The real reason Cheney swore....

[Isaac Brock]

Originally posted by NewGuy
When you become an American, or know what the Constitution says, then I will listen to your opinion on such things.

Until then, you are as much a part of the problem as they are.

Is that so? Your case is not strengthened when you rebuff me by Appealing to Authority, you should know much better than that.

And how am I a part of the problem? I don't even like Cheney, but I'm not going to slag the guy for saying a choice word. Forgive and forget and move on to the big stuff.

 

[NewGuy]

Originally posted by Kathianne
Ahem, I AM an American. :usa:

You and I are coming from different positions regarding the constitution. See, I believe in the Electoral College. I believe in precedents being germane to the law. I also believe the Constitution expands, is living as a document.

Difference is, I don't normally feel compelled to argue it. I want to be open to what others think. I am not so misguided that I think I HAVE to be right.

1. My post was directed at a Canadian who is telling us to disregard our Constitutional policy.

2. Believing in the electoral college means nothing here. That was not part of the point of discussion with myself nor Isaac.

3. You can believe whatever you want about the Constitution, but we have discussed before about what "context" means, and you contradicted yourself to justify your viewpoint. Fine, no prob. That doesn't make a misunderstanding of context a true understanding of how to read a foundational document.

4. You don't feel compelled to argue it. You want to be open to what others think. You are not so misguided that you think you HAVE to be right?

-That is the difference between us.

You are a moderator of a worldwide reaching American based message board and a teacher. As an American citizen and holding those other titles, you had better DAMN SURE KNOW you are right. Not only that, as we are talking about the very foundational base our nation lives and breathes from, one in which thousands continue to give their lives to uphold, you had BETTER be compelled to argue in favor of what is right.

If you choose not to, fine.

But don't assume to tell me I can't.

-Or do you want to restrict my Constitutional right to freedom of speech?

 

[Annie]

I knew this was going to be long, we do not see eye to eye on this and probably never will. You say:

You can believe whatever you want about the Constitution, but we have discussed before about what "context" means, and you contradicted yourself to justify your viewpoint. Fine, no prob. That doesn't make a misunderstanding of context a true understanding of how to read a foundational document.

I say I do see in context and I did not contradict myself, I let go of an argument that was going no where. I KNOW that I'm not going to see you change your mind, which is fine for you. You have a great window in which you see the world, your country, and your religion. Fine.

As an American citizen and holding those other titles, you had better DAMN SURE KNOW you are right. Not only that, as we are talking about the very foundational base our nation lives and breathes from, one in which thousands continue to give their lives to uphold, you had BETTER be compelled to argue in favor of what is right.

Oh I know I am right, I have the credentials and training in this field, though one thing I do know is that greater minds than mine have seen not only the Constitution through different prisms, but at different times they were all correct. You have never expressed something so odious or anti-Constitutional that I would feel compelled to actually argue point by point, though I know you like to do so. I also don't think that I need to pull out pieces of paper to defend my positions, do you?

As far as moderator, well that's something else. Think it has to do with the ability to stay up late and usually be polite and stuff, but not always. : For you, yes, polite is earned and given.



Now this:

...you had BETTER be compelled to argue in favor of what is right.

If you choose not to, fine.

But don't assume to tell me I can't.

-Or do you want to restrict my Constitutional right to freedom of speech?

is where you ARE wrong. I do not have to argue with you in your circular way of doing so. I am not cryptic, which you enjoy being. So I choose, usually not to go down that road.

I have NEVER said you couldn't argue. Nor have I limited your right to free speech. There has never been a question that you express yourself just fine, in any forum.

 

[NewGuy]

Crap.

It appears this whole thing went as much of our dialog does.

I think we are both talking to each other about our statements and we are both on different pages of what we are meaning and saying.

This can go on forever.

I will try to cut it all down to 2 simple points I think we both agree on:

1. I was telling Isaac something.....not referenceing you, although you may have thought I was.

2. The Constitution says things we need to obey and we need to be sure to follow it. -No matter what someone else thinks from an outside perspective.

These were my points.

I am nearly positive we agree.

I am willing to apologize and flush the rest since I think we tend to misunderstand each other and spin tangents on such things.

 

[Isaac Brock]

What is the constitutional policy on swearing? Is there one?

 

[Annie]

Originally posted by NewGuy
Crap.

It appears this whole thing went as much of our dialog does.

I think we are both talking to each other about our statements and we are both on different pages of what we are meaning and saying.

This can go on forever.

