Satanists in OK seek to put monument at State House like 10 Commandments

[bodecea]

This is really appropriate. Let one religion put their stuff up on government property.......open that door to all.

Okla. Satanists seek monument by Statehouse steps

 

[BreezeWood]

OKLAHOMA CITY (AP) — In their zeal to tout their faith in the public square, conservatives in Oklahoma may have unwittingly opened the door to a wide range of religious groups, including Satanists who are seeking to put their own statue next to a Ten Commandments monument outside the Statehouse.

the same thing is going on in Florida - where a nativity scene was allowed inside the Rotunda capital bld. using "private" money ... and now the Atheist are putting up a display of their own.

this is really about people committed to the Bible and insisting it be a part of Gov't forcing it on everyone else, they are the ones who make an issue out of their beliefs and government year in year out.

 

[KevinWestern]

This is really appropriate. Let one religion put their stuff up on government property.......open that door to all.

Okla. Satanists seek monument by Statehouse steps

I agree that putting the Ten Commandments up in front of a public facility is favoritism. I can understand the argument if (perhaps) the Ten Commandment slab was from 150 years ago (and is historically considered part of the building), but given it was just constructed recently I say they should be brought down immediately.

And I'm not saying that just because something is "historical" it justifies the whole thing, I'm just saying that there would be more of an argument to keep this monument up.

 

[bodecea]

This is really appropriate. Let one religion put their stuff up on government property.......open that door to all.

Okla. Satanists seek monument by Statehouse steps

I agree that putting the Ten Commandments up in front of a public facility is favoritism. I can understand the argument if (perhaps) the Ten Commandment slab was from 150 years ago (and is historically considered part of the building), but given it was just constructed recently I say they should be brought down immediately.

And I'm not saying that just because something is "historical" it justifies the whole thing, I'm just saying that there would be more of an argument to keep this monument up.

Of course...the issue even boils down to WHICH version of the Big Ten did they use? There are three....Catholic, Protestant, and Jewish.

 

[Alfalfa]

Hilarious. But if someone really wants to make a scene of it request to put up an islam display.

Then a pastafarian display.

 

[Alfalfa]

Has anybody actually read the ten commands lately? 5 or 6 of them are patently unconstitutional.

 

[KevinWestern]

This is really appropriate. Let one religion put their stuff up on government property.......open that door to all.

Okla. Satanists seek monument by Statehouse steps

I agree that putting the Ten Commandments up in front of a public facility is favoritism. I can understand the argument if (perhaps) the Ten Commandment slab was from 150 years ago (and is historically considered part of the building), but given it was just constructed recently I say they should be brought down immediately.

And I'm not saying that just because something is "historical" it justifies the whole thing, I'm just saying that there would be more of an argument to keep this monument up.

Of course...the issue even boils down to WHICH version of the Big Ten did they use? There are three....Catholic, Protestant, and Jewish.

Yea. Basically this day and age there are thousands of very different religions practiced by Americans (vs. a much smaller number maybe 200 years ago) and I think it's understood that official representations of a specific religion by a public entity should be avoided.

Again, we nonetheless have numerous traditions/historical monuments/etc (in the public sphere) that lean in the Christian direction that we don't want necessarily "destroyed" (because they're historical in nature), but when people are adding new things to the mix I think it's rather inappropriate.

 

[peach174]

OKLAHOMA CITY (AP) — In their zeal to tout their faith in the public square, conservatives in Oklahoma may have unwittingly opened the door to a wide range of religious groups, including Satanists who are seeking to put their own statue next to a Ten Commandments monument outside the Statehouse.

the same thing is going on in Florida - where a nativity scene was allowed inside the Rotunda capital bld. using "private" money ... and now the Atheist are putting up a display of their own.

this is really about people committed to the Bible and insisting it be a part of Gov't forcing it on everyone else, they are the ones who make an issue out of their beliefs and government year in year out.

How is looking at a nativity scene forcing you to become a Christian?
Does looking at a menorah force you to become Jewish?
It doesn't.
Why can't Atheists' put up their displays in another month of the year, instead of Christmas?
Our Government is about freedom for all, not exclusion for all.

