The results of Bidenomics

[DialogDiplomat]

$33 TRILLION in debt and you think one Party is better than the other? Seriously? Biden alone will have added $7 TRILLION to the debt in one term

I do think one party is better than the other based on the objective numbers I provided in the other thread that I linked you to. There is absolutely no question that one party is better than the other at managing the budget.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

I do think one party is better than the other based on the objective numbers I provided in the other thread that I linked you to. There is absolutely no question that one party is better than the other at managing the budget.

So Biden adding $7Trillion to the debt in one term is good?

I said it before, your analysis is like saying the Titanic would make a great submarine because look at how deep it traveled. Neither Party is good or better, they both SUCK.

 

[Natural Citizen]

This is great, but what do you have to say about 5.2% GDP growth and 3.7% unemployment? This is the question to you.

Most of the GDP is government spending and unemplyment data is just as distorted as the stock market.

Seems like you're just the newest blip on the screen regurgitating the same old lines that have been beat down a guhzillion times around here already.

 

[Godboy]

I already answered this back on page 1 when you originally asked me this. Copy and pasting my original response below:

Those are all jobs paid for with taxes. Those dont count as "jobs". Not when youre trying to imply that the country is doing awesome because Biden blew tax dollars to employ a bunch of people. Government jobs dont count. Any president can sign something to hire government workers. He doesnt need to know what he is signing, he just needs to be physically capable of signing his name. That isnt a praise worthy thing.

 

[LAUGHatLEFTISTS]

OK, but why? Care to elaborate?

George W Bush over 8 years 373k jobs lost ? Hahahahaahhaahahaaa

 

[DialogDiplomat]

So Biden adding $7Trillion to the debt in one term is good?

I said it before, your analysis is like saying the Titanic would make a great submarine because look at how deep it traveled. Neither Party is good or better, they both SUCK.

If he reduces the deficit that he inherited, yes. Presidents have no control over debt accumulation because they have no control over what they inherit in terms of deficit. This is entry level fiscal policy understanding here.

 

[DialogDiplomat]

Those are all jobs paid for with taxes. Those dont count as "jobs". Not when youre trying to imply that the country is doing awesome because Biden blew tax dollars to employ a bunch of people. Government jobs dont count. Any president can sign something to hire government workers. He doesnt need to know what he is signing, he just needs to be physically capable of signing his name. That isnt a praise worthy thing.

What do you mean? In what sense are the 12.8 million jobs created under Biden paid for with taxes? Are you only talking about the jobs that stem from the infrastructure bill? You could make an argument there in that case, but why would that be a bad thing?

 

[DBA]

Trump chose to spend his remaining months in office trying to overthrow democracy and seize power

At least you don't attempt to hide your politics.

That policy is what brought the pandemic to a halt and all of the jobs that were lost as a result.

Much of the world was seeing the very similar rates of decline in COVID deaths and infections as the US. Were they on board with this policy as well or is Biden just so good that he saved the world?

But even there, that was already Iran's own money, and those funds have strings attached to them such that they can only be used for humanitarian purposes.

Who cares whose money it is? Iran sponsors terrorism. They don't get their money back. The money may be earmarked for humanitarian purposes, but it isn't like Iran doesn't have other money they can use to finance terrorism. It doesn't take a rocket scientist, or a even a Democrat, to understand that by giving Iran access to the money, they can divert other funds that were once used for humanitarian purposes, to terrorism. I might also add that they could simply donate a bunch to a humanitarian fund to save the Palestinians that only ends up in the hands of Hamas. It is pure stupidity to give them access to this money, particularly now.

 

[Dr.Know]

GDP growth is currently at 5.2% - historically high. Unemployment (U3) is currently at 3.7% - historically low. The stock market is currently at an all time high - historically...record breaking. Pandemic-related (supply shock) inflation is now getting under control as a result of interest rate hikes from the central bank. Economists are now saying we will get a soft landing out of inflation as opposed to a recession. Here in FL where I live, there are 176 infrastructure projects queued up and backed by $8.1B in funding from Biden's historic infrastructure bill to build and repair roads, bridges, public transport, ports, airports, clean water, etc. This will ensure economic prosperity for the next several years during the building phase at the very least.

