Scranton, PA is broke...

[jillian]

Isn't "Slow Joe" Biden from there?

No, Biden is from Delaware.

he was born in scranton.

but i wouldn't call him "slow"...

someone who voted for bush and thought the tweeting twit was an acceptable VP, in particular, shouldn't call him 'slow'.

just saying.

 

[thereisnospoon]

scranton is noteworthy as the place Binghamton students used to go to buy grain alcohol.

keep outsourcing jobs... i'm sure it will stay that way.

What the hell does "out sourcing" have to do with anything?
If you are referring to business leaving Scranton, blame the high cost of union labor and blame poor management decisions.

if you don't understand, i'm afraid it can't be explained to you.

unions aren't the problem. thinking U.S. workers should have to live on substandard wages and compete for jobs with mexico is...

Not substandard wages. Competitive wages. Wages that reflect the marketplace.
Unions force the employer to pay far above market rates.
50 years ago when the US was THE industrial power in the Universe it worked to the advantage of unions. Unions could at the end of each contract hold the employer over a barrel, threaten them with crippling strikes.
Today, unions don't have that clout. Reality has seen to that.
If you read my entire post you'd have noticed I stated unions were not the entire problem.

 

[chanel]

Unions are not the problem. The Democratic mayor is the problem. This is his third term.

To that end, Doherty has proposed a recovery plan with 78 percent tax increases over the next three years. However, the council majority has refused to consider the mayor's plan or any tax hikes greater than 10 percent each year, and instead wants to fill the gap with alternative revenue sources, such as increased contributions from nonprofits and commuter, sales and payroll taxes, to name a few.

The council majority's position has been that the city did not plunge into its financial crisis overnight. Evans has repeatedly said the mayor has had a 10-year run of "unbridled spending and debt" before a four-vote, veto-proof majority of herself and council members Frank Joyce, Jack Loscombe and Pat Rogan drew a line in the sand.

Scranton mayor , council point fingers as city hits rock bottom - News - Citizens Voice

Do you think those union members would prefer to have their taxes raised 78% to pay their own salaries? What people often forget is that they pay taxes too.

 

[Claudette]

Yup. The mayor is a Dem and I'm sure the Unions had a big hand in his election.

Any city with a Union public sector is in the same boat. Here's hoping those running the show in these cities can see the writing on the wall. The taxpayers are getting hosed and are probably pretty sick of it by now.

In this crappy economy no one wants to pay more taxes. Just to expensive to live as it is right now.

 

[chanel]

Well Claudette I am a union member and a taxpayer. I expect the union leadership to negotiate the best deal they can get. That's what I pay dues for. But as a taxpayer, I also understand that there is a finite amount of money. Our elected leaders hold the purse strings and ultimately they are responsible for spending (and misspending) taxpayer money. The buck stops with this mayor.

 

[Artevelde]

Well Claudette I am a union member and a taxpayer. I expect the union leadership to negotiate the best deal they can get. That's what I pay dues for. But as a taxpayer, I also understand that there is a finite amount of money. Our elected leaders hold the purse strings and ultimately they are responsible for spending (and misspending) taxpayer money. The buck stops with this mayor.

That's pretty reasonable.

 

[BDBoop]

I can't even believe this is happening. Minimum wage.

I think I'm in shock.

 

[Artevelde]

scranton is noteworthy as the place Binghamton students used to go to buy grain alcohol.

keep outsourcing jobs... i'm sure it will stay that way.

What the hell does "out sourcing" have to do with anything?
If you are referring to business leaving Scranton, blame the high cost of union labor and blame poor management decisions.

if you don't understand, i'm afraid it can't be explained to you.

unions aren't the problem. thinking U.S. workers should have to live on substandard wages and compete for jobs with mexico is...

So you feel US industry shouldn't be competitive and close down? Or do you feel the US should simply stop trading with other countries and close itself off from the rest of the world?

 

[DGS49]

The wages mentioned in the article do not seem excessive.

If history is any guide, the funding will eventually be found somewhere and the City employees will receive backpay to supplement the MW payments and bring them up to date. This has usually been the case when, for example, government workers are furloughed due to a budget impasse.

Without question, any wages that are covered by a Collective Bargaining agreement will be recouped, as the City is blatantly breaching those contracts, notwithstanding a lack of funds.

The percentage increase in taxes is only half the relevant information. What is the tax level now? How does it compare with comparable municipalities? Are other revenue streams available?

