What you should know about Islam

[Rigby5]

We will agree to disagree, as strict Islamic nations still do these things in the 21st century and when they went through their own "reform," they ended up with Wahhabism.
The bottom line is the last thing the west needs is the oppression of Islam or the oppression of Marxism. Evil is evil.

Nah, there is no country that routinely cuts off hands, stones adulterers, etc.
And neither Islam nor Marxism has to be oppressive.
When a religion says something like flying kites is a sin, that does not empower a human to punish kite flyers.
And those who do think that, just have it all wrong, and that mistake can be corrected.
And the whole point of Marxism was to end economic oppression, where those with a monopoly made slaves out of everyone who could not afford to build factories.
Both Islam and Marxism are idealist, and the fact some who actually implement them have deliberately gotten it wrong, does not at all mean it has to be done that way or destroyed.

 

[Rigby5]

Well, we can look at many religions and see massive problems.

Ask yourself why the top 34 countries in the world for murder are all Christian countries.

Murder is a symptom of injustice, lack of opportunity, poverty, etc.
A more ethical government is the solution.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Muslim is a culture, tradition, social order, etc., and does not require a belief in a supreme being, just like Judaism.

So the hijackers were Muslims, but atheist Muslims.

Why do atheist Muslims want to kill so many non-Muslims?

What part of their atheist culture, atheist tradition and atheist social order....makes them so violent toward non-atheist (and atheist) non-Muslim cultures, traditions and social orders?

 

[Rigby5]

Yes, they do. Conquest is the reason they're the two biggest religions, and also why Judaism is much smaller these days.

But the fact Judaism is more elitest and does not let the conquered convert, is not an improvement.

 

[surada]

So the hijackers were Muslims, but atheist Muslims.

Why do atheist Muslims want to kill so many non-Muslims?

What part of their atheist culture, atheist tradition and atheist social order....makes them so violent toward non-atheist (and atheist) non-Muslim cultures, traditions and social orders?

Because Osama Bin Laden hated the US and the Saudis.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Because Osama Bin Laden hated the US and the Saudis.

Why would a bunch of atheist Muslims hate the US and the Saudis?

 

[LuckyDuck]

Nah, there is no country that routinely cuts off hands, stones adulterers, etc.
And neither Islam nor Marxism has to be oppressive.
When a religion says something like flying kites is a sin, that does not empower a human to punish kite flyers.
And those who do think that, just have it all wrong, and that mistake can be corrected.
And the whole point of Marxism was to end economic oppression, where those with a monopoly made slaves out of everyone who could not afford to build factories.
Both Islam and Marxism are idealist, and the fact some who actually implement them have deliberately gotten it wrong, does not at all mean it has to be done that way or destroyed.

You might want to check out Saudi Arabia.
As for Marxism....whenever you have a One-Party government (religious, military juntas, et cetera) it ALWAYS leads to authoritarianism, oppression of the public, tyranny and murder. ALWAYS.

 

[surada]

Why would a bunch of atheist Muslims hate the US and the Saudis?

OBL was under the influence of Hassan al Banna and Sayid Qubt which was outlawed in 1970 by King Faisal. Extremely nationalism and hatred for the West.

 

[Rigby5]

So the hijackers were Muslims, but atheist Muslims.

Why do atheist Muslims want to kill so many non-Muslims?

What part of their atheist culture, atheist tradition and atheist social order....makes them so violent toward non-atheist (and atheist) non-Muslim cultures, traditions and social orders?

So you don't think those in the Mideast should be upset or angry that their countries have been taken over and colonized by imperialists?
They should not mind we massacred tens of thousands on the Highway of Death under a negotiated retreat?
They should not mind we took over half of Palestine and gave it to illegal European immigrants?

There has never been any indication any Moslem, atheist or not, have ever wanted to kill anyone.
Those killed by Moslems, seem to be to have been killed only as a very reluctant last resort, after tremendous abuses.

 

[surada]

You might want to check out Saudi Arabia.
As for Marxism....whenever you have a One-Party government (religious, military juntas, et cetera) it ALWAYS leads to authoritarianism, oppression of the public, tyranny and murder. ALWAYS.

They don't stone people in KSA.. You must be confused with some other country.

 

[surada]

So you don't think those in the Mideast should be upset or angry that their countries have been taken over and colonized by imperialists?
They should not mind we massacred tens of thousands on the Highway of Death under a negotiated retreat?
They should not mind we took over half of Palestine and gave it to illegal European immigrants?

