Top Three Mysteries in Liberal Beliefs

[rightwinger]

MYSTERY A:
How can Liberals only want POLICE to have guns
but then don't trust POLICE with guns either.
What is the solution?

I'm a liberal. I never said any of that crap.

Emily is on her game tonight
Her mind is going in six different directions at once

 

[Yarddog]

if RW's spent as much time, and energy solving their own issues as they do slinging mud at liberals they might gain a little credibility -

She did no mud slinging whatsoever... simply asking questions. If anyone around here has credibility it has to be Em. Shes one of the more thoughtful posters on the forum. Either your out of your mind or in deep denial.

 

[miketx]

If I had to summarize the Top Three Mysteries
I cannot understand with Liberal Beliefs, here they are.
Can any LIBERAL/PROGRESSIVE please take 1 and explain to me
using simple terms what you are REALLY trying to accomplish
and how you expect to achieve it THAT MAKES SENSE:

A. Ending abuse of firearms and gun violence

MYSTERY A:
How can Liberals only want POLICE to have guns
but then don't trust POLICE with guns either.
What is the solution?

1. Liberals only want REGISTERED and REGULATED
owners to have guns like POLICE and MILITARY.
2. But at the same time DON'T TRUST POLICE WITH GUNS
and want to DEFUND the military
3. So who is left to regulate laws except the police?
And if they aren't trusted with guns, who is?

If you are going to reduce military, and police the police,
what is your proposal for doing this without relying on
CITIZENS getting involved in policing and law enforcement.
And doesn't empowering CITIZENS to get involved
REQUIRE training in Constitutional laws and enforcement?

Which is what Second Amendment and Constitutionalists are arguing for?
Why are you disagreeing if the common solution *IS* Constitutional law enforcement!

B. Universal Health Care and either forced minimum wage or forced slave labor

MYSTERY B:
How can Liberals afford "universal health care" for all people except by
providing charitable and voluntary services. While the same liberals
demand minimum wage at 15.00 an hour and don't want slave labor.

How can you have both?

PS My answer to this is to set up Medical internships, teaching
hospitals and health care cooperatives IN PLACE OF FAILED
mental health and prison systems. So instead of wasting 50K a year
per person incarcerated under a FAILED system, we pay for educating
doctors and nurses through public service internships and
use those programs to TREAT criminally ill and prevent mental disorders
from causing MORE crime and triple the costs, where taxes can go toward
health care, education and housing through campus cooperatives that work.

DO YOU HAVE A BETTER SOLUTION HOW TO PROVIDE FREE
HEALTH CARE AND EDUCATION while preventing SLAVE LABOR
(with or without the 15.00/hour minimum wage if you can explain how that works!)

C. Socialism mandated through Federal taxes versus keeping religion out of Govt

MYSTERY C:

Liberals who believe in "separation of church and state" and don't
want Christians IMPLEMENTING their beliefs through schools and public institutions
want their SOCIALIST beliefs (such as health care for all people including immigrants)
mandated, regulated and paid for through Federal Govt forcing all TAXPAYERS to comply.

How can you FORCE taxpayers to pay for SOCIALISM beliefs,
while arguing AGAINST Christians doing this through Govt?

Is that DISCRIMINATION BY CREED to allow this for
SOCIALIST beliefs but bar Christians and other beliefs from
being established through Govt forcing the public to comply?

My answer: I am guessing that neither side will agree to remove their beliefs from Govt.
What we will end up with, is a system of allowing taxpayers to DEFUND The programs
they don't believe in funding, and setting up TAX BREAKS and TAX DEDUCTIONS
for investing in programs they DO believe in funding. And democratically set up
enough schools, hospital programs, housing and cooperatives for everyone to
pay for what they believe in under terms and conditions they consent to without conflict or coercion.

LIBERALS/PROGRESSIVES how do you answer these problems?

What SOLUTIONS and steps toward democratic social development do
you propose that either RESOLVES or AVOIDS the above 3 conflicts with others?