In this case, Bankruptcy is the logical, fair option, provided it can be done under applicable PA laws. Any contracts (including collective bargaining agreements) may be rejected or renegotiated at the discretion of a trustee, and the City can work through its troubles. Anyone working for the City who feels unjustly abused can go find better employment wherever it may be had.

Just like in the Real World.

 

[thereisnospoon]

Unions are not the problem. The Democratic mayor is the problem. This is his third term.

To that end, Doherty has proposed a recovery plan with 78 percent tax increases over the next three years. However, the council majority has refused to consider the mayor's plan or any tax hikes greater than 10 percent each year, and instead wants to fill the gap with alternative revenue sources, such as increased contributions from nonprofits and commuter, sales and payroll taxes, to name a few.

The council majority's position has been that the city did not plunge into its financial crisis overnight. Evans has repeatedly said the mayor has had a 10-year run of "unbridled spending and debt" before a four-vote, veto-proof majority of herself and council members Frank Joyce, Jack Loscombe and Pat Rogan drew a line in the sand.

Scranton mayor , council point fingers as city hits rock bottom - News - Citizens Voice

Do you think those union members would prefer to have their taxes raised 78% to pay their own salaries? What people often forget is that they pay taxes too.

More often than not, unions and their members vigorously oppose limits on tax increases.
For example, when New Jersey taxpayers were relieved with a 2% annual tax levy cap, the public worker unions lobbied strongly against the cap and then protested in the State Capital once the cap became law.
Fact is, public sector workers essentially pay themselves. AND they get far more out of the taxes they pay than they contribute.
Also, unless the City of Scranton has a residency requirement for all municipal workers, they workers can simply move out of the city to avoid paying the tax.
Oh, most union contracts, prohibit residency requirements.

 

[thereisnospoon]

Well Claudette I am a union member and a taxpayer. I expect the union leadership to negotiate the best deal they can get. That's what I pay dues for. But as a taxpayer, I also understand that there is a finite amount of money. Our elected leaders hold the purse strings and ultimately they are responsible for spending (and misspending) taxpayer money. The buck stops with this mayor.

Public or private sector?

 

[Moonglow]

Scary for Scranton.

Yes it is...
The issue here is what buried the City in the first place.
The wage range for all city workers is $19 to $36 per hour. That does not include their pensions and medical benefits.
To arrive at the real cost for each worker, not including pensioners, you can add 50% to the hourly wage. So the top wage is actually over $50 per hour.

The unions are going to break every city and state in the very same way......

well then when all cops are making minimum wage in every city the repubs can pat themselves on the back. While they pass each other on sentry duty.

 

[thereisnospoon]

The wages mentioned in the article do not seem excessive.

If history is any guide, the funding will eventually be found somewhere and the City employees will receive backpay to supplement the MW payments and bring them up to date. This has usually been the case when, for example, government workers are furloughed due to a budget impasse.

Without question, any wages that are covered by a Collective Bargaining agreement will be recouped, as the City is blatantly breaching those contracts, notwithstanding a lack of funds.

The percentage increase in taxes is only half the relevant information. What is the tax level now? How does it compare with comparable municipalities? Are other revenue streams available?

In this case, Bankruptcy is the logical, fair option, provided it can be done under applicable PA laws. Any contracts (including collective bargaining agreements) may be rejected or renegotiated at the discretion of a trustee, and the City can work through its troubles. Anyone working for the City who feels unjustly abused can go find better employment wherever it may be had.

Just like in the Real World.

The best path of course is Bankruptcy protection. This would get the city ou from underneath it's debts, nullify all union contracts, require all workers to reapply for their jobs on a new pay scale with higher contributions for benefits and pensions. Just like the private sector.
If there is no more money, that means, no more money.
BTW, I think $19 per hour to do things such as cut the grass in the city's parks is absurd.
The city can contract landscaping services at a fraction of the cost of hiring and employing full time grounds people. The problem is, the unions demand those people have jobs.
In fact the city could rid themselves of the duty of trash collection. Grounds maintenance of parks and other common areas.
Scranton has a recycling division. That can be contracted out to a private company.
There are so many ways a city can slash expenses. Unfortunately, many city leaders are to shit scared of unions to put their foot down.

 

[thereisnospoon]

Yes it is...
The issue here is what buried the City in the first place.
The wage range for all city workers is $19 to $36 per hour. That does not include their pensions and medical benefits.
To arrive at the real cost for each worker, not including pensioners, you can add 50% to the hourly wage. So the top wage is actually over $50 per hour.

