Unions threaten to disrupt Super Bowl

[daveman]

we should do what they did in China and threaten anyone who wants to form a union with 12 years of jail time!

YEAH!!!!

Nice strawman you have there.

Why should someone have to join a union to get a job?

strawman? it literally happened with the company Foxconn.
You know jailtime, besides the suicides and threats of suicide. The 35 hour work days....But yeah Unions are EVIL.....


Perspective people, you lack it.

That was China. In case you didn't notice, Indiana is not in China.

Moron.

 

[thereisnospoon]

I have run the same business for the past 23 years. Now my son is half owner.
We pay our employees very well, ensure they have 6 weeks paid vacation per year after one year plus health insurance.
How do you expect to demand good work if you dont pay them?
I have great workers, many who have been with me over 15 years. How do I keep them? By annual raises, good benefits. Sure I could make more profit by paying less but then the work quality is less. Turnaround is high. I have skilled people happily working. I make less profit because I pay more. Makes PERFECT business sense to me. My workers are people, they are what makes my business perform. Paying them less means less performance. Treat them like people, not like workers.

and if they decided to unionize?
See here's the deal. Mot small businesses cannot afford to do what you do and turn a profit. If a business pays their people inappropriate wages or well above the prevailing market wage, they must be able to maintain their profit margins and continue to increase business in order to do that.
Now, i have always been an advocate of business paying their key people well.
management makes the sales and comes up with ideas. Labor produces. As long as those things are in place, everyone wins.
You keep your key people happy. Good!
I ask you one more time, what your reaction would be if one day they came to you and said we just voted to unionize with the 'whatevers'?

 

[daveman]

you're new, plenty of people around here want to see unions gone period.

im pro-death

You didn't answer his question.
Do you think people should have a choice to join a union or to not join a union?
Contrary to union propaganda, right to work has nothing to do with unions at all. Except right to work protects the rights of workers in that a worker SHALL NOT be compelled to join a labor organization as a prerequisite for employment or to maintain employment.
It's that simple. What's wrong with that?

Always have a choice, that doesnt mean that unions shouldnt fight back against people who want them destroyed.

So you advocate using violence to oppose people exercising their freedom of choice?

Then you don't support people having freedom of choice.

 

[daveman]

Speaking of pay such as $10 per hour. That isnt a job than any adult should ever apply for. Thats a job for kids.

Shut up and deliver that pizza.

 

[daveman]

I see sticking up for the middle class is not welcome here. Wanting people to get a fair wage is not welcome. Sounds like a group of CEO's.

Whining about "fairness"? This is real life, kid, not kindergarten.

 

[initforme]

"See here's the deal. Mot small businesses cannot afford to do what you do and turn a profit"

Then they shouldnt hire. They sound lazy.

Nowhere am I sticking up for unions. I'm simply saying that I believe that workers are worth something. We shouldnt need a union to encourage businesses to pay a little more.
The outlook for posters here is they are not and that they should work for low wages. I disagree. Theoretically I could hire more, as my workload if full already. That might lead to higher profits, but at my age I dont want higher profits. That doesnt make a whole lot of sense in my situation. However, I would have to pay lower wages. I feel it is immoral and unethical to

1) EVER lower my employees wages and
2) establish more jobs at a lower wage

What would be the point in that? More profit? I'm not after that. I'm making a good profit now. My workers are dedicated and yes I do pay $20.50 per hour....many have gone to school for their craft. If you want good workers you pay them well, otherwise you SHOULDNT OWN A BUSINESS. I am too old to complicate things. My son, being younger and a gunner, wants to hire an additional 5 for this coming summer. But he wants it to be seasonal only. I have shot that idea down. If we hire we hire full time. Otherwise, there is not the demand.

 

[thereisnospoon]

Construction and concrete. I have 17 employees so I 'm not that big. I could acutally use more hands but as stated I wont pay less than $20.50 per hour per employee. I just dont believe its fair to pay less than that when people have families to feed. So I could expand, make more profit, pay less. But why would I upset the apple cart when it works well now.

In what state is your business. $20 per hour is a good wage in say the NY metro area. In Louisville, KY where houses in good neighborhoods run under $100k is it probably twice the market rate for unskilled or semi-skilled workers.
6 weeks vacation is unheard of. If you can afford to have your workers on the job for 10.5 months and pay them for 12( yes 6 weeks is 30 paid days off..30 days is 6 weeks or 1.5 months), good for you. 90% of small business cannot do that.
I wish you nothing but success in your endeavors.

 

[Chris]

Ah, Republican governors....

The best friends a Dem ever had.

 

[initforme]

I live in Wisconsin in a more rural area. I can do it because my workers turn a good profit for me. They are skilled and work hard.

In the end capitalism is all about the Management VERSUS its workers. They both fight, scrap, go after, and do whatever it takes to get the most out of each. Any worker that doesnt ask for a raise after one year in my mind is a complete idiot. If I keep you that long I increase your pay. Simple math. But to make the struggle less intense I pay a little more.

 

[thereisnospoon]

If you give the corporations tax breaks to come in, then I have to make up for it. So my taxes will inevitably go up. SO if they are going to go up, at least ENSURE that all jobs created are nothing less than high paying. A job that pays $10 per hour should NEVER BE CONSIDERED A JOB. Then again if I'm paid $10 per hour I'm going to barely work so to speak.

