Which 'Rights' would you remove?

[DKSuddeth]

Originally posted by -=d=-
Here's you taking a very small thing I wrote, and making it inclusive of MUCH LARGER things. I listed three rights I would change...you are now implying I advocate 'removing ALL rights'.

Weirdo.

fine, you big dork :

I have never seen proof that ANYONE i've encountered online has been negatively affected by things like The Patriot Act, etc.

and therefore it must not exist?

 

[dmp]

Originally posted by DKSuddeth
and therefore it must not exist?

Yeah. Pretty much. I'd like to meet somebody who was 'violated' in such a way that wasn't inline with prudent actions taken on reasonable suspicion by our gov't.

Just one.

 

[freeandfun1]

Originally posted by DKSuddeth
and when its happened, did we not later find that it was often times a grievous act but still refuse to learn from it?

i'm not talking about internments, etc.

Was rationing during WWII legal? Did that not infringe upon our rights? What about blackouts? What if somebody didn't want to turn off their lights while German subs were off the east coast? I mean, my right to light is more important than safety. Or how about the draft? Is that constitutional? (NewGuy thinks not).

During the Civil War people were prevented from traveling into certain areas. What about their rights to go where they want?

I am trying to point out that throughout history we have had some rights infringed upon for the good of the nation. I would not recommend it today though, as I feel most Americans (believe it or not, I am not worried about the politicos as much as I am the masses) are willing to put up with the inconvenience even if it does mean the loss of more American lives. We are such a selfish nation these days.

 

[NewGuy]

I'd like to meet somebody who was 'violated' in such a way that wasn't inline with prudent actions taken on reasonable suspicion by our gov't.

Just one.

Translation:

We can suspend our Constitution whenever we like if the cause is good. -Based on merely "SUSPICION".

That, my friend, is wrong, illegal, immoral, and unethical.

-AND UNCONSTITUTIONAL

 

[NATO AIR]

i don't trust the gov't, whether its a democratic one or a GOP one...

my bad about the fully free society comment... a free society? better?

what about those environmental, anti-war and social protesters who were prevented from flying by TSA no-fly lists?

 

[dmp]

Originally posted by NewGuy
Translation:

We can suspend our Constitution whenever we like if the cause is good. -Based on merely "SUSPICION".

That, my friend, is wrong, illegal, immoral, and unethical.

-AND UNCONSTITUTIONAL

Frankly, you are mistaken. It's none of those things. By your definition, ANY person arrested on reasonable suspicion is being held in violation of the Constitution.

I know you are smart - but I'd bet there are smarter guys out there who would have made the case long before you or I were even born.

 

[DKSuddeth]

Most of us would like to think that the constitution is not a suicide pact, but if we can allow the constitution to be suspended and hand over liberty, freedom, and rights to the government so we can feel/be safe from some threat then why bother with a constitution?

 

[NewGuy]

Originally posted by -=d=-
Frankly, you are mistaken. It's none of those things. By your definition, ANY person arrested on reasonable suspicion is being held in violation of the Constitution.

I know you are smart - but I'd bet there are smarter guys out there who would have made the case long before you or I were even born.

Prove the Constitution may be suspended.

-UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES.

You can't.

I don't care who made what case. Law is Law.

 

[dmp]

Originally posted by NATO AIR
i don't trust the gov't, whether its a democratic one or a GOP one...

my bad about the fully free society comment... a free society? better?

what about those environmental, anti-war and social protesters who were prevented from flying by TSA no-fly lists?

Society? or Government? If they were prevented from flying, so be it. If they were a threat, screw em. Worst case, they were delayed. Best case, a plane full of ppl were saved.

 

[dmp]

Originally posted by NewGuy
Prove the Constitution may be suspended.

-UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES.

You can't.

I don't care who made what case. Law is Law.

Here's what I can do:

Nobody is supsending the constitution. The constitution ALLOWS For the Patriot Act. (Note the period).

Law is law - yup. And since the patriot act is LAW, it's therefore 'legal'. It wasn't made up by a judge...it was passed by CONGRESS - who are LARGER than the constitution.

