YES, America CERTAINLY WAS FOUNDED as a CHRISTIAN NATION...

[Hollie]

I think the better question is:
"Why do some here assume that anyone who doesn't share their particular Christian POV is 'a GOD-hating atheist' or something on that order?

Probably my own personal experience with Hollie has tainted my view. She is a militant, God-hating gay person, raised in a Christian home, and attacks not only Christians, but Muslims, or anyone else who will take the bait and fall prey to her "robot on repeat" arguing technique. Here he/she is posing as a man "Rugged Touch" attacking some Muslims in 2010. This response from Hapless Jackel about sums up my experience with him/her:

"Do you ever answer people's questions? Or is every inquiry just a different type of excuse for you to pour out the freshest batch of excess venom and prejudice? I'm finding it hard to think of a single time when you've ever actually addressed anything I've ever said."

Hapless Jackels - Page 2

I'll take this to mean that your feelings were hurt when you were exposed for your lies.

I'm still waiting for your reference to christianity or the christian gods in the constitution.

 

[logical4u]

Can't you find it?

It is a test of your intelligence, come on, play along.

Are you suggesting a conspiracy theory wherein there is a second constitution that exalts the christian gods?

It is a very simple question. What is the written date on the Constitution? No conspriracy theories, just a straight forward question. For the bold one, you proclaim yourself to be, this should not be hard.

 

[UltimateReality]

Oh, you have done it now, Hollie. logical4u will hunt you to the ends of the earth for telling the truth.

Let em' come looking!


For the benefit of UltimateReality and others, the U.S. certainly was not founded by Christian men on Christian principles.

The United States was founded largely by men called Deists. They believed in a creator (hence the word used in the Declaration of Independence and the US Constitution); but most shunned Christianity. George Washington specifically said "As the Government of the United States of America is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion..." in his treaty with Turkey. The Jefferson letters make it very clear that Thomas Jefferson had a simple belief: The Creator created and that's that. I have on my bookshelf the Jefferson Bible. It ends with Jesus being crucified --- and not rising from the dead.

On bing:

george washington's prayer for america


george washington's prayer


george washington's prayer at valley forge


george washington's prayer journal


george washington's prayer for the nation


george washington's prayer journal christian


george washington's prayer for his country


george washington's prayer before battle


"the Christian religion"? Which one would that be? This country is Christianity based. It is not organized on any particular "Christian" faith. Be smarter than the muslims, will you?

Thomas Jefferson’s
Prayer for The Nation
Almighty God, Who has given us this good land for our
heritage; We humbly beseech Thee that we may always prove
ourselves a people mindful of Thy favor and glad to do Thy
will. Bless our land with honorable ministry, sound learning,
and pure manners. Save us from violence, discord, and
confusion, from pride and arrogance, and from every evil way.
Defend our liberties, and fashion into one united people, the
multitude brought hither out of many kindreds and tongues.
Endow with Thy spirit of wisdom those whom in Thy name we
entrust the authority of government, that there may be justice
and peace at home, and that through obedience to Thy law, we
may show forth Thy praise among the nations of the earth. In
time of prosperity fill our hearts with thankfulness, and in the
day of trouble, suffer not our trust in Thee to fail; all of which
we ask through Jesus Christ our Lord. Amen.
President Thomas Jefferson
Washington D.C.
March 4, 1801
http://www.prayercaucus.org/files/p...s_Thomas_Jeffersons_Prayer_for_The_Nation.pdf

Now what was that you were saying about Jefferson?

Out of compassion I implore not to engage Hollie. She will ignore every relevant post you take the time to author, and will never address any point you make, instead, using the diversionary technique of tangential distraction. She will try your patience and lure you into acting unbecomingly. He/she feeds on this, and to give in is to encourage him/her. He/she is not interested in the truth of any kind, but spews vitriol like water.

You will immediately notice this thread go from a few post an hour, to a few pages a minute as she hammers away. He/she is a very disturbed human being.

 

[Hollie]

It is a test of your intelligence, come on, play along.

Are you suggesting a conspiracy theory wherein there is a second constitution that exalts the christian gods?

It is a very simple question. What is the written date on the Constitution? No conspriracy theories, just a straight forward question. For the bold one, you proclaim yourself to be, this should not be hard.

Why are you having such difficulty finding a reference to christianity in the constitution if, as you claim, the U.S. was founded on christian principles?

 

[Hollie]

Let em' come looking!


For the benefit of UltimateReality and others, the U.S. certainly was not founded by Christian men on Christian principles.

The United States was founded largely by men called Deists. They believed in a creator (hence the word used in the Declaration of Independence and the US Constitution); but most shunned Christianity. George Washington specifically said "As the Government of the United States of America is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion..." in his treaty with Turkey. The Jefferson letters make it very clear that Thomas Jefferson had a simple belief: The Creator created and that's that. I have on my bookshelf the Jefferson Bible. It ends with Jesus being crucified --- and not rising from the dead.

