we are not evil for defending the 2nd amendment

[yidnar]

i am seeing a lot of left wing media claiming that people that are against Obama and the left going after the 2nd amendment as not caring about children !! really ??let me tell you something .we are not trying to endanger our children or anyone when we stand up for the 2nd amendment !! yes we care about children !!!! thats why we are against abortion for convenience !! let me ask you leftist this one question why are you afraid of outlawing partial birth abortions ??i'll answer for you ...you are afraid that it would be the 1st step in overthrowing Roe v Wade !! AND IF THAT IS THE REASONS WHY CAN YOU NOT UNDERSTAND WHY WE ARE CONCERNED ABOUT THE GOVERNMENT TAMPERING WITH THE 2ND AMENDMENT !!

 

[yidnar]

I would like to hear a serious debate without name calling and cheap shots .

 

[yidnar]

 

[yidnar]

maybe i shouldn't have put this thread in the clean debate zone ...

 

[Billo_Really]

i am seeing a lot of left wing media claiming that people that are against Obama and the left going after the 2nd amendment as not caring about children !! really ??let me tell you something .we are not trying to endanger our children or anyone when we stand up for the 2nd amendment !! yes we care about children !!!! thats why we are against abortion for convenience !! let me ask you leftist this one question why are you afraid of outlawing partial birth abortions ??i'll answer for you ...you are afraid that it would be the 1st step in overthrowing Roe v Wade !! AND IF THAT IS THE REASONS WHY CAN YOU NOT UNDERSTAND WHY WE ARE CONCERNED ABOUT THE GOVERNMENT TAMPERING WITH THE 2ND AMENDMENT !!

No one is going after the 2nd Amendment. All this hysteria over a mythical issue, is just a distraction from the real problems we need to be addressing. There's nothing wrong with having background checks for people buying guns or laws limiting high-volume clips and assault weapons. That doesn't mean the government is going to come in and take someone's gun away!

The government doesn't care if someone has a gun! If it wants to do something to you, it's gonna do it and there's nothing your gun can do to stop it! If you disagree, I got two words for you............."Ruby Ridge!"

Or I could do it in one word............"Waco!"

As far as the abortion issue, I have no opinion on it one way or the other. I'm not for it, nor am I against it. I'm a guy. I don't have baby's. It's not my dance. It's not part of my life in any way. And it's certainly not a discussion I ever intend to participate in.

 

[sealadaigh]

maybe i shouldn't have put this thread in the clean debate zone ...

maybe you should stop tarring everyone with such a broad brush. all liberals don't think alike on all issues any more than all conservatives do.

 

[Billo_Really]

maybe you should stop tarring everyone with such a broad brush. all liberals don't think alike on all issues any more than all conservatives do.

I'll second that!

Liberals argue with other liberals, more than conservatives argue with other conservatives. But it is nice to see con-on-con crime!

 

[007]

i am seeing a lot of left wing media claiming that people that are against Obama and the left going after the 2nd amendment as not caring about children !! really ??let me tell you something .we are not trying to endanger our children or anyone when we stand up for the 2nd amendment !! yes we care about children !!!! thats why we are against abortion for convenience !! let me ask you leftist this one question why are you afraid of outlawing partial birth abortions ??i'll answer for you ...you are afraid that it would be the 1st step in overthrowing Roe v Wade !! AND IF THAT IS THE REASONS WHY CAN YOU NOT UNDERSTAND WHY WE ARE CONCERNED ABOUT THE GOVERNMENT TAMPERING WITH THE 2ND AMENDMENT !!

No one is going after the 2nd Amendment. All this hysteria over a mythical issue, is just a distraction from the real problems we need to be addressing. There's nothing wrong with having background checks for people buying guns or laws limiting high-volume clips and assault weapons. That doesn't mean the government is going to come in and take someone's gun away!

The government doesn't care if someone has a gun! If it wants to do something to you, it's gonna do it and there's nothing your gun can do to stop it! If you disagree, I got two words for you............."Ruby Ridge!"

Or I could do it in one word............"Waco!"

As far as the abortion issue, I have no opinion on it one way or the other. I'm not for it, nor am I against it. I'm a guy. I don't have baby's. It's not my dance. It's not part of my life in any way. And it's certainly not a discussion I ever intend to participate in.

Yes they are, and don't pretend like they're not. There are millions of people that know fully well what they anti gun lefts intentions are...

Precedent Teaches Us The Left Really Wants ALL Our Guns | CNS News

 

[Billo_Really]

Yes they are, and don't pretend like they're not. There are millions of people that know fully well what they anti gun lefts intentions are...

Precedent Teaches Us The Left Really Wants ALL Our Guns | CNS News

That's just more redneck psycho-babble!

