The Lies of Franklin Roosevelt

[PoliticalChic]

No. But thanks so much for asking.

Let's see, what might you have accomplished in your 30 something years (?). A career? No, not with the amount of time you spend proselytizing on this forum (and I presume others); Marriage and a family? No, not likely - divorce and several "get lost, you lying scum" failed relationships seems likely; does she own a dog or a cat? I doubt it, narcissists aren't usually into caring for others - human or animal (though she may own a cat and use it like a 'beard').

And really, what is her agenda if not what I suggested?

I had a blossoming career as a life guard until some blue kid got me fired.

Get lost, you lying scum.

No, but thanks for asking. I see CrusaderFrank thanked you, you must be so proud. When I think of the body of work produced by those who find you to be brilliant, witty and clever, I'm truly amazed. Amazed someone would 'show their face' after getting praise from the village idiots.

BTW, do you have a cat?

There seems to be a pattern here....

First you fabricate charges about my posts, lies, that, like you....are totally without merit.

Now you make requests for personal information about my private life.




I fully understand a lesser being like you, having a fascination with my abilities, and charms....but, face facts: you have as much hope here as you've had in every other relationship you endeavored.



You not only sound like an imbecile, but I'll hazard a guess you look exactly like one too


I'll bet you're so ugly when you walk into a bank, they turn the cameras off!



Off with you, lying scum.

 

[PoliticalChic]

The blanket term "Lies" is too far reaching in any honest analysis, IMO, rather a critical look at what occurred.

FDR believed that capitalism and excessive competition were responsible for the failed economy and implemented over bearing government intervention which was deemed unconstitutional and prolonged the great depression.

"The policies were contained in the National Industrial Recovery Act (NIRA), which exempted industries from antitrust prosecution if they agreed to enter into collective bargaining agreements that significantly raised wages. Because protection from antitrust prosecution all but ensured higher prices for goods and services, a wide range of industries took the bait, Cole and Ohanian found. By 1934 more than 500 industries, which accounted for nearly 80 percent of private, non-agricultural employment, had entered into the collective bargaining agreements called for under NIRA.

Cole and Ohanian calculate that NIRA and its aftermath account for 60 percent of the weak recovery. Without the policies, they contend that the Depression would have ended in 1936 instead of the year when they believe the slump actually ended: 1943.

Even after being deemed unconstitutional, Roosevelt's anti-competition policies persisted — albeit under a different guise, the scholars found. Ohanian and Cole painstakingly documented the extent to which the Roosevelt administration looked the other way as industries once protected by NIRA continued to engage in price-fixing practices for four more years...."
FDR's policies prolonged Depression by 7 years, UCLA economists calculate / UCLA Newsroom

If I were a mindless hack spouting off anything which furthers my agenda I would call FDR a Communist. Thankfully, I am a pragmatist who just wants to get at the truth regardless of the label.

Too much government interference hampers free enterprise as FDR's policies demonstrate and a laissez faire approach to economic growth and stability should always take precedence over government intervention.

Sorry, Connery.....

While a most interesting post, it is not one that is applicable in this thread.

I certainly attack Roosevelt's economic policies....regularly....but this OP deals entirely with foreign policy.



The thrust is that FDR was willing to overlook all of the homicidal policies of Stalin, and convince Americans that the USSR was a noble partner for our democracy.

Not only was that a lie, but it allowed the Evil Empire to a flourish.....and communism to grow in our nation with severe and deleterious effect.



The Holocaust, the Ukrainian Terror Famine, the blood purges, the Katyn Forest massacre, the Korean War, Mao's slaughter of millions,....all can be traced to FDR's foreign policy vis-a-vis Stalin.

And, yes...I can back up everything in that perspective.



I hope you have the time and interest to comment on said view.

 

[Connery]

The blanket term "Lies" is too far reaching in any honest analysis, IMO, rather a critical look at what occurred.

FDR believed that capitalism and excessive competition were responsible for the failed economy and implemented over bearing government intervention which was deemed unconstitutional and prolonged the great depression.

"The policies were contained in the National Industrial Recovery Act (NIRA), which exempted industries from antitrust prosecution if they agreed to enter into collective bargaining agreements that significantly raised wages. Because protection from antitrust prosecution all but ensured higher prices for goods and services, a wide range of industries took the bait, Cole and Ohanian found. By 1934 more than 500 industries, which accounted for nearly 80 percent of private, non-agricultural employment, had entered into the collective bargaining agreements called for under NIRA.

Cole and Ohanian calculate that NIRA and its aftermath account for 60 percent of the weak recovery. Without the policies, they contend that the Depression would have ended in 1936 instead of the year when they believe the slump actually ended: 1943.

Even after being deemed unconstitutional, Roosevelt's anti-competition policies persisted — albeit under a different guise, the scholars found. Ohanian and Cole painstakingly documented the extent to which the Roosevelt administration looked the other way as industries once protected by NIRA continued to engage in price-fixing practices for four more years...."
FDR's policies prolonged Depression by 7 years, UCLA economists calculate / UCLA Newsroom

If I were a mindless hack spouting off anything which furthers my agenda I would call FDR a Communist. Thankfully, I am a pragmatist who just wants to get at the truth regardless of the label.

Too much government interference hampers free enterprise as FDR's policies demonstrate and a laissez faire approach to economic growth and stability should always take precedence over government intervention.

Sorry, Connery.....

While a most interesting post, it is not one that is applicable in this thread.

I certainly attack Roosevelt's economic policies....regularly....but this OP deals entirely with foreign policy.



The thrust is that FDR was willing to overlook all of the homicidal policies of Stalin, and convince Americans that the USSR was a noble partner for our democracy.

Not only was that a lie, but it allowed the Evil Empire to a flourish.....and communism to grow in our nation with severe and deleterious effect.



The Holocaust, the Ukrainian Terror Famine, the blood purges, the Katyn Forest massacre, the Korean War, Mao's slaughter of millions,....all can be traced to FDR's foreign policy vis-a-vis Stalin.

And, yes...I can back up everything in that perspective.



I hope you have the time and interest to comment on said view.

When I saw your term communism I naturally was thinking about:

com·mu·nism
noun \ˈkäm-yə-ˌni-zəm, -yü-\

: a way of organizing a society in which the government owns the things that are used to make and transport products (such as land, oil, factories, ships, etc.) and there is no privately owned property

Communism - Definition and More from the Free Merriam-Webster Dictionary


You are very difficult to understand sometimes....

 

[PoliticalChic]

The blanket term "Lies" is too far reaching in any honest analysis, IMO, rather a critical look at what occurred.

FDR believed that capitalism and excessive competition were responsible for the failed economy and implemented over bearing government intervention which was deemed unconstitutional and prolonged the great depression.

"The policies were contained in the National Industrial Recovery Act (NIRA), which exempted industries from antitrust prosecution if they agreed to enter into collective bargaining agreements that significantly raised wages. Because protection from antitrust prosecution all but ensured higher prices for goods and services, a wide range of industries took the bait, Cole and Ohanian found. By 1934 more than 500 industries, which accounted for nearly 80 percent of private, non-agricultural employment, had entered into the collective bargaining agreements called for under NIRA.

Cole and Ohanian calculate that NIRA and its aftermath account for 60 percent of the weak recovery. Without the policies, they contend that the Depression would have ended in 1936 instead of the year when they believe the slump actually ended: 1943.

Even after being deemed unconstitutional, Roosevelt's anti-competition policies persisted — albeit under a different guise, the scholars found. Ohanian and Cole painstakingly documented the extent to which the Roosevelt administration looked the other way as industries once protected by NIRA continued to engage in price-fixing practices for four more years...."
FDR's policies prolonged Depression by 7 years, UCLA economists calculate / UCLA Newsroom

If I were a mindless hack spouting off anything which furthers my agenda I would call FDR a Communist. Thankfully, I am a pragmatist who just wants to get at the truth regardless of the label.

