Retribution or Rehabilitation - that is the question.

[Wry Catcher]

"Attorney General Jeff Sessions is directing federal prosecutors to pursue the most serious charges possible against the vast majority of suspects, a reversal of Obama-era policies that is sure to send more people to prison and for much longer terms."
US prosecutors told to push for more, harsher punishments

Consider the annual cost alone is $30,000 + per inmate per year ($83.89 per day)

And consider Federal Probation Supervision:

Per Day FY 2014 ADULT
Intensive Probation (currently in 2 locations) $12.85 per day
High Supervision Probationer (1.62 hours per month) $3.00 per day
Medium Supervision Probationer (1.17 hours per month) $2.17 per day
Low Supervision Probationer (0.44 hours per month) $ .86 per day
Administrative Supervision Case (0.27 hours per month) $ .50 per day
Case Service Monitoring Case (0.09 hours per month) $ .17 per day

JUVENILE 
Intensive Probation (currently in 11 locations) $16.06 per day 
High Supervision Probationer (1.78 hours per month) $3.30 per day 
Medium Supervision Probationer (1.63 hours per month) $3.02 per day 
Low Supervision Probationer (0.71 hours per month) $1.32 per day 
Administrative Supervision Case (0.33 hours per month) $ .61 per day  Informal Diversion Case (0.23 hours per month) $ .43 per day  Case Service Monitoring Case (0.10 hours per month) $ .19 per day Average

Cost of Supervision - All Categories $3.08 per day\

How about that national debt and annual deficit Mr. AG Session?

 

[SavannahMann]

This is the question. Proponents of rehabilitation point to successful programs that exist around the world. Because these programs are more successful than our own they argue that these systems should be implemented here.

But since these programs are not 100% successful they aren't tried.

Proponents of more prisons all of the time argue that only long, preferably life sentences for every crime will prevent the offender from committing any other crimes ever. So Prisons are little more than a warehouse storing people and taking minor criminals to give them graduate degrees in major crime.

When the convicted person does get out, the advocates of more prisons pass laws so the offender can never rejoin society after paying the debt. Some damned fool will come here any moment now and talk about murderers and rapists and all that. Yet most people in prison are not major criminals. Yet.

Three percent of the crooks in Federal Prison are murderers etc. what you would call major crimes against another person.

BOP Statistics: Inmate Offenses

Because three out of a hundred are murderers, we have to discuss the other 97 like they are Al Capone reincarnate.

I can tell you this. The proponents don't care about cost in dollars. They don't care about program success. They don't care about anything except the maximum penalty for the minimum criminal action.

 

[Wry Catcher]

This is the question. Proponents of rehabilitation point to successful programs that exist around the world. Because these programs are more successful than our own they argue that these systems should be implemented here.

But since these programs are not 100% successful they aren't tried.

Proponents of more prisons all of the time argue that only long, preferably life sentences for every crime will prevent the offender from committing any other crimes ever. So Prisons are little more than a warehouse storing people and taking minor criminals to give them graduate degrees in major crime.

When the convicted person does get out, the advocates of more prisons pass laws so the offender can never rejoin society after paying the debt. Some damned fool will come here any moment now and talk about murderers and rapists and all that. Yet most people in prison are not major criminals. Yet.

Three percent of the crooks in Federal Prison are murderers etc. what you would call major crimes against another person.

BOP Statistics: Inmate Offenses

Because three out of a hundred are murderers, we have to discuss the other 97 like they are Al Capone reincarnate.

I can tell you this. The proponents don't care about cost in dollars. They don't care about program success. They don't care about anything except the maximum penalty for the minimum criminal action.

There may be another agenda Sessions has in mind: Private profit prisons.

 

[SavannahMann]

This is the question. Proponents of rehabilitation point to successful programs that exist around the world. Because these programs are more successful than our own they argue that these systems should be implemented here.

But since these programs are not 100% successful they aren't tried.

Proponents of more prisons all of the time argue that only long, preferably life sentences for every crime will prevent the offender from committing any other crimes ever. So Prisons are little more than a warehouse storing people and taking minor criminals to give them graduate degrees in major crime.

When the convicted person does get out, the advocates of more prisons pass laws so the offender can never rejoin society after paying the debt. Some damned fool will come here any moment now and talk about murderers and rapists and all that. Yet most people in prison are not major criminals. Yet.

Three percent of the crooks in Federal Prison are murderers etc. what you would call major crimes against another person.

BOP Statistics: Inmate Offenses

Because three out of a hundred are murderers, we have to discuss the other 97 like they are Al Capone reincarnate.

I can tell you this. The proponents don't care about cost in dollars. They don't care about program success. They don't care about anything except the maximum penalty for the minimum criminal action.

There may be another agenda Sessions has in mind: Private profit prisons.

Let's say you really like Ford cars and trucks. Let's say you believe they make a superior product. You buy stock in Ford. You buy an interest in a Ford dealer. Then you run for political office. You get elected to the County Commission.

The County wants to buy some more cars. You argue and vote for Ford. Yes you stand to profit, but you honestly believe that Ford makes a superior product.

