Rand Paul is not a certified Doctor

[Ravi]

Why does it matter if he started it himself? He's still the head of the same organization he's certified by. Clearly there's a conflict of interests.

It would depend on when he was certified, IMO. You can keep pretending that starting and running your own certification group to certify yourself is kosher, though.

IMO it would depend more on who authorized the certification. Did someone else review his qualifications and his board exam or did anyone review those things at all? And if someone else did, were they given free reign to deny him the certification if he did not pass the exam or were they afraid for their job?

Immie

I don't know...it would be interesting to know when he was certified. The same questions should apply to Paul, but for some reason they aren't.

 

[Immanuel]

It would depend on when he was certified, IMO. You can keep pretending that starting and running your own certification group to certify yourself is kosher, though.

IMO it would depend more on who authorized the certification. Did someone else review his qualifications and his board exam or did anyone review those things at all? And if someone else did, were they given free reign to deny him the certification if he did not pass the exam or were they afraid for their job?

Immie

I don't know...it would be interesting to know when he was certified. The same questions should apply to Paul, but for some reason they aren't.

What do you mean? I was referring to Rand Paul. Did I miss a change in the discussion between you two?

Dr. Clarkson, is certified by the ABO. I may be wrong in this assumption, but it seems to me that the ABO is a very large organization and it is highly unlikely that he "certified himself".

As for the NBO, I think it is probably unlikely that Rand did either, but the question still needs to be asked seeing as how he is the President, his wife is the VP and father-in-law the Secretary/Treasurer. The potential conflicts of interest are too evident in this regard.

However, it still boils down to state licensing in my book. The only thing the certification means to me is that he has paid his dues (which may or may not include education/continuing education/passing a board exam etc)

Immie

 

[Ravi]

IMO it would depend more on who authorized the certification. Did someone else review his qualifications and his board exam or did anyone review those things at all? And if someone else did, were they given free reign to deny him the certification if he did not pass the exam or were they afraid for their job?

Immie

I don't know...it would be interesting to know when he was certified. The same questions should apply to Paul, but for some reason they aren't.

What do you mean? I was referring to Rand Paul. Did I miss a change in the discussion between you two?

Dr. Clarkson, is certified by the ABO. I may be wrong in this assumption, but it seems to me that the ABO is a very large organization and it is highly unlikely that he "certified himself".

As for the NBO, I think it is probably unlikely that Rand did either, but the question still needs to be asked seeing as how he is the President, his wife is the VP and father-in-law the Secretary/Treasurer. The potential conflicts of interest are too evident in this regard.

However, it still boils down to state licensing in my book. The only thing the certification means to me is that he has paid his dues (which may or may not include education/continuing education/passing a board exam etc)

Immie

Oops...I misread your post.

I understand what you're saying but if he doesn't need to be certified he just makes himself look suspicious by certifying himself.

 

[uscitizen]

Rand is clearly certifiable.

 

[Immanuel]

I don't know...it would be interesting to know when he was certified. The same questions should apply to Paul, but for some reason they aren't.

What do you mean? I was referring to Rand Paul. Did I miss a change in the discussion between you two?

Dr. Clarkson, is certified by the ABO. I may be wrong in this assumption, but it seems to me that the ABO is a very large organization and it is highly unlikely that he "certified himself".

As for the NBO, I think it is probably unlikely that Rand did either, but the question still needs to be asked seeing as how he is the President, his wife is the VP and father-in-law the Secretary/Treasurer. The potential conflicts of interest are too evident in this regard.

However, it still boils down to state licensing in my book. The only thing the certification means to me is that he has paid his dues (which may or may not include education/continuing education/passing a board exam etc)

Immie

Oops...I misread your post.

I understand what you're saying but if he doesn't need to be certified he just makes himself look suspicious by certifying himself.

Actually, I went back and looked, I had missed the change. You were discussing Clarkson and I was discussing Paul.

He does not, IMO, make himself look suspicious because the average patient that enters his office is not going to look into his certification. "Wow, Dr. Rand is certified by the National Board of Ophthalmologists, he must be good". That is all that they care about. Quite truthfully, I don't think I would explore the meaning behind the certification, in fact, I know I would not. Because two of my children had eye surgery from an Ophthalmologist and I don't even know for a fact that she was certified. I know she was highly recommended by a friend of mine who is an Optometrist, but I could not say for sure that she is certified by either the ABO or the NBO although, my guess is that she is.

