Setting the Record Straight

[Ventura77]

God deeded that land to Israel. not the UN. We would do well to leave Israel alone. You may be able to defeat the Jews, but you will never defeat their God.

perhaps we can reach out to 'God' to confirm this putative deed? Failing that we might well ask why this particular fictive God permitted Arab/Palestinians an unbroken residency of 13---count em---centuries? I'm all ears!!!

 

[MJB12741]

foul Jews

Do you identify as antisemitic? I have read many of your posts, and while factually correct from what I have researched, I feel these antisemitic comments that you throw in do a disservice not only to yourself, but also to the Jewish people who are not zionists, which is the majority of us.

That said, can any of the zionists in here trolling comment on or refute any of the claims made in the OP? Or, can we agree here that in essence that this is what happened? For those interested in a solution, this would be a huge first step.

You are incorrect that the 'majority' of Jews do not identify with Zionist ideology...can you prove this assertion?

So very true. I sure as hell despise the Zionists & their ideology for their treatment of Palestinians with peace offerings, security fence & land concessions so they can remain in Israel to kill Israeli's instead of treating the Palestinians with the surrounding Arab country love, justice & respect the Palestinians were so well accustomed to --- And so well deserve.

 

[abi]

To the extent that 'anti-Semitism' is a misnomer I am hardly obligated to even entertain the standard question/accusation...according to polling the vast majority of Jews ARE indeed Zionists to varying degree, hence my reference to the plunderers of Palestine---"foul Jews'---is descriptively valid...kindly note that I did not say "all Jews'...

I noticed you didn't say all, but most Jews and no traditional Jews are not zionists.

Most Jews have not moved there. Over 1/4 of those who have wish to leave, but cannot. It is dangerous for any of us to conflate the Jewish people with zionists as I have been explaining to Shusha. And it is important to note that the Jews who were there before the Europeans came lived peacefully with their Christian and Muslim neighbors for centuries.

 

[Ventura77]

To the extent that 'anti-Semitism' is a misnomer I am hardly obligated to even entertain the standard question/accusation...according to polling the vast majority of Jews ARE indeed Zionists to varying degree, hence my reference to the plunderers of Palestine---"foul Jews'---is descriptively valid...kindly note that I did not say "all Jews'...

I noticed you didn't say all, but most Jews and no traditional Jews are not zionists.

Most Jews have not moved there. Over 1/4 of those who have wish to leave, but cannot. It is dangerous for any of us to conflate the Jewish people with zionists as I have been explaining to Shusha. And it is important to note that the Jews who were there before the Europeans came lived peacefully with their Christian and Muslim neighbors for centuries.

Abi I just posted a link to a poll that reveals that the vast majority of denominational Jews are indeed Zionists...the state of Israel is supported by the vast majority of world Jewry...if you can disprove this statistic please do...

 

[abi]

The OP is in error by omission, misrepresentation and factually incorrect as well as demonizing and anti-semitic. I'll make a post on it.

You need to state why and then have facts to support your claims.

And any time you want to talk solutions, you've been invited many times. You never seem to take us up on it.

I just did.

 

[Ventura77]

foul Jews

Do you identify as antisemitic? I have read many of your posts, and while factually correct from what I have researched, I feel these antisemitic comments that you throw in do a disservice not only to yourself, but also to the Jewish people who are not zionists, which is the majority of us.

That said, can any of the zionists in here trolling comment on or refute any of the claims made in the OP? Or, can we agree here that in essence that this is what happened? For those interested in a solution, this would be a huge first step.

The anti-semitism does a disservice to ALL Jews, not just the ones who don't believe Jews should have the same rights that other peoples do.

The OP is in error by omission, misrepresentation and factually incorrect as well as demonizing and anti-semitic. I'll make a post on it.

And any time you want to talk solutions, you've been invited many times. You never seem to take us up on it.

