Senate panel moves to cut off Cheney's funding

[ReillyT]

WASHINGTON (AP) -- Senate Democrats moved Tuesday to cut off funding for Vice President Dick Cheney's office in a continuing battle over whether he must comply with national security disclosure rules.

A Senate appropriations panel chaired by Sen. Richard Durbin, D-Illinois, refused to fund $4.8 million in the vice president's budget until Cheney's office complies with parts of an executive order governing its handling of classified information.

At issue is a requirement that executive branch offices provide data on how much material they classify and declassify. That information is to be provided to the Information Security Oversight Office at The National Archives.

Cheney's office, with backing from the White House, argues that the offices of the president and vice president are exempt from the order because they are not executive branch "agencies."

http://www.cnn.com/2007/POLITICS/07/10/democrats.cheney.ap/index.html

I think that Cheney is in the wrong here, and that the argument that he is not part of the executive branch just plain silly. Nonetheless, this seems like a grade school playground move. I don't see how it will help anything, and I wish the Senate would drop this particular issue.

 

[actsnoblemartin]

yay, lets give the libs more information, so the terrorists can read about it in the new york times.

WASHINGTON (AP) -- Senate Democrats moved Tuesday to cut off funding for Vice President Dick Cheney's office in a continuing battle over whether he must comply with national security disclosure rules.

A Senate appropriations panel chaired by Sen. Richard Durbin, D-Illinois, refused to fund $4.8 million in the vice president's budget until Cheney's office complies with parts of an executive order governing its handling of classified information.

At issue is a requirement that executive branch offices provide data on how much material they classify and declassify. That information is to be provided to the Information Security Oversight Office at The National Archives.

Cheney's office, with backing from the White House, argues that the offices of the president and vice president are exempt from the order because they are not executive branch "agencies."

http://www.cnn.com/2007/POLITICS/07/10/democrats.cheney.ap/index.html

I think that Cheney is in the wrong here, and that the argument that he is not part of the executive branch just plain silly. Nonetheless, this seems like a grade school playground move. I don't see how it will help anything, and I wish the Senate would drop this particular issue.

 

[ReillyT]

yay, lets give the libs more information, so the terrorists can read about it in the new york times.

The National Archives does not turn over the classified information to anyone or release it publicly, or even actually view the materials. The process is merely an audit to determine that information that is classified is kept in such a way to ensure its secrecy. This has nothing to do with the release of information. It actually is intended to prevent the very opposite.

 

[Angel Heart]

Oh and the archives are so safe....

http://www.evesun.com/chenango-coun...06-11/2060/A-chapter-from-Alice-in-Wonderland

Sandy Berger was a top White House aide in the Clinton White House. He was our national security adviser. Which means, of course, he knew our most secret secrets.

Sandy Berger stole classified documents. From our National Archives. You no doubt have read about this.

 

[ReillyT]

Oh and the archives are so safe....

http://www.evesun.com/chenango-coun...06-11/2060/A-chapter-from-Alice-in-Wonderland

The National Archives doesn't take or even review the classified materials. It performs an audit to make sure that classified documents are being kept in a secure manner. It is designed to ensure secrecy, not vice versa.

 

[Gunny]

I'm rather curious on thoughts for and against Cheney's exemption claim. What's the precedent, if any?

 

[ReillyT]

I'm rather curious on thoughts for and against Cheney's exemption claim. What's the precedent, if any?

I think it is a silly claim. It is true that the VP is listed under both Article I and Article II of the Constitution, and I think that the VP could legitimately say that his is a legislative office. However, by virtue of his Article II designation, it appears to be an executive office as well. In light of his earlier successful claim of executive privilege, I have a hard time seeing how he does not qualify as part of the executive branch (even if he could also plausibly claim to be part of the legislative branch).

 

[Gunny]

I think it is a silly claim. It is true that the VP is listed under both Article I and Article II of the Constitution, and I think that the VP could legitimately say that his is a legislative office. However, by virtue of his Article II designation, it appears to be an executive office as well. In light of his earlier successful claim of executive privilege, I have a hard time seeing how he does not qualify as part of the executive branch (even if he could also plausibly claim to be part of the legislative branch).

