Zone1 The nature of discernment

[buttercup]

What are your thoughts on discernment? Do you believe it is spiritual in nature, and one of the 'fruits' of salvation and being a new creation in Christ?

Or do you believe it's something that all people have, in varying degrees?

There are so many scriptures on discernment, and although I haven't done a specific study on this topic, so far from what I have looked at it seems to be spiritual in nature. It's something I find very interesting, and definitely want to learn more about.

This is from a study on biblegateway.com:

8227 discernment, nature of​

Discernment is given by God, through his Holy Spirit. It is received through God’s word and through the insight of a renewed mind. Discerning believers seek to grow in their understanding and knowledge of God’s truth.

Discernment as sound judgment​

Judging the right course Pr 15:21; Php 1:9-10 See also Pr 3:21-23; Pr 8:8-9; Pr 10:21; Pr 11:12; Pr 18:1; Pr 24:30; Hos 14:9

Distinguishing good from evil 2Sa 14:17 See also Ge 3:22; Job 6:30; Job 34:3-4; Isa 7:15

Distinguishing holy from common Lev 10:10; Lev 11:47; Eze 22:26; Eze 44:23

Seeing through outward appearances Pr 28:11 See also 1Sa 16:7; Isa 11:3

Understanding the significance of events Dt 32:29-30 See also 1Ch 12:32; Est 1:13; Mt 24:32-33 pp Mk 13:28-29; Lk 12:54-56

Exercising judgment to rule 1Ki 3:9 See also Pr 8:14-16; Pr 28:2,16; Jer 23:5

Discernment as insight into spiritual realities​

Distinguishing between spirits 1Co 12:10 See also 1Ki 22:19-23 pp 2Ch 18:18-22; 1Ti 4:1; 1Jn 4:1-3

Discerning true and false prophecy Dt 13:1-3; Dt 18:21-22; 1Co 14:29

Characteristics of discerning people​

The discerning grow in wisdom Pr 1:5 See also Pr 9:9; Pr 10:14; Pr 14:6; Pr 15:14; Pr 17:24; Pr 18:15

The discerning accept rebuke Pr 17:10; Pr 19:25

The discerning keep God’s law 1Ch 22:12; Ps 119:34; Pr 28:7

The source of discernment​

Discernment is given by God Da 2:21 See also Pr 9:10; Da 2:27-28; 1Co 2:12-15

Discernment through God’s word Heb 5:14 See also Ps 19:7; Ps 119:98-100,130; Ro 2:18

Discernment through a renewed mind Ro 12:2 See also Jer 31:33; 1Co 2:16

Asking for discernment Ps 119:66 See also Ps 119:27,125; Jas 1:5


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There's more to be said about this, but I don't want to write an essay here so I'll start it with that for now.

 

[BULLDOG]

Not quite sure what you mean by discernment. Is it God specifically telling you what decision to make, which would make you similar to a prophet, or just something that you do yourself, like taking extra time to consider whether there is something in the bible that points out implications of your choices?

 

[buttercup]

Not quite sure what you mean by discernment. Is it God specifically telling you what decision to make, which would make you similar to a prophet, or just something that you do yourself, like taking extra time to consider whether there is something in the bible that points out implications of your choices?

No, that is something different. Discernment is like insight. It's sound judgment and the ability to make correct determinations. Seeing beyond mere appearances and understanding the actual truth of a matter.

The reason I asked if it's spiritual in nature is because sometimes I see nonbelievers who seem to have some discernment. But maybe that's something different... intuition? I think everyone has intuition, to some degree.

 

[sparky]

It would be nice where there a tad more of that in this world Buttercup ~S~

 

[buttercup]

It would be nice where there a tad more of that in this world Buttercup ~S~

Definitely! That reminds me of something you said on another thread the other day... when you said you realize that most of what you read, see and hear is BS, haha. (Especially when it comes to things like wars, and certain media events, etc.)

 

[BULLDOG]

No, that is something different. Discernment is like insight. It's sound judgment and the ability to make correct determinations. Seeing beyond mere appearances and understanding the actual truth of a matter.

The reason I asked if it's spiritual in nature is because sometimes I see nonbelievers who seem to have some discernment. But maybe that's something different... intuition? I think everyone has intuition, to some degree.

So, is it innate in the person, or something that originates outside the person?

 

[Natural Citizen]

For some reason I was reminded of Bastiat's thoughts on discernment...


The Influence of Socialist Writers

How did politicians ever come to believe this weird idea that the law could be made to produce what it does not contain --the wealth, science, and religion that, in a positive sense, constitute prosperity? Is it due to the influence of our modern writers on public affairs?