In which case I would expect a refutation which curiously enough is omitted...the OP is both accurate and easily documented...if you naively believe that Israelis are interested in 'solutions' I regret to inform you that you have grossly misunderstood the stated aims of Zionism---as articulated by such luminaries as Ben Gurion...Jabotinsky...Herzl...Begin...Rabin...etc. Your pathetic argument is inexorably with these men and their public statements..

 

[Ventura77]

The OP is in error by omission, misrepresentation and factually incorrect as well as demonizing and anti-semitic. I'll make a post on it.

You need to state why and then have facts to support your claims.

And any time you want to talk solutions, you've been invited many times. You never seem to take us up on it.

I just did.

Shusha is a mindless Hasbara-parrot...she works from alpha-numerical software which contains a scripted--albeit incorrect---reply to any subject within the Arab/Israeli subject spectrum...you cannot expect her to refute or argue...she is a paid liar...

 

[abi]

Abi I just posted a link to a poll that reveals that the vast majority of denominational Jews are indeed Zionists...the state of Israel is supported by the vast majority of world Jewry...if you can disprove this statistic please do...

Do you have a link to the actual research? I am interested in the criteria used to determine the claimed results. A saw an article link and a link to a graphic. Did I miss it?

 

[Hollie]

The OP is in error by omission, misrepresentation and factually incorrect as well as demonizing and anti-semitic. I'll make a post on it.

You need to state why and then have facts to support your claims.

And any time you want to talk solutions, you've been invited many times. You never seem to take us up on it.

I just did.

Shusha is a mindless Hasbara-parrot...she works from alpha-numerical software which contains a scripted--albeit incorrect---reply to any subject within the Arab/Israeli subject spectrum...you cannot expect her to refute or argue...she is a paid liar...

Wow. That summer you spent at the hamas version of the Hitler Youth camp really is effective in turning you 12 year olds into mindless drones.

 

[Shusha]

...the pervasive idea that the UN authorized the creation of Israel demands specific correction.

No one here on this board on Team Israel argues that the UN authorized the creation of Israel. We all know that the UN does not possess the legal capacity to create States nor to authorize their creation. At best, the UN provides one possible source of recognition.

The UN sponsored a ridiculous partition-proposal to grant 56% of historic Palestine

There is no such thing as "historic" Palestine as a legal entity beyond a designation for a specific territory -- like Appalachia or the Pacific Northwest. These geographical designations do not in any way suggest or confer sovereignty.

Further, Palestine as relevant in this context included Jordan. Therefore, 77% of the territory was removed from any possibility of coming under Jewish sovereignty and assigned to Arab sovereignty. It is false to say that the partition plan granted 56% of Palestine to the Jewish people.

to a Jewish minority that legally owned less than 5% of the land.

Repeat after me: private land ownership is not sovereignty, private land ownership is not sovereignty.

Repeat after me: minorities have rights, minorities have rights

The Arab States of course rejected the recommendation, along with India.

That part is true. (Though slightly ironic since India was partitioned. Twice.)

Following this the Zionist terrorists

correction: The nascent State of Israel.

launched a well-organized terror-offensive /ethnic-cleansing

correction: launched a well-organized military defensive action against the illegally present regular and irregular armies of five Arab States, as well as hostile Arab residents who attacked Israel. Part of that defensive action, as was normal practice at the time, was to secure towns and villages. For a wide number of reasons involved in military action in residential places -- BOTH the Arab and Jewish residents were displaced.

driving 800,000 native Palestinians from their homes and property

note also that nearly one million Jewish people were actually ethnically cleansed from the surrounding ME countries. I know it was an actual ethnic cleansing because there was no WAR or hostilities occurring in those ME countries at the time and therefore had no cause or justification that is either legally or morally correct.

.

in the wake of this crime

self-defense is not a crime

the foul Jews announced the 'new nation of Israel'

yes, they most certainly did, in keeping with the legal demands of the Mandate for Palestine which acknowledged an already existing right of the Jewish people to a homeland in their historical and ancestral territory.

---which in reality was occupied Palestine.

Which, according to all laws at the time was the place for the reconstitution of the national home (State) for the Jewish people. One can not occupy land one is legally entitled to.