THANK YOU!

You've never actually met a liberal, have you.

I have, they are all brain dead traitor pos that dont have the dense to pour piss out of a boot.

But I bet they can compose a legible sentence.

So can I. I love when you idiots get triggered by on purpose spelling errors.

Lmao!

The "I meant to do that" defense.

I call bullshit.

No one cares what you call. I do it several times and you pos take the bait almost every time. You can't help it.
Regressive liberal ROE



1. Demand a link or an explanation of the truth they are objecting to.


2. Promptly reject all explanations as right wing lies. Smoke spin deflect


3. Ignore any facts presented.


4. Ridicule spelling and typos, punctuation.


5. Attack the person as being juvenile, ie: "are you 12 years old", question their education, intelligence, Age


6. Employ misdirection,


6a. smear people


6b. attack religion


6c. attack your rationality.


7. Lie


8. Play race/gender card/misogynist card


9. Play gay/lesbian card


10. Play the Nazi/Fascist/bigot card


11. Make up stuff/So you got nothing?


12. Deny constantly


13. Reword and repeat


14. Pretending not to understand, playing ignorant/what did I lie about


15. When losing, resort to personal attacks.


16. Russia


17. Fox News/Alex Jones/Brietbart/infowars/Stormfront/Gateway/hannity


18. You can’t read.


19. Trump Trump Trump TrumpTrump Trump

 

[Disir]

How can Liberals afford "universal health care" for all people except by
providing charitable and voluntary services. While the same liberals
demand minimum wage at 15.00 an hour and don't want slave labor.

How can you have both?

The charitable and voluntary services get grants from the government. As a liberal, I get where the 15 comes from. You guys are hooked on minimum wage at 15 to be nice. Not even. It's enough to kick 'em off state aid but not enough to go anywhere.

That said, you can have universal health care for US citizens.

 

[Disir]

How can you FORCE taxpayers to pay for SOCIALISM beliefs,
while arguing AGAINST Christians doing this through Govt?

Is that DISCRIMINATION BY CREED to allow this for
SOCIALIST beliefs but bar Christians and other beliefs from
being established through Govt forcing the public to comply?

Tax payers fund Christian charities..............so........yeah.

 

[G.T.]

Pretty dishonest thread, disappointingly.

The left, from what Ive ever heard in any official platform, want things like background checks...Ive never once heard "only Police should have guns" unless it was by some kook on a messageboard or an outlier.

What a troubling and dishonest thread, all around.

Socialism is a form of Government(economics, really) not a fakkin Religion and I have never met a Socialist and most folks accusing x,y,z of being "socialist" dont seem to actually know what socialism even is. Another fucktarded canaard.

 

[22lcidw]

People talk bait on forums. Like they are winning something. To me the bait is when someone takes a fishing rod into a building and catches some of the fishies to let them go to sleep.

 

[miketx]

How can Liberals afford "universal health care" for all people except by
providing charitable and voluntary services. While the same liberals
demand minimum wage at 15.00 an hour and don't want slave labor.

How can you have both?

The charitable and voluntary services get grants from the government. As a liberal, I get where the 15 comes from. You guys are hooked on minimum wage at 15 to be nice. Not even. It's enough to kick 'em off state aid but not enough to go anywhere.

That said, you can have universal health care for US citizens.

Tax and spend fail like all libs.

 

[Disir]

How can Liberals afford "universal health care" for all people except by
providing charitable and voluntary services. While the same liberals
demand minimum wage at 15.00 an hour and don't want slave labor.

How can you have both?

The charitable and voluntary services get grants from the government. As a liberal, I get where the 15 comes from. You guys are hooked on minimum wage at 15 to be nice. Not even. It's enough to kick 'em off state aid but not enough to go anywhere.

That said, you can have universal health care for US citizens.

Tax and spend fail like all libs.

Look! Look over there, Mike. It's a bag. There is something shiny and purple sticking out of it. Go get it, Mikie. Go get it!