Too much government interference hampers free enterprise as FDR's policies demonstrate and a laissez faire approach to economic growth and stability should always take precedence over government intervention.

Sorry, Connery.....

While a most interesting post, it is not one that is applicable in this thread.

I certainly attack Roosevelt's economic policies....regularly....but this OP deals entirely with foreign policy.



The thrust is that FDR was willing to overlook all of the homicidal policies of Stalin, and convince Americans that the USSR was a noble partner for our democracy.

Not only was that a lie, but it allowed the Evil Empire to a flourish.....and communism to grow in our nation with severe and deleterious effect.



The Holocaust, the Ukrainian Terror Famine, the blood purges, the Katyn Forest massacre, the Korean War, Mao's slaughter of millions,....all can be traced to FDR's foreign policy vis-a-vis Stalin.

And, yes...I can back up everything in that perspective.



I hope you have the time and interest to comment on said view.

When I saw your term communism I naturally was thinking about:

com·mu·nism
noun \ˈkäm-yə-ˌni-zəm, -yü-\

: a way of organizing a society in which the government owns the things that are used to make and transport products (such as land, oil, factories, ships, etc.) and there is no privately owned property

Communism - Definition and More from the Free Merriam-Webster Dictionary


You are very difficult to understand sometimes....

1. "You are very difficult to understand sometimes..."

I doubt that such is the case for one of your intelligence....if you actually read the OP to which you were ostensibly replying.....




2. The communism in question is that of Karl Marx....

This communism:
Lenin believed in Utopia, a harmony reached only after certain groups of people are killed: the 'War of Classes'.
'Initially, wherever communists come to power, Russia, Cuba, Poland, Nicaragua, China, it doesn't matter- they destroy about 10% of the people. They are not enemies...best intellectuals, best workers, best engineers...doesn't matter. It is to restructure the fabric of society, a form of social engineering."
Vladimir Bukovsky.


3. And, to return to the OP....this is what Franklin Roosevelt decided to attach America to in November of 1933.

a. FDR came into office March 4th of 1933. On November 16, 1933, President Roosevelt rushed to embrace....recognize...the USSR. If this act, based on FDR's additional pro-Soviet endeavors, was rational....then these folks must have been irrational:

"Four Presidents and their six Secretaries of State for over a decade and a half held to this resolve," i.e., refusal to recognize the Soviet government. That was written by Herbert Hoover, one of those four Presidents. He wrote it in his "Freedom Betrayed: Herbert Hoover's Secret History of the Second World War and Its Aftermath" by George H. Nash, published posthumously, obviously, in 2011, pg 24-29.


b. Bear in mind, eight months earlier, journalist Gareth Jones had exposed Stalin's Terror Famine: "In the train a Communist denied to me that there was a famine. I flung a crust of bread which I had been eating from my own supply into a spittoon. A peasant fellow-passenger fished it out and ravenously ate it." http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gareth_Jones_(journalist)

c. Malcolm Muggeridge " was the first writer to reveal the true nature of Stalin's regime when in 1933 he exposed the terror famine in the Ukraine. " [ame=http://www.amazon.com/Time-Eternity-Uncollected-Writings-Muggeridge/dp/1570759057]Time and Eternity: The Uncollected Writings of Malcolm Muggeridge: Malcolm Muggeridge, Nicholas Flynn: 9781570759055: Amazon.com: Books[/ame]

So FDR knew of the Terror Famine...yet he enveloped Joe Stalin in " the cloak of his popularity..." Time Magazine, December 17, 1934.



I'd be happy to provide Dunn's 'convergence' theory that he developed to explain FDR's insane alliance with this sociopathic regime.

 

[Connery]

Sorry, Connery.....

While a most interesting post, it is not one that is applicable in this thread.

I certainly attack Roosevelt's economic policies....regularly....but this OP deals entirely with foreign policy.



The thrust is that FDR was willing to overlook all of the homicidal policies of Stalin, and convince Americans that the USSR was a noble partner for our democracy.

Not only was that a lie, but it allowed the Evil Empire to a flourish.....and communism to grow in our nation with severe and deleterious effect.



The Holocaust, the Ukrainian Terror Famine, the blood purges, the Katyn Forest massacre, the Korean War, Mao's slaughter of millions,....all can be traced to FDR's foreign policy vis-a-vis Stalin.

And, yes...I can back up everything in that perspective.



I hope you have the time and interest to comment on said view.

When I saw your term communism I naturally was thinking about:

com·mu·nism
noun \ˈkäm-yə-ˌni-zəm, -yü-\

: a way of organizing a society in which the government owns the things that are used to make and transport products (such as land, oil, factories, ships, etc.) and there is no privately owned property

Communism - Definition and More from the Free Merriam-Webster Dictionary


You are very difficult to understand sometimes....

if you actually read the OP

Thanks for your reply, I should have done more than take a quick glance.... and spend the normal amount of time I do deciphering your writings.

 

[Book of Jeremiah]

FDR had a little white house built in Warm Springs, Ga. due to the healing properties in the Springs there. He stayed there during the summer. His mistress stayed there with him. It was common knowledge in Warm Springs that Eleanor's secretary was his mistess. She offered to divorce him but he declined the offer fearing it would harm his reputation. The Little White House is now a museum which includes the original furnishings - his personal belongings, etc. I've seen it. Quite a story behind the scenes for FDR.

Interesting.
"She offered to divorce him but he declined the offer fearing it would harm his reputation."
I've read that she threatened to divorce him...but he promised to break it off with Mercer.....he lied. This was way before his presidency.
Her house in Hyde Park also has original furnishings.



I've visited his home, and Eleanor's- they are separate- at Hyde Park....and been to the FDR Presidential Library.





What I found amusing was the attached building, the Henry A. Wallace Visitor and Education Center.


Wallace, was one of Roosevelt's three vice presidents......and a total dupe of the communists.

He insisted that peace would be assured “if the United States guaranteed Stalin control of Eastern Europe.” (Ronad Radosh, “Progressively Worse,” The New Republic, June 12, 2000)
When Stalin seized Czechoslovakia, Wallace sided with Stalin. When Stalin blockaded Berlin, Wallace opposed the Berlin Airlift. After visiting a Soviet slave camp, Wallace enthusiastically described it a s a “combination TVA and Hudson Bay Company.”
Ibid






Had not, as the Declaration of Independence notes, the Supreme Judge of the world mandated that FDR live long enough for Wallace to be replaced by Truman......Stalin would have had another dupe in the Oval Office.



Are you familiar with the old trivia question, what was Eleanor Roosevelt's maiden name?

I would have thought she'd threaten him at the very least, PC. The person who gave the tour at The Little White House said Eleanor actually offered him the divorce so he could marry her but because of his political future - fear of harm to his reputation he decided against it. From the photographs / tour it doesn't look like he took Eleanor's threats seriously. Mercer's bedroom was right next to his. ( at Warm Springs ) FDR was responsible for the deaths of the Jews seeking asylum during WWII. He refused to grant the Jews refuge and forced them to sail back to Europe where they perished. The man was utterly despicable. No conscience whatsoever...

I would love to see what you could find out about Hoover & the FBI. I was told there was never any confirmation about his actual date of birth - where he came from, etc.

As to what you have uncovered concerning FDR & Wallace -amazing! Thank you!

note* I never heard of the trivia question what was Eleanor's maiden name.