Under heavy western pressure from the Truman administration the United Nations was directed to 'recognize and legitimize' the nation of Israel

Which the UN did thus adding a critical piece of the sovereignty criteria -- recognition and the ability to enter into agreements with other States and international entities.

--thereby violating the wording and spirit of its own charter, sworn to protect and defend the residency rights of native peoples

ALL peoples -- not just Arab peoples. That includes the rights of the Jewish people.

 

[Ventura77]

Abi I just posted a link to a poll that reveals that the vast majority of denominational Jews are indeed Zionists...the state of Israel is supported by the vast majority of world Jewry...if you can disprove this statistic please do...

Do you have a link to the actual research? I am interested in the criteria used to determine the claimed results. A saw an article link and a link to a graphic. Did I miss it?

A better question would be: can you offer any substantiation of your claim that most Jews are not Zionists?

 

[Ventura77]

Abi I just posted a link to a poll that reveals that the vast majority of denominational Jews are indeed Zionists...the state of Israel is supported by the vast majority of world Jewry...if you can disprove this statistic please do...

Do you have a link to the actual research? I am interested in the criteria used to determine the claimed results. A saw an article link and a link to a graphic. Did I miss it?

The post contains a link to the Pew Research Center...beyond that I am unable to assist...if you dispute the findings please refute them with documented sources...

 

[Ventura77]

...the pervasive idea that the UN authorized the creation of Israel demands specific correction.

No one here on this board on Team Israel argues that the UN authorized the creation of Israel. We all know that the UN does not possess the legal capacity to create States nor to authorize their creation. At best, the UN provides one possible source of recognition.

The UN sponsored a ridiculous partition-proposal to grant 56% of historic Palestine

There is no such thing as "historic" Palestine as a legal entity beyond a designation for a specific territory -- like Appalachia or the Pacific Northwest. These geographical designations do not in any way suggest or confer sovereignty.

Further, Palestine as relevant in this context included Jordan. Therefore, 77% of the territory was removed from any possibility of coming under Jewish sovereignty and assigned to Arab sovereignty. It is false to say that the partition plan granted 56% of Palestine to the Jewish people.

to a Jewish minority that legally owned less than 5% of the land.

Repeat after me: private land ownership is not sovereignty, private land ownership is not sovereignty.

Repeat after me: minorities have rights, minorities have rights

The Arab States of course rejected the recommendation, along with India.

That part is true. (Though slightly ironic since India was partitioned. Twice.)

Following this the Zionist terrorists

correction: The nascent State of Israel.

launched a well-organized terror-offensive /ethnic-cleansing

correction: launched a well-organized military defensive action against the illegally present regular and irregular armies of five Arab States, as well as hostile Arab residents who attacked Israel. Part of that defensive action, as was normal practice at the time, was to secure towns and villages. For a wide number of reasons involved in military action in residential places -- BOTH the Arab and Jewish residents were displaced.

driving 800,000 native Palestinians from their homes and property

note also that nearly one million Jewish people were actually ethnically cleansed from the surrounding ME countries. I know it was an actual ethnic cleansing because there was no WAR or hostilities occurring in those ME countries at the time and therefore had no cause or justification that is either legally or morally correct.

.

in the wake of this crime

self-defense is not a crime

the foul Jews announced the 'new nation of Israel'

yes, they most certainly did, in keeping with the legal demands of the Mandate for Palestine which acknowledged an already existing right of the Jewish people to a homeland in their historical and ancestral territory.

---which in reality was occupied Palestine.

Which, according to all laws at the time was the place for the reconstitution of the national home (State) for the Jewish people. One can not occupy land one is legally entitled to.

Under heavy western pressure from the Truman administration the United Nations was directed to 'recognize and legitimize' the nation of Israel

Which the UN did thus adding a critical piece of the sovereignty criteria -- recognition and the ability to enter into agreements with other States and international entities.

