True conservatives are pro-choice

[Ravi]

The issue of abortion should not be a political issue, it should be entirely a judicial issue. It's simple:

If the Fetus is an individual, then they deserve to be protected under the Constitution, if it is not an individual then it does not deserve to be protected under the constitution.

The question really is: "What constitues an individual"?

Though my memory is vague, I believe that in 1974, the courts decided that "viability" was the criteria for determining the point at which the fetus wa sconsidered an individual.

I personally think that "viability" is a lousy standard - totally subjective.

Since 1974, technology has advanced and with it our ability to understand life.

I think that a more objective way of determining the whether a fetus is an individual is by it's DNA:

When a fetus has DNA that is unique from taht of it's mother, it is an individual.

I don't know exactly when that is. It may be within minutes of conception or weeks.

My toe has dna, even if I cut it off. I guess it should enjoy full civil rights...shoot! It can't work I guess I'll help it enroll in the welfare system.

 

[Ravi]

False.

True conservatives also recognize that the securing of life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness is the role of government. True conservatives recognize that there are times where some interests overlap and come into conflict.

Thus, a true conservative might very well believe that the government has an obligation to preserve the life of the pre-born.

This is correct.
The only time you have the right to end a human life in in self-defense.
Abortion on demand is not self-defense.
:shrug:

It most certainly is.

 

[DiveCon]

False.

True conservatives also recognize that the securing of life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness is the role of government. True conservatives recognize that there are times where some interests overlap and come into conflict.

Thus, a true conservative might very well believe that the government has an obligation to preserve the life of the pre-born.

This is correct.
The only time you have the right to end a human life in in self-defense.
Abortion on demand is not self-defense.
:shrug:

It most certainly is.

shouldnt a woman think about that before she consents to the act that creates a baby? and the man too for that matter

 

[Ravi]

What someone should do is immaterial to the discussion.

 

[mdn2000]

My non-aborted fetuses are awake, playing with Legos.

 

[DiamondDave]

The issue of abortion should not be a political issue, it should be entirely a judicial issue. It's simple:

If the Fetus is an individual, then they deserve to be protected under the Constitution, if it is not an individual then it does not deserve to be protected under the constitution.

The question really is: "What constitues an individual"?

Though my memory is vague, I believe that in 1974, the courts decided that "viability" was the criteria for determining the point at which the fetus wa sconsidered an individual.

I personally think that "viability" is a lousy standard - totally subjective.

Since 1974, technology has advanced and with it our ability to understand life.

I think that a more objective way of determining the whether a fetus is an individual is by it's DNA:

When a fetus has DNA that is unique from taht of it's mother, it is an individual.

I don't know exactly when that is. It may be within minutes of conception or weeks.

My toe has dna, even if I cut it off. I guess it should enjoy full civil rights...shoot! It can't work I guess I'll help it enroll in the welfare system.

Your toe has YOUR DNA... the child, even when not born yet, has it's own unique DNA... but then again, we've gone thru this before

 

[JamesInFlorida]

What ever happened to personal responsibility? If you engage in an act of sex-just do so in a responsible manor to prevent unwanted pregnancies. People should be held accountable for their actions. I don't know when life truly begins (and nobody really does), but that shouldn't even be a factor, because what we do know is that when a woman is pregnant-the fetus is going to become a human being given time. I'm all for people being able to do whatever they want to do to their own bodies-unless it directly effects the life of somebody else-which in this case it does. There are so many options out there today with contraceptives out there which if used properly will make it so you can engage in sex responsibly (if you don't want to have kids). Plus you can always give up the baby for adoption.

The only time I think abortion is acceptable is in cases where the mother's life is in danger, or if the child is going to die a few hours after birth regardless.

 

[M14 Shooter]

False.

True conservatives also recognize that the securing of life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness is the role of government. True conservatives recognize that there are times where some interests overlap and come into conflict.

Thus, a true conservative might very well believe that the government has an obligation to preserve the life of the pre-born.