 

[PoliticalChic]

FDR had a little white house built in Warm Springs, Ga. due to the healing properties in the Springs there. He stayed there during the summer. His mistress stayed there with him. It was common knowledge in Warm Springs that Eleanor's secretary was his mistess. She offered to divorce him but he declined the offer fearing it would harm his reputation. The Little White House is now a museum which includes the original furnishings - his personal belongings, etc. I've seen it. Quite a story behind the scenes for FDR.

Interesting.
"She offered to divorce him but he declined the offer fearing it would harm his reputation."
I've read that she threatened to divorce him...but he promised to break it off with Mercer.....he lied. This was way before his presidency.
Her house in Hyde Park also has original furnishings.



I've visited his home, and Eleanor's- they are separate- at Hyde Park....and been to the FDR Presidential Library.





What I found amusing was the attached building, the Henry A. Wallace Visitor and Education Center.


Wallace, was one of Roosevelt's three vice presidents......and a total dupe of the communists.

He insisted that peace would be assured “if the United States guaranteed Stalin control of Eastern Europe.” (Ronad Radosh, “Progressively Worse,” The New Republic, June 12, 2000)
When Stalin seized Czechoslovakia, Wallace sided with Stalin. When Stalin blockaded Berlin, Wallace opposed the Berlin Airlift. After visiting a Soviet slave camp, Wallace enthusiastically described it a s a “combination TVA and Hudson Bay Company.”
Ibid






Had not, as the Declaration of Independence notes, the Supreme Judge of the world mandated that FDR live long enough for Wallace to be replaced by Truman......Stalin would have had another dupe in the Oval Office.



Are you familiar with the old trivia question, what was Eleanor Roosevelt's maiden name?

I would have thought she'd threaten him at the very least, PC. The person who gave the tour at The Little White House said Eleanor actually offered him the divorce so he could marry her but because of his political future - fear of harm to his reputation he decided against it. From the photographs / tour it doesn't look like he took Eleanor's threats seriously. Mercer's bedroom was right next to his. ( at Warm Springs ) FDR was responsible for the deaths of the Jews seeking asylum during WWII. He refused to grant the Jews refuge and forced them to sail back to Europe where they perished. The man was utterly despicable. No conscience whatsoever...

I would love to see what you could find out about Hoover & the FBI. I was told there was never any confirmation about his actual date of birth - where he came from, etc.

As to what you have uncovered concerning FDR & Wallace -amazing! Thank you!

note* I never heard of the trivia question what was Eleanor's maiden name.

Thank you for that post.

1. Eleanor's maiden name was Roosevelt...they were cousins.


2. In addition to your reference to the St. Louis, and the Jews....let's remember that his confinement of Japanese Americans was a political rather than military machination.

3. AND....his very first appointment to the Supreme Court was a KKKer who embroiled all of in the bogus 'separation of church and state' movement, to erase religion from the public arena.

a. Hugo Black was his first, in 1937. This KKK Senator from Alabama wrote the majority decision on Korematsu v. US; in 1967, he said ‘They all look alike to a person not a Jap.” Engage: Conversations in Philosophy: "They all look alike to a person not a Jap"*: The Legacy of Korematsu at OSU

b. Hugo Black's anti-Catholic bias, which showed up in his actions on the Supreme Court:
"... Black was head of new members for the largest Klan cell in the South. New members of the KKK had to pledge their allegiance to the “eternal separation of Church and State.”... Separation was a crucial part of the KKK’s jurisprudential agenda. It was included in the Klansman’s Creed..."
Egnorance: Hugo Black and the real history of "the wall of separation between church and state"

 

[PoliticalChic]

When I saw your term communism I naturally was thinking about:

com·mu·nism
noun \ˈkäm-yə-ˌni-zəm, -yü-\

: a way of organizing a society in which the government owns the things that are used to make and transport products (such as land, oil, factories, ships, etc.) and there is no privately owned property

Communism - Definition and More from the Free Merriam-Webster Dictionary


You are very difficult to understand sometimes....

if you actually read the OP

Thanks for your reply, I should have done more than take a quick glance.... and spend the normal amount of time I do deciphering your writings.

Watch your step, Connery.....or I may start posting in the Occitan language.....

 

[Connery]

if you actually read the OP

Thanks for your reply, I should have done more than take a quick glance.... and spend the normal amount of time I do deciphering your writings.

Watch your step, Connery.....or I may start posting in the Occitan language.....

I may understand you better as I speak Bronx....

BTW very nice topic!!!!!

 

[regent]

Posters go through all these tid-bits of history to find fault with FDR, and certainly in twelve years of presidency, the Great Depression and World War II, there are many areas and many decisions where faults can be found. Yet, when push comes to shove in rating presidents historians, including conservative historians, have always rated FDR in the top three, with Lincoln and Washington. In the last rating, however, historians moved FDR from one of the top three to number one. The answer to that rating by some, is to label historians as communists, and non-thnkers as they are, but what of the American people, they elected FDR four times a record that will stand for some time. Were they communists too? So we can verify that the people that lived through that Great Depression and World War II, plus the historians agree on FDR's rating.
The question for conservatives and FDR haters is how do you combat the people that voted for FDR four times and the historians and presidential experts? Well other than calling FDR a communist, his marriage, his dog Fala, (yep, they went after
fdr's dog) plus nit picking mistakes in history not much. It's all in the history books.

 

[PoliticalChic]

Posters go through all these tid-bits of history to find fault with FDR, and certainly in twelve years of presidency, the Great Depression and World War II, there are many areas and many decisions where faults can be found. Yet, when push comes to shove in rating presidents historians, including conservative historians, have always rated FDR in the top three, with Lincoln and Washington. In the last rating, however, historians moved FDR from one of the top three to number one. The answer to that rating by some, is to label historians as communists, and non-thnkers as they are, but what of the American people, they elected FDR four times a record that will stand for some time. Were they communists too? So we can verify that the people that lived through that Great Depression and World War II, plus the historians agree on FDR's rating.
The question for conservatives and FDR haters is how do you combat the people that voted for FDR four times and the historians and presidential experts? Well other than calling FDR a communist, his marriage, his dog Fala, (yep, they went after
fdr's dog) plus nit picking mistakes in history not much. It's all in the history books.

An interesting comment.

BTW...I could list a dozen advances for society to FDR's credit....and did so on his birthday.

And you write...
"there are many areas and many decisions where faults can be found."

So, you agree with all..most....or many of the faults that I have posted over the months.
OK.


The difference in our perspectives is this: the weight on each side of the scale.


Perhaps this is too limiting as a summary....but I cannot forgive the damage to the fabric of American society and culture by acknowledging the material good that FDR did for the folks.

He told us that we were just like the Soviets....or, the same thing, that they were just like us.

 

[regent]

Posters go through all these tid-bits of history to find fault with FDR, and certainly in twelve years of presidency, the Great Depression and World War II, there are many areas and many decisions where faults can be found. Yet, when push comes to shove in rating presidents historians, including conservative historians, have always rated FDR in the top three, with Lincoln and Washington. In the last rating, however, historians moved FDR from one of the top three to number one. The answer to that rating by some, is to label historians as communists, and non-thnkers as they are, but what of the American people, they elected FDR four times a record that will stand for some time. Were they communists too? So we can verify that the people that lived through that Great Depression and World War II, plus the historians agree on FDR's rating.
The question for conservatives and FDR haters is how do you combat the people that voted for FDR four times and the historians and presidential experts? Well other than calling FDR a communist, his marriage, his dog Fala, (yep, they went after
fdr's dog) plus nit picking mistakes in history not much. It's all in the history books.

An interesting comment.

BTW...I could list a dozen advances for society to FDR's credit....and did so on his birthday.