I'm on the left and that's not my intention.

When someone qualify's their position with a statement like, "...doesn't matter what they say...", that should be a red flag! Because if it doesn't matter what "they" say, then what is it, are you reacting to? If you're not going by what someone says, then you're making up what you want them to say.

 

[Noomi]

i am seeing a lot of left wing media claiming that people that are against Obama and the left going after the 2nd amendment as not caring about children !! really ??let me tell you something .we are not trying to endanger our children or anyone when we stand up for the 2nd amendment !! yes we care about children !!!! thats why we are against abortion for convenience !! let me ask you leftist this one question why are you afraid of outlawing partial birth abortions ??i'll answer for you ...you are afraid that it would be the 1st step in overthrowing Roe v Wade !! AND IF THAT IS THE REASONS WHY CAN YOU NOT UNDERSTAND WHY WE ARE CONCERNED ABOUT THE GOVERNMENT TAMPERING WITH THE 2ND AMENDMENT !!

I am amazed. You have managed to segue yourself from gun control to abortion without skipping a beat.

 

[yidnar]

i am seeing a lot of left wing media claiming that people that are against Obama and the left going after the 2nd amendment as not caring about children !! really ??let me tell you something .we are not trying to endanger our children or anyone when we stand up for the 2nd amendment !! yes we care about children !!!! thats why we are against abortion for convenience !! let me ask you leftist this one question why are you afraid of outlawing partial birth abortions ??i'll answer for you ...you are afraid that it would be the 1st step in overthrowing Roe v Wade !! AND IF THAT IS THE REASONS WHY CAN YOU NOT UNDERSTAND WHY WE ARE CONCERNED ABOUT THE GOVERNMENT TAMPERING WITH THE 2ND AMENDMENT !!

No one is going after the 2nd Amendment. All this hysteria over a mythical issue, is just a distraction from the real problems we need to be addressing. There's nothing wrong with having background checks for people buying guns or laws limiting high-volume clips and assault weapons. That doesn't mean the government is going to come in and take someone's gun away!

The government doesn't care if someone has a gun! If it wants to do something to you, it's gonna do it and there's nothing your gun can do to stop it! If you disagree, I got two words for you............."Ruby Ridge!"

Or I could do it in one word............"Waco!"

As far as the abortion issue, I have no opinion on it one way or the other. I'm not for it, nor am I against it. I'm a guy. I don't have baby's. It's not my dance. It's not part of my life in any way. And it's certainly not a discussion I ever intend to participate in.

Yes they are, and don't pretend like they're not. There are millions of people that know fully well what they anti gun lefts intentions are...

Precedent Teaches Us The Left Really Wants ALL Our Guns | CNS News

the NY gov is talking about confiscation !!and the left will say anything to achieve there goals .

 

[yidnar]

i am seeing a lot of left wing media claiming that people that are against Obama and the left going after the 2nd amendment as not caring about children !! really ??let me tell you something .we are not trying to endanger our children or anyone when we stand up for the 2nd amendment !! yes we care about children !!!! thats why we are against abortion for convenience !! let me ask you leftist this one question why are you afraid of outlawing partial birth abortions ??i'll answer for you ...you are afraid that it would be the 1st step in overthrowing Roe v Wade !! AND IF THAT IS THE REASONS WHY CAN YOU NOT UNDERSTAND WHY WE ARE CONCERNED ABOUT THE GOVERNMENT TAMPERING WITH THE 2ND AMENDMENT !!

I am amazed. You have managed to segue yourself from gun control to abortion without skipping a beat.

they tie into the premise of this thread .

 

[JustTheFacts]

i am seeing a lot of left wing media claiming that people that are against Obama and the left going after the 2nd amendment as not caring about children !! really ??let me tell you something .we are not trying to endanger our children or anyone when we stand up for the 2nd amendment !! yes we care about children !!!! thats why we are against abortion for convenience !! let me ask you leftist this one question why are you afraid of outlawing partial birth abortions ??i'll answer for you ...you are afraid that it would be the 1st step in overthrowing Roe v Wade !! AND IF THAT IS THE REASONS WHY CAN YOU NOT UNDERSTAND WHY WE ARE CONCERNED ABOUT THE GOVERNMENT TAMPERING WITH THE 2ND AMENDMENT !!

and likewise those who advocate some sensible gun control are not evil.

Glad to clear that up for you.

 

[yidnar]

i am seeing a lot of left wing media claiming that people that are against Obama and the left going after the 2nd amendment as not caring about children !! really ??let me tell you something .we are not trying to endanger our children or anyone when we stand up for the 2nd amendment !! yes we care about children !!!! thats why we are against abortion for convenience !! let me ask you leftist this one question why are you afraid of outlawing partial birth abortions ??i'll answer for you ...you are afraid that it would be the 1st step in overthrowing Roe v Wade !! AND IF THAT IS THE REASONS WHY CAN YOU NOT UNDERSTAND WHY WE ARE CONCERNED ABOUT THE GOVERNMENT TAMPERING WITH THE 2ND AMENDMENT !!

and likewise those who advocate some sensible gun control are not evil.

