Withdrawal Time Tables, That Will Encourage the Terrorists

[sealybobo]

The Republican Plan For 2008 Begins Today
Published on Tuesday, May 29, 2007

ThomHartmann.com - The Republican Plan For 2008 Begins Today

The political calculus being pursued by Karl Rove and the Republican Party with regard to Iraq and the 2008 elections is a simple four-step process:

1. Shift “ownership” of the downside of the “war” and occupation of Iraq to the Democrats.

2. Begin to wind down American involvement in the occupation of Iraq no later than mid-2008.

3. “Claim victory and get out” of direct combat in Iraq by the early fall of 2008.

4. Win big in the 2008 elections by having “won” a “war.”

 

[RetiredGySgt]

I was a part of that history. 70-71

The NVA united the country when they toppled the American puppet government of the South.

The North and South was an artificial division created by the Western colonial powers.

Now Vietnam is a single country and the people finally are able to chart and choose their own destany without foriegn interferance.

Ya that would be why so many died leaving after the North one. In sinking boats and across the killing fields of Cambodia. Cause they were all happy that the "fake" Government was overthrown. That also would be why the out numbered, out gunned 11 Divisions of the South Vietnamese Army fought for over 30 days against that invading army.

That would be why in 72 when they lost some land to North Vietnam they were so busy trying to recapture it right up to the invasion of the North.

My Dad fought there too . He went twice, nearly dieing the second time. He remained in the army to retirement but eventually that old wound lead to his death. Cost him both his legs before he died.

 

[dilloduck]

Don't talk down to me, I don't think your qualified. You have no idea what I want to see take place because you don't know shit about me and you aren't going to tell me much I don't already know about Iraq. If I get brazen you'll be the first to know. I don't give out shit and I don't take it so find some other target for your smartass comments.

If you want to discuss timetables fine but if you want to impress your audience practice on someone else because that shit bores the hell out of me.

For your information I had a son in Iraq not too long ago and I know EXACTLY what the conditions are on the ground.

How you managed to make the above quote into an insult on my knowledge about Iraq is beyond me.

I would think that uindertanding the conditions on the ground would require a bit more information than the perception of one soldier. You wanna try discussing timetables again ?

 

[stivex]

I can't believe some of the crap I am hearing. Who actually believes that we never planned to leave Iraq? Our plan all along was to set up a democracy in Iraq. After doing that was to make them self-sufficient, not a territory of the US. Once they are able to handle their own security, we will leave (although leaving some troops is always a possibility as we NEVER leave a place we go to, i.e. Germany, Japan, Korea, Bosnia, Kosovo, etc.).

The problem with setting timetables has been to officially announce when we were leaving, so the terrorists could sit back and wait for that time and attack to topple the government. Well, once they are able to deal with such a problem (themselves), we can back off and let them handle it. This means they need their military, police forces, infrastructure, government, etc.to be able to handle adversity. T

he vast majority of combat missions in Iraq have been under Iraqi control for some time now. Their own forces are getting experienced and trained very quickly. Want more information on what is really going on? Go to centcom.mil and read the news. Sign up for the newsletter like me if you like. I am not going to babysit you.

Anyway, if we are able to pull our troops out, that is a good thing. Who doesn't want our troops out? The problem is leaving before the job is done. If the job can be done on a timetable, that is good. That wouldn't have been possible before the surge. The country was in chaos, and our presence was necessary. What is important is that Iraq remains stable after we leave. The current discussion is to have troops out in 2012. That means 4 more years. I can see that as a possibility. Obama's 16 months proposal, is just political silliness.

The problem with the Dems' previous proposals and political stunts to defund the troops is it leaves Iraq to fail/fall. Then, they can blame Bush and Republicans and use that politically to win various seats, to include the presidency. Playing politics with the lives of our soldiers makes me ill. Some of us aren't so blind by unconceivable dreams of world peace to see the reality of things. Some of us who have spent time in the military (US Army, 1996 - 2005) have seen a few things in this world so vile that hippies would turn violent over.

