When did Junk Plans become Junk Plans

[ron4342]

They became junk when insurers began cancelling them in droves and the Administration needed a talking point to persuade people Obamacare was actually doing them a favor.
Perhaps a few really stupid ones fell for it.

The ones that are subsidized could care less if others lost their insurance.

I think the ones they consider crap plans are the ones that most doctors would actually accept. Few doctors are willing to accept Obamacare patients because they will only be paid a fraction of what it actually costs to care for the patients.

'Crap plans' paid a big chunk of our medical bills and it was affordable. Obamacare will offer a small payment for medical bills, tell the doctors to eat the rest and it is not affordable to the majority. Less for more money, that's the liberal way.

Obviously you have no clue what you are speaking about. When people go to a doctor's office they are asked to provide identification and their insurance cards. If the person presents a card that only provides junk insurance the doctor's often turn down providing service. I have seen it happen and I have talked to my doctor about junk insurance. They know that the insurance company will not pay the claim and the person requesting service cannot pay for the service. In other words, they know that they will not be paid for their services so they refuse to provide them to avoid the hassle.
Get back to us when you know what a junk policy is.

 

[blackhawk]

If these were junk or sub standard plans simple question why didn't Obama and the Democrats tell the public over and over and over they would be losing their junk/substandard plan and getting a better one in return instead of if you like your plan you can keep it period?

 

[ron4342]

Whenever I see Obama on TV I can't get the theme song of Sanford and Son out of my head.

Whenever I see posts like yours I can't get the thought of Archie Bunker out of my head. What an interesting coincidence. Ya think.......

 

[Listening]

In all the debate over Obamadon'tcare, I don't recall much discussion about "Junk Plans". It was always about "you could keep your insurance if you like it".

Period.

Then our Affirmative Action Non-Hero gets has skinny ass caught in a wringer and all of sudden, these became junk plans.

I am sure there might have been a few statements about this prior to the BIG LIE being exposed, but I don't recall hearing it at all.

If the left can't produce 1000 clips of this, then they have to admit that this is nothing more than a scorched earth effort to divert from the fact that our incompetent president is also an incompetent liar.

ALL OF A SUDDEN THE LEFT BECOMES CONCERNED about our junk plans.

And Ed Shultz has the moxy and the dead brain cells to push this pile of horseshyt.

If you are from the left, don't bother posting about what the plans did and did not cover, that is just more smoke. It really does not matter if you think they are junk or not.

You were pretty quiet on the whole topic prior to the BIG LIE. That is what this is about. Negs to anyone who compares plans.

And maybe I am wrong about this. But I just don't recall seeing it.

All I heard was the may plan (good or bad) and doctor were safe from any issues because of Obamacare.

Let's see it.

Insurance companies have been offering "junk plans" for years. They are nothing new, however the the phrase is used in the trade and so it is unknown in the general population. Junk plans offer little and are basically a scam by the insurance companies. They are great plans if you are not sick or in a serious accident. If you sign up for a junk plan you pay a low premiem but if you have a serious problem you are SHIT OUT OF LUCK.
If you want some insight into junk plans (which I seriously doubt) rent the video "The Rainmaker" with Matt Damon. The story deals with a lawyer who goes after an insurance company that sells junk policies.
The truth of the matter is I do not think you are here to learn anything. You are here to throw mud!

Hello Ronnie,

Did you read the OP. Even though you quoted it, I suspect you didn't really take the time to understand the point.

I understand what you want us to believe.

I paid for a couple of those plans for kids and they were adequately covered for what I wanted to cover them. I did a risk analysis and came up with a scenario I felt good with. Now, I am forced with potentially paying more for coverage I don't want.

You don't get to decide for me. I'll not put anything on you. I can (along with my insurance) cover all potential issues.

But the real issue is that Junk Plans were never spoken of by Obama and team. All you heard was "you can keep it. PERIOD". Recall that ? Not what he meant...what he said. That is what he said.

No talk of junk plans before. Unless I missed them. If you can produce them, I'll be happy to recant...but it better be a lot of clips.

And so you missed the point.

And you've been negged for using this argument.

 

[Listening]

Whenever I see Obama on TV I can't get the theme song of Sanford and Son out of my head.

Whenever I see posts like yours I can't get the thought of Archie Bunker out of my head. What an interesting coincidence. Ya think.......

Produce the clips or go post in the freeway Ronnie.

You are a hack.

Go tell your insurance commissioner (you know, the government) to get rid of junk plans.