Present-day writers -- especially those of the socialist school of thought -- base their various theories upon one common hypothesis: They divide mankind into two parts. People in general -- with the exception of the writer himself -- from the first group. The writer, all alone, forms the second and most important group. Surely this is the weirdest and mostconceited notion that ever entered a human brain!

In fact, these writers on public affairs begin by supposing that people have within themselves no means of discernment; no motivation to action. The writers assume that people are inert matter, passive particles, motionless atoms, at best a kind of vegetation indifferent to its own manner of existence. They assume that people are susceptible to being shaped -- by the will and hand of another person -- into an infinite variety of forms, more or less symmetrical, artistic, and perfected.

Moreover, not one of these writers on governmental affairs hesitates to imagine that he himself -- under the title of organizer, discoverer, legislator, or founder -- is this will and hand, this universal motivating force, this creative powerwhose sublime mission is to mold these scattered materials --persons -- into a society.

These socialist writers look upon people in the same manner that the gardener views his trees. Just as the gardener capriciously shapes the trees into pyramids, parasols, cubes, vases, fans, and other forms, just so does the socialist writer whimsically shape human beings into groups, series, centers, sub-centers, honeycombs, labor corps, and other variations. And just as the gardener needs axes, pruning hooks, saws, and shears to shape his trees, just so does the socialist writer needs the force that he can find only in law to shape human beings. For this purpose, he devises tariff laws, tax laws, relief laws, and school laws.


Of course, these days it's not just the socialist writers. It's authoritarian writers in general. And people, collectively, tend to need/want to be led.


But maybe you're thinking more along the lines of Blackstone's thoughts on it...

The absolute rights of man, considered as a free agent, endowed with discernment to know good from evil, and with power of choosing those measures which appear to him to be most desirable, are usually summed up in one general appellation, and denominated the natural liberty of mankind. This natural liberty consists properly in a power of acting as one thinks fit, without any restraint or control, unless by the law of nature: being a rightinherent in us by birth, and one of the gifts of God to man at his creation, when he endued him with the faculty of freewill.

 

[buttercup]

So, is it innate in the person, or something that originates outside the person?

No, I don't believe it's innate. I'm sure you will disagree, but as I said in the OP, I believe it's spiritual in nature and an aspect (or 'fruit') of salvation and regeneration, with a renewed heart and mind. It's OK if we disagree, I asked for people's thoughts. I'm just telling you what I believe, since you asked.

 

[BULLDOG]

No, I don't believe it's innate. I'm sure you will disagree, but as I said in the OP, I believe it's spiritual in nature and an aspect (or 'fruit') of salvation and becoming regenerated with a renewed heart and mind. It's OK if we disagree, I asked for people's thoughts. I'm just telling you what I believe, since you asked.

Too early to determine if I agree or disagree. I can't make that decision before I'm sure what you are talking about. Can you give me an example of discernment that doesn't have religious connotations? Does it affect decisions in all cases, or just the ones with a religious bent?

 

[buttercup]

For some reason I was reminded of Bastiat's thoughts on discernment...


The Influence of Socialist Writers

How did politicians ever come to believe this weird idea that the law could be made to produce what it does not contain --the wealth, science, and religion that, in a positive sense, constitute prosperity? Is it due to the influence of our modern writers on public affairs?

Present-day writers -- especially those of the socialist school of thought -- base their various theories upon one common hypothesis: They divide mankind into two parts. People in general -- with the exception of the writer himself -- from the first group. The writer, all alone, forms the second and mostimportant group. Surely this is the weirdest and mostconceited notion that ever entered a human brain!

In fact, these writers on public affairs begin by supposing thatpeople have within themselves no means of discernment; nomotivation to action. The writers assume that people are inertmatter, passive particles, motionless atoms, at best a kind ofvegetation indifferent to its own manner of existence. Theyassume that people are susceptible to being shaped -- by the will and hand of another person -- into an infinite variety of forms, more or less symmetrical, artistic, and perfected.

Moreover, not one of these writers on governmental affairshesitates to imagine that he himself -- under the title of organizer, discoverer, legislator, or founder -- is this will and hand, this universal motivating force, this creative powerwhose sublime mission is to mold these scattered materials --persons -- into a society.

These socialist writers look upon people in the same manner that the gardener views his trees. Just as the gardener capriciously shapes the trees into pyramids, parasols, cubes,vases, fans, and other forms, just so does the socialist writer whimsically shape human beings into groups, series, centers, sub-centers, honeycombs, labor corps, and other variations. And just as the gardener needs axes, pruning hooks, saws, andshears to shape his trees, just so does the socialist writer need the force that he can find only in law to shape human beings. For this purpose, he devises tariff laws, tax laws, relief laws, and school laws.


Of course, these days it's not just the socialist writers. It's authoritarian writers in general. And people, collectively, tend to need/want to be led.