 

[rightwinger]

Pretty dishonest thread, disappointingly.

The left, from what Ive ever heard in any official platform, want things like background checks...Ive never once heard "only Police should have guns" unless it was by some kook on a messageboard or an outlier.

What a troubling and dishonest thread, all around.

Socialism is a form of Government(economics, really) not a fakkin Religion and I have never met a Socialist and most folks accusing x,y,z of being "socialist" dont seem to actually know what socialism even is. Another fucktarded canaard.

Keep in mind it is Emily

 

[emilynghiem]

GREAT responses anynameyouwish
Thank you for answering with your
honest SPECIFIC feedback and criticisms.

WONDERFUL!

Let's start with these and work toward solutions.

1. First do you agree that licensing and registering
CAR insurance and drivers is done THROUGH THE STATE
AND NOT THROUGH FEDERAL GOVT.

Do you understand the difference
between state and federal regulations of citizens
in these matters?

2. Do you understand that there are MORE
than just two choices of
A. universal health care THROUGH GOVT
B. denying people help and killing/letting them die

Do you understand that Conservatives believe
in people owning and managing their own health care
programs so they have DIRECT CHOICE IN SERVICES.

Example: Health care cooperatives that allow the best
options of BOTH federally funded programs for those who need them
as well as free market choice and local ownership of payment
programs between providers and patients, where the costs
are HALF of what insurance costs and with BETTER BENEFITS.

Do you understand there are BETTER choices both
economically and with respect to FREEDOM OF CHOICE
than govt run programs and mandates that have a limit on what they can provide?

If I had to summarize the Top Three Mysteries
I cannot understand with Liberal Beliefs, here they are.
Can any LIBERAL/PROGRESSIVE please take 1 and explain to me
using simple terms what you are REALLY trying to accomplish
and how you expect to achieve it THAT MAKES SENSE:

A. Ending abuse of firearms and gun violence

MYSTERY A:
How can Liberals only want POLICE to have guns
but then don't trust POLICE with guns either.
What is the solution?

1. Liberals only want REGISTERED and REGULATED
owners to have guns like POLICE and MILITARY.
2. But at the same time DON'T TRUST POLICE WITH GUNS
and want to DEFUND the military
3. So who is left to regulate laws except the police?
And if they aren't trusted with guns, who is?

If you are going to reduce military, and police the police,
what is your proposal for doing this without relying on
CITIZENS getting involved in policing and law enforcement.
And doesn't empowering CITIZENS to get involved
REQUIRE training in Constitutional laws and enforcement?

Which is what Second Amendment and Constitutionalists are arguing for?
Why are you disagreeing if the common solution *IS* Constitutional law enforcement!

B. Universal Health Care and either forced minimum wage or forced slave labor

MYSTERY B:
How can Liberals afford "universal health care" for all people except by
providing charitable and voluntary services. While the same liberals
demand minimum wage at 15.00 an hour and don't want slave labor.

How can you have both?

PS My answer to this is to set up Medical internships, teaching
hospitals and health care cooperatives IN PLACE OF FAILED
mental health and prison systems. So instead of wasting 50K a year
per person incarcerated under a FAILED system, we pay for educating
doctors and nurses through public service internships and
use those programs to TREAT criminally ill and prevent mental disorders
from causing MORE crime and triple the costs, where taxes can go toward
health care, education and housing through campus cooperatives that work.

DO YOU HAVE A BETTER SOLUTION HOW TO PROVIDE FREE
HEALTH CARE AND EDUCATION while preventing SLAVE LABOR
(with or without the 15.00/hour minimum wage if you can explain how that works!)

C. Socialism mandated through Federal taxes versus keeping religion out of Govt

MYSTERY C:

Liberals who believe in "separation of church and state" and don't
want Christians IMPLEMENTING their beliefs through schools and public institutions
want their SOCIALIST beliefs (such as health care for all people including immigrants)
mandated, regulated and paid for through Federal Govt forcing all TAXPAYERS to comply.

