**** the EU?

[DiamondSea73]

I don´t know much about politics but several things make me thinking. When Rumsfeld talked about "Old Europe", I didn´t take it serious, cause I think that W. Bush government was just crazy and a gang of criminals. When Obama was elected, I was really happy, and I thought things changed a little bit. "**** the EU"?? I think the USA is a state that depends on trading with the EU and other continents as Asia. I think the State itself can only survive at the moment by trading with military equipment, other states overtook with selling cars and cereals. When Edward Snowden, for me a real american hero, revealed the observation mania I asked myself if this is a paranoid hysteria of a State that is losing it´s meaning more and more. Obama´s recent raction was disappointing. Our chancellors, however we here in this land think about them, were monitored illegaly. This is not an act of friendly togetherness. The US: on the way to a total surveillance state??

 

[iamwhatiseem]

Uh...you do realize that ALL nations spy on each other right?
And you do realize that Britain especially has damn near their whole country under public cameras?
You think only America spies on allies???
That is pretty funny

 

[Edgetho]

I don´t know much about politics but several things make me thinking. When Rumsfeld talked about "Old Europe", I didn´t take it serious, cause I think that W. Bush government was just crazy and a gang of criminals. When Obama was elected, I was really happy, and I thought things changed a little bit. "**** the EU"?? I think the USA is a state that depends on trading with the EU and other continents as Asia. I think the State itself can only survive at the moment by trading with military equipment, other states overtook with selling cars and cereals. When Edward Snowden, for me a real american hero, revealed the observation mania I asked myself if this is a paranoid hysteria of a State that is losing it´s meaning more and more. Obama´s recent raction was disappointing. Our chancellors, however we here in this land think about them, were monitored illegaly. This is not an act of friendly togetherness. The US: on the way to a total surveillance state??

Stick around, kid.

You got a lot to learn

 

[Iceweasel]

I don't know what the "**** the EU" comment is all about but the NSA issue is hotly debated here. I'd be surprised if the US was the only nation doing this.

 

[RandomVariable]

I don´t know much about politics but several things make me thinking. When Rumsfeld talked about "Old Europe", I didn´t take it serious, cause I think that W. Bush government was just crazy and a gang of criminals. When Obama was elected, I was really happy, and I thought things changed a little bit. "**** the EU"?? I think the USA is a state that depends on trading with the EU and other continents as Asia. I think the State itself can only survive at the moment by trading with military equipment, other states overtook with selling cars and cereals. When Edward Snowden, for me a real american hero, revealed the observation mania I asked myself if this is a paranoid hysteria of a State that is losing it´s meaning more and more. Obama´s recent raction was disappointing. Our chancellors, however we here in this land think about them, were monitored illegaly. This is not an act of friendly togetherness. The US: on the way to a total surveillance state??

"not an act of friendly togetherness"? Yeah, you're probably right about that. This spying stuff we do is called intelligence and, yes, we do a lot of it. Being one half of a nuclear standoff for fifty years will do that to some people. No offense but I would prefer America to choose its national heroes. (That is a capital 'A' by the way.)

 

[DiamondSea73]

Hello and thanks for your opinion. Yes, perhaps my point of view is some kind of naive, there is no doubt that spying or intelligence (I´m sure this has nothing to do with "intelligent" in this context) is limited to the US. But I think the costs for this hysteria plus military costs in your state budget is in no relation to other things, that are far more important (Public health service, restoring the rotten infrastructure). You can spy in every country, you can send your world police to every land. Does this make your country safer?

 

[eagle1462010]

Nations throughout the world have been spying on each other forever quite frankly. It is nothing new.........So, the outrage of some over the current incident may very well be overstated............As behind the scenes the one's outraged are probably doing the exact same thing to others in other countries...........

After 9/11 the rules changed. Is it for better or worse...........Clearly, many in the intel field claimed the WALL was a serious problem, and they needed more relaxed rules to track potential terrorists who are constantly on the move........This allowed the Federal agencies to track without getting warrants and getting the warrants later through the FISA court. Requirement is within 72 hours.........

United States Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Court - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The new rules allow them to piggy back to other people who may not be the prime suspect of the investigation. He calls someone, and they now track the new contact.............

So the NSA and other intel agencies are still required to operate under the law.................

Have they abused these new laws, aka violated the law.......................Probably................

If they have abused these laws, should they be prosecuted.............Yes and No depending on the situation............Was the intent to protect the nation or a violation done by not understanding the law..................

This is a slippery slope..............Security versus individual rights versus possible abuses of power. The current media hype may well be overblown. So to find out, there should be a special investigation completely unbiased to research the subject, who are not attached to party affiliations to get to the bottom of what really is going on..................

Thus using logic and reason to find out if the laws have been violated, and whether individual citizens or other leaders rights have been violated. Then make changes as necessary or even prosecute rule violators to make sure the situation is resolved.

 

[eagle1462010]

Oh, By the Way, Germany Spies on Us | Keith Thomson

Project Rahab uses SIGINT -- intelligence based on interception of signals, conversations and electronic communications -- to gather information on foreign business competition that can benefit German companies. BND officers have penetrated computer networks and databases in countries including Russia, the United Kingdom, Japan, France, Italy, and the United States.

Is this the real deal here.................should these countries have investigations and pure outrage over their spying as well.................................

Should our Nations be spying on each other to get an advantage on business and economic matters..........................

Let those without sin cast the first stone.

 

[Decus]

Please remember that Obama was going to "reset" our foreign policy to undo the toxic effect of the Bush years. As we can see the world now loves us.

The "**** the EU" comment is proof of the attitude behind this new foreign policy approach. Read this:

"On Thursday, a video was posted on YouTube in which Victoria Nuland, the top U.S. diplomat for Europe, disparagingly dismissed European Union efforts to mediate the ongoing crisis in the Ukraine by bluntly saying, “F--- the E.U.”"

"Experts say the image of the United States has deeply suffered, with the Nuland gaffe reinforcing perceptions of American heavy-handedness at a highly sensitive time."

Germans not amused by Victoria Nuland gaffe - The Washington Post

 

[JoeB131]

I think this was an example of a Gaffe in the respect that a politician was caught telling the truth.

The EU's efforts have been pretty worthless, trying to woo Ukraine out of Russia's orbit.

She will probably resign, and rightfully so.

But it does tell the insecurity of the Russians, that they are willing to expose their own spying to score a cheap political point.

 

[FJO]

I said "**** the E.U." when the EUROPEAN Nobel Committee awarded the Piss prize to Obama and when those blind yahoos in EUROPE went gaga over Obama.

The feeling was reinforced when I visited my old country a few years ago.

 

[L.K.Eder]

i said "**** Mexico", when the AMERICAN Oscar committee awarded the best actress prize to julia roberts.

 

[Old Rocks]

Whether friend or foe, one judges what a nation is doing by capabilities, not by stated intentions. And spying, or intelligence work, is the only way to have an accurate knowledge of the capabilities of another nation. I believe Clauwitz made an observation like this in one of his books.