On bing:

george washington's prayer for america


george washington's prayer


george washington's prayer at valley forge


george washington's prayer journal


george washington's prayer for the nation


george washington's prayer journal christian


george washington's prayer for his country


george washington's prayer before battle


"the Christian religion"? Which one would that be? This country is Christianity based. It is not organized on any particular "Christian" faith. Be smarter than the muslims, will you?

Thomas Jefferson’s
Prayer for The Nation
Almighty God, Who has given us this good land for our
heritage; We humbly beseech Thee that we may always prove
ourselves a people mindful of Thy favor and glad to do Thy
will. Bless our land with honorable ministry, sound learning,
and pure manners. Save us from violence, discord, and
confusion, from pride and arrogance, and from every evil way.
Defend our liberties, and fashion into one united people, the
multitude brought hither out of many kindreds and tongues.
Endow with Thy spirit of wisdom those whom in Thy name we
entrust the authority of government, that there may be justice
and peace at home, and that through obedience to Thy law, we
may show forth Thy praise among the nations of the earth. In
time of prosperity fill our hearts with thankfulness, and in the
day of trouble, suffer not our trust in Thee to fail; all of which
we ask through Jesus Christ our Lord. Amen.
President Thomas Jefferson
Washington D.C.
March 4, 1801
http://www.prayercaucus.org/files/p...s_Thomas_Jeffersons_Prayer_for_The_Nation.pdf

Now what was that you were saying about Jefferson?

Out of compassion I implore not to engage Hollie. She will ignore every relevant post you take the time to author, and will never address any point you make, instead, using the diversionary technique of tangential distraction. She will try your patience and lure you into acting unbecomingly. He/she feeds on this, and to give in is to encourage him/her. He/she is not interested in the truth of any kind, but spews vitriol like water.

And still no reference to christianity or the christian gods in the constitution.

Why are you ignoring relevant posts? Are you not interested in the truth?

 

[NYcarbineer]

This might clear up some of the nonsense here:

Faux historian David Barton exposed as a fraud - National Humanist | Examiner.com

Faux historian and Christian extremist David Barton has been exposed as a fraud and a con man pushing a false narrative of American history to gullible Christians willing to sacrifice truth for a false history that promotes Christianity at the expense of historical reality.

Christian publisher Thomas Nelson is ending the publication and distribution of Barton’s recent bestseller, “The Jefferson Lies: Exposing the Myths You've Always Believed About Thomas Jefferson.” The book is being pulled because of gross historical inaccuracies and outright fabrications.

 

[logical4u]

Are you suggesting a conspiracy theory wherein there is a second constitution that exalts the christian gods?

It is a very simple question. What is the written date on the Constitution? No conspriracy theories, just a straight forward question. For the bold one, you proclaim yourself to be, this should not be hard.

Why are you having such difficulty finding a reference to christianity in the constitution if, as you claim, the U.S. was founded on christian principles?

Your answer is in the date of the Constitution.

 

[UltimateReality]

This is an incredibly ignorant statement. Shall we take the Constitution as a document existing in and of itself, with no authors, no history, and no other works from that period? I would hope that folks here on this thread would not be so gullible to your Christian-hating, twisted, atheistic version of the truth, but it looks like JakeStarkey has already succumbed. The mistaken belief it is a "living" document has already been used to bastardize it and shred an Christ inspired truth that once existed in it.

Hollie, why do you hate God so much?

You're hoping to dodge the issue of your lies.

Please find a single reference to Christianity or the Christian gods in the constitution.

What is the "written" date on the Constitution?

She will never answer the real pertinent questions. Her technique is to keep you trapped in her thought line without deviation. For to deviate, she would have to address the real outlying issues. This question is not rhetorical to her, but will not be answered in the next 10 pages of hate.

She will get you to admit God is not mentioned in the Constitution (He isn't) and claim a very childish viewpoint of victory.

So Hollie/Rugged Touch, here is my answer. God is not mentioned in the Constitution. So now do me the favor of answering my question:

Shall we take the Constitution as a document existing in and of itself, with no authors, no history, and no other works from that period? The body of evidence from the time is overwhelming that the inspiration for the Constitution was very much Christianity, with the caveat that no one denomination be forced on the public as it was in England.

 

[bodecea]

This is an incredibly ignorant statement. Shall we take the Constitution as a document existing in and of itself, with no authors, no history, and no other works from that period? I would hope that folks here on this thread would not be so gullible to your Christian-hating, twisted, atheistic version of the truth, but it looks like JakeStarkey has already succumbed. The mistaken belief it is a "living" document has already been used to bastardize it and shred an Christ inspired truth that once existed in it.