But this thread is about our Affirmative Action Moron Liar In Chief. Get over it.

 

[Listening]

They became junk when insurers began cancelling them in droves and the Administration needed a talking point to persuade people Obamacare was actually doing them a favor.
Perhaps a few really stupid ones fell for it.

The ones that are subsidized could care less if others lost their insurance.

I think the ones they consider crap plans are the ones that most doctors would actually accept. Few doctors are willing to accept Obamacare patients because they will only be paid a fraction of what it actually costs to care for the patients.

'Crap plans' paid a big chunk of our medical bills and it was affordable. Obamacare will offer a small payment for medical bills, tell the doctors to eat the rest and it is not affordable to the majority. Less for more money, that's the liberal way.

Obviously you have no clue what you are speaking about. When people go to a doctor's office they are asked to provide identification and their insurance cards. If the person presents a card that only provides junk insurance the doctor's often turn down providing service. I have seen it happen and I have talked to my doctor about junk insurance. They know that the insurance company will not pay the claim and the person requesting service cannot pay for the service. In other words, they know that they will not be paid for their services so they refuse to provide them to avoid the hassle.
Get back to us when you know what a junk policy is.

We know what it is. It's what Obama never mentioned until he got his ass caught in the BIG LIE.

 

[ron4342]

If these were junk or sub standard plans simple question why didn't Obama and the Democrats tell the public over and over and over they would be losing their junk/substandard plan and getting a better one in return instead of if you like your plan you can keep it period?

Probably because they had no idea that so many people had purchased junk plans in the first place. I have seen people at my doctor's office who have been turned away because the office staff knew that the plan they had would not cover the cost of services.

 

[Clementine]

In all the debate over Obamadon'tcare, I don't recall much discussion about "Junk Plans". It was always about "you could keep your insurance if you like it".

Period.

Then our Affirmative Action Non-Hero gets has skinny ass caught in a wringer and all of sudden, these became junk plans.

I am sure there might have been a few statements about this prior to the BIG LIE being exposed, but I don't recall hearing it at all.

If the left can't produce 1000 clips of this, then they have to admit that this is nothing more than a scorched earth effort to divert from the fact that our incompetent president is also an incompetent liar.

ALL OF A SUDDEN THE LEFT BECOMES CONCERNED about our junk plans.

And Ed Shultz has the moxy and the dead brain cells to push this pile of horseshyt.

If you are from the left, don't bother posting about what the plans did and did not cover, that is just more smoke. It really does not matter if you think they are junk or not.

You were pretty quiet on the whole topic prior to the BIG LIE. That is what this is about. Negs to anyone who compares plans.

And maybe I am wrong about this. But I just don't recall seeing it.

All I heard was the may plan (good or bad) and doctor were safe from any issues because of Obamacare.

Let's see it.

I want to know when any plan became anything better than a junk plan. All insurance is junk. You pay the insurance company, they pay the doctor. They're not paying the doctor out of the kindness of their heart. They're in it for profit. That means that, in the long run, you're always paying more than they're paying the doctor. Get rid of Obamacare, and just ban insurance. That way the market can deal with costs the way that markets are meant to deal with them. If the services are too expensive for people to afford, the providers will have to adjust their prices on their own accord if they want to stay in business.

I get your point and I believe the private sector and free market system runs better without government calling the shots.

Health insurance, like auto insurance, was intended to help people in the event of a catastrophic accident or illness. It was government tying it to people's jobs and interfering with what companies had to provide that messed things up. Government wouldn't allow them to compete across state lines and the lack of competition and government control increased prices. Health care suppliers and big pharms also learned to take advantage of insurers by raising their prices. The insurance companies, along with government regulations kept a fountain of money flowing and everyone was ready to grab what they could. Medicare fraud was a huge problem for the last 20 years.

My brother had a lengthy hospital stay due to a serious illness. The final bill was well over 1 million. The amount he was responsible for was around $10,000. Not bad. Without insurance, he would never have been able to pay. The money insurance paid for his hospital stay was waaaay more than he ever paid in.

When government insists that insurance pay for every doctor visit and every pill we take, the costs go up. It would be insane to expect auto insurance to pay for oil changes and other minor things. If the government forced auto insurance companies to follow the same rules they set for health insurers, no one would be able to afford it.

Insurance was a brilliant idea. You make small payments, they invest it along with other payments and make money. Then they are prepared to make a large payout in the event of a serious illness or injury. The amount people paid in would be a small fraction of what the insurance company would pay out.