 

[sealybobo]

Ohh look, Col Mustard has returned and is at his usual moronic claims again. He insisted we would never be at a point where we could even consider leaving and demanded we abandon them , cut and run. Now he is whining cause we have reached a point where we can talk about no more US daily security.

Must suck to be on the shitty end of that stick Col Mustard. Seen Commander Dumb shit around, he too insisted we would never be at this point.

The Republican Plan For 2008 Begins Today
Published on Tuesday, May 29, 2007 by CommonDreams.org

The political calculus being pursued by Karl Rove and the Republican Party with regard to Iraq and the 2008 elections is a simple four-step process:

1. Shift “ownership” of the downside of the “war” and occupation of Iraq to the Democrats.

2. Begin to wind down American involvement in the occupation of Iraq no later than mid-2008.

3. “Claim victory and get out” of direct combat in Iraq by the early fall of 2008.

4. Win big in the 2008 elections by having “won” a “war.”

Bush is using the Democrats plan as his own!!!

The Surge didn't work. Paying the terrorists millions of dollars worked. And promising to leave worked.

Now Bush is trying to get Al Malaki to sign an agreement that would keep us there past January 2009.

Ultimately either one of two things will happen. We will either bankrupt ourselves trying to control Iraq, or we will give up and Sadr will rule Iraq and Iraq will become great friends and neighbors with Iran.

Even if we do stay, we can't stop the latter from happening. What did we actually win?

How much has gas gone down since we won?

How much do we pay each month for this level of victory?

Why does Iraq have $90 billion in surplus but we are going broke paying for reconstuction?

How much has Blackwater & Haloburton & Exxon made in Iraq so far?

How is political reconciliation going?

Are we now going to have a problem with the Kurds and/or the Sunni's? Eventually? Do you even know schmuck?

 

[AllieBaba]

You're just too much of an idiot to reason with.

 

[AllieBaba]

There is something very funky going on with this site....

 

[AllieBaba]

Ok, I don't know what's going on.

My post was in response to bobo's latest rant, and at first it didn't post at all, then it triple posted. So I deleted two of them, and now it's in the middle of the thread, on page one.....

And I still have a notice that I have 4 new reputation comments, which has been there all afternoon.

I'm having trouble posting, getting weird messages, and when I don't, my post doesn't show up until later, when it's injected in the middle of earlier posts.

What the heck?

 

[AllieBaba]

Ok, I don't know what's going on.

My post was in response to bobo's latest rant, and at first it didn't post at all, then it triple posted. So I deleted two of them, and now it's in the middle of the thread, on page one.....

And I still have a notice that I have 4 new reputation comments, which has been there all afternoon.

I'm having trouble posting, getting weird messages, and when I don't, my post doesn't show up until later, when it's injected in the middle of earlier posts.

What the heck?

And crap, it happened again..why aren't these posts going on the end of the thread, instead of being plunked in the middle?

 

[AllieBaba]

Really? Point out the lie, and explain who the silver spooners are. Then tell us how much you make a year, and the circumstances of your upbringing.

 

[Red Dawn]

This thread is some of the worst conservative spin ever.

It was mere weeks ago, that NeoCons and Bush voters we're telling us that we couldn't publically give a withdrawl target date.

Because once that date became public knowlege, the insurgents would just lay low and wait us out. Jesus, I spent years having NeoCons tell me that insurgent would just lay low, if we ever gave them a target date for withdrawawl. Why did that talking point get abandoned, just in the last 30 days for some strange reason?

Were you Neocons lying before? Or, did you just have to flip flop, to match the latest GOP talking points?

 

[sealybobo]

Don't talk down to me, I don't think your qualified. You have no idea what I want to see take place because you don't know shit about me and you aren't going to tell me much I don't already know about Iraq. If I get brazen you'll be the first to know. I don't give out shit and I don't take it so find some other target for your smartass comments.

