To separate the USA and Europe. Can that be a good idea?

[Alex_northern_germany]

I find it rather sad that we are currently allowing ourselves to be driven apart like this. Every clear-thinking European is aware that Western Europe and the USA fundamentally share the same values. It's what's written in the preamble to the US Constitution. And I can already imagine who on the world stage doesn't like that: the autocratic states. Democracy, freedom, justice—leaders like those in China or Russia naturally don't like those. In my opinion, we mustn't do these countries the favor...

United States–European Union relations - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[Mac1958]

I find it rather sad that we are currently allowing ourselves to be driven apart like this. Every clear-thinking European is aware that Western Europe and the USA fundamentally share the same values. It's what's written in the preamble to the US Constitution. And I can already imagine who on the world stage doesn't like that: the autocratic states. Democracy, freedom, justice—leaders like those in China or Russia naturally don't like those. In my opinion, we mustn't do these countries the favor of trying to find common ground.

The USA is no longer one of the "good guys". America is now an aggressive, authoritarian, predatory country.

Permanently? I don't know. But that's where we are now.

 

[kyzr]

I find it rather sad that we are currently allowing ourselves to be driven apart like this. Every clear-thinking European is aware that Western Europe and the USA fundamentally share the same values. It's what's written in the preamble to the US Constitution. And I can already imagine who on the world stage doesn't like that: the autocratic states. Democracy, freedom, justice—leaders like those in China or Russia naturally don't like those. In my opinion, we mustn't do these countries the favor...

Welcome aboard newbie. To start a thread the OP (opening post) needs a link to support or oppose your "opinions". A moderator may close this thread if you don't follow the rules. Here is one example link:

Europe pushes back against Trump over Greenland military threat

Whether serious or not, Trump's remarks that he wants to buy or seize Greenland from Denmark could do lasting damage to transatlantic relations, experts say.

www.nbcnews.com

MSN

Europe backs Greenland as Trump renews threat of annexation for 'national security'​

 

[kyzr]

The USA is no longer one of the "good guys". America is now an aggressive, authoritarian, predatory country.
Permanently? I don't know. But that's where we are now.

Can you support those claims? No you can't.

 

[Alex_northern_germany]

The USA is no longer one of the "good guys". America is now an aggressive, authoritarian, predatory country.

Permanently? I don't know. But that's where we are now.

I think, or rather hope, that the USA will once again become the political and moral role model (and I believe it's important that the USA is a role model!) that it was for me for a long time. And I believe that democracy is strong enough to remember the ideas of its founding fathers.

 

[Mac1958]

I think, or rather hope, that the USA will once again become the political and moral role model (and I believe it's important that the USA is a role model!) that it was for me for a long time. And I believe that democracy is strong enough to remember the ideas of its founding fathers.

That's certainly the hope, and it's certainly possible. But it will take a while if it happens.

 

[Mac1958]

Can you support those claims? No you can't.

Not to someone like you, no.

 

[Alex_northern_germany]

Welcome aboard newbie. To start a thread the OP (opening post) needs a link to support or oppose your "opinions". A moderator may close this thread if you don't follow the rules. Here is one example link:

Europe pushes back against Trump over Greenland military threat

Whether serious or not, Trump's remarks that he wants to buy or seize Greenland from Denmark could do lasting damage to transatlantic relations, experts say.

www.nbcnews.com

MSN

Europe backs Greenland as Trump renews threat of annexation for 'national security'​

Thanks for the heads-up. I wasn't aware of that. Is this just a discussion forum for exchanging links? What if there isn't a suitable link that aligns with my political opinion? I can search for a link, but will it be 100% relevant to the topic?

 

[Alex_northern_germany]

Thanks for the heads-up. I wasn't aware of that. Is this just a discussion forum for exchanging links? What if there isn't a suitable link that aligns with my political opinion? I can search for a link, but will it be 100% relevant to the topic?

I've added one

 

[Meathead]

I find it rather sad that we are currently allowing ourselves to be driven apart like this. Every clear-thinking European is aware that Western Europe and the USA fundamentally share the same values. It's what's written in the preamble to the US Constitution. And I can already imagine who on the world stage doesn't like that: the autocratic states. Democracy, freedom, justice—leaders like those in China or Russia naturally don't like those. In my opinion, we mustn't do these countries the favor...

United States–European Union relations - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Preamble to the Declaration of Independence:

In Congress, July 4, 1776

The unanimous Declaration of the thirteen united States of America, When in the Course of human events, it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another, and to assume among the powers of the earth, the separate and equal station to which the Laws of Nature and of Nature's God entitle them, a decent respect to the opinions of mankind requires that they should declare the causes which impel them to the separation.

 

[Dorian Mode]

I think, or rather hope, that the USA will once again become the political and moral role model (and I believe it's important that the USA is a role model!) that it was for me for a long time. And I believe that democracy is strong enough to remember the ideas of its founding fathers.