Glad to clear that up for you.

the leaders on the left want to disarm Americans !!how can the government control every aspect of our lives with an armed populace ??

 

[Wiseacre]

I would like to hear a serious debate without name calling and cheap shots .

If you want a serious debate then you've gotta start with a serious, unconfrontational OP, which you didn't do. Lose the exclamation points and the caps, tone down the rhetoric and the antagonism, and don't be puting words in someone else's mouth.

Re gun control, we lost 20 little kids last month and some heroic teachers; as a reasonable society we oughta be able to talk about this in a calm and rational manner. Connecticutt is one of the more strict states when it comes to GC, and they had this incident anyway. I don't think Sandy Hook would have been prevented unless all guns were banned and confiscated. Obviously that ain't going to happen, but the question is whether the next time might be prevented with tighter laws. Maybe not, but maybe we should consider making it tougher for some nutcase to get his/her hands on an AR-15.

 

[yidnar]

I would like to hear a serious debate without name calling and cheap shots .

If you want a serious debate then you've gotta start with a serious, unconfrontational OP, which you didn't do. Lose the exclamation points and the caps, tone down the rhetoric and the antagonism, and don't be puting words in someone else's mouth.

Re gun control, we lost 20 little kids last month and some heroic teachers; as a reasonable society we oughta be able to talk about this in a calm and rational manner. Connecticutt is one of the more strict states when it comes to GC, and they had this incident anyway. I don't think Sandy Hook would have been prevented unless all guns were banned and confiscated. Obviously that ain't going to happen, but the question is whether the next time might be prevented with tighter laws. Maybe not, but maybe we should consider making it tougher for some nutcase to get his/her hands on an AR-15.

you will not stop with AR15s .and standing on the graves of dead children to promote your agenda is offensive !!

 

[Wiseacre]

I would like to hear a serious debate without name calling and cheap shots .

If you want a serious debate then you've gotta start with a serious, unconfrontational OP, which you didn't do. Lose the exclamation points and the caps, tone down the rhetoric and the antagonism, and don't be puting words in someone else's mouth.

Re gun control, we lost 20 little kids last month and some heroic teachers; as a reasonable society we oughta be able to talk about this in a calm and rational manner. Connecticutt is one of the more strict states when it comes to GC, and they had this incident anyway. I don't think Sandy Hook would have been prevented unless all guns were banned and confiscated. Obviously that ain't going to happen, but the question is whether the next time might be prevented with tighter laws. Maybe not, but maybe we should consider making it tougher for some nutcase to get his/her hands on an AR-15.

you will not stop with AR15s .and standing on the graves of dead children to promote your agenda is offensive !!

Well. So much for the serious debate. Have a nice day.

 

[yidnar]

If you want a serious debate then you've gotta start with a serious, unconfrontational OP, which you didn't do. Lose the exclamation points and the caps, tone down the rhetoric and the antagonism, and don't be puting words in someone else's mouth.

Re gun control, we lost 20 little kids last month and some heroic teachers; as a reasonable society we oughta be able to talk about this in a calm and rational manner. Connecticutt is one of the more strict states when it comes to GC, and they had this incident anyway. I don't think Sandy Hook would have been prevented unless all guns were banned and confiscated. Obviously that ain't going to happen, but the question is whether the next time might be prevented with tighter laws. Maybe not, but maybe we should consider making it tougher for some nutcase to get his/her hands on an AR-15.

you will not stop with AR15s .and standing on the graves of dead children to promote your agenda is offensive !!

Well. So much for the serious debate. Have a nice day.

yeah using dead children to promote your agenda is not a serious debate .you are dismissed !!

 

[JustTheFacts]

I would like to hear a serious debate without name calling and cheap shots .

If you want a serious debate then you've gotta start with a serious, unconfrontational OP, which you didn't do. Lose the exclamation points and the caps, tone down the rhetoric and the antagonism, and don't be puting words in someone else's mouth.

Re gun control, we lost 20 little kids last month and some heroic teachers; as a reasonable society we oughta be able to talk about this in a calm and rational manner. Connecticutt is one of the more strict states when it comes to GC, and they had this incident anyway. I don't think Sandy Hook would have been prevented unless all guns were banned and confiscated. Obviously that ain't going to happen, but the question is whether the next time might be prevented with tighter laws. Maybe not, but maybe we should consider making it tougher for some nutcase to get his/her hands on an AR-15.

you will not stop with AR15s .and standing on the graves of dead children to promote your agenda is offensive !!

how do you claim to want serious debate when every time someone makes a proposal you shoot it down and say " you won't stop there" and you make the asinine claim that they are standing on the graves of children? No one is doing that. They are pointing the OBVIOUS trigger point for the recent gun control talk.