Leave it to government to get involved and decide that employers must provide it and that insurance must cover damn near everything. Between increased obligations for the insurance companies and no competition, it is any wonder that costs went up?

Yes, they want to make money. It would be downright stupid to start a business that was designed to lose money. It was government run insurance, like Medicare, that caused hikes in medical care and insurance costs because they only paid a small fraction of the bill, leaving other insurance companies to pick up the slack. Hospitals and doctors do need to stay in business, so the cost gets passed on.

Government has a tendency to take a good thing and turn it into a disaster by making volumes of regulations in an effort to micromanage the country.

 

[BobPlumb]

Whenever I see Obama on TV I can't get the theme song of Sanford and Son out of my head.

Whenever I see posts like yours I can't get the thought of Archie Bunker out of my head. What an interesting coincidence. Ya think.......

All in the family was a pretty damn good TV show. Coming from a Meat Head, I will take that as a compliment.

 

[ron4342]

The ones that are subsidized could care less if others lost their insurance.

I think the ones they consider crap plans are the ones that most doctors would actually accept. Few doctors are willing to accept Obamacare patients because they will only be paid a fraction of what it actually costs to care for the patients.

'Crap plans' paid a big chunk of our medical bills and it was affordable. Obamacare will offer a small payment for medical bills, tell the doctors to eat the rest and it is not affordable to the majority. Less for more money, that's the liberal way.

Obviously you have no clue what you are speaking about. When people go to a doctor's office they are asked to provide identification and their insurance cards. If the person presents a card that only provides junk insurance the doctor's often turn down providing service. I have seen it happen and I have talked to my doctor about junk insurance. They know that the insurance company will not pay the claim and the person requesting service cannot pay for the service. In other words, they know that they will not be paid for their services so they refuse to provide them to avoid the hassle.
Get back to us when you know what a junk policy is.

We know what it is. It's what Obama never mentioned until he got his ass caught in the BIG LIE.

If you know what a junk plan is then you know that the plan is pretty much not worth the paper it is printed on. Junk plans are a scam and are NOT intended to provide insurance. They are intended to make money for the insurance company by selling a worthless plan to gullible idiots. The truth of the matter is that it is probably better NOT to have a junk insurance plan. A junk plan gives people a false sense of security. They think they are covered for serious problems but the truth of the matter is that they are not. For example, a junk plan may offer $600 per day for hospital care for a week. It sounds wonderful but the problem is the average cost for one night in the hospital is around $1800 per day. That means that every day they spend in the hospital they will have to pay $1200 out of their pocket. At the end of the week it becomes $1800 out of pocket. It does not take long to build up a huge debt with those types of charges.
The main reason for filing for personal bankrupcy in this country is for medical reasons. That number is around 2,000,000 a year. It would be my guess many of those had the junk policies you are defending.

 

[blackhawk]

If these were junk or sub standard plans simple question why didn't Obama and the Democrats tell the public over and over and over they would be losing their junk/substandard plan and getting a better one in return instead of if you like your plan you can keep it period?

Probably because they had no idea that so many people had purchased junk plans in the first place. I have seen people at my doctor's office who have been turned away because the office staff knew that the plan they had would not cover the cost of services.

Uh huh you going to stick with that story or try and come with a better one? My theory is if they told millions of Americans that the government had decided the plans these people had researched bought and liked were garbage and they were going to cancel them in order to force them into the plans the government thought they needed there is a better than average chance Obamacare would never have been passed. I can't say this is the reason for certain it does however seem more probable than they didn't know how many so called junk plans had been purchased in the first place.

 

[Listening]

Obviously you have no clue what you are speaking about. When people go to a doctor's office they are asked to provide identification and their insurance cards. If the person presents a card that only provides junk insurance the doctor's often turn down providing service. I have seen it happen and I have talked to my doctor about junk insurance. They know that the insurance company will not pay the claim and the person requesting service cannot pay for the service. In other words, they know that they will not be paid for their services so they refuse to provide them to avoid the hassle.
Get back to us when you know what a junk policy is.

We know what it is. It's what Obama never mentioned until he got his ass caught in the BIG LIE.