How so?...Does your business receive an additional tax levy in direct proportion to a tax break given another?
Again, the wage paid is not relative to anything but the prevailing market wage.
Obviously( and you of all people should know this) you are in a unique situation. According to you, your business has reached a level of success where you can pay above market wages and offer benefits that few other companies can offer.
You cannot expect that your business is a measuring stick for all others.
Most small business operate on low profit margins and many actually operate at a loss.
In order for a business to pay the kind of wages you believe are the minimum it either needs to turn a very high net profit or must be flush with cash or capital reserves.
My argument with tax breaks for business is that often the business projects a certain volume which relates directly to the number of jobs promised. In many instances, those numbers never materialize.
Two examples. Chiquita was lured away from it's long time base in Cincinnati to Charlotte, NC.
North Carolina, famous for offering heavy tax incentives to lure business, offered Chiquita a large tax break. Chiquita promised 400 jobs would come to Charlotte. What the company di not state that at least half of those jobs would be offered to existing employees who will transfer from Ohio. In my opinion, NC should have made it clear that those 400 jobs should come form local talent.
Dell Computers....They were given a $200 million tax incentive over 20 years to build a computer factory near Greensboro, NC...The offer was for up to 1,500 jobs. Three years later, only 900 people were hired. Last year the company shut the plant down stating the economy led to a slowdown in demand. The company still retains the tax breaks. That is on the politicians who agreed to this.
Here's another example of how the feet of company management's feet are not held to the fire to make good on promises of jobs when receiving tax breaks.
Red flag rises over Malta - Times Union

 

[Sirkarl101]

Awesome! That is what unions are all about. When they see injustices they unite. When companies state that unions are killing their bottom line but give huge bonuses and payout dividends they revolt. When a janitor in New York City can not make $21.00 hr because that would be lower middle class wages if that, they ban together. It is the private industry workers that are getting screwed in wages that are jealous and want all the unions gone. News flash. Unions will always exist. Unions do need to stop defending people who violate workplace rules though. You stop the unions everyone will be working for minimum wage till they put an end to that as they have already proposed. Stand Firm my union brothers and sisters.

 

[Chris]

The decline of unions coincides with this....

 

[thereisnospoon]

"See here's the deal. Mot small businesses cannot afford to do what you do and turn a profit"

Then they shouldnt hire. They sound lazy.

Nowhere am I sticking up for unions. I'm simply saying that I believe that workers are worth something. We shouldnt need a union to encourage businesses to pay a little more.
The outlook for posters here is they are not and that they should work for low wages. I disagree. Theoretically I could hire more, as my workload if full already. That might lead to higher profits, but at my age I dont want higher profits. That doesnt make a whole lot of sense in my situation. However, I would have to pay lower wages. I feel it is immoral and unethical to

1) EVER lower my employees wages and
2) establish more jobs at a lower wage

What would be the point in that? More profit? I'm not after that. I'm making a good profit now. My workers are dedicated and yes I do pay $20.50 per hour....many have gone to school for their craft. If you want good workers you pay them well, otherwise you SHOULDNT OWN A BUSINESS. I am too old to complicate things. My son, being younger and a gunner, wants to hire an additional 5 for this coming summer. But he wants it to be seasonal only. I have shot that idea down. If we hire we hire full time. Otherwise, there is not the demand.

Your assertion that most small business are "lazy" is irrational. I dismiss it as a knee jerk reaction to my post. A post which you believe makes sense and you are expressing anger that It does make 100% clear business sense. Look, you're a business owner You know damned well capital for wages does not exist in vacuum. Especially in small business. Every penny counts.
Yes. Employees are worth the value of their labor. A business owner is not going to pay an unskilled laborer $40k per year. That's stupid and it's inappropriate.
No one or government agency or other busy body entity should be permitted to interfere in the business of business regarding wages. The idea of an outside agency setting wages is preposterous. That kind of meddling would be an absolute job killer.
You do whatever you want with your buisness. However your authority in that area ends at the front door of your business.
Do not be so arrogant as to believe you are the only one doing it right and anyone else who runs a business not the same as you is wrong.
To be frank, I am sick and tired of pompous, pretentious busy bodies who run aropunf pointing fingers as though they are the perfect human being.
Remember this and mark it well. YOU ARE NOT BETTER than anyone. Just different. You run your show the way you see fit. Others will do the same without your crying and carping because they son;t do it your way.
It apparent to me that you have an arrogance about you.

 

[thereisnospoon]

Awesome! That is what unions are all about. When they see injustices they unite. When companies state that unions are killing their bottom line but give huge bonuses and payout dividends they revolt. When a janitor in New York City can not make $21.00 hr because that would be lower middle class wages if that, they ban together. It is the private industry workers that are getting screwed in wages that are jealous and want all the unions gone. News flash. Unions will always exist. Unions do need to stop defending people who violate workplace rules though. You stop the unions everyone will be working for minimum wage till they put an end to that as they have already proposed. Stand Firm my union brothers and sisters.

Cut the bullshit.
Unions have no such clout. They do not set the wage market. Just stop it.