And yet if I talk to any of my republican voter friends, most tend to disregard all of the economic data mentioned above and instead declare - without any supporting facts or data - that we're actually in the worst economy in 50 years. So with that, I'm curious what republican/libertarian voters here on this board think about the economy?

Here are the facts one more time. 5.2% GDP. 3.7% unemployment. Record high stock market. Solid growth in output. Solid stability in the labor market. Solid value in investment. And as things like the Infrastructure bill and the CHIPs Act play out, there are solid economic prospects for the future for years to come.

I'm going to add in some historical jobs numbers as well, since Joe Biden was also VP in the Obama administration. Quite literally all private sector job growth in the 21st century happened under democratic presidents. The numbers below are from BLS databases (B tables on seasonally adjusted private sector jobs).

Clinton - 2000 to 2001: 1.4M jobs created
W Bush - 2001 to 2009: 373k jobs lost
Obama - 2019 to 2017: 11.8M jobs created
Trump - 2017 to 2021: 2.1M jobs lost
Biden - 2021 to 2023: 12.8M jobs created

GDP expansion and the labor market are some of the most commonly cited data points used by economists to explain the economy. So there is the data for the 21st century.

Putting all of this together, what do republican/libertarian voters of this site make of all of this and Bidenomics? I'm interested in hearing about how you think the economy is doing today, and what data it is you're looking at that leads you to that conclusion. Also curious in what you have to say about the current state of GDP, the labor market, and the stock market. Also curious about what you think about jobs results in the 21st century.

GDP data: https://www.bea.gov/news/2023/gross...-corporate-profits-preliminary-estimate-third
Unemployment rate data: Employment Situation Summary - 2023 M11 Results
Historical jobs data: Establishment data series from the monthly B Tables : U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics

Propaganda BS

GDP has been on a steady upward trajectory since 1970, the Village Idiot had nothing to do with that.

JOBS ??? Yeah sure, the Village Idiot counts GIG WORK like DOOR DASH as viable jobs AND corporations are creating FAKE JOB ADS where they have no intention of actually hiring in order to push up Job numbers. Trump crated REAL JOBS with benefits not smoke and mirrors

The Economy SEEMS OK but it is because people are living on CREDIT CARDS and many boomers are pulling money out of 401s to buy toys , take cruises, etc,,,

Go buy a new car and pay 70k for a sedan, 450k for a house,,,,,this is called Inflation and the Village Idiot started printing Money like he was at a Thai Strip club right after being placed into office. Look at the Giant spike in M2 in 2020.

Core Inflation is 4% and will remain elevated for several years to come.

Deep State Joe is propping up the economy now ( Cheap Gas) because its an election year cycle; it is smoke and mirrors.

Enlighten us about the wisdom of Deep State Joe OPENING UP US BORDERS TO ANYBODY THAT WANTS IN WHILE THEY TAKE RESOURCES NEEDED FOR HOMELESS AMERICANS AND BANKRUPT CITIES.

 

[DialogDiplomat]

George W Bush over 8 years 373k jobs lost ? Hahahahaahhaahahaaa

Yes, those are the numbers. Here again, care to elaborate? You really haven’t said anything with substance yet.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

If he reduces the deficit that he inherited, yes. Presidents have no control over debt accumulation because they have no control over what they inherit in terms of deficit. This is entry level fiscal policy understanding here.

Biden had no control over the trillions in new spending her proposed? Biden wasn't allowed to proposed any spending cuts? You talk like Paul "Wrong in the trillions column" Krugman

Biden did better than a 2 year long global pandemic and economic shut down, and that's his claim to fiscal policy greatness?

 

[JohnDB]

 

[DBA]

GDP growth is currently at 5.2% - historically high. Unemployment (U3) is currently at 3.7% - historically low. The stock market is currently at an all time high - historically...record breaking. Pandemic-related (supply shock) inflation is now getting under control as a result of interest rate hikes from the central bank. Economists are now saying we will get a soft landing out of inflation as opposed to a recession. Here in FL where I live, there are 176 infrastructure projects queued up and backed by $8.1B in funding from Biden's historic infrastructure bill to build and repair roads, bridges, public transport, ports, airports, clean water, etc. This will ensure economic prosperity for the next several years during the building phase at the very least.