--thereby violating the wording and spirit of its own charter, sworn to protect and defend the residency rights of native peoples

ALL peoples -- not just Arab peoples. That includes the rights of the Jewish people.

Standardized Zionist propaganda that has been corrected time and again...the hilarity is that you post this tired swill again and again with zero credibility...what part of 'ethnic-cleansing' just doesn't register princess????

 

[Shusha]

what part of 'ethnic-cleansing' just doesn't register princess????

The part where you entirely neglect to mention the hostile activities of the Arab residents and invading armies.

 

[P F Tinmore]

what part of 'ethnic-cleansing' just doesn't register princess????

The part where you entirely neglect to mention the hostile activities of the Arab residents and invading armies.

What is the relevance to the question?

 

[Ventura77]

what part of 'ethnic-cleansing' just doesn't register princess????

The part where you entirely neglect to mention the hostile activities of the Arab residents and invading armies.

Whatever you do don't ask why they were hostile Princess...possibly the steady import of Zio-trash? Whaddaya think Einstein? Oh I know why not post more of your scripted Hasbara? That should work huh Camille??? LOL

 

[Ventura77]

...the pervasive idea that the UN authorized the creation of Israel demands specific correction.

No one here on this board on Team Israel argues that the UN authorized the creation of Israel. We all know that the UN does not possess the legal capacity to create States nor to authorize their creation. At best, the UN provides one possible source of recognition.

The UN sponsored a ridiculous partition-proposal to grant 56% of historic Palestine

There is no such thing as "historic" Palestine as a legal entity beyond a designation for a specific territory -- like Appalachia or the Pacific Northwest. These geographical designations do not in any way suggest or confer sovereignty.

Further, Palestine as relevant in this context included Jordan. Therefore, 77% of the territory was removed from any possibility of coming under Jewish sovereignty and assigned to Arab sovereignty. It is false to say that the partition plan granted 56% of Palestine to the Jewish people.

to a Jewish minority that legally owned less than 5% of the land.

Repeat after me: private land ownership is not sovereignty, private land ownership is not sovereignty.

Repeat after me: minorities have rights, minorities have rights

The Arab States of course rejected the recommendation, along with India.

That part is true. (Though slightly ironic since India was partitioned. Twice.)

Following this the Zionist terrorists

correction: The nascent State of Israel.

launched a well-organized terror-offensive /ethnic-cleansing

correction: launched a well-organized military defensive action against the illegally present regular and irregular armies of five Arab States, as well as hostile Arab residents who attacked Israel. Part of that defensive action, as was normal practice at the time, was to secure towns and villages. For a wide number of reasons involved in military action in residential places -- BOTH the Arab and Jewish residents were displaced.

driving 800,000 native Palestinians from their homes and property

note also that nearly one million Jewish people were actually ethnically cleansed from the surrounding ME countries. I know it was an actual ethnic cleansing because there was no WAR or hostilities occurring in those ME countries at the time and therefore had no cause or justification that is either legally or morally correct.

.

in the wake of this crime

self-defense is not a crime

the foul Jews announced the 'new nation of Israel'

yes, they most certainly did, in keeping with the legal demands of the Mandate for Palestine which acknowledged an already existing right of the Jewish people to a homeland in their historical and ancestral territory.

---which in reality was occupied Palestine.

Which, according to all laws at the time was the place for the reconstitution of the national home (State) for the Jewish people. One can not occupy land one is legally entitled to.

Under heavy western pressure from the Truman administration the United Nations was directed to 'recognize and legitimize' the nation of Israel

Which the UN did thus adding a critical piece of the sovereignty criteria -- recognition and the ability to enter into agreements with other States and international entities.

--thereby violating the wording and spirit of its own charter, sworn to protect and defend the residency rights of native peoples

ALL peoples -- not just Arab peoples. That includes the rights of the Jewish people.

Standardized Zionist propaganda that has been corrected time and again...the hilarity is that you post this tired swill again and again with zero credibility...what part of 'ethnic-cleansing' just doesn't register princess????

