Public Opinion Supports Repealing “Don’t Ask, Don’t Tell”

[JBeukema]

Last month the Palm Center at the University of California, Santa Barbara, released a new report showing how the President can legally suspend discharges of gay and lesbian personnel in advance of congressional action to permanently repeal DADT. (Full disclosure: I’m a coauthor of that report; my main contribution was to the section on how to effectively implement a new, nondiscriminatory policy.)

(here)

 

[garyd]

One of the great problems with the modern Public is that all too few of them have EVER SERVED IN THE MILITARY. Which is why they don't buy the unit cohesion argument. They don't understand it.

 

[JBeukema]

One of the great problems with the modern Public is that all too few of them have EVER SERVED IN THE MILITARY. Which is why they don't buy the unit cohesion argument. They don't understand it.

What does sexuality have to do with unit cohesion? Hell, if anything, the queer with a crush on his fellow soldier is more likely to do anything to bring his fellow home alive than the guy who kinda doesn't like the queer in the closet

 

[garyd]

That of course assumes the fellow soldier doesn't find said crush repugnant and when it is voiced immeddiately seek to transfer out. When you are hunkered down in a fox hole standing guard in a hot zone you don't need any additional distractions say like the ass of the guy you're on duty with.

 

[JBeukema]

That of course assumes the fellow soldier doesn't find said crush repugnant and when it is voiced immeddiately seek to transfer out.

They heard the same arguments when they first desegregated the army, about Whites not wanting to 'fight in a foxhole next to a ******'. They found it no less repulsive or offensive. Are you telling me that the DIs can't get the morons to fight together?

When you are hunkered down in a fox hole standing guard in a hot zone you don't need any additional distractions say like the ass of the guy you're on duty with.

1) Who the fuck thinks about ass when in a foxhole waiting to get shot?

2)How's that any different than thinking about your gal back home or the female in the Humvee?

3) Will a homosexual be any more distracted by his fellow's ass if he's not afraid of talking about his boyfriend back home? How will it change at all?

 

[bodecea]

That of course assumes the fellow soldier doesn't find said crush repugnant and when it is voiced immeddiately seek to transfer out. When you are hunkered down in a fox hole standing guard in a hot zone you don't need any additional distractions say like the ass of the guy you're on duty with.

You think so little of our military and their professionalism.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

Ya cause on a submarine where part of the crew hot racks and some sleep elbow to elbow the one thing straight guys are looking for is a gay guy living in their sleeping space.

Lets try this another way shall we?

We do not allow men and women to bunk together. Why? Cause of sex and the problems it brings to a unit. We do not allow them to shower together nor to share the same toilet facilities.

Most military personal under the rank of Sgt share quarters with at LEAST one other and sometimes more people. Do you plan to pay to build the THOUSANDS of new quarters the military will need to accommodate admitted gays? Do you plan to pay for the maintenance and upkeep, the furniture, the electricity, all the other ancillary things involved in running those quarters?

What about aboard naval vessels? How does one accommodate admitted gay personnel? As for unit cohesion, having a guy in the unit that is gay is fine as long as he is not there CAUSE he is gay. As long as he is not practicing his sexuality amongst his fellow troops. Openly gay people that are more interested in ADMITTING to everyone they are gay and getting the shock value out of it are not in the military to serve the greater good of the Country. They are not there to protect this country. Don't ask don't tell is perfect for that purpose. It ensures that gays that CHOSE to serve are doing so for the serves not as a political statement.

Clinton tried to get rid of the ban on Gays in the military too. He quickly learned it just is not a good Idea. In fact as I recall that is why we have don't ask don't tell.

The military does not need activists nor those more interested in self then group.

 

[garyd]

No I think so little of humanity in general. I'm 61 a lot of experience and a life long study of history tends to reinforce that view.

Never stood guard duty have you Jay?

 

[bodecea]

No I think so little of humanity in general. I'm 61 a lot of experience and a life long study of history tends to reinforce that view.

Never stood guard duty have you Jay?

I have, and I agree with J.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

No I think so little of humanity in general. I'm 61 a lot of experience and a life long study of history tends to reinforce that view.

Never stood guard duty have you Jay?

I have, and I agree with J.

Then answer my questions and my points.

 

[Big Black Dog]

I think if you're queer, and you're brave enough to admit it in public, then you can most likely deal with anything that comes about by making that announcement to the world. If that's the bed you made, go lay in it. Not my worry or concern.

 

[JBeukema]

How about the military worries about winning the damned conflicts instead of trying to kick anyone out who's found out to be queer?

If they behave inappropriately, then deal with the behavior itself.

 

[Douger]

Just make it illegal for soldiers to be on duty U.I.C.
Somebody make a breathalyser for that ?