There has never been any indication any Moslem, atheist or not, have ever wanted to kill anyone.
Those killed by Moslems, seem to be to have been killed only as a very reluctant last resort, after tremendous abuses.

What are you calling the highway of death?

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

So you don't think those in the Mideast should be upset or angry that their countries have been taken over and colonized by imperialists?
They should not mind we massacred tens of thousands on the Highway of Death under a negotiated retreat?
They should not mind we took over half of Palestine and gave it to illegal European immigrants?

There has never been any indication any Moslem, atheist or not, have ever wanted to kill anyone.
Those killed by Moslems, seem to be to have been killed only as a very reluctant last resort, after tremendous abuses.

So you don't think those in the Mideast should be upset or angry that their countries have been taken over and colonized by imperialists?

Taken over? The Middle East was freed from the Ottoman Empire overa century ago.
WTH are you whining about now?

They should not mind we massacred tens of thousands on the Highway of Death under a negotiated retreat?

Negotiated? Link?

They should not mind we took over half of Palestine and gave it to illegal European immigrants?

Well over half of Palastine was given to create Jordan. Your Arabic math is failing you.

There has never been any indication any Moslem, atheist or not, have ever wanted to kill anyone.

As long as you ignore all that they've killed.

Those killed by Moslems, seem to be to have been killed only as a very reluctant last resort, after tremendous abuses.

What were the abuses at the Boston Marathon, in San Bernadino or at the Pulse nightclub?

 

[Rigby5]

You might want to check out Saudi Arabia.
As for Marxism....whenever you have a One-Party government (religious, military juntas, et cetera) it ALWAYS leads to authoritarianism, oppression of the public, tyranny and murder. ALWAYS.

From what little I know about Saudi Arabia, it seems to have a much less violent system than ours.
Not only only are there fewer criminals per capita, but much less imprisonment, executions, etc.

Marxism most definitely is NOT a One-Party government, and in fact does not specify anything at all about how a country should be run.
The implication of any communal, collective, and cooperative system is that it really has to also be democratic, but parties are irrelevant.
No parties at all would be much better than the corrupt and evil 2 party monopoly we have in the US, and no party really is identical to a one party system.
What is wrong and evil is when any elite party controls who gets to be on the ballot. And the way to do that is to ensure anyone can get on the ballot if they have a petition with at least 0.5%, (or some number), of the electorate.
It is pretty hard for anyone in the US to criticize what anyone else has done, since the US is one of the worst governments in the world. We have the least free political representation, and have the largest % incarcerated in the world. We do not even have universal health care. The US is just plain awful.

 

[surada]

So you don't think those in the Mideast should be upset or angry that their countries have been taken over and colonized by imperialists?

Taken over? The Middle East was freed from the Ottoman Empire overa century ago.
WTH are you whining about now?

They should not mind we massacred tens of thousands on the Highway of Death under a negotiated retreat?

Negotiated? Link?

They should not mind we took over half of Palestine and gave it to illegal European immigrants?

Well over half of Palastine was given to create Jordan. Your Arabic math is failing you.

There has never been any indication any Moslem, atheist or not, have ever wanted to kill anyone.

As long as you ignore all that they've killed.

Those killed by Moslems, seem to be to have been killed only as a very reluctant last resort, after tremendous abuses.

What were the abuses at the Boston Marathon, in San Bernadino or at the Pulse nightclub?

Transjordan always had an Arab Majority and then they had thousands of refugees from Palestine forced on them.

 

[Rigby5]

What are you calling the highway of death?

In general I was disgusted by Desert Storm because Saddam actually politely asked the US ambassador Glasspie for permission to punish Kuwait for stealing oi, but the massacre of the retreating Iraqi forces by the US was really uncalled for. I believe the US use thermobaric weapons, (air/fuel dispersion bomb), which are incredibly barbaric. The US air attack on a negotiated retreat has to be one of the worst war crimes in history. I can't think of any greater duplicity or unnecessary and brutal loss of life. Especially since most of the convoys were civilians attempting to flee the return to power of the evil Emir of Kuwait.

 

[Rigby5]

So you don't think those in the Mideast should be upset or angry that their countries have been taken over and colonized by imperialists?

Taken over? The Middle East was freed from the Ottoman Empire overa century ago.
WTH are you whining about now?

They should not mind we massacred tens of thousands on the Highway of Death under a negotiated retreat?

Negotiated? Link?

They should not mind we took over half of Palestine and gave it to illegal European immigrants?