Immie

 

[Ravi]

What do you mean? I was referring to Rand Paul. Did I miss a change in the discussion between you two?

Dr. Clarkson, is certified by the ABO. I may be wrong in this assumption, but it seems to me that the ABO is a very large organization and it is highly unlikely that he "certified himself".

As for the NBO, I think it is probably unlikely that Rand did either, but the question still needs to be asked seeing as how he is the President, his wife is the VP and father-in-law the Secretary/Treasurer. The potential conflicts of interest are too evident in this regard.

However, it still boils down to state licensing in my book. The only thing the certification means to me is that he has paid his dues (which may or may not include education/continuing education/passing a board exam etc)

Immie

Oops...I misread your post.

I understand what you're saying but if he doesn't need to be certified he just makes himself look suspicious by certifying himself.

Actually, I went back and looked, I had missed the change. You were discussing Clarkson and I was discussing Paul.

He does not, IMO, make himself look suspicious because the average patient that enters his office is not going to look into his certification. "Wow, Dr. Rand is certified by the National Board of Ophthalmologists, he must be good". That is all that they care about. Quite truthfully, I don't think I would explore the meaning behind the certification, in fact, I know I would not. Because two of my children had eye surgery from an Ophthalmologist and I don't even know for a fact that she was certified. I know she was highly recommended by a friend of mine who is an Optometrist, but I could not say for sure that she is certified by either the ABO or the NBO although, my guess is that she is.

Immie

That's what makes it so suspicious, IMO...he knows no one is going to check his credentials so he shouldn't perpetuate this fallacy.

 

[Immanuel]

Oops...I misread your post.

I understand what you're saying but if he doesn't need to be certified he just makes himself look suspicious by certifying himself.

Actually, I went back and looked, I had missed the change. You were discussing Clarkson and I was discussing Paul.

He does not, IMO, make himself look suspicious because the average patient that enters his office is not going to look into his certification. "Wow, Dr. Rand is certified by the National Board of Ophthalmologists, he must be good". That is all that they care about. Quite truthfully, I don't think I would explore the meaning behind the certification, in fact, I know I would not. Because two of my children had eye surgery from an Ophthalmologist and I don't even know for a fact that she was certified. I know she was highly recommended by a friend of mine who is an Optometrist, but I could not say for sure that she is certified by either the ABO or the NBO although, my guess is that she is.

Immie

That's what makes it so suspicious, IMO...he knows no one is going to check his credentials so he shouldn't perpetuate this fallacy.

Any idea why people put initials after their name? Any idea why people get certified by these things?







































E





G




O




period!

Immie

PS, I hope you do not have initials after your name!

 

[Ravi]

No, but most people that do either earned a degree or were certified by someone other than their wife.

 

[geauxtohell]

Rand Paul is not a certified Doctor

He's not a BOARD Certified doctor.

Board Certification has no bearing on whether or not you are a doctor, or whether or not you can practice medicine.

Board Certification is just a method by which doctors are monitored for competency. Patient's can still chose to go to a physician who is not board certified...insurance may not pay.

That's kind of what I am wondering. Especially considering the Paul's views on Medicare and Medicaid.

Maybe Paul launched this to selectively eliminate Medicaid patients. I don't doubt he's competent at what he does, so he might have been able to swing that.

I don't know, it's all so kooky (as are most things involving the Pauls) that I can only venture to guess.

I also wonder how it affects his malpractice insurance?

 

[geauxtohell]

National group: Paul isn't a board-certified doc - Decision 2010- msnbc.com

My brother is an M.D. and does not belong to the AMA and neither does my physician in Oregon. In fact the AMA has very few members considering the amount of practicing Dr.s.

Rand Paul is also an M.D.

Paul, a graduate of Duke University's medical school, said he was board certified under the American Board of Ophthalmology for a decade. Paul has been licensed to practice in Kentucky since 1993.

In the late 1990s, Paul was a driving force behind forming the National Board of Ophthalmology to protest the ABO's exemption policy.

"I don't think that some people should recertify and others shouldn't," he said. "And I don't choose to give my money to a private group that discriminates."