If I were King for a day in the current climate I would remove the 2nd Amendment. And understand that I own and love guns. But we have some fucked up people in America who have no business having a gun, and as long as the majority of gun owners stand in the way of addressing THAT issue, you're going to wind up losing your own rights.

Do you not understand that it IS possible for a constitutional amendment to take your guns?

your choices at this point are

work with the system to make sure those who shouldn't have guns don't have gus
wind up losing EVERYOE'S guns

ignoring the situation and screaming "guns dont kill people" won't make it go away.

It's your call o how you want to proceed but in the end there will be some form of gun control come out of this.

 

[Againsheila]

A LITTLE BIT OF HISTORY TO THINK ABOUT.......December 29, 2012 marks the 122nd Anniversary of the murder of 297 Sioux Indians at Wounded Knee Creek on the Pine Ridge Indian Reservation in South Dakota. These 297 people, in their winter camp, were murdered by federal agents and members of the 7th Cavalry who had come to confiscate their firearms “for their own safety and protection”. The slaughter began after the majority of the Sioux had peacefully turned in their firearms. The Calvary began shooting, and managed to wipe out the entire camp. 200 of the 297 victims were women and children. About 40 members of the 7th Cavalry were killed, but over half of them were victims of fratricide from the Hotchkiss guns of their overzealous comrades-in-arms. Twenty members of the 7th Cavalry's death squad, were deemed “National Heroes” and were awarded the Medal of Honor for their acts of [cowardice] heroism.

We hear very little of Wounded Knee today. It is usually not mentioned in our history classes or books. What little that does exist about Wounded Knee is normally a sanitized “Official Government Explanation”. And there are several historically inaccurate depictions of the events leading up to the massacre, which appear in movie scripts and are not the least bit representative of the actual events that took place that day.

Wounded Knee was among the first federally backed gun confiscation attempts in United States history. It ended in the senseless murder of 297 people.

Before you jump on the emotionally charged bandwagon for gun-control, take a moment to reflect on the real purpose of the Second Amendment, the right of the people to take up arms in defense of themselves, their families, and property in the face of invading armies or an oppressive government. The argument that the Second Amendment only applies to hunting and target shooting is asinine. When the United States Constitution was drafted, “hunting” was an everyday chore carried out by men and women to put meat on the table each night, and “target shooting” was an unheard of concept. Musket balls were a precious commodity and were certainly not wasted on “target shooting”. The Second Amendment was written by people who fled oppressive and tyrannical regimes in Europe, and it refers to the right of American citizens to be armed for defensive purposes, should such tyranny arise in the United States.

As time goes forward, the average citizen in the United States continually loses little chunks of personal freedom or “liberty”. Far too many times, unjust gun control bills were passed and signed into law under the guise of “for your safety” or “for protection”. The Patriot Act signed into law by G.W. Bush, was expanded and continues under Barack Obama. It is just one of many examples of American citizens being stripped of their rights and privacy for “safety”. Now, the Right to Keep and Bear Arms is on the table, and will, most likely be attacked to facilitate the path for the removal of our firearms, all in the name of “our safety”.

Before any American citizen blindly accepts whatever new firearms legislation that is about to be doled out, they should stop and think about something for just one minute-
Evil does exist in our world. It always has and always will. Throughout history evil people have committed evil acts. In the Bible one of the first stories is that of Cain killing Abel. We can not legislate “evil” into extinction. Good people will abide by the law, and the criminal element will always find a way around it.

Evil exists all around us, but looking back at the historical record of the past 200 years, across the globe, where is “evil” and “malevolence” most often found? In the hands of those with the power, the governments. That greatest human tragedies on record and the largest loss of innocent human life can be attributed to governments. Who do the governments always target? “Scapegoats” and “enemies” within their own borders…but only after they have been disarmed to the point where they are no longer a threat. Ask any Native American, and they will tell you it was inferior technology and lack of arms that contributed to their demise. Ask any Armenian why it was so easy for the Turks to exterminate millions of them, and they will answer “We were disarmed before it happened”. Ask any Jew what Hitler’s first step prior to the mass murders of the Holocaust was- confiscation of firearms from the people.

Wounded Knee is the prime example of why the Second Amendment exists, and why we should vehemently resist any attempts to infringe on our Rights to Bear Arms. Without the Second Amendment we will be totally stripped of any ability to defend ourselves and our families.