 

[dmp]

Originally posted by DKSuddeth
Most of us would like to think that the constitution is not a suicide pact, but if we can allow the constitution to be suspended and hand over liberty, freedom, and rights to the government so we can feel/be safe from some threat then why bother with a constitution?

Nobody is supsending the constitution, or invalidating it.

(shrug).

 

[NewGuy]

Originally posted by -=d=-
Here's what I can do:

Nobody is supsending the constitution. The constitution ALLOWS For the Patriot Act. (Note the period).

Law is law - yup. And since the patriot act is LAW, it's therefore 'legal'. It wasn't made up by a judge...it was passed by CONGRESS - who are LARGER than the constitution.

Wrong again.

Article. VI.


This Constitution, and the Laws of the United States which shall be made in Pursuance thereof; and all Treaties made, or which shall be made, under the Authority of the United States, shall be the supreme Law of the Land; and the Judges in every State shall be bound thereby, any Thing in the Constitution or Laws of any State to the Contrary notwithstanding.

The Senators and Representatives before mentioned, and the Members of the several State Legislatures, and all executive and judicial Officers, both of the United States and of the several States, shall be bound by Oath or Affirmation, to support this Constitution;

NOBODY supercedes the Constitution.

 

[dmp]

Originally posted by NewGuy
Wrong again.

Because you say so! right on!

Originally posted by NewGuy

NOBODY supercedes the Constitution.

Any group who can augment, edit, or otherwise Change a policy (the Constitution) is 'greater than' said policy.

 

[NewGuy]

Originally posted by -=d=-
Because you say so! right on!






Any group who can augment, edit, or otherwise Change a policy (the Constitution) is 'greater than' said policy.

Did you even read it?

It states clearly that the body allowed to Amend must stay bowing to the context and authority of the Constitution.

In other words, nothing may contradict, or twist the wording and NOBODY is greater than the document its self.

Read it again and stop filtering.

Put into context with its self.

This is what you would do with scripture.

In so doing, you either:

a: cannot comprehend or accept the fact that as a nation of corruption, the politicians have you fooled.

or

b: truly have not thought this over logically.

I hope it is "b".

You can CHANGE that one.

 

[DKSuddeth]

Originally posted by -=d=-
Nobody is supsending the constitution, or invalidating it.

(shrug).

If you suspend rights, such as habeus corpus ( guaranteed by the constitution I believe) then you are suspending the constitution, at least in part.

 

[dmp]

Originally posted by NewGuy
Did you even read it?

It states clearly that the body allowed to Amend must stay bowing to the context and authority of the Constitution.

In other words, nothing may contradict, or twist the wording and NOBODY is greater than the document its self.

Read it again and stop filtering.

Put into context with its self.

This is what you would do with scripture.

In so doing, you either:

a: cannot comprehend or accept the fact that as a nation of corruption, the politicians have you fooled.

or

b: truly have not thought this over logically.

I hope it is "b".

You can CHANGE that one.

 

[dilloduck]

Originally posted by NewGuy
Did you even read it?

It states clearly that the body allowed to Amend must stay bowing to the context and authority of the Constitution.

In other words, nothing may contradict, or twist the wording and NOBODY is greater than the document its self.

Read it again and stop filtering.

Put into context with its self.

This is what you would do with scripture.

In so doing, you either:

a: cannot comprehend or accept the fact that as a nation of corruption, the politicians have you fooled.

or

b: truly have not thought this over logically.

I hope it is "b".

You can CHANGE that one.

How long has our government been operating unconstitutionally?

 

[NewGuy]

Originally posted by dilloduck
How long has our government been operating unconstitutionally?

I am not the great Oz.

Do some research.

 

[dilloduck]

Originally posted by NewGuy
I am not the great Oz.

Do some research.

Cmon new guy---this is your deal here ! If you wish for people to listen to the constitutional viewpoint I would think you could anwser a simple question.

 

[DKSuddeth]

Originally posted by dilloduck
How long has our government been operating unconstitutionally?

depends, but the first one that started it was Adams 4 I believe. From there, its all depended upon the administration of which the ones that violated it the most tend to end up on the list of best presidents, go figure.