It honestly amazes me Tinmore...no sooner does one categorically expose their Hasbara lies than they re-post the same shit with that unmistakable smugness...you cannot make this up!

 

[Ventura77]

what part of 'ethnic-cleansing' just doesn't register princess????

The part where you entirely neglect to mention the hostile activities of the Arab residents and invading armies.

What is the relevance to the question?

Not unlike the 99.9% of the sewage posted by Israeli defenders it has zero 'relevance'...

 

[Hollie]

...the pervasive idea that the UN authorized the creation of Israel demands specific correction.

No one here on this board on Team Israel argues that the UN authorized the creation of Israel. We all know that the UN does not possess the legal capacity to create States nor to authorize their creation. At best, the UN provides one possible source of recognition.

The UN sponsored a ridiculous partition-proposal to grant 56% of historic Palestine

There is no such thing as "historic" Palestine as a legal entity beyond a designation for a specific territory -- like Appalachia or the Pacific Northwest. These geographical designations do not in any way suggest or confer sovereignty.

Further, Palestine as relevant in this context included Jordan. Therefore, 77% of the territory was removed from any possibility of coming under Jewish sovereignty and assigned to Arab sovereignty. It is false to say that the partition plan granted 56% of Palestine to the Jewish people.

to a Jewish minority that legally owned less than 5% of the land.

Repeat after me: private land ownership is not sovereignty, private land ownership is not sovereignty.

Repeat after me: minorities have rights, minorities have rights

The Arab States of course rejected the recommendation, along with India.

That part is true. (Though slightly ironic since India was partitioned. Twice.)

Following this the Zionist terrorists

correction: The nascent State of Israel.

launched a well-organized terror-offensive /ethnic-cleansing

correction: launched a well-organized military defensive action against the illegally present regular and irregular armies of five Arab States, as well as hostile Arab residents who attacked Israel. Part of that defensive action, as was normal practice at the time, was to secure towns and villages. For a wide number of reasons involved in military action in residential places -- BOTH the Arab and Jewish residents were displaced.

driving 800,000 native Palestinians from their homes and property

note also that nearly one million Jewish people were actually ethnically cleansed from the surrounding ME countries. I know it was an actual ethnic cleansing because there was no WAR or hostilities occurring in those ME countries at the time and therefore had no cause or justification that is either legally or morally correct.

.

in the wake of this crime

self-defense is not a crime

the foul Jews announced the 'new nation of Israel'

yes, they most certainly did, in keeping with the legal demands of the Mandate for Palestine which acknowledged an already existing right of the Jewish people to a homeland in their historical and ancestral territory.

---which in reality was occupied Palestine.

Which, according to all laws at the time was the place for the reconstitution of the national home (State) for the Jewish people. One can not occupy land one is legally entitled to.

Under heavy western pressure from the Truman administration the United Nations was directed to 'recognize and legitimize' the nation of Israel

Which the UN did thus adding a critical piece of the sovereignty criteria -- recognition and the ability to enter into agreements with other States and international entities.

--thereby violating the wording and spirit of its own charter, sworn to protect and defend the residency rights of native peoples

ALL peoples -- not just Arab peoples. That includes the rights of the Jewish people.

Standardized Zionist propaganda that has been corrected time and again...the hilarity is that you post this tired swill again and again with zero credibility...what part of 'ethnic-cleansing' just doesn't register princess????

It honestly amazes me Tinmore...no sooner does one categorically expose their Hasbara lies than they re-post the same shit with that unmistakable smugness...you cannot make this up!

You just made that up..........

 

[abi]

The post contains a link to the Pew Research Center...beyond that I am unable to assist...if you dispute the findings please refute them with documented sources...

I couldn't find the actual poll. I think it depends on your definition of zionist. Do you have to move to Israel? Do you even need to understand the situation, which I would argue that most Jews outside of Israel do not? Do you feel that you support them in some way or do you have to send money?

I actually think if you check it out that you will find way more Christian zionists than Jewish ones.

And I am not taking issue with any of the facts you presented in the OP. I don't think anyone has, actually.