And you write...
"there are many areas and many decisions where faults can be found."

So, you agree with all..most....or many of the faults that I have posted over the months.
OK.


The difference in our perspectives is this: the weight on each side of the scale.


Perhaps this is too limiting as a summary....but I cannot forgive the damage to the fabric of American society and culture by acknowledging the material good that FDR did for the folks.

He told us that we were just like the Soviets....or, the same thing, that they were just like us.

The problem with selecting isolated faults on a piecemeal basis is the larger historical picture, is often omitted. Add to that from the Monday morning quarter-back position we can not only look at the mistake but present a different action as the correct one. Posters on these boards are limited in giving the whole historical picture but not in labeling historical mistakes or their version of the proper solution.
Professional historians often do the same but other historians point out their errors. For example, Beard wrote a history saying that the framers in writing the Constitution intended it to be for the benefit of the wealthy and for themselves. Other historians called Beard on his interpretation and Beard accepted the criticisms. Eventually historians get history correct.
As to your tid-bit of history that FDR said we were like the Soviets, if true, what was the larger picture at the time, what was FDR's intent. Did FDR mean we were like the Soviets in that we were communists, or that we were like the Soviets in that we were both fighting Germany, or other? And a good historian would ask what was the significant or importance of the statement.

 

[Billo_Really]

FU to all those who would knock FR.

 

[PoliticalChic]

FU to all those who would knock FR.

Liberal post, such as yours, always leave one with the conundrum.....deciding whether it is more classy or more insightful.


Dunce.

 

[PoliticalChic]

Posters go through all these tid-bits of history to find fault with FDR, and certainly in twelve years of presidency, the Great Depression and World War II, there are many areas and many decisions where faults can be found. Yet, when push comes to shove in rating presidents historians, including conservative historians, have always rated FDR in the top three, with Lincoln and Washington. In the last rating, however, historians moved FDR from one of the top three to number one. The answer to that rating by some, is to label historians as communists, and non-thnkers as they are, but what of the American people, they elected FDR four times a record that will stand for some time. Were they communists too? So we can verify that the people that lived through that Great Depression and World War II, plus the historians agree on FDR's rating.
The question for conservatives and FDR haters is how do you combat the people that voted for FDR four times and the historians and presidential experts? Well other than calling FDR a communist, his marriage, his dog Fala, (yep, they went after
fdr's dog) plus nit picking mistakes in history not much. It's all in the history books.

An interesting comment.

BTW...I could list a dozen advances for society to FDR's credit....and did so on his birthday.

And you write...
"there are many areas and many decisions where faults can be found."

So, you agree with all..most....or many of the faults that I have posted over the months.
OK.


The difference in our perspectives is this: the weight on each side of the scale.


Perhaps this is too limiting as a summary....but I cannot forgive the damage to the fabric of American society and culture by acknowledging the material good that FDR did for the folks.

He told us that we were just like the Soviets....or, the same thing, that they were just like us.

The problem with selecting isolated faults on a piecemeal basis is the larger historical picture, is often omitted. Add to that from the Monday morning quarter-back position we can not only look at the mistake but present a different action as the correct one. Posters on these boards are limited in giving the whole historical picture but not in labeling historical mistakes or their version of the proper solution.
Professional historians often do the same but other historians point out their errors. For example, Beard wrote a history saying that the framers in writing the Constitution intended it to be for the benefit of the wealthy and for themselves. Other historians called Beard on his interpretation and Beard accepted the criticisms. Eventually historians get history correct.
As to your tid-bit of history that FDR said we were like the Soviets, if true, what was the larger picture at the time, what was FDR's intent. Did FDR mean we were like the Soviets in that we were communists, or that we were like the Soviets in that we were both fighting Germany, or other? And a good historian would ask what was the significant or importance of the statement.

1. "The problem with selecting isolated faults on a piecemeal basis...."

I haven't done that. I've provided numerous examples, documented and linked, designed to lead to the overwhelming conclusion about FDR and the Soviets.


2. ".... is the larger historical picture, is often omitted."

As you haven't denied what I have provided....I would be more than appreciative if you would give some explanation of FDR's propensities in said regard......giving the larger picture.


No one has been able to do so. I await your insight.



3. "...look at the mistake but present a different action as the correct one."
I did so....here:
http://www.usmessageboard.com/history/329174-fdr-and-what-could-have-been.html




4. "As to your tid-bit of history that FDR said we were like the Soviets, if true, what was the larger picture at the time, what was FDR's intent. Did FDR mean we were like the Soviets in that we were communists, or that we were like the Soviets in that we were both fighting Germany, or other?"

William Bullitt was FDR's first ambassador to Moscow.....and began as a supporter of the communists.
He became a strong anti-communist and his warnings to Roosevelt were ignored.

And the officers of the Foreign Service who opposed communism were purged....as per the demands of Stalin.

"...or that we were like the Soviets in that we were both fighting Germany, or other?"

We weren't fighting Germany in 1933, when FDR first recognized the USSR, even though he knew that Stalin had killed more of his own people than Hitler, later, would.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

It's too bad that this post goes in "History," because the FDR endeavors are largely responsible for the social breakdown we face today....
Under Roosevelt's alignment with Soviet communism the United States "exchanged foundational principles and guiding ideas" for some sort of vain, destructive, moral relativity.






1. Behind FDR's lies and actions which served to cover and support Stalin's murderous regime had to be the belief that, either,
FDR was a devotee of communism and anticipated imposing it on America..
....or, that he believed that he could incorporate Stalin into an organization with himself as the 'CEO.'

The former explanation would represent illimitable evil.....the latter, abysmal ignorance.





2. There is the false notion that FDR's infatuations began due to a need for the Soviet Union's aid in WWII, .....but he rushed to recognize them in 1933- was the first hint.

Is 'infatuation' too strong? Was there kind of political romance with Stalin?
Consider the following pieces of the puzzle before you consider it hyperbolic:

a. As former ambassador to the Soviet Union, William Bullitt, queried him about why he, FDR, persuaded the public that "communists had become the friends of democracy" and that he should remind all "that Communists in the United States are just as dangerous enemies as ever, and should not be allowed to crawl into our productive mechanism in order later to wreck it when they get new orders from somewhere abroad."
"For the President Personal & Secret: Correspondence Between Franklin D. Roosevelt and William C. Bullitt," Orville H. Bullitt, p. 522

b. Roosevelt threw himself into shoring up the USSR at any cost- in July of 1942 he lost 23 out of 34 ships in just one Lend-Lease supply voyage...

c. ...151,000 troops were left unsupplied in the Philippines....think Bataan Death March...

d. ....the British colony of Singapore was left without air cover in order to satisfy Stalin's desire for the planes. Found in Paul Johnson's "Modern Times," 'included 200 modern fighter aircraft, originally intended for Britain's highly vulnerable base in Singapore, which had no modern fighters at all. The diversion of these aircraft, plus tanks, to Russia sealed the fate of Singapore." Johnson, Op.Cit., p. 386.
Singapore fell February 15, 1942.

e. ...Roosevelt purged anti-communist Foreign Service officers when given a "list of officials who were supposedly undermining American relations with Russia" by Soviet Foreign Minister Litvinov. The purges began in 1937, and, irony of irony, Litvinov was dragged out of his position and replaced with Molotov, by Stalin, because Litvinov was Jewish, and Stalin had treaties with Hitler.

f. The New Deal 'reorganization' of the State Department called for the destruction of "the best Soviet Library in the United States." (according to Loy Henderson, Soviet and Eastern European Affairs Officer, State Department.) The 'Library' was broken up and dispersed among various files in the Library of Congress.
"Blacklisted by History: The Untold Story of Senator Joe McCarthy and His Fight Against America's Enemies" by M. Stanton Evans, p. 83-84




3. Representative Martin Dies formed a committed to investigate communism, but found that government archives of communist records and correspondence had been destroyed. He wrote: "I was informed, confidentially, by a man well placed in the Department of Justice, that they were destroyed after it was learned that the Dies Committee was determined to conduct a full-scale investigation of Communism."
It was Harry Hopkins, FDR's White House live-in Soviet spy, who turned down Dies' request of assistance from Roosevelt to help furnish the nascent committee with a staff of lawyers, investigators and stenographers.
Dies, "Martin Dies' Story," p. 64.

a. Although the reference 'card-carrying Communist' was once accurate, the CPUSA stopped issuing cards once the Dies Committee began hearings. The highest membership serial number that his committee came across was 195,762.
'Given that Communists strive for quality, it was amazing tht they had been able to grow from 10,000 aliens in 1919 to nearly 200,000 members in 1938, mostly naive born or naturalized citizens."
Dies, Ibid, p. 62-63.




