us, the country would have a chance at being saved by an overhaul/revolution, mainly by having strength in a larger, hopefully unified voice.

It may be a pipe dream, but the Tea Party and Occupy movement need to join forces. What could be more non-partisan than making sure everyone is heard? Not only that, IMO we'd save money in the long run, if our representitives don't have a lot of expensive promises to keep. The bonus prize is, since they wouldn't be spending so much time hunting for cash, our representitives might actually have time to read a bill or two!

 

[konradv]

This is NOT a Left v. Right issue. Shirley, there is enough lobbying from the Left to make everyone sick, including the most moonbat of liberal pansies.

The point is that there is no Left v. Right anymore, not as far as the average citizen is concerned. All of our elected officials are beholden to upper class nabobs who employ lobbying firms to get whatever they want, over the interests of the middle class citizen, whether he be liberal, conservative, or somewhere in between.

The middle class vote doesn't count anymore! Don't you get it?

Sig, no matter how realistic and logical your arguments are, Whitehall will never get it, because she doesn't want to. When someone falls back to name calling as an argument, as she has, ABSOLUTELY NOTHING will change her mind. Logic or real events don't count. Don't waste your breathe or your time.

Finally! I have been yelling this for years. We have to reboot the entire system. Presidential election is discrimintory against the non-wealthy and we allow it. The ONLY choice we have is one or the other rich guy, who can't even relate to us.
We allow the career politicians to run amock and we wonder what the hell happened.
We need term limits and get rid of the legal money laundering operations, (PACs). Serving in Congress should be like serving in the military. If you want to make money get out and go do it in the private sector.

Not only that, "outlawing lobbying" is a TOTAL LIE. This is about the money, NOT speech.

 

[Spectre13]

Our political system is really a one-party plutocracy masquerading as a two-party republic.

Or an economic oligarchy run by tyrants who have bought out the "democratic process".

 

[Spectre13]

That's just tinkering. I think we need a complete overhaul. Tinkering in the past has often made things worse, e.g. unlimited PAC money.

I tend to agree with you on that, problem is HTF do we overhaul anything without agreeing how bad things are? I mean we have people still stuck in the left/right paradigm, arguing over bottom tier issues, while everything including our rights are being eroded at the hands of both party's, which is just a two headed snake..

Once we understand that the petty decisive issues coming out of the TV psyop box are just a way of distracting, and dividing us, the country would have a chance at being saved by an overhaul/revolution, mainly by having strength in a larger, hopefully unified voice.

It may be a pipe dream, but the Tea Party and Occupy movement need to join forces. What could be more non-partisan than making sure everyone is heard? Not only that, IMO we'd save money in the long run, if our representitives don't have a lot of expensive promises to keep. The bonus prize is, since they wouldn't be spending so much time hunting for cash, our representitives might actually have time to read a bill or two!

Or deciding corporations are people. What an absurd notion. Only a super rich guy can make that turd fly, but with enough money people will say they see little pink elephants tippy-toeing across the living room.

That will never happen because half the tea party are part of the wealthy class trying to subvert everything but their very narrow bandwidth of ideas. Besides, Republicans are not populist and will never support any idea but a fascist leaning philosophy. Anything less will drag out the term "marxist" or whatever ancient term they can, since they don't look to the future...only to the past.

 

[konradv]

Our political system is really a one-party plutocracy masquerading as a two-party republic.

Or an economic oligarchy run by tyrants who have bought out the "democratic process".

Only vote for candidates who are at least open to public financing. It may take years to convince enough people but, IMO, it's a battle worth fighting.

 

[Mr. Jones]

That's just tinkering. I think we need a complete overhaul. Tinkering in the past has often made things worse, e.g. unlimited PAC money.

I tend to agree with you on that, problem is HTF do we overhaul anything without agreeing how bad things are? I mean we have people still stuck in the left/right paradigm, arguing over bottom tier issues, while everything including our rights are being eroded at the hands of both party's, which is just a two headed snake..

Once we understand that the petty decisive issues coming out of the TV psyop box are just a way of distracting, and dividing us, the country would have a chance at being saved by an overhaul/revolution, mainly by having strength in a larger, hopefully unified voice.

It may be a pipe dream, but the Tea Party and Occupy movement need to join forces. What could be more non-partisan than making sure everyone is heard? Not only that, IMO we'd save money in the long run, if our representitives don't have a lot of expensive promises to keep. The bonus prize is, since they wouldn't be spending so much time hunting for cash, our representitives might actually have time to read a bill or two!