Hollie, why do you hate God so much?

You're hoping to dodge the issue of your lies.

Please find a single reference to Christianity or the Christian gods in the constitution.

What is the "written" date on the Constitution?

The date that was LEGALLY required to make something a LEGAL document thru out the Western world at that time.

But please....do tell us that our Nation is a Christian nation because it has "Year of Our Lord"...which is merely the translation of Anno Domino......

So...any history book with AD in it is a christian book, eh?

 

[logical4u]

You're hoping to dodge the issue of your lies.

Please find a single reference to Christianity or the Christian gods in the constitution.

What is the "written" date on the Constitution?

She will never answer the real pertinent questions. Her technique is to keep you trapped in her thought line without deviation. For to deviate, she would have to address the real outlying issues. This question is not rhetorical to her, but will not be answered in the next 10 pages of hate.

She will get you to admit God is not mentioned in the Constitution (He isn't) and claim a very childish viewpoint of victory.

So Hollie/Rugged Touch, here is my answer. God is not mentioned in the Constitution. So now do me the favor of answering my question:

Shall we take the Constitution as a document existing in and of itself, with no authors, no history, and no other works from that period? The body of evidence from the time is overwhelming that the inspiration for the Constitution was very much Christianity, with the caveat that no one denomination be forced on the public as it was in England.

The Lord is mentioned in the Constitution. Look at the line for the date.

 

[UltimateReality]

I think the better question is:
"Why do some here assume that anyone who doesn't share their particular Christian POV is 'a GOD-hating atheist' or something on that order?

Probably my own personal experience with Hollie has tainted my view. She is a militant, God-hating gay person, raised in a Christian home, and attacks not only Christians, but Muslims, or anyone else who will take the bait and fall prey to her "robot on repeat" arguing technique. Here he/she is posing as a man "Rugged Touch" attacking some Muslims in 2010. This response from Hapless Jackel about sums up my experience with him/her:

"Do you ever answer people's questions? Or is every inquiry just a different type of excuse for you to pour out the freshest batch of excess venom and prejudice? I'm finding it hard to think of a single time when you've ever actually addressed anything I've ever said."

Hapless Jackels - Page 2

I'll take this to mean that your feelings were hurt when you were exposed for your lies.

I'm still waiting for your reference to christianity or the christian gods in the constitution.

Let everyone witness this. Hollie never addresses her lies, which the link obviously points out, but refers to my lies??? She is using her typical distraction technique to take the focus off HER agenda and misrepresentations on this and other forums. She is not interested in the healthy exchange of viewpoints. She is a troll and feeds on controversy and hatred.

 

[Hollie]

It is a very simple question. What is the written date on the Constitution? No conspriracy theories, just a straight forward question. For the bold one, you proclaim yourself to be, this should not be hard.

Why are you having such difficulty finding a reference to christianity in the constitution if, as you claim, the U.S. was founded on christian principles?

Your answer is in the date of the Constitution.

False. Conspiracy theories will not save your failed argument.

 

[bodecea]

You're hoping to dodge the issue of your lies.

Please find a single reference to Christianity or the Christian gods in the constitution.

What is the "written" date on the Constitution?

She will never answer the real pertinent questions. Her technique is to keep you trapped in her thought line without deviation. For to deviate, she would have to address the real outlying issues. This question is not rhetorical to her, but will not be answered in the next 10 pages of hate.

She will get you to admit God is not mentioned in the Constitution (He isn't) and claim a very childish viewpoint of victory.

So Hollie/Rugged Touch, here is my answer. God is not mentioned in the Constitution. So now do me the favor of answering my question:

Shall we take the Constitution as a document existing in and of itself, with no authors, no history, and no other works from that period? The body of evidence from the time is overwhelming that the inspiration for the Constitution was very much Christianity, with the caveat that no one denomination be forced on the public as it was in England.

#1...the inspiration of the Constitution was the Enlightenment, the Athenian Democracy and the Roman Republic.

#2..."caveat that no one denomination".....you mean, other religions besides christianity can be forced out? That's what our Founders intended?

 

[Hollie]

Probably my own personal experience with Hollie has tainted my view. She is a militant, God-hating gay person, raised in a Christian home, and attacks not only Christians, but Muslims, or anyone else who will take the bait and fall prey to her "robot on repeat" arguing technique. Here he/she is posing as a man "Rugged Touch" attacking some Muslims in 2010. This response from Hapless Jackel about sums up my experience with him/her:

"Do you ever answer people's questions? Or is every inquiry just a different type of excuse for you to pour out the freshest batch of excess venom and prejudice? I'm finding it hard to think of a single time when you've ever actually addressed anything I've ever said."

Hapless Jackels - Page 2

I'll take this to mean that your feelings were hurt when you were exposed for your lies.