What is the historical precedent? Have all other VPs complied with the audit?

 

[ReillyT]

What is the historical precedent? Have all other VPs complied with the audit?

The Executive Order was issued by Clinton in 1998 and then re-issued by Bush. Gore complied with it and Cheney complied with it until 2003, when he stopped complying.

 

[Gunny]

The Executive Order was issued by Clinton in 1998 and then re-issued by Bush. Gore complied with it and Cheney complied with it until 2003, when he stopped complying.

Sounds like he's lost something to me, LOL.

 

[Angel Heart]

The National Archives doesn't take or even review the classified materials. It performs an audit to make sure that classified documents are being kept in a secure manner. It is designed to ensure secrecy, not vice versa.

Oh but keeping them filed is one of their jobs. Making sure the records are kept TOGETHER!!! Do you have any idea what was removed? NO. It was protected documents that shouldn't of left the archives.

 

[ReillyT]

Oh but keeping them filed is one of their jobs. Making sure the records are kept TOGETHER!!! Do you have any idea what was removed? NO. It was protected documents that shouldn't of left the archives.

What are you talking about? Is this about Berger, because this has nothing to do with that, either in a matter of kind or degree. Not applicable to this. Completely different thing going on.

The group within the National Archives that would do the auditing of the VP's classified documents wouldn't remove anything. All those documents would stay with the VP. They don't even look at the documents themselves. Under the order, Cheney's office would file a report describing its classification activities. Then, if it chooses to, the National Archives could send an on-site inspection team to visit the VP's offices to ensure that classified documents are being properly handled.

The National Archives would not remove or review the actual classified documents. They just want to have some idea what documents are out there, and to make sure that they are being kept adequately secure.

Even if you don't feel that the National Archives is an especially competent department, there is no additional security risk involved with letting them attempt to do their jobs.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

I see the same old "repeat the lie enough" is in play here.

Cheney NEVER said he was not part of the Executive branch. Provide source documents that he did.

What has been claimed is his office is NOT AN AGENCY as covered under the executive order. But hey don't let facts get in the way of a good lie.

 

[Gunny]

I see the same old "repeat the lie enough" is in play here.

Cheney NEVER said he was not part of the Executive branch. Provide source documents that he did.

What has been claimed is his office is NOT AN AGENCY as covered under the executive order. But hey don't let facts get in the way of a good lie.

That is what I read as well.

 

[maineman]

why would he comply up until 2003?

 

[RetiredGySgt]

why would he comply up until 2003?

He decided he wasn't required. That he did before and now doesn't is not somehow proof of anything.

I am still waiting ( and have been for weeks) for a SOURCE document that has Cheney making the claim the left keeps saying he made.

 

[Gunny]

why would he comply up until 2003?

I have no idea. I know in the Corps, the Nazis come around every so often and go through classified material with a fine-toothed comb, but my understanding it was that is all about accountability, not content.

I really don't see why he's got a problem with it, myself.

 

[maineman]

He decided he wasn't required. That he did before and now doesn't is not somehow proof of anything.

I am still waiting ( and have been for weeks) for a SOURCE document that has Cheney making the claim the left keeps saying he made.

it is not "proof of anything".

and that is all that matters? appearances mean nothing?????



One wonders why the republicans kept the thumbscrews on Clinton for all those years for whitewater filegate travelgate vince foster et cetera et cetera. Did you all have any PROOF?

 

[maineman]

I have no idea. I know in the Corps, the Nazis come around every so often and go through classified material with a fine-toothed comb, but my understanding it was that is all about accountability, not content.

I really don't see why he's got a problem with it, myself.

I think you were right at first...he either lost something, or he has something he doesn't want anyone else to find.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

Well except for the whole " his term ends in jan 2009" part. As I recall we were all gonna be surprised when the Congress was controlled by the dems and they provided us with all the evidence of Republican wrong doing that was being hidden from us.... I am STILL waiting.

Those same people you claim never said the elections were stolen all claimed we just needed a dem congress and Bush would be history.