This is correct.
The only time you have the right to end a human life in in self-defense.
Abortion on demand is not self-defense.
:shrug:

It most certainly is.

How is ending a human life for the purpose of convenience an act of self-defense?

 

[M14 Shooter]

False.

True conservatives also recognize that the securing of life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness is the role of government. True conservatives recognize that there are times where some interests overlap and come into conflict.

Thus, a true conservative might very well believe that the government has an obligation to preserve the life of the pre-born.

This is correct.
The only time you have the right to end a human life in in self-defense.
Abortion on demand is not self-defense.
:shrug:

Define: self-defense

You REALLY need this defined?
You have the right end a human life when your life, or the lives of others, is under a clear, present and imminent threat.
Abortion on demand does not qualify.

 

[JBeukema]

And by definition it may be homicide however it would be called 'Non-criminal homicide'.

And?

The way you are trying to make it look is that homicide is a criminal act no matter how you look at it

No, that's just you being functionally illiterate.

. To post a word and then a 'short' definition is misleading expecally the way you did it. The homicide you are trying to say abortion is would be 'Criminal homicide'

Fail. Do show where I said abortion was always criminal.

But, if you want to get even more technical, of which you seem to like to do, then even 'Criminal homicide' would not work in the case of abortion.

It was in the peterson case.

Seeing that abortion is not illegal

Depends on when it occurs, kinda like sex

You're insistent on proving how much of an idiot you are, aren't you?

 

[JBeukema]

Ectopic pregnancies that don't self-terminate could still put the woman in danger of her own life. No one can say it will 'kill' her

Except that's what you just said in thew first clause of that very sentence

You're retarded, aren't you?

If the doctor determans

commiting homicide.

To post a word and then a 'short' definition is misleading expecally

refering

they did not intentionally or plan premeditatively to kill anyone.

YOU look like the illiterate one.

 

[JBeukema]

The issue of abortion should not be a political issue, it should be entirely a judicial issue. It's simple:

If the Fetus is an individual, then they deserve to be protected under the Constitution, if it is not an individual then it does not deserve to be protected under the constitution.

The question really is: "What constitues an individual"?

Though my memory is vague, I believe that in 1974, the courts decided that "viability" was the criteria for determining the point at which the fetus wa sconsidered an individual.

I personally think that "viability" is a lousy standard - totally subjective.

Since 1974, technology has advanced and with it our ability to understand life.

I think that a more objective way of determining the whether a fetus is an individual is by it's DNA:

When a fetus has DNA that is unique from taht of it's mother, it is an individual.

I don't know exactly when that is. It may be within minutes of conception or weeks.

My toe has dna, even if I cut it off. I guess it should enjoy full civil rights...shoot! It can't work I guess I'll help it enroll in the welfare system.

Your toe has YOUR DNA... the child, even when not born yet, has it's own unique DNA... but then again, we've gone thru this before

What if it's a clone?

 

[NYcarbineer]

The issue of abortion should not be a political issue, it should be entirely a judicial issue. It's simple:

If the Fetus is an individual, then they deserve to be protected under the Constitution, if it is not an individual then it does not deserve to be protected under the constitution.

The question really is: "What constitues an individual"?

The issue of slavery should not be a political issue, it should be entirely a judicial issue. It's simple:

If the slave is a citizen, then they deserve to be protected under the Constitution, if they are not a citizen then they do not deserve to be protected under the constitution.

The question really is: "What constitutes a citizen"?

The judicial decision?

Dred Scott v. Sanford...1857.

Where in the Constitution, or in constitutional law, is it, or has it ever been, determined that a fetus is a citizen?

 

[JBeukema]

The issue of abortion should not be a political issue, it should be entirely a judicial issue. It's simple:

If the Fetus is an individual, then they deserve to be protected under the Constitution, if it is not an individual then it does not deserve to be protected under the constitution.

The question really is: "What constitues an individual"?

The issue of slavery should not be a political issue, it should be entirely a judicial issue. It's simple:

If the slave is a citizen, then they deserve to be protected under the Constitution, if they are not a citizen then they do not deserve to be protected under the constitution.