I'm still waiting for your reference to christianity or the christian gods in the constitution.

Let everyone witness this. Hollie never addresses her lies, but using her distraction technique to take the focus off HER agenda and misrepresentations on this and other forums. She is not interested in the healthy exchange of viewpoints. She is a troll and feeds on controversy and hatred.

My goodness. Aren't you the angry little boy.

And still no reference to christianity or the christian gods in the constitution. You were exposed for lies and now you're upset and lashing out.

Have you learned a valuable lesson in this?

 

[UltimateReality]

Are you suggesting a conspiracy theory wherein there is a second constitution that exalts the christian gods?

It is a very simple question. What is the written date on the Constitution? No conspriracy theories, just a straight forward question. For the bold one, you proclaim yourself to be, this should not be hard.

Why are you having such difficulty finding a reference to christianity in the constitution if, as you claim, the U.S. was founded on christian principles?

Does being founded on Christian principles require it to specifically cite the source of those principles? You logic is incredibly flawed.

 

[bodecea]

It is a very simple question. What is the written date on the Constitution? No conspriracy theories, just a straight forward question. For the bold one, you proclaim yourself to be, this should not be hard.

Why are you having such difficulty finding a reference to christianity in the constitution if, as you claim, the U.S. was founded on christian principles?

Your answer is in the date of the Constitution.

So, all documents with "Year of our lord" or "Anno Domino" or "AD" in them are christian documents.....?

 

[logical4u]

You're hoping to dodge the issue of your lies.

Please find a single reference to Christianity or the Christian gods in the constitution.

What is the "written" date on the Constitution?

The date that was LEGALLY required to make something a LEGAL document thru out the Western world at that time.

But please....do tell us that our Nation is a Christian nation because it has "Year of Our Lord"...which is merely the translation of Anno Domino......

So...any history book with AD in it is a christian book, eh?

The question was for "a single reference" to Christianity or the the Christian Lord. It is there.

BTW, the founders were very educated people. Most knew more than one language and knew of other cultures and calendars. If they wanted to make the country more "American" they could have used the Aztec calendar. If they wanted the world to know how influencial Rome was, they could have used a Roman calendar (and declared that the citizens "worship" the new emperor). They would have been aware of the Arabian calendar, and could have chosen that. They did not. They chose the calendar that European Christians (and the gov't officials educated by the churches) used.

 

[bodecea]

It is a very simple question. What is the written date on the Constitution? No conspriracy theories, just a straight forward question. For the bold one, you proclaim yourself to be, this should not be hard.

Why are you having such difficulty finding a reference to christianity in the constitution if, as you claim, the U.S. was founded on christian principles?

Does being founded on Christian principles require it to specifically cite the source of those principles? You logic is incredibly flawed.

What are the christian principles in our Constitution...in our form of government? Should be easy to provide, since we are allegedly based on them.

 

[logical4u]

Why are you having such difficulty finding a reference to christianity in the constitution if, as you claim, the U.S. was founded on christian principles?

Your answer is in the date of the Constitution.

False. Conspiracy theories will not save your failed argument.

It is not "false". You wanted a reference, you got one, and now you are going to pretend it isn't so. It appears you are being "false".

 

[Hollie]

What is the "written" date on the Constitution?

She will never answer the real pertinent questions. Her technique is to keep you trapped in her thought line without deviation. For to deviate, she would have to address the real outlying issues. This question is not rhetorical to her, but will not be answered in the next 10 pages of hate.

She will get you to admit God is not mentioned in the Constitution (He isn't) and claim a very childish viewpoint of victory.

So Hollie/Rugged Touch, here is my answer. God is not mentioned in the Constitution. So now do me the favor of answering my question:

Shall we take the Constitution as a document existing in and of itself, with no authors, no history, and no other works from that period? The body of evidence from the time is overwhelming that the inspiration for the Constitution was very much Christianity, with the caveat that no one denomination be forced on the public as it was in England.

#1...the inspiration of the Constitution was the Enlightenment, the Athenian Democracy and the Roman Republic.

#2..."caveat that no one denomination".....you mean, other religions besides christianity can be forced out? That's what our Founders intended?

Good observations.

The US Constitution, quite literally and plainly (by choice of the FF's), leaves out any mentioning of gods and such (and it is this obvious deletion that caused the Danbury Baptists to argue in favor of incorporating some mention of the Christian god in the document that would define the nation's fundamental laws). The colonies of the time were conclaves of religious intolerance, wherein a Baptist in one colony was safe, but a Roman Catholic was a criminal by defintion, yet in a different colony the reverse was true. This is completely unworkable and the FF's knew it.

Note that the separation of state and church did not mean ignoring the church or faith. It means the state cannot legislate religious belief upon the populace -- and by defintion the only way to acheive that is for the state to be neutral on all matters of religion.