4. Remarkable as the attempt to make files inaccessible seems, it is just as common during Obama's term, during which both the Justice Department and the Pentagon have overseen the methodical purges of "anti-Islamic" educational materials from security and military files and training courses.
Diana West, "American Betrayal," chapter one.




5. "Because the American way and the Soviet system were diametrically opposed, FDR had to lie to present common ground to the American people. In order to make his Big Lie stick, he also had to remove the people who knew better. Literally. On a larger, more punitive scale, [Victor] Kravchenko discussed the same process."
West, Ibid, p. 247.


Kravchenko wrote, of his Soviet experiences:

"Shamelessly, without so much as an explanation, it revised half a century of Russian history. I don't mean simply that it falsified some facts or gave a new interpretation of events. I mean that it deliberately stood history on its head, expunging events and inventing facts.

It twisted the recent past--a past still fresh in millions of memories--into new and bizarre shapes, to conform with the version of affairs presented by the blood-purge trials and the accompanying propaganda... The roles of leading historical figures were perverted or altogether erased.... More than that, living witnesses, as far as possible, were removed. The directing staff of the Institute of Marx, Engels and Lenin in Moscow, repository of ideological truth, were removed and the more important people among them imprisoned or shot."
Text collection


And that is what FDR did in America.

...did to America.

"In 1926, Roosevelt started the non-profit Georgia Warm Springs Foundation on the site of the springs he visited to partake of the waters' therapeutic effects. Twelve years later, he reinvented the charity as the National Foundation for Infantile Paralysis (NFIP). The NFIP was a non-partisan association of health scientists and volunteers that helped fund research for a polio vaccine and assisted victims on the long path through physical rehabilitation. Funded originally through the generosity of wealthy celebrities at yearly President's Birthday Balls, the foundation could not raise money fast enough to keep pace with polio's continued toll on America's children and, during the Depression, the polio epidemic worsened. In 1938, Roosevelt decided to appeal to the general public for help. At one fundraiser, celebrity singer Eddie Cantor jokingly urged the public to send dimes to the president, coining the term March of Dimes. The public took his appeal seriously, flooding the White House with 2,680,000 dimes and thousands of dollars in donations"

Franklin Roosevelt founds March of Dimes ? History.com This Day in History ? 1/3/1938

What has PoliticalChic done in her miserable life besides spread hate, fear and partisanship in an effort to further divide our country?

What is her agenda? Besides character assassinations and the RED SCARE?

March of Dimes?

Did you read the OP before that non-sequitar response?

 

[Connery]

It's too bad that this post goes in "History," because the FDR endeavors are largely responsible for the social breakdown we face today....
Under Roosevelt's alignment with Soviet communism the United States "exchanged foundational principles and guiding ideas" for some sort of vain, destructive, moral relativity.






1. Behind FDR's lies and actions which served to cover and support Stalin's murderous regime had to be the belief that, either,
FDR was a devotee of communism and anticipated imposing it on America..
....or, that he believed that he could incorporate Stalin into an organization with himself as the 'CEO.'

The former explanation would represent illimitable evil.....the latter, abysmal ignorance.





2. There is the false notion that FDR's infatuations began due to a need for the Soviet Union's aid in WWII, .....but he rushed to recognize them in 1933- was the first hint.

Is 'infatuation' too strong? Was there kind of political romance with Stalin?
Consider the following pieces of the puzzle before you consider it hyperbolic:

a. As former ambassador to the Soviet Union, William Bullitt, queried him about why he, FDR, persuaded the public that "communists had become the friends of democracy" and that he should remind all "that Communists in the United States are just as dangerous enemies as ever, and should not be allowed to crawl into our productive mechanism in order later to wreck it when they get new orders from somewhere abroad."
"For the President Personal & Secret: Correspondence Between Franklin D. Roosevelt and William C. Bullitt," Orville H. Bullitt, p. 522

b. Roosevelt threw himself into shoring up the USSR at any cost- in July of 1942 he lost 23 out of 34 ships in just one Lend-Lease supply voyage...

c. ...151,000 troops were left unsupplied in the Philippines....think Bataan Death March...

d. ....the British colony of Singapore was left without air cover in order to satisfy Stalin's desire for the planes. Found in Paul Johnson's "Modern Times," 'included 200 modern fighter aircraft, originally intended for Britain's highly vulnerable base in Singapore, which had no modern fighters at all. The diversion of these aircraft, plus tanks, to Russia sealed the fate of Singapore." Johnson, Op.Cit., p. 386.
Singapore fell February 15, 1942.

e. ...Roosevelt purged anti-communist Foreign Service officers when given a "list of officials who were supposedly undermining American relations with Russia" by Soviet Foreign Minister Litvinov. The purges began in 1937, and, irony of irony, Litvinov was dragged out of his position and replaced with Molotov, by Stalin, because Litvinov was Jewish, and Stalin had treaties with Hitler.

f. The New Deal 'reorganization' of the State Department called for the destruction of "the best Soviet Library in the United States." (according to Loy Henderson, Soviet and Eastern European Affairs Officer, State Department.) The 'Library' was broken up and dispersed among various files in the Library of Congress.
"Blacklisted by History: The Untold Story of Senator Joe McCarthy and His Fight Against America's Enemies" by M. Stanton Evans, p. 83-84




3. Representative Martin Dies formed a committed to investigate communism, but found that government archives of communist records and correspondence had been destroyed. He wrote: "I was informed, confidentially, by a man well placed in the Department of Justice, that they were destroyed after it was learned that the Dies Committee was determined to conduct a full-scale investigation of Communism."
It was Harry Hopkins, FDR's White House live-in Soviet spy, who turned down Dies' request of assistance from Roosevelt to help furnish the nascent committee with a staff of lawyers, investigators and stenographers.
Dies, "Martin Dies' Story," p. 64.

a. Although the reference 'card-carrying Communist' was once accurate, the CPUSA stopped issuing cards once the Dies Committee began hearings. The highest membership serial number that his committee came across was 195,762.
'Given that Communists strive for quality, it was amazing tht they had been able to grow from 10,000 aliens in 1919 to nearly 200,000 members in 1938, mostly naive born or naturalized citizens."
Dies, Ibid, p. 62-63.




4. Remarkable as the attempt to make files inaccessible seems, it is just as common during Obama's term, during which both the Justice Department and the Pentagon have overseen the methodical purges of "anti-Islamic" educational materials from security and military files and training courses.
Diana West, "American Betrayal," chapter one.




