"protecting" And "serving"

[MikeK]

you might be right Ave Bear , like I say , I don't know but I don't like seeing whats happening in the USA . Things in the USA sure seem different , worse as regards police . I was born in 49 so I've seen lots of changes since I became aware of how things work in the early to middle 60s .

You and me, both!

Most discouraging is the rapidly rising authoritarian/dominant atmosphere which is largely facilitated by the War on Drugs, an utterly ineffective, counterproductive farce which is wholly responsible for the militarization of the Nation's civilian police agencies and for the emergence of a virtual law-enforcement industrial complex with prison construction being one of the few remaining growth industries in America.

 

[MikeK]

There are over 780,000 police officers in the US. Let's say we have 10 incidents per day of over aggressive officers involving 15 officers, do you realize how many are actually out there serving with dignity and honor? That means that over 99.9% serve honorably.

Sure, there are bad apples out there and we need to get rid of them but to taint the mass majority because of the minor few? It isn't right.

When the "minor few" are identified, appropriately and publicly purged and/or punished, the "taint" will soon diminish and will eventually disappear. But until then the innocent will carry the stain of those who are protected and defended by a defective system known as "the Blue Wall."

 

[Unkotare]

Sad to see supposedly grown people who never got over a juvenile, insecure fear of authority. One thing sure to get the arrested development losers over it instantly...

^says the statist.

No, says an adult.

 

[MikeK]

Illinois State Police protecting and serving the people.

While the cop was out of control, the driver certainly could have avoided everything by being cooperative. This concerns me much less than other instances of absolute abuse of power by police.

Of course that's true. But when we ignore a minor infringement on our Constitutional protections by agents of the State they invariably will move to the next step, then the next, and so on, until we eventually are living in a police state and wondering how it happened. So although I don't always agree with the often unnecessarily provocative means of testing the limits of government authority I cannot ignore the need for it.

In this situation the transaction with the first cop was going along nicely. The driver was being cooperative but was asking perfectly reasonable questions which the cop was calmly and intelligently attempting to answer. But the driver's failure to submissively respond clearly infuriated the second cop who is a manifest example of the authoritarian/dominant personality, a psychological frame of mind which is responsible for the vast majority of excessive force incidents and for the rising level of public resentment of police.

Unfortunately it is not possible for a clinical psychologist to detect and identify the authoritarian/dominant personality in the relatively brief period of time allotted to the typical pre-employment screening interview (60 - 90 minutes). But if this driver would forward the tape of his encounter to the appropriate Internal Affairs unit, and that abusive cop was issued a stern warning and made to attend anger management sessions, the agency that employs him would very likely be avoiding potentially costly lawsuits.

 

[bucs90]

There are over 780,000 police officers in the US. Let's say we have 10 incidents per day of over aggressive officers involving 15 officers, do you realize how many are actually out there serving with dignity and honor? That means that over 99.9% serve honorably.

Sure, there are bad apples out there and we need to get rid of them but to taint the mass majority because of the minor few? It isn't right.

When the "minor few" are identified, appropriately and publicly purged and/or punished, the "taint" will soon diminish and will eventually disappear. But until then the innocent will carry the stain of those who are protected and defended by a defective system known as "the Blue Wall."

So we should smear all black people who dont snitch on other blacks? Should we smear all teachers just because a few are pedophiles?

Funny. You want human cops to not act how all humans typically act.

 

[bucs90]

Illinois State Police protecting and serving the people.

While the cop was out of control, the driver certainly could have avoided everything by being cooperative. This concerns me much less than other instances of absolute abuse of power by police.

Of course that's true. But when we ignore a minor infringement on our Constitutional protections by agents of the State they invariably will move to the next step, then the next, and so on, until we eventually are living in a police state and wondering how it happened. So although I don't always agree with the often unnecessarily provocative means of testing the limits of government authority I cannot ignore the need for it.