Well over half of Palastine was given to create Jordan. Your Arabic math is failing you.

There has never been any indication any Moslem, atheist or not, have ever wanted to kill anyone.

As long as you ignore all that they've killed.

Those killed by Moslems, seem to be to have been killed only as a very reluctant last resort, after tremendous abuses.

What were the abuses at the Boston Marathon, in San Bernadino or at the Pulse nightclub?

Wrong.
The forces that the British used to defeat the Ottoman Empire were Arab.
Remember Lawrence of Arabia?

The retreat of Iraqi forces were announced by the media before the massacre, so it is well established it was illegal murder by the US.
{...
The attacks became controversial to outsiders, with some commentators arguing that they represented disproportionate use of force, saying that the Iraqi forces were retreating from Kuwait in compliance with the original UN Resolution 660 of August 2, 1990, and that the column included Kuwaiti hostages[10] and civilian refugees. The refugees were reported to have included women and children family members of pro-Iraqi, PLO-aligned Palestinian militants and Kuwaiti collaborators who had fled shortly before the returning Kuwaiti authorities pressured nearly 200,000 Palestinians to leave Kuwait. Activist and former United States Attorney General Ramsey Clark argued that these attacks violated the Third Geneva Convention, Common Article 3, which outlaws the killing of soldiers who "are out of combat."[11] Clark included it in his 1991 report WAR CRIMES: A Report on United States War Crimes Against Iraq to the Commission of Inquiry for the International War Crimes Tribunal.[12]
...}

Highway of Death - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

You totally do not know anything about the history of Palestine.
Jordan was never part of Palestine.
Palestine was part of Trans Jordan and Jordan was part of Trans Jordan.
Palestine was always west of the Jordan River and Jordan east of the Jordan River.
But in 1920 as the Allies were trying to uphold their promises to liberate Trans Jordan, the natives forced them to divide Trans Jordan into Palestine, where Jewish immigration would be allowed, and Jordan, where no Jewish immigration would be allowed.
If you want to look it up, it is the Treaty of San Remo and the Treaty of Sevres.

And no, there are no Arab Moslem killings that were not essential, in defense, after all else had failed.
You can find aggression by Turks who were not really Moslem but just pretended to convert.
You can find aggression by Moors who were not really Moslem but just pretended to convert.
But not by actual Moslems, who would also have to be Arab to not just be pretending to convert.

The the abuses at the Boston Marathon, in San Bernadino or at the Pulse nightclub were stupid, but more than justified.
The Highway of Death alone was so incredibly evil that it justifies the total destruction of the entire US.
And we can't claim the innocense of civilians because we all know it happened and yet never ever tried to punish the guilty.
We are all complicit.
We paid for the weapons, and we did not properly supervise what the military did with them.

 

[rylah]

Totally wrong.
Mohammad started out being attacked by Meccans, and responded with a very war like doctrine.
He got more peaceful and so did Islam, with age, because we was no longer under attack all the time.

When Islam got more violent was after 1200 or so, the Mongols massacred Baghdad and took over Islam.
The Moghuls took over again about 200 years later, and the Turks took over a couple hundred years after that.
So Mohammad had nothing to do with any of the Islamic violence.

Of course, when Muslims are violent it's "always someone's else fault"...

Sure it can't be that first, he tried to convert them
and got laughed by the literate Meccans.


Now tell us,
did the Mongols write this?

"I will expel the Jews and Christians
from the Arabian Peninsula and
will not leave any but Muslim."

Sahih Muslim 1767a - The Book of Jihad and Expeditions - كتاب الجهاد والسير - Sunnah.com - Sayings and Teachings of Prophet Muhammad (صلى الله عليه و سلم)

Hadith of the Prophet Muhammad (saws) in English and Arabic

sunnah.com

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Transjordan always had an Arab Majority

And they were given over half the mandate.

 

[rylah]

Muslim is a culture, tradition, social order, etc., and does not require a belief in a supreme being, just like Judaism.
What people these days forget, is that at one time government did not provide social services.
That was all the responsibility of religions.
So these older religions have many diverse social functions other than just worshiping a divine being.

Yeah at the end of the day all Abrahamic religions want to be 'like Judaism',
but that's also their fundamental difference, that Judaism is what you've
listed above and it's not a religion, while Islam is.

Know why, simply put there're atheist Jews,
but can there be an atheist Muslim?

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

The US air attack on a negotiated retreat has to be one of the worst war crimes in history.

Who negotiated? Link?