If you want to discuss timetables fine but if you want to impress your audience practice on someone else because that shit bores the hell out of me.

For your information I had a son in Iraq not too long ago and I know EXACTLY what the conditions are on the ground.

How you managed to make the above quote into an insult on my knowledge about Iraq is beyond me.

You're son being in iraq doesn't mean you know the politics that are going on just like you only listening to the corporate media doesn't mean you do either.

You and your son only know what they want you to know.

The guys stationed in the green zone might have a different reality from the guy in the hotzone. Or you might hear different stories from sunni's than you would if you talked to a shiite.

Listen to rachel maddow. I think she just got a show on msnbc too. she tells you what the mainstream doesn't. the politics in iraq are amazing. if you knew the facts, you'd know this is all about oil, and what we are doing is going to divide the country in 3, and that means the sunni's are going to get screwed out of oil revenues and that is going to create future terrorists! All we are doing is raping that countries resources. A small few iraqi's will help us do it and get rich, and the american and iraqi middle classes will pay the way.

its hard to not talk down to you when you don't know what you are talking about.

I hope your son is safe. I hope no future president sends another troop into harms way over money. We were getting food for oil CHEAP before we invaded iraq. But invading allowed bush and his buddies to rape the treasury.

gop proved gov. doesn't work by breaking it.

 

[rayboyusmc]

Who actually believes that we never planned to leave Iraq?

The people who started this war believed that. Here we have the perfect opportunity to produce a pure supply side society. Create a democracy was never part of the plan until it fit the spin later.

NeoCon don't have the Midas touch, they have the "turn it to turds" touch.

 

[Article 15]

Maliki sides with the terrorist ...

Iraqi leader insists on deadline for troop pullout - Yahoo! News

 

[stivex]

The people who started this war believed that. Here we have the perfect opportunity to produce a pure supply side society. Create a democracy was never part of the plan until it fit the spin later.

NeoCon don't have the Midas touch, they have the "turn it to turds" touch.

You seriously believe that? Do you think we intended on making Iraq a US territory? Are we a conquering empire now? Even you you are a partisan hack, you have to acknowledge that we want to leave Iraq. The difference is what condition do we want to leave Iraq in when we leave.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

You seriously believe that? Do you think we intended on making Iraq a US territory? Are we a conquering empire now? Even you you are a partisan hack, you have to acknowledge that we want to leave Iraq. The difference is what condition do we want to leave Iraq in when we leave.

You will find Col Mustard is more interested in make democrats and liberals look good. The country, the troops, be damned, Bush can not get credit for anything and a lose in Iraq would have seen to that. Now that that is not going to happen they are in spin mode to twist what ever they can out.

 

[Red Dawn]

You seriously believe that? Do you think we intended on making Iraq a US territory? Are we a conquering empire now? snip

Anyone who is informed, and doesn't rely on Matt Drudge and Sean Hannity for news, knows exactly why we invaded iraq. Its a historical, documented fact that we wanted to establish a pro-american, client state. One that would privatize their oil resources, and be a pro-american free market economy.

That's why the hapless BushCo thought they could put Ahmed Chalabi in charge of iraq.

 

[Gunny]

Anyone who is informed, and doesn't rely on Matt Drudge and Sean Hannity for news, knows exactly why we invaded iraq. Its a historical, documented fact that we wanted to establish a pro-american, client state. One that would privatize their oil resources, and be a pro-american free market economy.

That's why the hapless BushCo thought they could put Ahmed Chalabi in charge of iraq.

Pure conjecture on your part. Your "historical, documented facts" don't exist.

Guess what the most under-reported story of the past 8 years is? All of you loudmouthed leftwingnuts and your high drama completely drowning out the fact the withdrawal timetables have been started under the CURRENT administration.

That rug was stolen completely out from under Obama's, Reid's and Pelosi's feet.

That won't stop y'all from claiming the whole thing if Obama is elected since the withdrawlas will be scheduled during the next Presidential term.

Intellectually dishonest to a fault, the lot of you.