In this situation the transaction with the first cop was going along nicely. The driver was being cooperative but was asking perfectly reasonable questions which the cop was calmly and intelligently attempting to answer. But the driver's failure to submissively respond clearly infuriated the second cop who is a manifest example of the authoritarian/dominant personality, a psychological frame of mind which is responsible for the vast majority of excessive force incidents and for the rising level of public resentment of police.

Unfortunately it is not possible for a clinical psychologist to detect and identify the authoritarian/dominant personality in the relatively brief period of time allotted to the typical pre-employment screening interview (60 - 90 minutes). But if this driver would forward the tape of his encounter to the appropriate Internal Affairs unit, and that abusive cop was issued a stern warning and made to attend anger management sessions, the agency that employs him would very likely be avoiding potentially costly lawsuits.

PDs already do that. Its done in private. Which is why you dont see it.

 

[pismoe]

public servants should be held to the highest standards no matter if police or teachers as they are trusted to do the correct thing ALL the time . Just a comment .

 

[MikeK]

So...if we had 10 bad cop stories a day, every day, for a year, that's 3,650. Bad right?

Out of 1,000,000 cops.

Whats that.....0.3%

Does that mean the 3% should be ignored?

 

[depotoo]

Of course not, and I doubt it is even 3%. But what is outrageous is to broad brush the other 97+% with that one stroke. Do you think they deserve that?

So...if we had 10 bad cop stories a day, every day, for a year, that's 3,650. Bad right?

Out of 1,000,000 cops.

Whats that.....0.3%

Does that mean the 3% should be ignored?

 

[Dont Taz Me Bro]

Of course not, and I doubt it is even 3%. But what is outrageous is to broad brush the other 97+% with that one stroke. Do you think they deserve that?

Absolutely, because the so-called "good" ones rarely ever step forward to stop the bad ones.

 

[Ravi]

Of course not, and I doubt it is even 3%. But what is outrageous is to broad brush the other 97+% with that one stroke. Do you think they deserve that?

Absolutely, because the so-called "good" ones rarely ever step forward to stop the bad ones.

And therein lies the problem.

 

[depotoo]

How do you know what goes on behind closed doors? You don't.

Of course not, and I doubt it is even 3%. But what is outrageous is to broad brush the other 97+% with that one stroke. Do you think they deserve that?

Absolutely, because the so-called "good" ones rarely ever step forward to stop the bad ones.

 

[MikeK]

So we should smear all black people who dont snitch on other blacks?

Black people, per se, are not uniformed, trained peace officers who are sworn to conform with a specific standard of conduct.

Should we smear all teachers just because a few are pedophiles?

A few? No. But when a continuing series of examples begins to manifest the entire profession will be unavoidably stained.

Funny. You want human cops to not act how all humans typically act.

Your occupation calls for an exceptionally high level of constraints. Your status as a human being does not permit you to ignore those constraints. There are aspects of the job you probably don't like, which even more probably includes those constraints.

Owing to a broad divergence of personalities, dealing with the public is never easy. Being a cop does not mean ordinary public demeanor must conform to your personal level of tolerance. You exist to serve the public, not to be served by them. Your individual emotional makeup has no acceptable bearing on the performance of the duties you are paid to perform.

Too few cops are aware of the importance of stoicism which is essential to the proper and most effective performance of their job. They endeavor to maintain their individuality while wearing a uniform -- which is like trying to put a round peg into a square hole. It is the formula for trouble.

Either wear the uniform, or don't.

 

[bucs90]

So we should smear all black people who dont snitch on other blacks?

Black people, per se, are not uniformed, trained peace officers who are sworn to conform with a specific standard of conduct.

Should we smear all teachers just because a few are pedophiles?

A few? No. But when a continuing series of examples begins to manifest the entire profession will be unavoidably stained.

Funny. You want human cops to not act how all humans typically act.

Your occupation calls for an exceptionally high level of constraints. Your status as a human being does not permit you to ignore those constraints. There are aspects of the job you probably don't like, which even more probably includes those constraints.

Owing to a broad divergence of personalities, dealing with the public is never easy. Being a cop does not mean ordinary public demeanor must conform to your personal level of tolerance. You exist to serve the public, not to be served by them. Your individual emotional makeup has no acceptable bearing on the performance of the duties you are paid to perform.