5. "Because the American way and the Soviet system were diametrically opposed, FDR had to lie to present common ground to the American people. In order to make his Big Lie stick, he also had to remove the people who knew better. Literally. On a larger, more punitive scale, [Victor] Kravchenko discussed the same process."
West, Ibid, p. 247.


Kravchenko wrote, of his Soviet experiences:

"Shamelessly, without so much as an explanation, it revised half a century of Russian history. I don't mean simply that it falsified some facts or gave a new interpretation of events. I mean that it deliberately stood history on its head, expunging events and inventing facts.

It twisted the recent past--a past still fresh in millions of memories--into new and bizarre shapes, to conform with the version of affairs presented by the blood-purge trials and the accompanying propaganda... The roles of leading historical figures were perverted or altogether erased.... More than that, living witnesses, as far as possible, were removed. The directing staff of the Institute of Marx, Engels and Lenin in Moscow, repository of ideological truth, were removed and the more important people among them imprisoned or shot."
Text collection


And that is what FDR did in America.

...did to America.

I finally had the time to properly devote to your op, my apologies. I am working on another aspect of FDR's presidency.

Your post was very interesting and insightful. My view is that FDR was the master manipulator of the 20th century who would go to any lengths to foster his vision of what the US should be and his relationship with Stalin is no different.

In his correspondence with Stalin FDR clearly sees a post war relationship between Russia and the US on all levels and sought to include Stalin on many levels including creating an economic infrastructure linking the US and Russia.

The book My Dear Mr. Stalin: The Complete Correspondence of Franklin D. Roosevelt and Joseph V. Stalin, Susan Butler, ed; with a Foreword by Arthur Schlesinger, Jr., New Haven: Yale University Press, 2005 demonstartes the relationship between the two


"The two also discussed the importance of post-war economic cooperation. Russia, which had suffered enormous losses of men and matériel during the war, was eager to secure a major loan for post-war reconstruction. On Feb. 23, 1944, Roosevelt wrote to Stalin about the Bretton Woods conference. "What I am raising here is the question of further steps toward the establishment of United Nations machinery for post-war economic collaboration, which was raised by the Secretary of State at the Moscow meeting and was discussed by you, Prime Minister Churchill, and myself at Teheran. I should appreciate it very much if you would give me your views on the suggestion made by the Secretary of State at Moscow, together with any other thoughts as to the best procedures to be followed in this extremely important matter."

Moreover, Roosevelt sought to establish a situation wherby Stalin would be viewed as an ally. "The correspondence also reveals the serious differences that President Roosevelt had with wartime "ally" Winston Churchill, over the course of the war, and, more fundamentally, over the shape of the world that would emerge from it. Roosevelt was intent on reshaping the post-war world around the creation of new nation-states in the developing world that would emerge from the destruction of the old colonial empires, a system which Roosevelt felt had given rise to the war. In that respect, Roosevelt felt that Stalin might serve as a key ally in his attempt to rid the world of the last vestiges of colonialism, and could well serve as a counterweight to the British Prime Minister, who was intent on reviving in some form a post-war British Empire."
Roosevelt-Stalin Correspondence Sheds Light on FDR Post-War Vision


FDR turned a blind eye to what Stalin was doing in Russia. I believe FDR was ruthless in his pursuits and would use anyone to further his goals.

 

[PoliticalChic]

It's too bad that this post goes in "History," because the FDR endeavors are largely responsible for the social breakdown we face today....
Under Roosevelt's alignment with Soviet communism the United States "exchanged foundational principles and guiding ideas" for some sort of vain, destructive, moral relativity.






1. Behind FDR's lies and actions which served to cover and support Stalin's murderous regime had to be the belief that, either,
FDR was a devotee of communism and anticipated imposing it on America..
....or, that he believed that he could incorporate Stalin into an organization with himself as the 'CEO.'

The former explanation would represent illimitable evil.....the latter, abysmal ignorance.





2. There is the false notion that FDR's infatuations began due to a need for the Soviet Union's aid in WWII, .....but he rushed to recognize them in 1933- was the first hint.

Is 'infatuation' too strong? Was there kind of political romance with Stalin?
Consider the following pieces of the puzzle before you consider it hyperbolic:

a. As former ambassador to the Soviet Union, William Bullitt, queried him about why he, FDR, persuaded the public that "communists had become the friends of democracy" and that he should remind all "that Communists in the United States are just as dangerous enemies as ever, and should not be allowed to crawl into our productive mechanism in order later to wreck it when they get new orders from somewhere abroad."
"For the President Personal & Secret: Correspondence Between Franklin D. Roosevelt and William C. Bullitt," Orville H. Bullitt, p. 522

b. Roosevelt threw himself into shoring up the USSR at any cost- in July of 1942 he lost 23 out of 34 ships in just one Lend-Lease supply voyage...

c. ...151,000 troops were left unsupplied in the Philippines....think Bataan Death March...

d. ....the British colony of Singapore was left without air cover in order to satisfy Stalin's desire for the planes. Found in Paul Johnson's "Modern Times," 'included 200 modern fighter aircraft, originally intended for Britain's highly vulnerable base in Singapore, which had no modern fighters at all. The diversion of these aircraft, plus tanks, to Russia sealed the fate of Singapore." Johnson, Op.Cit., p. 386.
Singapore fell February 15, 1942.

e. ...Roosevelt purged anti-communist Foreign Service officers when given a "list of officials who were supposedly undermining American relations with Russia" by Soviet Foreign Minister Litvinov. The purges began in 1937, and, irony of irony, Litvinov was dragged out of his position and replaced with Molotov, by Stalin, because Litvinov was Jewish, and Stalin had treaties with Hitler.

f. The New Deal 'reorganization' of the State Department called for the destruction of "the best Soviet Library in the United States." (according to Loy Henderson, Soviet and Eastern European Affairs Officer, State Department.) The 'Library' was broken up and dispersed among various files in the Library of Congress.
"Blacklisted by History: The Untold Story of Senator Joe McCarthy and His Fight Against America's Enemies" by M. Stanton Evans, p. 83-84




3. Representative Martin Dies formed a committed to investigate communism, but found that government archives of communist records and correspondence had been destroyed. He wrote: "I was informed, confidentially, by a man well placed in the Department of Justice, that they were destroyed after it was learned that the Dies Committee was determined to conduct a full-scale investigation of Communism."
It was Harry Hopkins, FDR's White House live-in Soviet spy, who turned down Dies' request of assistance from Roosevelt to help furnish the nascent committee with a staff of lawyers, investigators and stenographers.
Dies, "Martin Dies' Story," p. 64.

a. Although the reference 'card-carrying Communist' was once accurate, the CPUSA stopped issuing cards once the Dies Committee began hearings. The highest membership serial number that his committee came across was 195,762.
'Given that Communists strive for quality, it was amazing tht they had been able to grow from 10,000 aliens in 1919 to nearly 200,000 members in 1938, mostly naive born or naturalized citizens."
Dies, Ibid, p. 62-63.




4. Remarkable as the attempt to make files inaccessible seems, it is just as common during Obama's term, during which both the Justice Department and the Pentagon have overseen the methodical purges of "anti-Islamic" educational materials from security and military files and training courses.
Diana West, "American Betrayal," chapter one.




5. "Because the American way and the Soviet system were diametrically opposed, FDR had to lie to present common ground to the American people. In order to make his Big Lie stick, he also had to remove the people who knew better. Literally. On a larger, more punitive scale, [Victor] Kravchenko discussed the same process."
West, Ibid, p. 247.


Kravchenko wrote, of his Soviet experiences:

"Shamelessly, without so much as an explanation, it revised half a century of Russian history. I don't mean simply that it falsified some facts or gave a new interpretation of events. I mean that it deliberately stood history on its head, expunging events and inventing facts.