Editor Comment:
This could be a big deal. While progressives have major problems with much of the teaparty's values, I've always felt that if the left and the teaparty could get together on anything, it could prove incredibly powerful. So, this is not the left. It is the Occupy movement, a far less ideological movement, but one with amazing potency and promise. I hope we see a lot more of this, and that this even is wildly successful.

OpEdNews - Article: Occupy & Tea Party Join Forces to Protest NDAA

Hopefully it's a start to unifying both groups on major issues like the NDAA and other similar issues that are extremely important as well.

 

[Mr. Jones]

Looks like you have been targeted by the right here on the rep side.

Dont think anything of it, it means nothing.

Yes the money needs to be heaved out of the process or we will lose this country

We have already lost this country. It has not been a democracy in many years. We play at pretending to be a democracy, but it has not been anything but rich men's play toy.

The civil rights movement should give us encouragement and remove some of the apathy. United in overwhelming numbers, and using civil disobedience can turn the tide and create the change we are discussing here.
It takes courage and discipline like the freedom riders and many others of that movement had. They too had different opinions on how to accomplish their goal, and who would be leaders etc.. but they mostly succeeded.

The PTB know if we were unified and displayed our displeasure about the current situation we find ourselves in
shit would really hit the fan, why do you think all the police state laws are being rushed through, and anyone can be labeled a "terrorist" for the most trivial of things we used to take for granted?
A united disgruntled citizenry is a terrifying thought to them.

 

[konradv]

Looks like you have been targeted by the right here on the rep side.

Dont think anything of it, it means nothing.

Yes the money needs to be heaved out of the process or we will lose this country

We have already lost this country. It has not been a democracy in many years. We play at pretending to be a democracy, but it has not been anything but rich men's play toy.

The civil rights movement should give us encouragement and remove some of the apathy. United in overwhelming numbers, and using civil disobedience can turn the tide and create the change we are discussing here.
It takes courage and discipline like the freedom riders and many others of that movement had. They too had different opinions on how to accomplish their goal, and who would be leaders etc.. but they mostly succeeded.

The PTB know if we were unified and displayed our displeasure about the current situation we find ourselves in
shit would really hit the fan, why do you think all the police state laws are being rushed through, and anyone can be labeled a "terrorist" for the most trivial of things we used to take for granted?
A united disgruntled citizenry is a terrifying thought to them.

The civil rights movement is a good example. So many say public financing will never happen, but they said the same thing about integration. NAACP founded 1909, major civil rights acts enacted in the 1960s. Don't give up, even if it takes a while.

 

[konradv]

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tv1QIhBBKZE]MSNBC: Corruption & the Case for Public Financing of Elections, 12/27/10 - YouTube[/ame]

 

[TakeAStepBack]

Somehow I knew this would turn into the public campaign finance reform nonissue. So, how is getting this measure passed into law working out?

 

[konradv]

Somehow I knew this would turn into the public campaign finance reform nonissue. So, how is getting this measure passed into law working out?

Unlike libertarianism, at least it has a chance. NAACP founded 1909, major civil rights acts enacted in the 1960s. Sorry, if things aren't going fast enough for you, but at least it's more worthwhile to talk about actual solutions, than whining about "corporatism", when the answer is staring you in the face. (Not "cool" this time, but a symbol of some people's bindness)

 

[Spectre13]

We have already lost this country. It has not been a democracy in many years. We play at pretending to be a democracy, but it has not been anything but rich men's play toy.

The civil rights movement should give us encouragement and remove some of the apathy. United in overwhelming numbers, and using civil disobedience can turn the tide and create the change we are discussing here.
It takes courage and discipline like the freedom riders and many others of that movement had. They too had different opinions on how to accomplish their goal, and who would be leaders etc.. but they mostly succeeded.

The PTB know if we were unified and displayed our displeasure about the current situation we find ourselves in
shit would really hit the fan, why do you think all the police state laws are being rushed through, and anyone can be labeled a "terrorist" for the most trivial of things we used to take for granted?
A united disgruntled citizenry is a terrifying thought to them.

The civil rights movement is a good example. So many say public financing will never happen, but they said the same thing about integration. NAACP founded 1909, major civil rights acts enacted in the 1960s. Don't give up, even if it takes a while.

