Talking to God?...

[5stringJeff]

Originally posted by Bullypulpit
<center>Some Ideas Dubbyuh and Osama Share</center>



<blockquote>I am at war against the enemy
All who oppose me are evil
I will have others fight and die in my war
It matters not that many civilians will die as a result of my war
My actions are directed by God
My God is the real God
Working out our differences in a non-violent matter is not an option
I will take vengeance against nations that do not support my war
There is only one way in life and that way is my way
I will gain support for my war by making people fear my enemy
I will convince the people that it is honorable to die for my cause.
The law of the land matters not to me
I am the enemy and my followers don’t seem to understand</blockquote>

Oh boy...

1. You only go to war with enemies.
2. Bush only named three countires as "evil," and one has already been toppled.
3. OBL killed 3,000 civilians. Saddam killed millions, as far as we can tell. Bush has killed how many? A few dozen? A negligent amount by historical standards.
4. Bush looks to God for guidance. So what? IMO that's a good thing.
5. Bush has already stated that Muslims and Christians worship the same god. I think he's mistaken, but that's what he's claimed.
6. Non-violence was never an option with the terrorists. How could Bush have made it a realistic option - invite OBL to Geneva for a convention?
7. Bush made sure that nations who didn't pay (in terms of money, troops, and/or blood) in the GWOT didn't profit off that war. Great policy, IMO.
8. With us or with the terrorists... I don't see anything wrong with that either.
9. People have good reason to fear terrorists. See 9/11/01 and 3/11/04 as two good examples.
10. People are volunteering for military duty. They are not being drafted. They are willingly placing their lives on the line.
11. I'm not sure what laws you think Bush has broken.
12. If you think that Bush is the enemy in this war, then you have some real issues.

 

[Aquarian]

well countered Jeff. I don't want to get into the opinion portion of my reservations on some of your comments, but did want to reply to the 3rd point:

3. OBL killed 3,000 civilians. Saddam killed millions, as far as we can tell. Bush has killed how many? A few dozen? A negligent amount by historical standards.

according to Iraqbodycount.net the minimum reported civilian death count is 8918 with a maximum of 10769. More colorful stats can be found at Iraq-o-meter.

 

[winston churchi]

Originally posted by Bullypulpit
<center>Some Ideas Dubbyuh and Osama Share</center>



<blockquote>I am at war against the enemy

All who oppose me are evil

I will have others fight and die in my war

It matters not that many civilians will die as a result of my war

My actions are directed by God

My God is the real God

Working out our differences in a non-violent matter is not an option

I will take vengeance against nations that do not support my war

There is only one way in life and that way is my way

I will gain support for my war by making people fear my enemy

I will convince the people that it is
honorable to die for my cause.

The law of the land matters not to me

I am the enemy and my followers don’t seem to understand</blockquote>

These are hardly reasons that are out in left field.
War against an enemy? As oppposed to war against.....?

All who oppose me are evil? In this case, terrorism, 9/11, yes that is evil to me.

I will others fight for me and die in my war.
Since when has a sitting president been part of a war? From GW to today? You have the armed forces to protect and serve...if that is who you are refering to as 'others'.

It matters not how many civilians die in my war. Whose war? At anyrate, I would not assume any president thinks like that...sadly civilians will always become victim but this is not due to anything but being in the wrong place at the wrong time. No president, be it your Clinton or Bush should or could be blamed for that.

My actions are directed by God. Most people do live their lives according to their religious beliefs....going to church, reading their bibles, korans or whichever...And speaking of which, religion has been a strong reason for wars over the centuries but I am sure you know that.

My God is the real God...everything believes their religion is the correct one. I believe in Jesus, and I believe he is the son of God, am I wrong for that because you don't?

Working out differences? With whom? OBL? Wouldn't this world be a better place if everyone agreed? Wouldn't it be nice to live like the Brady Bunch where every problem could be resolved through communication....wouldn't it be nice if I could run that man off the road who cut me off and before he pulls out that gun to shoot me, we have talk first.

The rest of what you wrote is repetative. Nothing you said can be directed to one person. Take a look around you and you will find that not everything thinks like you.

 

[5stringJeff]

Originally posted by Aquarian
well countered Jeff. I don't want to get into the opinion portion of my reservations on some of your comments, but did want to reply to the 3rd point:



according to Iraqbodycount.net the minimum reported civilian death count is 8918 with a maximum of 10769. More colorful stats can be found at Iraq-o-meter.

Aquarian, I'll have to look that site over. Thanks for the correction!

 

[nycflasher]

Originally posted by NewGuy
Islam promotes, teaches and encourages terrorism....

No it does not.
Don't let predjudice get in the way of your worldview.

 

[NewGuy]

Originally posted by nycflasher
No it does not.
Don't let predjudice get in the way of your worldview.

Why do you say this?

Did you not read the koran refernces or the discussion with the professor where I clarified his statements and provided logical proof against his evidence?

Did you not read the verses IN THE KORAN IN CONTEXT in "Prove it:2"?

What is up, here?

 

[rtwngAvngr]

Originally posted by NewGuy
Why do you say this?

Did you not read the koran refernces or the discussion with the professor where I clarified his statements and provided logical proof against his evidence?

Did you not read the verses IN THE KORAN IN CONTEXT in "Prove it:2"?

What is up, here?

It's called "libs ignoring what they don't want to acknowledge."

 

[nycflasher]

Originally posted by NewGuy
Why do you say this?

Did you not read the koran refernces or the discussion with the professor where I clarified his statements and provided logical proof against his evidence?