If you know what a junk plan is then you know that the plan is pretty much not worth the paper it is printed on. Junk plans are a scam and are NOT intended to provide insurance. They are intended to make money for the insurance company by selling a worthless plan to gullible idiots. The truth of the matter is that it is probably better NOT to have a junk insurance plan. A junk plan gives people a false sense of security. They think they are covered for serious problems but the truth of the matter is that they are not. For example, a junk plan may offer $600 per day for hospital care for a week. It sounds wonderful but the problem is the average cost for one night in the hospital is around $1800 per day. That means that every day they spend in the hospital they will have to pay $1200 out of their pocket. At the end of the week it becomes $1800 out of pocket. It does not take long to build up a huge debt with those types of charges.
The main reason for filing for personal bankrupcy in this country is for medical reasons. That number is around 2,000,000 a year. It would be my guess many of those had the junk policies you are defending.

Hello dumbass...nobody is defending the kind of plan you described. Not all the plans they called junk were bad. I had two of them so STFU.

Even then, Huge debt. What a load.

The point is that somehow our Affirmative Action Moron didn't bother to mention this issue.

What he said was.....you can keep your insurance. period.

Are you claiming he knew he was lying when he said it ?

Or was he really that incompetent ?

And guess away. The average level of bankruptcy was below the cost of a mid-sized sedan and was rarely all related to health care costs. People will bail on anything these days (how do you like that one).

 

[ron4342]

Whenever I see Obama on TV I can't get the theme song of Sanford and Son out of my head.

Whenever I see posts like yours I can't get the thought of Archie Bunker out of my head. What an interesting coincidence. Ya think.......

All in the family was a pretty damn good TV show. Coming from a Meat Head, I will take that as a compliment.

I was sure you would be proud to be compared to Archie Bunker. After all, Archie was a racist idiot with low IQ. You seem to fit that pattern perfectly.

 

[Kosh]

If these were junk or sub standard plans simple question why didn't Obama and the Democrats tell the public over and over and over they would be losing their junk/substandard plan and getting a better one in return instead of if you like your plan you can keep it period?

Probably because they had no idea that so many people had purchased junk plans in the first place. I have seen people at my doctor's office who have been turned away because the office staff knew that the plan they had would not cover the cost of services.

Spoken like a true far left elitist.

 

[Listening]

Whenever I see posts like yours I can't get the thought of Archie Bunker out of my head. What an interesting coincidence. Ya think.......

All in the family was a pretty damn good TV show. Coming from a Meat Head, I will take that as a compliment.

I was sure you would be proud to be compared to Archie Bunker. After all, Archie was a racist idiot with low IQ. You seem to fit that pattern perfectly.

Do you have any clips to back up all your ass-talk ? Or are you going to waste our time with your sorry liberal yacking ?

 

[Kosh]

Whenever I see posts like yours I can't get the thought of Archie Bunker out of my head. What an interesting coincidence. Ya think.......

All in the family was a pretty damn good TV show. Coming from a Meat Head, I will take that as a compliment.

I was sure you would be proud to be compared to Archie Bunker. After all, Archie was a racist idiot with low IQ. You seem to fit that pattern perfectly.

Seeing that the far left elites (like you) are more racist than Archie Bunker and have lower IQ's than an ameba, not sure how you can cast any stones.

 

[blackhawk]

My last post for the evening Obama never said if you like your plan you can keep unless it's a junk plan he never said you can keep any plan except a junk plan he said if you like your current plan and doctor you can keep them period. The term junk, garbage, and sub standard plan did not come into play until millions of people got cancellation notices and everybody started asking Obama about the thirty something times he said if you like your plan and doctor you can keep them period. Something else that has been forgotten here was it not HHS and Kathleen Sebelius who rewrote the rules that made it all but impossible for the people to keep those plans?

 

[Londoner]

Junk plans were made possible by a health care industry which invested trillions of dollars into the elections of our politicians. They did this in order to create a state protected monopoly.

This meant that a handful of companies could divide the country into fixed no-compete zones which allowed them to raise rates and decrease services without fear of losing customers.

It also meant they could offer plans with terrible coverage and deductibles people couldn't pay . . . because there were no alternatives being offered by other market competitors (who didn't exist because the existing players divided the country up into fixed markets where many people only had one option).

This was the opposite of what was promised in 1980 when we began deregulating everything. We were told that if we got government out of health care and allowed corporations to make higher profits, than we would see competitive pricing and expanded covered. But we saw the exact opposite. We saw a profusion of junk plans along with an increasing number of good plans that became too expensive for average workers. We saw the kind of price inflation that only occurs with government protected monopolies.