The question really is: "What constitutes a citizen"?

The judicial decision?

Dred Scott v. Sanford...1857.

Where in the Constitution, or in constitutional law, is it, or has it ever been, determined that a fetus is a citizen?

It wasn't so long ago people asked the same question about blacks

 

[rikules]

True conservatives believe that a government that governs least governs best.

And that would naturally mean an opposition to a government forcing newly pregnant women to carry to term.

Alleged conservatives perform a lot of mental gymnastics to try to rationalize away this simple fact. But they're still wrong and they're not true conservatives.

And that's just the way it is.

in addition....

true conservatives would OPPOSE laws against pot smoking

in fact...
when it comes to religion, divorce, marriage, gays, pot, abortion...

true conservatives should ALWAYS be PRO-freedom to choose for yourself

I guess there are not many TRUE conservatives out there....


seems like liberals who support the freedom to choose for yourself on all these issues are MORE conservative than todays so-called conservatives

 

[DiveCon]

True conservatives believe that a government that governs least governs best.

And that would naturally mean an opposition to a government forcing newly pregnant women to carry to term.

Alleged conservatives perform a lot of mental gymnastics to try to rationalize away this simple fact. But they're still wrong and they're not true conservatives.

And that's just the way it is.

in addition....

true conservatives would OPPOSE laws against pot smoking

in fact...
when it comes to religion, divorce, marriage, gays, pot, abortion...

true conservatives should ALWAYS be PRO-freedom to choose for yourself

I guess there are not many TRUE conservatives out there....


seems like liberals who support the freedom to choose for yourself on all these issues are MORE conservative than todays so-called conservatives

well, THIS "true conservative" thinks the government shouldnt be involved in ANY of those things

what does that do to the paradigm

 

[Ravi]

The issue of slavery should not be a political issue, it should be entirely a judicial issue. It's simple:

If the slave is a citizen, then they deserve to be protected under the Constitution, if they are not a citizen then they do not deserve to be protected under the constitution.

The question really is: "What constitutes a citizen"?

The judicial decision?

Dred Scott v. Sanford...1857.

Where in the Constitution, or in constitutional law, is it, or has it ever been, determined that a fetus is a citizen?

It wasn't so long ago people asked the same question about blacks

Blacks are obviously post birth...you know, living, breathing creatures...just like whites. Your continual comparison is RGS retarded.

 

[rikules]

The issue of abortion should not be a political issue, it should be entirely a judicial issue. It's simple:

If the Fetus is an individual, then they deserve to be protected under the Constitution, if it is not an individual then it does not deserve to be protected under the constitution.

The question really is: "What constitues an individual"?

The issue of slavery should not be a political issue, it should be entirely a judicial issue. It's simple:

If the slave is a citizen, then they deserve to be protected under the Constitution, if they are not a citizen then they do not deserve to be protected under the constitution.

The question really is: "What constitutes a citizen"?

The judicial decision?

Dred Scott v. Sanford...1857.

Where in the Constitution, or in constitutional law, is it, or has it ever been, determined that a fetus is a citizen?

according to modern conservatives....fetuses are citizens......but liberals are NOT


does a fetus lose its' citizenship if it is born and grows up to be liberal?

 

[DiveCon]

Where in the Constitution, or in constitutional law, is it, or has it ever been, determined that a fetus is a citizen?

It wasn't so long ago people asked the same question about blacks

Blacks are obviously post birth...you know, living, breathing creatures...just like whites. Your continual comparison is RGS retarded.

his point is valid, since at one time blacks were not legal considered citizens

 

[PLYMCO_PILGRIM]

True conservatives believe that a government that governs least governs best.

And that would naturally mean an opposition to a government forcing newly pregnant women to carry to term.

Alleged conservatives perform a lot of mental gymnastics to try to rationalize away this simple fact. But they're still wrong and they're not true conservatives.

And that's just the way it is.

Well said (especially since it agree's with my opinion on the matter, lol)