I will try to cut it all down to 2 simple points I think we both agree on:

1. I was telling Isaac something.....not referenceing you, although you may have thought I was.

2. The Constitution says things we need to obey and we need to be sure to follow it. -No matter what someone else thinks from an outside perspective.

These were my points.

I am nearly positive we agree.

I am willing to apologize and flush the rest since I think we tend to misunderstand each other and spin tangents on such things.

New Guy, no hard feelings. We definately agree on the first, I did think that with him agreeing with me, I had to step up.

Second point, since I usually can be a bit diplomatic, let's say that we both treasure and would defend the Constitution from any attacks that we saw. How's that?

 

[NewGuy]

Originally posted by Kathianne
New Guy, no hard feelings. We definately agree on the first, I did think that with him agreeing with me, I had to step up.

Second point, since I usually can be a bit diplomatic, let's say that we both treasure and would defend the Constitution from any attacks that we saw. How's that?

No can do.

I will add your statement to my first.

If an American citizen cannot agree to:
"The Constitution says things we need to obey and we need to be sure to follow it. -No matter what someone else thinks from an outside perspective."

Then they must believe it isn't worth fighting for or dying for. They must also believe it matters what "the world" thinks about our government equal to what we do.

I refuse to acknowledge that.

We will disagree then. I have respect for our foundation, and everything it encompasses including the flag, the morals and ethics, the people who died, and all else in the establishment of our doctrine.

To refuse to agree to follow it is an insult.

 

[NewGuy]

Originally posted by Kathianne
Hope it's safe to say this, I mean I'm hoping that New Guy and I are at truce and friends again, : , the rest of ya, move along now, nothing to see.....: : : :

Truce, but no complete agreement.....agree to disagree I guess.

 

[Annie]

Originally posted by NewGuy
Truce, but no complete agreement.....agree to disagree I guess.

I am more than happy to go along with this. I missed it in the flurry.

 

[Gop guy]

LOL, what happened to the original topic?

 

[Jimmyeatworld]

Originally posted by Gop guy
LOL, what happened to the original topic?

Gone with the wind.

To get back to it, I don't think Cheney is leaving the ticket, it's a little late in the game for that. If he leaves at the convention it could do as much harm as good if the Dems try to spin it, and you know they would.

Everything else aside, J.C. Watts would make a great running mate in '08. I know not everyone will agree with this, but how about a McCain/Watts ticket?

 

[5stringJeff]

Watts yes, McCain no. I would sooner vote for John Kerry.

 

[nycflasher]

Originally posted by rtwngAvngr
No. THe exercise is for YOU to answer. THink about it. WHo's tough on terror? Bush/ Kerry? who refuses to see the connections between various governments and terrorists? Bush/Kerry?

Huh? I could care less what bin Laden WANTS. I have a pretty good idea what he wants, based on his previous actions.

The questions you pose are certainly relevant to one's choice for President, but what bin Laden wants is irrelevant.

If one were to lead their lives in accordance with the wishes of a murderous madman...

 

[rtwngAvngr]

Originally posted by nycflasher

If one were to lead their lives in accordance with the wishes of a murderous madman... [/B]

...one might very well be a modern wacked out, power hungry, american democrat or eurolib, green with envy over the overwhelming success of american style capitalism, a system nearly capable of protecting, clothing and feeding the entire world. But you libs hate it, because we acknlowedge the role of the business entrepeneur in society. Selfish people who just want a job and a paycheck and to do the least for the most, have no vision for the future.

 

[DKSuddeth]

Originally posted by rtwngAvngr
...one might very well be a modern wacked out, power hungry, american democrat or eurolib, green with envy over the overwhelming success of american style capitalism, a system nearly capable of protecting, clothing and feeding the entire world. But you libs hate it, because we acknlowedge the role of the business entrepeneur in society. Selfish people who just want a job and a paycheck and to do the least for the most, have no vision for the future.

some people might even feel that being a dictator is easier than being a president......so long as that person is the dictator. :

 

[rtwngAvngr]

Originally posted by DKSuddeth
some people might even feel that being a dictator is easier than being a president......so long as that person is the dictator. :

Yes. It's simpler. It's something we have done in the past with puppet states, in the context of larger global battles. The best thing would be a world government which insists on individual rights and free markets for all. Unfortunately, the world government crowd we have now are mostly socialists and communists, consumed with envy, anxious to wreck the global economic system we've built, for the people.

 

[Jimmyeatworld]

Originally posted by gop_jeff
Watts yes, McCain no. I would sooner vote for John Kerry.

Ick! I'd vote for the corn in John McCain's crap before I'd vote for John Kerry!