How can you FORCE taxpayers to pay for SOCIALISM beliefs,
while arguing AGAINST Christians doing this through Govt?

Is that DISCRIMINATION BY CREED to allow this for
SOCIALIST beliefs but bar Christians and other beliefs from
being established through Govt forcing the public to comply?

My answer: I am guessing that neither side will agree to remove their beliefs from Govt.
What we will end up with, is a system of allowing taxpayers to DEFUND The programs
they don't believe in funding, and setting up TAX BREAKS and TAX DEDUCTIONS
for investing in programs they DO believe in funding. And democratically set up
enough schools, hospital programs, housing and cooperatives for everyone to
pay for what they believe in under terms and conditions they consent to without conflict or coercion.

LIBERALS/PROGRESSIVES how do you answer these problems?

What SOLUTIONS and steps toward democratic social development do
you propose that either RESOLVES or AVOIDS the above 3 conflicts with others?

THANK YOU!

1. Liberals only want REGISTERED and REGULATED
owners to have guns like POLICE and MILITARY.


lie.


trained and licensed like a regular person with a car.

why do you lie?


2. But at the same time DON'T TRUST POLICE WITH GUNS
and want to DEFUND the military

lie.

why do you lie?

I don't want police roaming around shooting people for talking on their cell phones but I have no problem with police having guns and I definitely do NOT want to defund the military.

I'm not happy that our military budget is 10 times what the next 9 nations spend COMBINED and yet we can't beat china or russia but since i do not trust n korea, russia, china, iran...etc....I definitely do NOT want to defund the military.

Besides, I might need them to keep YOU from killing me.

Why do you lie?


MYSTERY B:
"How can Liberals afford "universal health care" for all people except by
providing charitable and voluntary services. While the same liberals
demand minimum wage at 15.00 an hour and don't want slave labor.

How can you have both? "


Is this why you want to kill them?
because they are silly goobers who don't want slavery but do want affordable health care?

is that really a good enough reason to slaughter millions of people?


MYSTERY C

"Liberals who believe in "separation of church and state" and don't
want Christians IMPLEMENTING their beliefs through schools and public institutions
want their SOCIALIST beliefs (such as health care for all people including immigrants)
mandated, regulated and paid for through Federal Govt forcing all TAXPAYERS to comply.

How can you FORCE taxpayers to pay for SOCIALISM beliefs,
while arguing AGAINST Christians doing this through Govt?"


We FORCE PEOPLE to pay for certain things...like....

police with guns
and a heavily funded military

and public schools
and roads....

none of these things are religious based.

they do not favor one religion or one ideology over the others.

They would be available for ALL citizens regardless of religion.

Where-as YOUR desire to indoctrinate MY kids with YOUR dangerous and deluded religious beliefs favors YOUR religion and teaches MY KIDS to hate me.

so keep your hate based religions to yourself.

3. For public schools and military
do you understand people CONSENT to pay for
services they AGREE represent their interests as taxpayers?

Do you recognize the difference between COERCION
against people's beliefs and CONSENT based
agreement to pay taxes for govt and public services?

For example, when Liberals opposed the Wall funding,
PEOPLE WHO AGREED TO FUND IT STARTED DONATING
VOLUNTARILY TO A FUND TO RAISE THE MONEY ANYWAY.

This SHOWS that people are willing to fund the policies they believe in.

So why not make it tax deductible?

If you want to pay for people's health care,
let's set up HEALTH CARE COOPS and anything
you pay in for your coverage or for others
gets deducted 100% off taxes so you pay for health care
not anything to do with killing people.

 

[emilynghiem]

He'll never answer.

Then miketx and Pogo
how DO we present these issues
where people WILL present better solutions?

How would YOU ask and answer
so we still get ideas or directions
toward more effective solutions
that make sense to all sides?

Thanks!

Stop with the emotive rhetoric from politicians..