And yet if I talk to any of my republican voter friends, most tend to disregard all of the economic data mentioned above and instead declare - without any supporting facts or data - that we're actually in the worst economy in 50 years. So with that, I'm curious what republican/libertarian voters here on this board think about the economy?

Here are the facts one more time. 5.2% GDP. 3.7% unemployment. Record high stock market. Solid growth in output. Solid stability in the labor market. Solid value in investment. And as things like the Infrastructure bill and the CHIPs Act play out, there are solid economic prospects for the future for years to come.

I'm going to add in some historical jobs numbers as well, since Joe Biden was also VP in the Obama administration. Quite literally all private sector job growth in the 21st century happened under democratic presidents. The numbers below are from BLS databases (B tables on seasonally adjusted private sector jobs).

Clinton - 2000 to 2001: 1.4M jobs created
W Bush - 2001 to 2009: 373k jobs lost
Obama - 2019 to 2017: 11.8M jobs created
Trump - 2017 to 2021: 2.1M jobs lost
Biden - 2021 to 2023: 12.8M jobs created

GDP expansion and the labor market are some of the most commonly cited data points used by economists to explain the economy. So there is the data for the 21st century.

Putting all of this together, what do republican/libertarian voters of this site make of all of this and Bidenomics? I'm interested in hearing about how you think the economy is doing today, and what data it is you're looking at that leads you to that conclusion. Also curious in what you have to say about the current state of GDP, the labor market, and the stock market. Also curious about what you think about jobs results in the 21st century.

GDP data: https://www.bea.gov/news/2023/gross...-corporate-profits-preliminary-estimate-third
Unemployment rate data: Employment Situation Summary - 2023 M11 Results
Historical jobs data: Establishment data series from the monthly B Tables : U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics

The unemployment rated under Trump, pre-COVID was 3.5%. GDP growth was at about 2.5%.

Many got COVID stimulus money and Biden extended the child tax credit under the American Rescue Plan, which gave families with children quite a large sum of more free money, as the money could be claimed by those that didn't even pay any taxes. As the pandemic came to its natural and world-wide conclusion, they started to spend the free money they received. They were couped up and wanted to get out. They are still spending and the debt per household in the US has increased as, predictably, many spend even more than they received. They are/were on a spending frenzy fueled by a boon in free money. In short, freebees work in the short term. It is purely inorganic growth. To succeed long term, we need organic growth, which this administration doesn't seem to be interested in pursuing.

 

[iamwhatiseem]

The worse thing to point out to show a good economy is the stock market. The stock market was doing well even when the majority of the country was doing poorly.

A president doesn't actually get credit or blame for the actions of the Fed.

The one exception to that IMO is Obama renominating Bernanke who failed miserably and continued to do the wrong thing.

As well as the unemployment rate, which today is virtually a useless figure because it is so out of scale.
When the unemployment number is low, but the labor force participation rate (between the ages of 15-64) is also at historic lows - then that number has little value.
The numbers used historically are well of of context with how the average citizen is doing.
At no time was this more apparent than from 2009-2014. The stock market was explosively rising at a time everyone on the street was in absolute misery.

 

[pknopp]

$33 TRILLION in debt and you think one Party is better than the other? Seriously? Biden alone will have added $7 TRILLION to the debt in one term

And Trump added $7.8 trillion.

 

[iamwhatiseem]

And Trump added $7.8 trillion.

I have Trump at $6.7 trillion....wait... here is a chart that says $8.2 trillion...wait... another says $7.1 trillion.
WTF??

 

[pknopp]

I have Trump at $6.7 trillion....wait... here is a chart that says $8.2 trillion...wait... another says $7.1 trillion.
WTF??

Make all the excuses for his failures you want.

 

[iamwhatiseem]

Make all the excuses for his failures you want.

??
You need your Adderall?
Where on earth did you find where I gave an excuse??
I was looking up debt by President and the first one I saw, governments own data, said Trump contributed $6.7, seeing our two numbers were different, I looked up a different source... long story short.. every source I looked at had the numbers significantly different, as much as 20%.

 

[JohnDB]

 

[pknopp]

??
You need your Adderall?
Where on earth did you find where I gave an excuse??

Did you condemn Trump's debt?