FOXNews.com - Rand Paul's Doctor Credentials Questioned for Lacking Top Board's Certification

The AMA is a PAC. It has nothing to do with board certification. I'd be surprised if your brother wasn't board certified under the universally recognized accreditation group for whatever he does.

 

[geauxtohell]

The 2010 Executive Director of the ABO is John G. Clarkson, M.D.

ABO

And who do you think he's certified by?

Bascom Palmer Eye Institute - Find a Doctor

Now that we have that settled. You won't go to Rand because he's President of the NBO, and certified by the same. You can't go to Clarkson for essentially the same reason. Which means that you can't go to any board certified ophthalmologist at all, because I'm sure Clarkson and Rand went through the same certification process as the rest of them did. So if Rand and Clarkson made it easy for themselves to be certified, obviously everybody else that's certified by the ABO and the NBO had an easy certification as well.

Did Clarkson start the ABO and certify himself? If so, then I repeat, he is as big an asshole as Paul.

Why does it matter if he started it himself? He's still the head of the same organization he's certified by. Clearly there's a conflict of interests.

Standards.

Certification isn't a finger drill. It involves examination and evaluations.

 

[geauxtohell]

What do you mean? I was referring to Rand Paul. Did I miss a change in the discussion between you two?

Dr. Clarkson, is certified by the ABO. I may be wrong in this assumption, but it seems to me that the ABO is a very large organization and it is highly unlikely that he "certified himself".

As for the NBO, I think it is probably unlikely that Rand did either, but the question still needs to be asked seeing as how he is the President, his wife is the VP and father-in-law the Secretary/Treasurer. The potential conflicts of interest are too evident in this regard.

However, it still boils down to state licensing in my book. The only thing the certification means to me is that he has paid his dues (which may or may not include education/continuing education/passing a board exam etc)

Immie

Oops...I misread your post.

I understand what you're saying but if he doesn't need to be certified he just makes himself look suspicious by certifying himself.

Actually, I went back and looked, I had missed the change. You were discussing Clarkson and I was discussing Paul.

He does not, IMO, make himself look suspicious because the average patient that enters his office is not going to look into his certification. "Wow, Dr. Rand is certified by the National Board of Ophthalmologists, he must be good". That is all that they care about. Quite truthfully, I don't think I would explore the meaning behind the certification, in fact, I know I would not. Because two of my children had eye surgery from an Ophthalmologist and I don't even know for a fact that she was certified. I know she was highly recommended by a friend of mine who is an Optometrist, but I could not say for sure that she is certified by either the ABO or the NBO although, my guess is that she is.

Immie

Most patients are completely ignorant of the entire process. So simply saying "it doesn't matter to the patients" isn't necessarily a good answer.

This is about standards within the profession. That's why it's curious and relevant (though not to his election). It's analogous to the "Flexnor Report" and creating standards for Medical Education. 100 years ago, medical education was not regulated and there were about a jillion medical schools producing doctors of various competency levels to include many quacks.

Flexner Report - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[geauxtohell]

Any idea why people put initials after their name? Any idea why people get certified by these things?

EGO

period!

Immie

PS, I hope you do not have initials after your name!

And accomplishment. Earning a Doctoral Degree is no small matter. Do you begrudge military officers for carrying their rank with them after they leave the service?

As for certification: See my above post. Simply graduating from Medical School doesn't make you an ophthalmologist. Graduating from an internal medicine residency doesn't make you an ophthalmologists.

Physician competency is regulated and monitored for patient safety.

 

[Christopher]

Any idea why people put initials after their name? Any idea why people get certified by these things?

EGO

period!

Immie

PS, I hope you do not have initials after your name!

And accomplishment. Earning a Doctoral Degree is no small matter. Do you begrudge military officers for carrying their rank with them after they leave the service?

As for certification: See my above post. Simply graduating from Medical School doesn't make you an ophthalmologist. Graduating from an internal medicine residency doesn't make you an ophthalmologists.

Physician competency is regulated and monitored for patient safety.

So, why isn't the AOB consistent in requiring ALL ophthalmologists to re-certify?

 

[Immanuel]

Any idea why people put initials after their name? Any idea why people get certified by these things?

EGO

period!