Start posting CORRECTIONS Moonglow
or do you Pogo and Siete want to start
a list of Conservative Contradictions
and ask for Corrections/Solutions to those?

Is that easier for you than answering this list of points?

Thanks either way. I think we need both,
so wherever you want to start, is helpful!
Thank you Moonglow. You go!

 

[Crepitus]

You've never actually met a liberal, have you.

I have, they are all brain dead traitor pos that dont have the dense to pour piss out of a boot.

But I bet they can compose a legible sentence.

So can I. I love when you idiots get triggered by on purpose spelling errors.

Lmao!

The "I meant to do that" defense.

I call bullshit.

No one cares what you call. I do it several times and you pos take the bait almost every time. You can't help it.
Regressive liberal ROE



1. Demand a link or an explanation of the truth they are objecting to.


2. Promptly reject all explanations as right wing lies. Smoke spin deflect


3. Ignore any facts presented.


4. Ridicule spelling and typos, punctuation.


5. Attack the person as being juvenile, ie: "are you 12 years old", question their education, intelligence, Age


6. Employ misdirection,


6a. smear people


6b. attack religion


6c. attack your rationality.


7. Lie


8. Play race/gender card/misogynist card


9. Play gay/lesbian card


10. Play the Nazi/Fascist/bigot card


11. Make up stuff/So you got nothing?


12. Deny constantly


13. Reword and repeat


14. Pretending not to understand, playing ignorant/what did I lie about


15. When losing, resort to personal attacks.


16. Russia


17. Fox News/Alex Jones/Brietbart/infowars/Stormfront/Gateway/hannity


18. You can’t read.


19. Trump Trump Trump TrumpTrump Trump

Lol, you can't admit you made a mistake.

What an idiot.

 

[emilynghiem]

No mystery, you just are not interested in any answer that a liberal might give you. You already have it all figured out.

Dear occupied I am answering everyone on here
who gives me any correction, idea, suggestion or solution to work on.

Can you pick a point and give a correction or solution?
Naysaying is not specific enough to correct anything,
can you please
1. post something with content related to one of the 3 points
2. ELABORATE on some response that someone else
posted YOU THINK IS A GOOD POINT or response

Thanks occupied
NOTE: If you'd rather start with a list of
Conservative Contradictions that need Correction
I'm fine with that also! What points do you suggest
for a Conservative list, and I'll try to summarize the top 3.

 

[Moonglow]

He'll never answer.

Then miketx and Pogo
how DO we present these issues
where people WILL present better solutions?

How would YOU ask and answer
so we still get ideas or directions
toward more effective solutions
that make sense to all sides?

Thanks!

Stop with the emotive rhetoric from politicians..

Start posting CORRECTIONS Moonglow
or do you Pogo and Siete want to start
a list of Conservative Contradictions
and ask for Corrections/Solutions to those?

Is that easier for you than answering this list of points?

Thanks either way. I think we need both,
so wherever you want to start, is helpful!
Thank you Moonglow. You go!

What does it pay?

 

[emilynghiem]

He'll never answer.

Then miketx and Pogo
how DO we present these issues
where people WILL present better solutions?

How would YOU ask and answer
so we still get ideas or directions
toward more effective solutions
that make sense to all sides?

Thanks!

You wont solve them. All liberals want to do is take take and take. I'm convinced we will have a war in this country. Then whatever is left will hopefully build it back like it is supposed to be.

Dear miketx we already have war of ideology going on.
we have bullying in the media and deadlocks in Congress
while people are dying on the border either by crime or
trafficking or gang and drug wars gone wrong.

Are you even looking at the people RESPONDING
who are trying to answer and give corrections?

There is some discussion we are trying to form out of this.

If I started a separate list/thread for Conservative Corrections,
what are the top 3 accusations you see getting hit with
that don't make sense to liberals and you respond similarly
to the people here saying what I posted were strawman lies.

What is the equivalent list for Conservatives
where Liberals accuse them of contradictions?