The unions are going to break every city and state in the very same way......

well then when all cops are making minimum wage in every city the repubs can pat themselves on the back. While they pass each other on sentry duty.

Oh puhhhLeeeeeeze.

 

[Claudette]

Well Claudette I am a union member and a taxpayer. I expect the union leadership to negotiate the best deal they can get. That's what I pay dues for. But as a taxpayer, I also understand that there is a finite amount of money. Our elected leaders hold the purse strings and ultimately they are responsible for spending (and misspending) taxpayer money. The buck stops with this mayor.

I agree and well said.

I'm a public sector worker down here in Florida and our elected officials made the right choices. Hope those in Scranton do as well.

 

[Claudette]

Yes it is...
The issue here is what buried the City in the first place.
The wage range for all city workers is $19 to $36 per hour. That does not include their pensions and medical benefits.
To arrive at the real cost for each worker, not including pensioners, you can add 50% to the hourly wage. So the top wage is actually over $50 per hour.

The unions are going to break every city and state in the very same way......

well then when all cops are making minimum wage in every city the repubs can pat themselves on the back. While they pass each other on sentry duty.

LMAO Minimum wage? Boy are you an idiot if you think an LEO will EVER be payed minumum wage in any city or town in America. Jeeze.

I work with 40 of em down here in Florida and believe me, they make very good money.

They have to pay into their retirement and HC plans but they make out quite well.

Our elected officials made the tough choices here and the police union members approved those choices.

Democracy at work.

 

[D.C.]

Scranton: the result of outsourcing middle class jobs oversees and across our borders. This country has upset the portfolio of job sectors. Short of taking back what we sent elsewhere; no administration will have a remedy. Don't let Romeny nor Obama fool you.

 

[In_the_Weeds]

I think Scranton's problems are more than just the unions. But negotiating wages with a group that can have a big impact on your election is just wrong. Then most of those positions are filled with people who are politically connected. Then give them a great disability plan where they make more if they are out on disability. In a nearby town more than half of the staff is collecting disability and this is a town with relatively low crime and only a few buildings that are more than a few stories high.

Scranton and the surrounding area is in a bad way because of politics. Many companies that thought of locating in the area were chased away after learning about the strings attached. Providing a list of who had to be on your payroll was not uncommon and many companies went else where.

They have no money and no access to borrowed money. What were they to do. Oh their local tax is above 3 percent which is significantly higher than any towns in the area. All you libs who say that workers need to get even more money never worked on the other side of getting a pay check. There is only so much money to go around. If you spend more than you take in, well this is what happens. They paid at minimum wage and ended up with $550 dollars in the checking account. Scranton is a pretty large town so that amount is nothing.

City, State or Federal all have to set their government up where it spends at the level it takes in. Certainly some good things are going to get cut because we cannot afford it. Why is this so easy to understand at the household level but beyond comprehension to many when it comes to govt. Higher wages for govt workers means lower wages for the taxpayer who has to pay more to cover those costs. Wonder if that poster is willing to start sending in more of his or her money. Take that 40% of our governments outlay and send a bill proportionate to the number of adults we have in the US and lets see how generous a lot of these libs are. Being from the area I grew up Democrat and was surrounded by many others from that party, and in fact knew very few that were Republicans. I am not a Rep and cannot believe that I ever will be one but the Dem's have lost their minds when it comes to all these programs.

Scranton is in trouble and it is more than just the unions that key to that situation. Yes Biden originated in this area. In fact there was a local article where they talked about how bogus his blue collar roots are as portrayed in the last election. So fraudulent that even Biden did not want to agree to it. But the story was better that way so the party went with it even though he group up in a very affluent area and had I think a grandfather that was an engineer. Not a train one either. He did not grow up poor or even middle class.

 

[bobgnote]

There is no more VALUE, in America, for cities to tap. Many cities will try to declare bankruptcy.

The observation of the underground coal fire was relevant. Where all cities are going is to the land of YES, we have no bananas.

The way this city bankruptcy buggerall will play out is like the Sandusky affair. There are other cases. Somebody saw this, in the shower room. Louie Freeh should get us a number, to call.

 

[WillowTree]

... All city workers had their wages lowered to minimum wage.
This city can no longer absorb union wages. The courts have ruled the City cannot go into bankruptcy yet. So the only alternative is to slash pay.
This sucks for everyone.
This is what happens when government can no longer go to the citizens for money above and beyond current levels.
City workers wages slashed in Scranton, Pennsylvania - Yahoo! News

ain't that where the asswipe VP is from? He needs to send em some money and show em some compassion.