The only problem with that is you get accused by the right of being "Alinskis," like he invented the idea. Just another absurd assertion from the lack of fact right wing fascist types. I guess the Magna Carta just spontaneously appeared from some great parnormal cloud or something. Organizing has been around for quite a while. The application may be slightly different, but people didn't just wake up feeling particularly pissy one day and decide to organize to promote a greater outcome for a particular society at a particular point in time.

 

[Mr. Jones]

We have already lost this country. It has not been a democracy in many years. We play at pretending to be a democracy, but it has not been anything but rich men's play toy.

The civil rights movement should give us encouragement and remove some of the apathy. United in overwhelming numbers, and using civil disobedience can turn the tide and create the change we are discussing here.
It takes courage and discipline like the freedom riders and many others of that movement had. They too had different opinions on how to accomplish their goal, and who would be leaders etc.. but they mostly succeeded.

The PTB know if we were unified and displayed our displeasure about the current situation we find ourselves in
shit would really hit the fan, why do you think all the police state laws are being rushed through, and anyone can be labeled a "terrorist" for the most trivial of things we used to take for granted?
A united disgruntled citizenry is a terrifying thought to them.

The civil rights movement is a good example. So many say public financing will never happen, but they said the same thing about integration. NAACP founded 1909, major civil rights acts enacted in the 1960s. Don't give up, even if it takes a while.

This proposed movement, OWS, Tea Party and the likes shouldn't take as long to accomplish as the civil rights movement did, as ALL are being subjected to the current abuses of power and the privileged, not just a small percentage of a minority.
The more of the populace that is effected, the greater the numbers have increased to protest and speak out, and educating others.

 

[konradv]

This proposed movement, OWS, Tea Party and the likes shouldn't take as long to accomplish as the civil rights movement did, as ALL are being subjected to the current abuses of power and the privileged, not just a small percentage of a minority.
The more of the populace that is effected, the greater the numbers have increased to protest and speak out, and educating others.

I hope you're right. I won't live to see it, if it takes as long as civil rights.

 

[Mr. Jones]

This proposed movement, OWS, Tea Party and the likes shouldn't take as long to accomplish as the civil rights movement did, as ALL are being subjected to the current abuses of power and the privileged, not just a small percentage of a minority.
The more of the populace that is effected, the greater the numbers have increased to protest and speak out, and educating others.

I hope you're right. I won't live to see it, if it takes as long as civil rights.

If not in our lifetime due to our age, then for the future of our children and grandchildren and so on.
If you study the process of how we wound up in our current situation and mess, one would see that it was a long and calculated process.

The implementation e.g. of a private central bank in the US did not spring up overnight, indeed it was a plan that was implemented and put into motion by many who did not live to see it finally come to pass in 1913, thus in order to reverse such atrocities like the Fed Reserve, the same mindset of perhaps having to endure a long protracted effort, with the goal in mind to rid ourselves of it, should not deter us, for the sake of our country, and future generations.

Education on this and other topics of importance is vital, and it starts, i.e., with adding or subtracting factual caveats when discussing homework, or what our children are learning in school, and explaining to them from an early age, that everything may not be as it seems, of course backing up the interjections with true facts,
soon we will have a more educated youngster, immersed in factual history, instead of indoctrinated 'bots that simply repeat whatever propaganda is told/taught to them that can be dispelled by the truth.

Imagine a majority of educated people questioning the actions of government, and downright angry at being lied to about many things...a mass movement demanding REAL change would spring forth, and only those that are in step with reality, truth, honesty and their constituents who have these values, would be trusted to hold positions of political office.
If only greed would be demonized on the same level as real constitutional values, fairness, and freedom seem to be today, progress would be made more swiftly.

Judge Napolitano: Final Word on the Last Episode of Freedom Watch [14-Feb-12 © FoxBusiness] - YouTube

 

[Spectre13]

ME, I'd want a new government.

You can get new Congressperson with a little chance of change....

YOU! ARE! STUCK! WITH! NO! CHANCE! IN! HELL!
Getting a new Goverment!

If you're willing to give up, that's you. What's cuckoo about wanting a government that isn't bought by the highest bidder? Got any solutions?

There is a solution. Look at Switzerland's government. It is a direct democracy. There are a lot of things that would cut out a bunch of Congressional bullshit. The people have the authority to overturn anything that is not in the interests of the people and the country. Here is one thing I think would help. Every party gets a shot at governing, so no one is left out. They say it is a thrifty government that has far less corruption and most of the bills passed, benefit everyone. I am not totally schooled but I think several countries have this type of government, including parts of Germany, if I am not mistaken.