It twisted the recent past--a past still fresh in millions of memories--into new and bizarre shapes, to conform with the version of affairs presented by the blood-purge trials and the accompanying propaganda... The roles of leading historical figures were perverted or altogether erased.... More than that, living witnesses, as far as possible, were removed. The directing staff of the Institute of Marx, Engels and Lenin in Moscow, repository of ideological truth, were removed and the more important people among them imprisoned or shot."
Text collection


And that is what FDR did in America.

...did to America.

I finally had the time to properly devote to your op, my apologies. I am working on another aspect of FDR's presidency.

Your post was very interesting and insightful. My view is that FDR was the master manipulator of the 20th century who would go to any lengths to foster his vision of what the US should be and his relationship with Stalin is no different.

In his correspondence with Stalin FDR clearly sees a post war relationship between Russia and the US on all levels and sought to include Stalin on many levels including creating an economic infrastructure linking the US and Russia.

The book My Dear Mr. Stalin: The Complete Correspondence of Franklin D. Roosevelt and Joseph V. Stalin, Susan Butler, ed; with a Foreword by Arthur Schlesinger, Jr., New Haven: Yale University Press, 2005 demonstartes the relationship between the two


"The two also discussed the importance of post-war economic cooperation. Russia, which had suffered enormous losses of men and matériel during the war, was eager to secure a major loan for post-war reconstruction. On Feb. 23, 1944, Roosevelt wrote to Stalin about the Bretton Woods conference. "What I am raising here is the question of further steps toward the establishment of United Nations machinery for post-war economic collaboration, which was raised by the Secretary of State at the Moscow meeting and was discussed by you, Prime Minister Churchill, and myself at Teheran. I should appreciate it very much if you would give me your views on the suggestion made by the Secretary of State at Moscow, together with any other thoughts as to the best procedures to be followed in this extremely important matter."

Moreover, Roosevelt sought to establish a situation wherby Stalin would be viewed as an ally. "The correspondence also reveals the serious differences that President Roosevelt had with wartime "ally" Winston Churchill, over the course of the war, and, more fundamentally, over the shape of the world that would emerge from it. Roosevelt was intent on reshaping the post-war world around the creation of new nation-states in the developing world that would emerge from the destruction of the old colonial empires, a system which Roosevelt felt had given rise to the war. In that respect, Roosevelt felt that Stalin might serve as a key ally in his attempt to rid the world of the last vestiges of colonialism, and could well serve as a counterweight to the British Prime Minister, who was intent on reviving in some form a post-war British Empire."
Roosevelt-Stalin Correspondence Sheds Light on FDR Post-War Vision


FDR turned a blind eye to what Stalin was doing in Russia. I believe FDR was ruthless in his pursuits and would use anyone to further his goals.

That last line that you wrote is the heart of the issue.


How and why did he think that ignoring the iniquities of Soviet Russia could or should ever result in a bonding of the USA and the USSR?

The man had no moral compass, and no recognition of America's founding principles.

And, a deeper point in understanding his lack of objections to Marxism was the fact that what he aimed at domestically was materialism.....which is what Marx was about.



Consider the following pluses for FDR ( from “The Hundred Days of FDR”, by Schlesinger)

"Who can now imagine a day when America offered no Social Security, no unemployment compensation, no food stamps, no Federal guarantee of bank deposits, no Federal supervision of the stock market, no Federal protection for collective bargaining, no Federal standards for wages and hours, no Federal support for farm prices or rural electrification, no Federal refinancing for farm and home mortgages, no Federal commitment to high employment or to equal opportunity - in short, no Federal responsibility for Americans who found themselves, through no fault of their own, in economic or social distress?"
The 'Hundred Days' of F.D.R.



Where is the spirituality of the Founders?


And, largely, that is the legacy he left for our nation.

 

[Connery]

It's too bad that this post goes in "History," because the FDR endeavors are largely responsible for the social breakdown we face today....
Under Roosevelt's alignment with Soviet communism the United States "exchanged foundational principles and guiding ideas" for some sort of vain, destructive, moral relativity.






1. Behind FDR's lies and actions which served to cover and support Stalin's murderous regime had to be the belief that, either,
FDR was a devotee of communism and anticipated imposing it on America..
....or, that he believed that he could incorporate Stalin into an organization with himself as the 'CEO.'

The former explanation would represent illimitable evil.....the latter, abysmal ignorance.





2. There is the false notion that FDR's infatuations began due to a need for the Soviet Union's aid in WWII, .....but he rushed to recognize them in 1933- was the first hint.

Is 'infatuation' too strong? Was there kind of political romance with Stalin?
Consider the following pieces of the puzzle before you consider it hyperbolic:

a. As former ambassador to the Soviet Union, William Bullitt, queried him about why he, FDR, persuaded the public that "communists had become the friends of democracy" and that he should remind all "that Communists in the United States are just as dangerous enemies as ever, and should not be allowed to crawl into our productive mechanism in order later to wreck it when they get new orders from somewhere abroad."
"For the President Personal & Secret: Correspondence Between Franklin D. Roosevelt and William C. Bullitt," Orville H. Bullitt, p. 522

b. Roosevelt threw himself into shoring up the USSR at any cost- in July of 1942 he lost 23 out of 34 ships in just one Lend-Lease supply voyage...

c. ...151,000 troops were left unsupplied in the Philippines....think Bataan Death March...

d. ....the British colony of Singapore was left without air cover in order to satisfy Stalin's desire for the planes. Found in Paul Johnson's "Modern Times," 'included 200 modern fighter aircraft, originally intended for Britain's highly vulnerable base in Singapore, which had no modern fighters at all. The diversion of these aircraft, plus tanks, to Russia sealed the fate of Singapore." Johnson, Op.Cit., p. 386.
Singapore fell February 15, 1942.

e. ...Roosevelt purged anti-communist Foreign Service officers when given a "list of officials who were supposedly undermining American relations with Russia" by Soviet Foreign Minister Litvinov. The purges began in 1937, and, irony of irony, Litvinov was dragged out of his position and replaced with Molotov, by Stalin, because Litvinov was Jewish, and Stalin had treaties with Hitler.

f. The New Deal 'reorganization' of the State Department called for the destruction of "the best Soviet Library in the United States." (according to Loy Henderson, Soviet and Eastern European Affairs Officer, State Department.) The 'Library' was broken up and dispersed among various files in the Library of Congress.
"Blacklisted by History: The Untold Story of Senator Joe McCarthy and His Fight Against America's Enemies" by M. Stanton Evans, p. 83-84




3. Representative Martin Dies formed a committed to investigate communism, but found that government archives of communist records and correspondence had been destroyed. He wrote: "I was informed, confidentially, by a man well placed in the Department of Justice, that they were destroyed after it was learned that the Dies Committee was determined to conduct a full-scale investigation of Communism."
It was Harry Hopkins, FDR's White House live-in Soviet spy, who turned down Dies' request of assistance from Roosevelt to help furnish the nascent committee with a staff of lawyers, investigators and stenographers.
Dies, "Martin Dies' Story," p. 64.

a. Although the reference 'card-carrying Communist' was once accurate, the CPUSA stopped issuing cards once the Dies Committee began hearings. The highest membership serial number that his committee came across was 195,762.
'Given that Communists strive for quality, it was amazing tht they had been able to grow from 10,000 aliens in 1919 to nearly 200,000 members in 1938, mostly naive born or naturalized citizens."
Dies, Ibid, p. 62-63.




4. Remarkable as the attempt to make files inaccessible seems, it is just as common during Obama's term, during which both the Justice Department and the Pentagon have overseen the methodical purges of "anti-Islamic" educational materials from security and military files and training courses.
Diana West, "American Betrayal," chapter one.