 

[martybegan]

OKLAHOMA CITY (AP) — In their zeal to tout their faith in the public square, conservatives in Oklahoma may have unwittingly opened the door to a wide range of religious groups, including Satanists who are seeking to put their own statue next to a Ten Commandments monument outside the Statehouse.

the same thing is going on in Florida - where a nativity scene was allowed inside the Rotunda capital bld. using "private" money ... and now the Atheist are putting up a display of their own.

this is really about people committed to the Bible and insisting it be a part of Gov't forcing it on everyone else, they are the ones who make an issue out of their beliefs and government year in year out.

How is looking at a nativity scene forcing you to become a Christian?
Does looking at a menorah force you to become Jewish?
It doesn't.
Why can't Atheists' put up their displays in another month of the year, instead of Christmas?
Our Government is about freedom for all, not exclusion for all.

One has to look at the motive behind why people of certain groups want to put thier displays up. In the case of the traditional displays its about the holiday and celebration.

In the case of the atheists/satanists/pastafarians, its mostly about snark, butthurt and trying to ridicule the religous beliefs of the original displayers.

 

[KevinWestern]

OKLAHOMA CITY (AP) — In their zeal to tout their faith in the public square, conservatives in Oklahoma may have unwittingly opened the door to a wide range of religious groups, including Satanists who are seeking to put their own statue next to a Ten Commandments monument outside the Statehouse.

the same thing is going on in Florida - where a nativity scene was allowed inside the Rotunda capital bld. using "private" money ... and now the Atheist are putting up a display of their own.

this is really about people committed to the Bible and insisting it be a part of Gov't forcing it on everyone else, they are the ones who make an issue out of their beliefs and government year in year out.

How is looking at a nativity scene forcing you to become a Christian?
Does looking at a menorah force you to become Jewish?
It doesn't.
Why can't Atheists' put up their displays in another month of the year, instead of Christmas?
Our Government is about freedom for all, not exclusion for all.

The point is when PUBLIC money is used to fund a nativity scene - a very specific religious reference - things can get tricky. Why would a Muslim, or a Jew, or a Buddhist, or a Hindu want ANY of their tax dollars going to something Christian related?

How would you feel if you're a Muslim who has a court hearing for something and there's a baby Jesus setup outside the courthouse? Would you feel "equal"?

Best thing is simply to keep specific representations of religion out of gov't completely, I believe. There's MORE than enough private businesses spreading around the Christmas cheer I assure you.

 

[bodecea]

the same thing is going on in Florida - where a nativity scene was allowed inside the Rotunda capital bld. using "private" money ... and now the Atheist are putting up a display of their own.

this is really about people committed to the Bible and insisting it be a part of Gov't forcing it on everyone else, they are the ones who make an issue out of their beliefs and government year in year out.

How is looking at a nativity scene forcing you to become a Christian?
Does looking at a menorah force you to become Jewish?
It doesn't.
Why can't Atheists' put up their displays in another month of the year, instead of Christmas?
Our Government is about freedom for all, not exclusion for all.

One has to look at the motive behind why people of certain groups want to put thier displays up. In the case of the traditional displays its about the holiday and celebration.

In the case of the atheists/satanists/pastafarians, its mostly about snark, butthurt and trying to ridicule the religous beliefs of the original displayers.

So...you have this great insight on other people's motives?

 

[peach174]

This is really appropriate. Let one religion put their stuff up on government property.......open that door to all.

Okla. Satanists seek monument by Statehouse steps

I agree that putting the Ten Commandments up in front of a public facility is favoritism. I can understand the argument if (perhaps) the Ten Commandment slab was from 150 years ago (and is historically considered part of the building), but given it was just constructed recently I say they should be brought down immediately.

And I'm not saying that just because something is "historical" it justifies the whole thing, I'm just saying that there would be more of an argument to keep this monument up.

Of course...the issue even boils down to WHICH version of the Big Ten did they use? There are three....Catholic, Protestant, and Jewish.

There is only one and it is used by all three.

 

[martybegan]

How is looking at a nativity scene forcing you to become a Christian?
Does looking at a menorah force you to become Jewish?
It doesn't.
Why can't Atheists' put up their displays in another month of the year, instead of Christmas?
Our Government is about freedom for all, not exclusion for all.

One has to look at the motive behind why people of certain groups want to put thier displays up. In the case of the traditional displays its about the holiday and celebration.

In the case of the atheists/satanists/pastafarians, its mostly about snark, butthurt and trying to ridicule the religous beliefs of the original displayers.