ObamaCare created regulations that targeted junk plans with the hope of replacing them with good plans. The idea was that if enough people joined the state and federal exchanges, the sheer volume would bring the cost curve down so that the corporations could offer better plans at more competitive premiums. Problem is: one of our two political parties is heavily invested in the failure of the exchanges. To the degree that the Republicans can obstruct the exchanges, they can prevent the volume needed by health insurance companies to bring down premiums and offer good policies to those who lost junk policies.

My guess is that the demand for health care is so large, that ObamaCare will slowly spread to the point where it will be hard to take it away. This means that more and more people will be able to trade their junk policy for something much better. However, Republicans are trying awfully hard to prevent this. Their goal is to make sure that the system cannot offer better alternatives to those who lose junk policies. If they succeed, they have a chance at killing ObamaCare and restoring the health care monopoly that funds their elections.

 

[Kosh]

Junk plans were made possible by a health care industry which invested trillions of dollars into the elections of our politicians. They did this in order to create a state protected monopoly.

This meant that a handful of companies could divide the country into fixed no-compete zones which allowed them to raise rates and decrease services without fear of losing customers.

It also meant they could offer plans with terrible coverage and deductibles people couldn't pay . . . because there were no alternatives being offered by other market competitors (who didn't exist because the existing players divided the country up into fixed markets where many people only had one option).

This was the opposite of what was promised in 1980 when we began deregulating everything. We were told that if we got government out of health care and allowed corporations to make higher profits, than we would see competitive pricing and expanded covered. But we saw the exact opposite. We saw a profusion of junk plans along with an increasing number of good plans that became too expensive for average workers. We saw the kind of price inflation that only occurs with government protected monopolies.

ObamaCare created regulations that targeted junk plans with the hope of replacing them with good plans. The idea was that if enough people joined the state and federal exchanges, the sheer volume would bring the cost curve down so that the corporations could offer better plans at more competitive premiums. Problem is: one of our two political parties is heavily invested in the failure of the exchanges. To the degree that the Republicans can obstruct the exchanges, they can prevent the volume needed by health insurance companies to bring down premiums and offer good policies to those who lost junk policies.

My guess is that the demand for health care is so large, that ObamaCare will slowly spread to the point where it will be hard to take it away. This means that more and more people will be able to trade their junk policy for something much better. However, Republicans are trying awfully hard to prevent this. Their goal is to make sure that the system cannot offer better alternatives to those who lose junk policies. If they succeed, they have a chance at killing ObamaCare and restoring the health care monopoly that funds their elections.

Spoken using the far left platitude talking points.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

In all the debate over Obamadon'tcare, I don't recall much discussion about "Junk Plans". It was always about "you could keep your insurance if you like it".

Period.

Then our Affirmative Action Non-Hero gets has skinny ass caught in a wringer and all of sudden, these became junk plans.

I am sure there might have been a few statements about this prior to the BIG LIE being exposed, but I don't recall hearing it at all.

If the left can't produce 1000 clips of this, then they have to admit that this is nothing more than a scorched earth effort to divert from the fact that our incompetent president is also an incompetent liar.

ALL OF A SUDDEN THE LEFT BECOMES CONCERNED about our junk plans.

And Ed Shultz has the moxy and the dead brain cells to push this pile of horseshyt.

If you are from the left, don't bother posting about what the plans did and did not cover, that is just more smoke. It really does not matter if you think they are junk or not.

You were pretty quiet on the whole topic prior to the BIG LIE. That is what this is about. Negs to anyone who compares plans.

And maybe I am wrong about this. But I just don't recall seeing it.

All I heard was the may plan (good or bad) and doctor were safe from any issues because of Obamacare.

Let's see it.

Insurance companies have been offering "junk plans" for years. They are nothing new, however the the phrase is used in the trade and so it is unknown in the general population. Junk plans offer little and are basically a scam by the insurance companies. They are great plans if you are not sick or in a serious accident. If you sign up for a junk plan you pay a low premiem but if you have a serious problem you are SHIT OUT OF LUCK.
If you want some insight into junk plans (which I seriously doubt) rent the video "The Rainmaker" with Matt Damon. The story deals with a lawyer who goes after an insurance company that sells junk policies.
The truth of the matter is I do not think you are here to learn anything. You are here to throw mud!

FYI, The Rainmaker is about a lawyer who who sues an insurance company for not paying an insurance claim. It is a straight up case of insurance fraud, and has less to do with junk plans than the many plans that Obama currently hates for exposing his lies.