America was being driven bankrupt by its internal corruption and the high costs of being the world leader. It needs time to get back on track. Might I suggest that the UK and EU start spending enormous sums on protecting western interests? It's time for Europe to put on its Big Boy Pants and stop relying on Uncle Sam for so many things.

 

[22lcidw]

The USA is no longer one of the "good guys". America is now an aggressive, authoritarian, predatory country.

Permanently? I don't know. But that's where we are now.

The most powerful elites on the planet are in Europe. What you typed is what Europe is. Europe influenced the United Steps. We are the braun for the globalist designs. Decades ago, our own citizens became the ugly Americans. Take a cruise and find a percentage of the cruisers to see it if you do not go to Europe or other places. Since you Progs do not want to slow your loony tunes craziness, who cares anymore? You go your way and let others go their way.

 

[Alex_northern_germany]

America was being driven bankrupt by its internal corruption and the high costs of being the world leader. It needs time to get back on track. Might I suggest that the UK and EU start spending enormous sums on protecting western interests? It's time for Europe to put on its Big Boy Pants and stop relying on Uncle Sam for so many things.

I agree with you; I've always been in favor of Europe strengthening its military. I served on a battle tank in the German army, and despite knowing better, our army shrank and shrank after the Cold War until it was almost insignificant. But I firmly believe that a militarily strengthened Europe must work together with the USA. The USA was in the Cold War, and I hope they will always be comrades in arms in my heart. I've also always condemned the claim that we don't need a military or intelligence service, while secretly relying on the USA. But we mustn't allow ourselves to be divided. Third parties benefit from this. And yet, the USA can still be proud of being a democratic role model for many.

 

[shockedcanadian]

I find it rather sad that we are currently allowing ourselves to be driven apart like this. Every clear-thinking European is aware that Western Europe and the USA fundamentally share the same values. It's what's written in the preamble to the US Constitution. And I can already imagine who on the world stage doesn't like that: the autocratic states. Democracy, freedom, justice—leaders like those in China or Russia naturally don't like those. In my opinion, we mustn't do these countries the favor...

United States–European Union relations - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Europe has separated themselves based on the betrayal of their values. America saved Europe 80 years.ago.and Europe has had it good ever since. Now, observe who they elected in leadership roles there. .Frightening.. You have become more like China and less like America. The.E.U is in sharp decline,.all self induced, little appetite to address reality, with a change in demographics to boot. Look in the mirror.

 

[Alex_northern_germany]

Europe has separated themselves based on the betrayal of their values. America saved Europe 80 years.ago.and Europe has had it good ever since. Now, observe who they elected in leadership roles there. .Frightening.. You have become more like China and less like America. The.E.U is in sharp decline,.all self induced, little appetite to address reality, with a change in demographic to boot. Look in the mirror.

I don't think you've been here very often. Europe is very open and beautiful. And the food here—Italy, France, Bavaria, Austria... Of course, we have problems here too. But you should come; I'd be happy to show you, and we're certainly not China. Look what's become of Hong Kong under China. And by the way, I like your avatar; Reagan was my favorite president as a child. And he removed the Iron Curtain.

 

[shockedcanadian]

I don't think you've been here very often. Europe is very open and beautiful. And the food here—Italy, France, Bavaria, Austria... Of course, we have problems here too. But you should come; I'd be happy to show you, and we're certainly not China. Look what's become of Hong Kong under China. And by the way, I like your avatar; Reagan was my favorite president as a child. And he removed the Iron Curtain.

Europe is a fine place.with a.great history. You will have to decide if it is worth defending.

 

[Mac1958]

you Progs

And there we go again: If you're not a mindless member of the cult, you must be a "prog".

Despite all the evidence to contrary, despite all the conservatives who are horrified by this.

The spectacularly shallow thinking of MAGA.

 

[kyzr]

Thanks for the heads-up. I wasn't aware of that. Is this just a discussion forum for exchanging links? What if there isn't a suitable link that aligns with my political opinion? I can search for a link, but will it be 100% relevant to the topic?

It doesn't have to be 100% related, just some related basis or background for the discussion.

One other item, the mods will delete the thread if it is not a "clean start". Meaning the OP can't be too one-sided. If all you do in the OP is bash Trump or democrats the mods will stop it.
So try to be somewhat neutral when starting a thread.

 

[1srelluc]

What is hard to forget is that we left the EU pretty much to their own devices and got two world wars for our trouble.

 

[Alex_northern_germany]

What is hard to forget is that we left the EU pretty much to their own devices and got two world wars for our trouble.

I believe that. Both world wars were so senseless. We West Germans, and all the other European democratic states that didn't become Stalin's buffer states, appreciate the help the USA received. It has shaped my understanding of democracy. Terrible things happen in the world, and the USA helped to eliminate them in World War II. I think that's a morally right decision.