1. Prolife but not caring about health care
2. Constitutional limits on govt and NOT establishing religion
but pushing their Christian beliefs about LGBT and abortion through govt
(and some discriminate against Muslims and want to punish them collectively
whether they are guilty of terrorism or just guilty by association)
3. claiming to support independent business/private sector development and free market
WITHOUT depending on Govt, but then pushing to elect people to Govt offices to
mandate solutions through Govt (while they blame Liberals for such dependence)
INSTEAD OF SOLVING PROBLEMS OUTSIDE OF GOVT BY PRIVATE BUSINESS AND CHARITIES

Are those good points you'd rather defend and address?
If so, we can start a second list and try again!

 

[emilynghiem]

What does it pay?

If you help us Progressives on here to make
a streamlined list of corrections/solutions,
I can pitch that to different Dem and Green candidates.

We can create a paid internship for you if you want
to counsel and consult on mediation outreach to
solve political problems and assist office holders
or candidates for office on raising funds to implement these solutions.

Would you like to work as an admin assistant?
A team member in fundraising outreach?
Lobbying candidates to raise money to create jobs
in SOLUTIONS instead of wasting millions running for the same office?

What kind of job would you want to get paid to do Moonglow?

Which PROBLEM or which SOLUTION would you be
willing to work on full time, what type of assistance?

Is there a particular CANDIDATE or official you would like to intern with?

In TX both Ted Cruz and SJ Lee had positions open for LEGAL INTERNS.
why not create paid positions solving political problems
and lobby candidates to fund jobs directly in developing solutions?

 

[emilynghiem]

As long as our society and other societies are dominated by dark monies our govts. will cause the common folks to have conflict amongst themselves because that is the ploy to have the common folks not notice how the dark leaders of govt. and business take away the cream and barely leave enough for the majority to live on..

Thanks Moonglow

What approach do you think might work best
to empower people to take back control of
resources and manage programs ourselves?

A. Health care cooperatives owned and democratically
managed by people and providers directly and locally?
www.patientphysiciancooperatives.com

B. Worker owned business cooperatives?
As Sanders and his supporters advocate as solutions.

C. Nonprofit Microlending and business training programs?
www.grameenfoundation.org

D. Building and/or organizing locally owned Campus
programs to supervise education, job training, and services
to break the cycle of poverty while teaching ownership and management?
www.paceuniversal.com

Moonglow pick one of these that you would like to either
mentor, consult or work with if you could have a paid job.

Which candidate for public office could you see yourself working
with to create a team and/or paid jobs developing such a program?

I have friends with the Green Party working on locally managed banking
to cut debts charged to taxpayers, and put money saved into community development.

Which area most appeals to you?

 

[Pogo]

He'll never answer.

Then miketx and Pogo
how DO we present these issues
where people WILL present better solutions?

How would YOU ask and answer
so we still get ideas or directions
toward more effective solutions
that make sense to all sides?

Thanks!

Stop with the emotive rhetoric from politicians..

Start posting CORRECTIONS Moonglow
or do you Pogo and Siete want to start
a list of Conservative Contradictions
and ask for Corrections/Solutions to those?

Is that easier for you than answering this list of points?

Thanks either way. I think we need both,
so wherever you want to start, is helpful!
Thank you Moonglow. You go!

Why would we want to dive into the same blanket generalization fallacy you started with? Did my admonition sail right over your head?

I don't believe in specific "conservative contradictions" or "Liberal positions" as such.. People are individuals with free will. Stop trying to herd them into labels. You want to analyze a specific position for this or against that, have at it, but stop labeling them as "Liberal" or "conservative" as if that's all the can be, and argue the actual merits. Haven't we overachieved in tribalism already? Enough already.

 

[Pogo]

MYSTERY A:
How can Liberals only want POLICE to have guns
but then don't trust POLICE with guns either.
What is the solution?

I'm a liberal. I never said any of that crap.

Thank you. That's why I noted the thread was built on a stack of strawmen.