In Sessions case the For Profit prisons are an extension of his belief in maximum penalties. The people who believe that long prison sentences are punishment and people who break rules should be punished. My wife argues it is an extention of the puritan mentality that the nation was founded with. She may be right. Or it may just be a part of it.

 

[Wry Catcher]

This is the question. Proponents of rehabilitation point to successful programs that exist around the world. Because these programs are more successful than our own they argue that these systems should be implemented here.

But since these programs are not 100% successful they aren't tried.

Proponents of more prisons all of the time argue that only long, preferably life sentences for every crime will prevent the offender from committing any other crimes ever. So Prisons are little more than a warehouse storing people and taking minor criminals to give them graduate degrees in major crime.

When the convicted person does get out, the advocates of more prisons pass laws so the offender can never rejoin society after paying the debt. Some damned fool will come here any moment now and talk about murderers and rapists and all that. Yet most people in prison are not major criminals. Yet.

Three percent of the crooks in Federal Prison are murderers etc. what you would call major crimes against another person.

BOP Statistics: Inmate Offenses

Because three out of a hundred are murderers, we have to discuss the other 97 like they are Al Capone reincarnate.

I can tell you this. The proponents don't care about cost in dollars. They don't care about program success. They don't care about anything except the maximum penalty for the minimum criminal action.

There may be another agenda Sessions has in mind: Private profit prisons.

Let's say you really like Ford cars and trucks. Let's say you believe they make a superior product. You buy stock in Ford. You buy an interest in a Ford dealer. Then you run for political office. You get elected to the County Commission.

The County wants to buy some more cars. You argue and vote for Ford. Yes you stand to profit, but you honestly believe that Ford makes a superior product.

In Sessions case the For Profit prisons are an extension of his belief in maximum penalties. The people who believe that long prison sentences are punishment and people who break rules should be punished. My wife argues it is an extention of the puritan mentality that the nation was founded with. She may be right. Or it may just be a part of it.

I posted, "There may be another agenda Sessions has in mind: Private profit prisons"

In fact if we have a national debt (which we do) wouldn't responsible people in charge of budgets and spending provide evidence that a longer prison sentence is more effective, and in what ways, than a shorter one?

 

[SavannahMann]

This is the question. Proponents of rehabilitation point to successful programs that exist around the world. Because these programs are more successful than our own they argue that these systems should be implemented here.

But since these programs are not 100% successful they aren't tried.

Proponents of more prisons all of the time argue that only long, preferably life sentences for every crime will prevent the offender from committing any other crimes ever. So Prisons are little more than a warehouse storing people and taking minor criminals to give them graduate degrees in major crime.

When the convicted person does get out, the advocates of more prisons pass laws so the offender can never rejoin society after paying the debt. Some damned fool will come here any moment now and talk about murderers and rapists and all that. Yet most people in prison are not major criminals. Yet.

Three percent of the crooks in Federal Prison are murderers etc. what you would call major crimes against another person.

BOP Statistics: Inmate Offenses

Because three out of a hundred are murderers, we have to discuss the other 97 like they are Al Capone reincarnate.

I can tell you this. The proponents don't care about cost in dollars. They don't care about program success. They don't care about anything except the maximum penalty for the minimum criminal action.

There may be another agenda Sessions has in mind: Private profit prisons.

Let's say you really like Ford cars and trucks. Let's say you believe they make a superior product. You buy stock in Ford. You buy an interest in a Ford dealer. Then you run for political office. You get elected to the County Commission.

The County wants to buy some more cars. You argue and vote for Ford. Yes you stand to profit, but you honestly believe that Ford makes a superior product.

In Sessions case the For Profit prisons are an extension of his belief in maximum penalties. The people who believe that long prison sentences are punishment and people who break rules should be punished. My wife argues it is an extention of the puritan mentality that the nation was founded with. She may be right. Or it may just be a part of it.

I posted, "There may be another agenda Sessions has in mind: Private profit prisons"

In fact if we have a national debt (which we do) wouldn't responsible people in charge of budgets and spending provide evidence that a longer prison sentence is more effective, and in what ways, than a shorter one?

Evidence rarely affects belief. The stronger the belief, the less likely someone is liable to reconsider it.

Look at the debates that have run through our society for the last decades. Belief drives most if not all of those. The more the argument is a belief the less the believer wants to hear contradictory information. The stronger the belief, the less they want you discussing anything contradictory.

Take racism. The more evidence that shows minor and insignificant genetic differences in our people the more adamant the racist becomes to defend their belief. A White Police Officer is suing because he is 18% black and his fellow cops whom he would have defended to the death swearing they weren't racist are the bad guys.

There is an irony alert in there somewhere.

Think about it. Before the DNA test that cop would have sworn under oath that his fellow officers were just enforcing the law. There was no racist motivation behind any of their actions. After the test he suffered mental stress because those cops who were not racist before are now consumed with racist jokes for their friend.

A perception change may have opened his eyes. Or it just made him mad and he wanted revenge. Who knows. It takes an earth shattering event before most beliefs are challenged.