Too few cops are aware of the importance of stoicism which is essential to the proper and most effective performance of their job. They endeavor to maintain their individuality while wearing a uniform -- which is like trying to put a round peg into a square hole. It is the formula for trouble.

Either wear the uniform, or don't.

Haha thats some idealistic college coffee lounge thinking there. You dont know much about the real world or the cops who keep some sort of stability in it.

A few truths for you.

50% of cops quit before year 5. So...most patrol cops spend down time working on a resume because the job isnt for everyone and it washes people out fast.

Those cops want to lay low until they can quit.

The "bad cops"? Like any criminal...they're sneaky and dont do their dirt where many witnesses see. THAT is where your logic fails. You assume all cops see what the criminal cop does. They dont. Like all criminals...they hide their crimes.


So much like Dont Ask Dont Tell....most street cops are disgruntled and looking for a new career. The job is incredibly tough and unless you've done it you cant understand. They dont give a fuck what the cop two streets down is doing...and they dont care to find out. The career guys work their way off patrol quick. Into a detective or swat position. And get promoted off patrol.

And thats reality.

You imagine some dark cigar smoke filled room like the movies where all the cops go to share plot their cover ups. Thats all Hollywood myth.

 

[pismoe]

I don't imagine any dark cigar smoke filled room , I imagine that its pretty much like it is and it looks like you confirm my thinking Bucs . For that reason it seems to me that cameras , vigilance and watching , reporting , suing Police and cities is a good for citizens to do when there is Police misconduct .

 

[MikeK]

[...]

So much like Dont Ask Dont Tell....most street cops are disgruntled and looking for a new career. The job is incredibly tough and unless you've done it you cant understand. They dont give a fuck what the cop two streets down is doing...and they dont care to find out. The career guys work their way off patrol quick. Into a detective or swat position. And get promoted off patrol.

[...]

Because of my occupation I was closely familiar with the New York City Police and Correction Departments (as was my late wife) and it is very likely that I have come in contact with more cops than you have. Your commentary suggests that you worked for a comparatively low-paid, under-staffed, overworked, small-town department in which the job is not worth keeping. Because I can tell you that within my twenty-five years experience it was very rare for a New York City Police or Correction Officer to quit the job. In fact I've heard about a number of those who were terminated for misconduct breaking down and crying after putting the badge and gun on the desk.

And NYPD is not the highest-salaried police department in the U.S.

 

[Nutz]

Of course not, and I doubt it is even 3%. But what is outrageous is to broad brush the other 97+% with that one stroke. Do you think they deserve that?

Absolutely, because the so-called "good" ones rarely ever step forward to stop the bad ones.

Sort of like mods...huh?

 

[MikeK]

[...]

So much like Dont Ask Dont Tell....most street cops are disgruntled and looking for a new career. The job is incredibly tough and unless you've done it you cant understand. They dont give a fuck what the cop two streets down is doing...and they dont care to find out. The career guys work their way off patrol quick. Into a detective or swat position. And get promoted off patrol.

[...]

While most cops bitch and complain a lot they love the job, not only because the pay and benefits are far better than in any other occupation they could qualify for, but because of the identity it assigns to them. The badge and the authority it imparts sets them apart from the majority of their social contemporaries.

 

[MikeK]

[...]

50% of cops quit before year 5. So...most patrol cops spend down time working on a resume because the job isnt for everyone and it washes people out fast.

[...]

And go where?

The average NYPD officer has a high-school diploma or is a one or two-year college dropout. Their present starting salary is around $46k and rises to $50k after 3 years. They can retire at half-pay after only twenty years. They receive 30 paid vacation days a year, unlimited sick leave, free hospitalization and dental benefits. Last but by no means least, the badge -- the jewel in the crown that makes them agents of the State and sets them apart from ordinary citizens. For many if not most cops, the identity alone is worth another $25k a year.

So where do all these disgruntled, resigning cops go? FedEx? The local gas company? A security guard agency?

 

[Ame®icano]

It's scary to see things like this...