 

[bodecea]

Ya cause on a submarine where part of the crew hot racks and some sleep elbow to elbow the one thing straight guys are looking for is a gay guy living in their sleeping space.

Lets try this another way shall we?

We do not allow men and women to bunk together. Why? Cause of sex and the problems it brings to a unit. We do not allow them to shower together nor to share the same toilet facilities.

We do let gays shower with straights...have done it since the military shower was invented.

Most military personal under the rank of Sgt share quarters with at LEAST one other and sometimes more people. Do you plan to pay to build the THOUSANDS of new quarters the military will need to accommodate admitted gays?

Ooooo! Ooooo! The Potty Principle! I remember that argument when they started putting women on ships. An oldie but goodie!

Do you plan to pay for the maintenance and upkeep, the furniture, the electricity, all the other ancillary things involved in running those quarters?

Why change, besides the histerical ravings of an egomaniac who thinks everyone is goggling their not so attractive body in the shower?

What about aboard naval vessels? How does one accommodate admitted gay personnel?

Same why the Navy's done it since the Navy was formed.

As for unit cohesion, having a guy in the unit that is gay is fine as long as he is not there CAUSE he is gay.

Yes...of course. Gay people join the military because they are gay. Happens all the time.

As long as he is not practicing his sexuality amongst his fellow troops. Openly gay people that are more interested in ADMITTING to everyone they are gay and getting the shock value out of it are not in the military to serve the greater good of the Country.

I would love that to go both ways. How about the straight soldiers/sailors SHUT UP about their sexual antics? How about we no longer have the antics we have on deployment in places like Thailand, Sigonela, etc. How about we no longer have the wife swapping we had in one squadron I was in...or the groupies in New Zealand who worked their way thru the Officer's Lounge and the CPO roster? How about that?

They are not there to protect this country.

Ah, I see your problem now.

Don't ask don't tell is perfect for that purpose. It ensures that gays that CHOSE to serve are doing so for the serves not as a political statement.

How many blacks have served "as a political statement"?
How many other minorities as served "as a political statement"?
How many women have served "as a political statement"?


You just revealed yourself there, buckaroo.

Clinton tried to get rid of the ban on Gays in the military too. He quickly learned it just is not a good Idea. In fact as I recall that is why we have don't ask don't tell.

The military does not need activists nor those more interested in self then group.

Of course...you KNOW that gays are only interested in self. Of course that's why we have been a part of the military since its inception. BECAUSE WE'RE SO SELFISH!!!!

 

[Gudrid]

I don't have to be in the military to know that this country is made up of Americans, and if soldiers in the military can't deal with other Americans (of all sorts) in their units, then what the heck are they fighting for? Either way, the natural progression of our society is toward equality. It's already started down that road, and it will continue, and eventually don't ask, don't tell will be repealed. As it should be; it's a disgusting policy and a dangerous one. Firing our limited supply of Arabic translators in the middle of the "war on terror." WTF are these idiots thinking?

Of course, the behavior of straight male soldiers is legendary for it's appropriateness. Nothing makes soldiers bond so well as picking up the same STD from the same Tiajuana hooker (when she's not busy with the donkey...).

 

[Sunni Man]

America has sunk to a new low when the majority of people want homos to defend us

 

[JBeukema]

I don't have to be in the military to know that this country is made up of Americans, and if soldiers in the military can't deal with other Americans (of all sorts) in their units, then what the heck are they fighting for?

We've heard from these bigots before
desegregation of the american military - Google Search

It's like how they rail against gays 'flaunting their sexuality' but have no problem with hetero sexuality being pervasive in the culture and straights always talking about their love lives.

Of course, the behavior of straight male soldiers is legendary for it's appropriateness. Nothing makes soldiers bond so well as picking up the same STD from the same Tiajuana hooker (when she's not busy with the donkey...).

 

[garyd]

Give you a hint they aren't fighting to be ogled by other soldiers.

Another hint most of the gays that have been kicked out of the military were removed not because they were gay but for fraternization violations. (i.e. superiors sleeping with subordinates) That is considered a major violation no matter whether you are gay or straight and for fairly straight forward and obvous reason.

 

[JBeukema]

America has sunk to a new low when the majority of people want homos to defend us

I want the best damned soldiers we have defending us. I couldn't care less whether they prefer dick or pussy.

Kinda like I don't care what color the firefighters are, i just want the guys who can pass the fucking test.

 

[Gudrid]

Replace "homos" with "muslims" and you've got the same attitude as a bunch of other bigot in the nation.

I don't care who you are or what you are. You feel like risking you life to defend me and my family, and the only thing I have to say about it is "Thank you."