Did you not read the verses IN THE KORAN IN CONTEXT in "Prove it:2"?

What is up, here?

If other sources are neccesary to verify your conclusions here, I would think you should have included them.

I know many Muslims and none of them support terrorism. In fact a couple of them are in our armed forces fighting against it, and I suppose they have a copy of the Koran in their ruck.

 

[NewGuy]

Originally posted by nycflasher
If other sources are neccesary to verify your conclusions here, I would think you should have included them.

Interesting.

You POSTED in some of these threads, but apparently you didn't read them.

Including them would be redundant. If you cared to find the information, you would have. I have spent a LOT of time gathering and collecting evidence to understand things around me. It took MONTHS of gathering to understand and collect anything I have posted here in lengthy proofs on the Koran or our Constitution. Not only do I not owe you a link, but you owe yourself information.

I know many Muslims and none of them support terrorism. In fact a couple of them are in our armed forces fighting against it, and I suppose they have a copy of the Koran in their ruck.

GREAT!

How about reading it?

 

[nycflasher]

Originally posted by NewGuy
Interesting.... It took MONTHS of gathering to understand and collect anything I have posted here in lengthy proofs on the Koran or our Constitution. Not only do I not owe you a link, but you owe yourself information.

Your time was a complete waste if the results were that you think you have proven that Islam promotes and teaches terrorism. In fact, millions of practicing Muslims around the world would beg to differ on that point. Along with untold numbers of religious scholars.

But I'm not trying to pick a fight, I guess I'll have to bring some research of my own to the table and perhaps I can convince you otherwise.

 

[Hobbit]

Originally posted by insein
Anyone else hear that?

Yeah, it sounds like...diarrhea coming outta someone's mouth or something. Anyway, time to debunk, even though Bully won't be back to try to dodge the debunks for quite some time.

I am at war against the enemy
If you are at war, the other guy is the enemy...by pure definition.

All who oppose me are evil
Actually, Osama does think this, but Bush seems to only go after those that oppose him by hurting and killing people. Protestors don't draw too much ire, and Democrats only draw criticism.

I will have others fight and die in my war
A commander and chief does not fight and die, or else there would be no commander and chief. I can't even really blame Osama for doing this, except for one thing. Bush asks soldiers to risk their lives in order to save others. Osama asks terrorists to give their lives to kill others.

It matters not that many civilians will die as a result of my war
Sh*t happens. That's another part of war. The difference is that Osama kills civilians on purpose, while nearly all civilian casualties credited to the U.S. military result from misses.

My actions are directed by God
Most religious people believe this. Those who state it openly in a secular context need to learn discretion.

My God is the real God
Most religious people believe this, too.

Working out our differences in a non-violent matter is not an option
Bush only thinks this because Osama took all non-violent options off the table. We tried it your way and failed, so now, we're gonna try it our way.

I will take vengeance against nations that do not support my war
What did Bush do to France? Germany? Russia? He didn't do anything to them except criticise them. Last I heard, criticism was a natural reaction towards people you think are wrong, but didn't fit into the catagory of "vengence."

There is only one way in life and that way is my way
Bush is open to several methods. That's why he has advisors. You don't think any human being can think up all that stuff on his own and still sleep, do you?

I will gain support for my war by making people fear my enemy
Neither really does this. Osama uses examples to show that American is corrupting the Middle East and is full of infadels. Bush let's Osama speak for him when trying to drum up opposition to Al-Qaida. I mean, really, how much effort does it take to show that Al-Qaida is bad?

I will convince the people that it is honorable to die for my cause.
I don't recall Bush saying this. Quote and source, please? I think Bush isn't so much pushing the idea that dying for his cause is a good thing so much as he's pushing the idea that it's worth it.

The law of the land matters not to me
The only "law of the land" I recall Bush violating was part of the Patriot Act, and I'm mad about that, but not just at Bush, since Congress had to pass it.

I am the enemy and my followers don’t seem to understand
I don't really understand this one. Explain, please.

 

[Moi]

Hobbit's post spurred me..

Originally posted by Bullypulpit
<center>Some Ideas Dubbyuh and Osama Share</center>



<blockquote>I am at war against the enemy...well, for one thing, Bush declared war in advance and with whom else would one be at war?

All who oppose me are evil- I have never heard Bush call Gore evil.

I will have others fight and die in my war- in case you forgot, our military is all volunteer.

It matters not that many civilians will die as a result of my war- gee, exactly when did Bush say that? As far as I recall he said that he regrets loss of life.

My actions are directed by God- don't remember Bush telling us that God told him to declare war. What I do remember is that he said the allies, congress and his advisors were in agreement.

My God is the real God- once again, you've heard Bush utter those exact words?

Working out our differences in a non-violent matter is not an option- I suggest you revisit Libya compromise.

I will take vengeance against nations that do not support my war- exactly what has he done to those who don't support the war? I find nothing.

There is only one way in life and that way is my way- I'm quite sure he was not in favor of giving those who pay no taxes a refund, yet he did it to appease others.

I will gain support for my war by making people fear my enemy- no, he can't "make" anyone fear anything. He's not able to control minds nor hypnotize.

I will convince the people that it is
honorable to die for my cause.- he certainly doesn't have to convince our military, contractors or other civilians in the battel zones...they volunteered!

The law of the land matters not to me- Bush has followed the very letter of the Constitution. The only law he is charged with upholding.

I am the enemy and my followers don’t seem to understand- Makes absolutely no sense...those who follow Bush know exactly why they follow him...he's correct.</blockquote>