Immie

PS, I hope you do not have initials after your name!

And accomplishment. Earning a Doctoral Degree is no small matter. Do you begrudge military officers for carrying their rank with them after they leave the service?

As for certification: See my above post. Simply graduating from Medical School doesn't make you an ophthalmologist. Graduating from an internal medicine residency doesn't make you an ophthalmologists.

Physician competency is regulated and monitored for patient safety.

I was K-I-D-D-I-N-G!

There are many professions that take a hell of a lot of education to get into and a hell of a lot of continuing education to stay on top of, I'm sure the medical profession and Ophthalmology are included in that list.

However, Board Certification still is not a requirement. It is a "stamp of approval" from other doctors.

Immie

PS: I hope I didn't offend thee.

 

[geauxtohell]

Any idea why people put initials after their name? Any idea why people get certified by these things?

EGO

period!

Immie

PS, I hope you do not have initials after your name!

And accomplishment. Earning a Doctoral Degree is no small matter. Do you begrudge military officers for carrying their rank with them after they leave the service?

As for certification: See my above post. Simply graduating from Medical School doesn't make you an ophthalmologist. Graduating from an internal medicine residency doesn't make you an ophthalmologists.

Physician competency is regulated and monitored for patient safety.

So, why isn't the AOB consistent in requiring ALL ophthalmologists to re-certify?

I could see a practical argument being made about a degree of fairness in forcing a new standard on ophthalmologists that didn't exists when they entered the field.

I mean, isn't that the logic behind all grandfather clauses?

Frankly, I think it was a silly caveat since it improves the professional competency of the field, but most likely the Old Timers (who I would venture to guess were about 99% of the practicing ophthalmologists at the time) pitched a fit and the ABO caved.

Further Frankly, I doubt this was really Paul's reason for starting his own certification group. If fairness was his crucial argument, creating a nepotistic environment doesn't quite square with logic.

That being said, (unless there was some sort of dishonesty involved or Paul was going to lose his ABO certification), I don't see it as being germane to the election.

 

[geauxtohell]

I was K-I-D-D-I-N-G!

There are many professions that take a hell of a lot of education to get into and a hell of a lot of continuing education to stay on top of, I'm sure the medical profession and Ophthalmology are included in that list.

However, Board Certification still is not a requirement. It is a "stamp of approval" from other doctors.

Immie

PS: I hope I didn't offend thee.

Offend me? I am a mediocre medical student, not a Doctor. I have no reason to be offended. Though, God forbid I graduate, I am going to insist that you refer to me as Geauxtohell M.D.

Also, don't kid yourself. "Board certification" might not be a legal requirement but good luck doing anything of consequence without it (and good luck getting insurance to pay you and cover you for malpractice). It's a de-facto requirement. I don't know of a single Dr. I've run into during my time as a student that wasn't board certified in their field.

 

[ConHog]

This complaint is as stupid as the thread accusing Obama of violating the Logan Act.

Proving once again that morons abound in all sides of the political spectrum.

 

[Kevin_Kennedy]

Did Clarkson start the ABO and certify himself? If so, then I repeat, he is as big an asshole as Paul.

Why does it matter if he started it himself? He's still the head of the same organization he's certified by. Clearly there's a conflict of interests.

Standards.

Certification isn't a finger drill. It involves examination and evaluations.

And until we know that the standards of the NBO are easier than the ABO we have no reason to believe that Rand created the NBO because he had such a hard time meeting the ABO's standards. Especially when it's clearly explained that he had already met the ABO's standards before, and simply let his certification with them pass to create competition for them.

 

[geauxtohell]

Why does it matter if he started it himself? He's still the head of the same organization he's certified by. Clearly there's a conflict of interests.

Standards.

Certification isn't a finger drill. It involves examination and evaluations.

And until we know that the standards of the NBO are easier than the ABO we have no reason to believe that Rand created the NBO because he had such a hard time meeting the ABO's standards. Especially when it's clearly explained that he had already met the ABO's standards before, and simply let his certification with them pass to create competition for them.

Outside of the profession, I don't think any of us know that. However, I have doubts that a "Mom and pop" organization like the NBO is up to snuff with the ABO which certifies 95% of the eye docs in the nation.

It's a simple matter of resources.