But maybe you're thinking more along the lines of Blackstone's thoughts on it...

The absolute rights of man, considered as a free agent, endowed with discernment to know good from evil, and with power of choosing those measures which appear to him to be most desirable, are usually summed up in one general appellation, and denominated the natural liberty of mankind. This natural liberty consists properly in a power of acting as one thinks fit, without any restraint or control, unless by the law of nature: being a rightinherent in us by birth, and one of the gifts of God to man at his creation, when he endued him with the faculty of freewill.

Thanks for those different viewpoints. I don't agree with either of them.... The second one makes it sound like it's given to us from birth, and as I was just saying to Bulldog, I don't believe that's the case. But like I said, I want to study the topic more, I could be wrong.

I remember having an amazing insight MANY years before I became a believer. A long time ago, when Clinton first became president, I remember having a very strange overwhelming sense of doom, and I made a prediction right then and there, out loud, before he was even in office. (It was the day he won the election, the first term.) I predicted he would be impeached, or finish his term dishonorably. Both those thing happened. I mean, where did that come from? Just a good guess? That was before I even knew about most of his scandals.

 

[buttercup]

Too early to determine if I agree or disagree. I can't make that decision before I'm sure what you are talking about. Can you give me an example of discernment that doesn't have religious connotations? Does it affect decisions in all cases, or just the ones with a religious bent?

No, decisions in all cases. In life in general. For example, being a good judge of character. I know that many people judge solely based on party politics... (one side is all good and the other side is all evil, depending on which side one is on)... but have you ever sensed that a politician is a fraud, even if that politician is charismatic and says the right things most of the time? That would be an example of using discernment.

 

[Thunk]

I've noticed that people who have no discernment don't pay attention to anything...they never learn...not even from their own mistakes.

While people who have discernment do pay attention to things & do a fair amount of cogitating. They also have the ability to take a look at themselves. see what they don't like...and make changes.

That doesn't rule in or out if it's spiritual in nature...I just know that discernment is one of things I thank God for when I say my prayers!

 

[Thunk]

Not quite sure what you mean by discernment.

The best way I can thunk to describe it is it's X-ray vision goggles for bullshit.

Your discernment allows you to see right thru it.

 

[Thunk]

Discerning believers seek to grow in their understanding and knowledge

There we go...that's a great description of it (even though I cut off the last 3 words).

 

[buttercup]

I've noticed that people who have no discernment don't pay attention to anything...they never learn...not even from their own mistakes.

While people who have discernment do pay attention to things & do a fair amount of cogitating. They also have the ability to take a look at themselves. see what they don't like...and make changes.

That doesn't rule in or out if it's spiritual in nature...I just know that discernment is one of things I thank God for when I say my prayers!

Good point and well said. Another cool thing is that like wisdom, discernment is something that we can ask God for more of.... and although I don't have a scripture handy on this, I'm pretty sure that it's something God will give us more of when we ask.

 

[BULLDOG]

No, decisions in all cases. In life in general. For example, being a good judge of character. I know that many people judge solely based on party politics... (one side is all good and the other side is all evil, depending on which side one is on)... but have you ever sensed that a politician is a fraud, even if that politician is charismatic and says the right things most of the time? That would be an example of using discernment.

No. I am far from Washington and have only their record and what they say to go by. I note that you went directly to politics. I'll admit I am a little creeped out by people who can't separate religion from politics. Is that what you are talking about.

 

[Natural Citizen]

Thanks for those different viewpoints. I don't agree with either of them.... The second one makes it sound like it's given to us from birth, and as I was just saying to Bulldog, I don't believe that's the case. But like I said, I want to study the topic more, I could be wrong.

Well Bastiat wasn't speaking on discernment itself anyway, but more so consequences of the lack thereof.

It just hapened to be on my mind already, oronically, so I was just reminded of it.

Then Blackstone's thought came to mind just because I happened to be reading his stuff eleswhere the other day.

But it's alright. Everybody doesn't always have to agree on everything. So long as everybody all agrees that we should all be free anyway.

 

[buttercup]

No. I am far from Washington and have only their record and what they say to go by. I note that you went directly to politics. I'll admit I am a little creeped out by people who can't separate religion from politics. Is that what you are talking about.

I said, it affects everything, life in general. So you're focusing on the wrong thing, that was just one example, but it could apply to just about anything.

 

[buttercup]

But it's alright. Everybody doesn't always have to agree on everything. So long as everybody all agrees that we should all be free anyway.

Amen! I haven't heard that phrase in a while, but I wholeheartedly agree.

 

[Thunk]

I'm pretty sure that it's something God will give us more of when we ask.

Absolutely! I have...and He did!