5. "Because the American way and the Soviet system were diametrically opposed, FDR had to lie to present common ground to the American people. In order to make his Big Lie stick, he also had to remove the people who knew better. Literally. On a larger, more punitive scale, [Victor] Kravchenko discussed the same process."
West, Ibid, p. 247.


Kravchenko wrote, of his Soviet experiences:

"Shamelessly, without so much as an explanation, it revised half a century of Russian history. I don't mean simply that it falsified some facts or gave a new interpretation of events. I mean that it deliberately stood history on its head, expunging events and inventing facts.

It twisted the recent past--a past still fresh in millions of memories--into new and bizarre shapes, to conform with the version of affairs presented by the blood-purge trials and the accompanying propaganda... The roles of leading historical figures were perverted or altogether erased.... More than that, living witnesses, as far as possible, were removed. The directing staff of the Institute of Marx, Engels and Lenin in Moscow, repository of ideological truth, were removed and the more important people among them imprisoned or shot."
Text collection


And that is what FDR did in America.

...did to America.

I finally had the time to properly devote to your op, my apologies. I am working on another aspect of FDR's presidency.

Your post was very interesting and insightful. My view is that FDR was the master manipulator of the 20th century who would go to any lengths to foster his vision of what the US should be and his relationship with Stalin is no different.

In his correspondence with Stalin FDR clearly sees a post war relationship between Russia and the US on all levels and sought to include Stalin on many levels including creating an economic infrastructure linking the US and Russia.

The book My Dear Mr. Stalin: The Complete Correspondence of Franklin D. Roosevelt and Joseph V. Stalin, Susan Butler, ed; with a Foreword by Arthur Schlesinger, Jr., New Haven: Yale University Press, 2005 demonstartes the relationship between the two


"The two also discussed the importance of post-war economic cooperation. Russia, which had suffered enormous losses of men and matériel during the war, was eager to secure a major loan for post-war reconstruction. On Feb. 23, 1944, Roosevelt wrote to Stalin about the Bretton Woods conference. "What I am raising here is the question of further steps toward the establishment of United Nations machinery for post-war economic collaboration, which was raised by the Secretary of State at the Moscow meeting and was discussed by you, Prime Minister Churchill, and myself at Teheran. I should appreciate it very much if you would give me your views on the suggestion made by the Secretary of State at Moscow, together with any other thoughts as to the best procedures to be followed in this extremely important matter."

Moreover, Roosevelt sought to establish a situation wherby Stalin would be viewed as an ally. "The correspondence also reveals the serious differences that President Roosevelt had with wartime "ally" Winston Churchill, over the course of the war, and, more fundamentally, over the shape of the world that would emerge from it. Roosevelt was intent on reshaping the post-war world around the creation of new nation-states in the developing world that would emerge from the destruction of the old colonial empires, a system which Roosevelt felt had given rise to the war. In that respect, Roosevelt felt that Stalin might serve as a key ally in his attempt to rid the world of the last vestiges of colonialism, and could well serve as a counterweight to the British Prime Minister, who was intent on reviving in some form a post-war British Empire."
Roosevelt-Stalin Correspondence Sheds Light on FDR Post-War Vision


FDR turned a blind eye to what Stalin was doing in Russia. I believe FDR was ruthless in his pursuits and would use anyone to further his goals.

That last line that you wrote is the heart of the issue.


How and why did he think that ignoring the iniquities of Soviet Russia could or should ever result in a bonding of the USA and the USSR?

The man had no moral compass, and no recognition of America's founding principles.

And, a deeper point in understanding his lack of objections to Marxism was the fact that what he aimed at domestically was materialism.....which is what Marx was about.



Consider the following pluses for FDR ( from “The Hundred Days of FDR”, by Schlesinger)

"Who can now imagine a day when America offered no Social Security, no unemployment compensation, no food stamps, no Federal guarantee of bank deposits, no Federal supervision of the stock market, no Federal protection for collective bargaining, no Federal standards for wages and hours, no Federal support for farm prices or rural electrification, no Federal refinancing for farm and home mortgages, no Federal commitment to high employment or to equal opportunity - in short, no Federal responsibility for Americans who found themselves, through no fault of their own, in economic or social distress?"
The 'Hundred Days' of F.D.R.



Where is the spirituality of the Founders?


And, largely, that is the legacy he left for our nation.

We have yet to abandon FDR's legacy of government control and strange diplomatic bedfellows . Some control/oversight is necessary, but not to the point where we are puppets. More importantly, any moral compass FDR may have had was gone with the responsibility of office. Right or wrong his singular goal was to set the US on the "right" course at any cost. In this issue he sold his soul.

 

[regent]

An interesting comment.

BTW...I could list a dozen advances for society to FDR's credit....and did so on his birthday.

And you write...
"there are many areas and many decisions where faults can be found."

So, you agree with all..most....or many of the faults that I have posted over the months.
OK.


The difference in our perspectives is this: the weight on each side of the scale.


Perhaps this is too limiting as a summary....but I cannot forgive the damage to the fabric of American society and culture by acknowledging the material good that FDR did for the folks.

He told us that we were just like the Soviets....or, the same thing, that they were just like us.

The problem with selecting isolated faults on a piecemeal basis is the larger historical picture, is often omitted. Add to that from the Monday morning quarter-back position we can not only look at the mistake but present a different action as the correct one. Posters on these boards are limited in giving the whole historical picture but not in labeling historical mistakes or their version of the proper solution.
Professional historians often do the same but other historians point out their errors. For example, Beard wrote a history saying that the framers in writing the Constitution intended it to be for the benefit of the wealthy and for themselves. Other historians called Beard on his interpretation and Beard accepted the criticisms. Eventually historians get history correct.
As to your tid-bit of history that FDR said we were like the Soviets, if true, what was the larger picture at the time, what was FDR's intent. Did FDR mean we were like the Soviets in that we were communists, or that we were like the Soviets in that we were both fighting Germany, or other? And a good historian would ask what was the significant or importance of the statement.

1. "The problem with selecting isolated faults on a piecemeal basis...."

I haven't done that. I've provided numerous examples, documented and linked, designed to lead to the overwhelming conclusion about FDR and the Soviets.


2. ".... is the larger historical picture, is often omitted."

As you haven't denied what I have provided....I would be more than appreciative if you would give some explanation of FDR's propensities in said regard......giving the larger picture.


No one has been able to do so. I await your insight.



3. "...look at the mistake but present a different action as the correct one."
I did so....here:
http://www.usmessageboard.com/history/329174-fdr-and-what-could-have-been.html




4. "As to your tid-bit of history that FDR said we were like the Soviets, if true, what was the larger picture at the time, what was FDR's intent. Did FDR mean we were like the Soviets in that we were communists, or that we were like the Soviets in that we were both fighting Germany, or other?"

William Bullitt was FDR's first ambassador to Moscow.....and began as a supporter of the communists.
He became a strong anti-communist and his warnings to Roosevelt were ignored.

And the officers of the Foreign Service who opposed communism were purged....as per the demands of Stalin.

"...or that we were like the Soviets in that we were both fighting Germany, or other?"

We weren't fighting Germany in 1933, when FDR first recognized the USSR, even though he knew that Stalin had killed more of his own people than Hitler, later, would.

FDR was following America's first Secretary of State's, Jefferson, policy on recognizing foreign governments: the "US should acknowledge any government to be rightful which is formed by the will of the nation." That has been America's policy on recognition, not always followed by every administration but our policy, in short, we recognize the government in power. That policy probably reflected on America's need to be recognized after our revolution.