So...you have this great insight on other people's motives?

Other people's motives are often obvious from thier actions, despite thier protests to the contrary.

 

[CrusaderFrank]

This is really appropriate. Let one religion put their stuff up on government property.......open that door to all.

Okla. Satanists seek monument by Statehouse steps

"If I had a son, he'd look like Obama" -- Satan

 

[Pennywise]

The Untied States was started as a Christian country, with biblical based values and laws. Were they followers of Satan this would make sense, but such is not the case.

There is no separation of Church and State anywhere in the founding documents. It took an activist "supreme court" to invent that.

 

[KevinWestern]

In the case of the atheists/satanists/pastafarians, its mostly about snark, butthurt and trying to ridicule the religous beliefs of the original displayers.

As a Christian, how would you feel if you were about to enter a courthouse (as a defendant) and there were a bunch of Koran passages scribbled about? Would you feel like that courthouse would treat Christians the same way as Muslims?

Again, it's unnecessary. We should be minimizing all references (by public entities) to a specific religion. It's the Constitutional thing to do.

 

[KevinWestern]

The Untied States was started as a Christian country, with biblical based values and laws. Were they followers of Satan this would make sense, but such is not the case.

There is no separation of Church and State anywhere in the founding documents. It took an activist "supreme court" to invent that.

Are you inferring that Supreme Court rulings hold no authority, and the Founding Fathers did not want the Constitution to be open to interpretation by properly elected officials? I don't understand your argument.

Sure, you can believe that an activist court "invented that", but what you think doesn't matter due to the fact you are not a properly elected Supreme Court Justice, lol.

 

[peach174]

the same thing is going on in Florida - where a nativity scene was allowed inside the Rotunda capital bld. using "private" money ... and now the Atheist are putting up a display of their own.

this is really about people committed to the Bible and insisting it be a part of Gov't forcing it on everyone else, they are the ones who make an issue out of their beliefs and government year in year out.

How is looking at a nativity scene forcing you to become a Christian?
Does looking at a menorah force you to become Jewish?
It doesn't.
Why can't Atheists' put up their displays in another month of the year, instead of Christmas?
Our Government is about freedom for all, not exclusion for all.

The point is when PUBLIC money is used to fund a nativity scene - a very specific religious reference - things can get tricky. Why would a Muslim, or a Jew, or a Buddhist, or a Hindu want ANY of their tax dollars going to something Christian related?

How would you feel if you're a Muslim who has a court hearing for something and there's a baby Jesus setup outside the courthouse? Would you feel "equal"?

Best thing is simply to keep specific representations of religion out of gov't completely, I believe. There's MORE than enough private businesses spreading around the Christmas cheer I assure you.

Public money was not used in Florida.
Jesus is in the Koran.
"ALLAH is HE besides Whom there is none worthy of worship, the Living, the Self-Subsisting and All-Sustaining. HE has sent down to thee the Book containing the truth and fulfilling that which precedes it; and HE has sent down the Torah (Law of Moses) and the Gospel (of Jesus) before this, as a guidance to the people; and HE has sent down the Discrimination (judgement between right and wrong)."—Qur'an, Surah 3:3-4

 

[CrusaderFrank]

It's appropriate to display the 10 Commandments because they formed the basis of our laws

Are we going to use Satanism as a new foundation for our judicial system?

 

[martybegan]

In the case of the atheists/satanists/pastafarians, its mostly about snark, butthurt and trying to ridicule the religous beliefs of the original displayers.

As a Christian, how would you feel if you were about to enter a courthouse (as a defendant) and there were a bunch of Koran passages scribbled about? Would you feel like that courthouse would treat Christians the same way as Muslims?

Again, it's unnecessary. We should be minimizing all references (by public entities) to a specific religion. It's the Constitutional thing to do.

In the building I agree, what most of the issues I have revolve around are things like nativity displays, paid by private money, but ALLOWED in the commons being fought against by groups whose sole purpose is to demean the people trying to display thier holiday/religous spirit.

When it comes to the 10 commandments, one has to remember that they are not only religously significant, but part of the legal history of the world. How different would it be if a court referenced the code of Hannurabi, or the Code of Justinian? Both have legal historical value, but for some reason only the 10 commandments creates the butturt we see.