Bull Ring @Penelope: States requiring Car insurance vs. Federal mandates on health insurance

[Penelope]

... and we , who have health insurance , will not have to pay for your healthcare.

Good lord, am I reading this correctly? Did a resident lefty just suggest there should be no mandate to buy health insurance and if an uninsured person requires healthcare, they're at the mercy of charity?

Deal!

OK Penelope that two of us in agreement with you!

Totally agree that the point is NOT to force insurance as the only choice
and NOT to force taxpayers to pay if this is the requirement you want.

Now I happen to believe that prolife and antidrug advocates
ALSO have this right NOT to pay for
* abortions
* recreational drug use and its related costs
* people who refuse to get help for addictions or abuse that cost taxpayers
for medical or criminal/prison costs.

If everyone has different rules for what they will agree to pay for or NOT pay for,
that's where I'm saying Federal Govt should leave these to the taxpayers and/or parties
to decide and create their own TERMS and CONDITIONS FOR THEIR MEMBERS.

Taxpayers can choose the collective plans of Democrats/Liberals who want singlepayer on a national level,
or Republicans/Conservatives who want free market choices and free choice of charity,
or their own choices.

So as you say, if taxpayers don't agree to health insurance mandates, they don't sign up for your plan.
And you don't have to pay for them.
But if you and your colleagues believe in drug legalization, you may end up paying
for a bunch of deadbeats who can't work and become disabled if they mess up their brains with drugs.
So be CAREFUL what you legalize or mandate, because you should pay for that also!

Last I checked gov funds do no pay for abortions.

Do you pay taxes? Or are you like Trump, a real freeloader.

 

[Penelope]

Penelope please respond to explanations above if you agree, find them helpful, or hit the target like a bullseye.

1. Do you understand that car insurance is NOT required for US to cover our OWN LOSSES
which we are stuck with if we choose not to buy insurance.

So that is like getting stuck with paying your own medical bills
as the consequence of not buying insurance!

The insurance covers liability and damages to OTHER PEOPLE AND PROPERTY.

As I pointed out before, the EQUIVALENT of car insurance to health insurance
would be to require citizens to buy insurance in case WE INJURE DAMAGE HARM OR KILL *OTHERS* and our insurance covers *THEIR* medical bills -- not ours which is OPTIONAL to pay for. So this would be the equivalent of keeping insurance for our own costs OPTIONAL where we get stuck with the bill if we can't afford it, it's our fault.
(And I argue that's enough to compel people to CHOOSE to buy insurance so they don't get stuck with the bills they can't afford, and does NOT require federal govt to impose this. If people vote on it by State law, that is DIFFERENT from Federal law.)

Does that help, yes or no?

2. Can someone please explain the difference between
State laws and how these represent taxpayers and voters per State
v.
Federal laws and the limitations on federal govt that are different from State?

Penelope if you do not understand the difference between
STATE laws and FEDERAL laws, this is dangerous ignorance of the law.
You and other voters are manipulated and abused constantly by your ignorance,
because Politicians can PROMISE things that cannot be justified on federal levels,
misrepresent the system to GET your VOTE, then NOT be able to deliver!

So you will constantly be exploited if you do not learn the difference
so you know when Politicians are misrepresenting what they can do, when it isn't authorized
and it will get rejected as unconstitutional if they try that.

Obama overreached, and now Trump claims he can do more that others argue is unconstitutional.
So this lying to get votes will continue until ALL citizens learn the difference, and quit listening to lies and fraud!

And lastly, if you don't understand that people WILL NOT CONSENT to federal laws overriding their BELIEFS, then this ALSO causes waste and exploitation because of people's beliefs. (For example, the prolife beliefs cannot be legislated because of faith based arguments govt cannot establish. But as long as politicians promise to push prolife policies, they string along voters who will never get this established because of prochoice beliefs.)

The critical factor in these laws is CONSENT, and with BELIEFS, people just like you will NOT consent to any laws that violate your BELIEFS.

If you don't get this, then you will keep seeing manipulation and bullying, and waste of govt resources trying to force one belief or another, when this will ALWAYS get rejected later!

I gave you the link to get out of the fine of the ACA since you believe in Spiritual healing, but since you refuse to buy HI, and do not believe in medical care, when you get into an accident driving that uninsured vehicle, no medical care for you. When you sign that slip saying your exempt from the ACA fine due to your religious beliefs , it should be mandatory for you to wear a bracelet, saying no medical intervention please, only prayers are needed, hopefully they will not even bring to the ER and we , who have health insurance , will not have to pay for your healthcare.

So you go on the attack and show that you did not even read what yo posted, you just hopped on the standard far left religious narrative and ran with it..

Spiritual healing can be more than prayers, but it shows that you do not care about facts only your far left religious narratives!

Yes go to Benny Hinn.

And the far left drone proves my point!

You should look into Hinduism, the tribes of the American Indians, etc. if you want to understand true Spiritual healing!

Instead you went into the far left religious dogma!

I don't care if you do not want medical attention, just be sure to wear something stating you want no medical intervention.
I'd hate to have you wake up in a hospital after a car accident, and find out you had blood infusions and surgery to stop your internal bleeding.

 

[Kosh]

Penelope please respond to explanations above if you agree, find them helpful, or hit the target like a bullseye.

1. Do you understand that car insurance is NOT required for US to cover our OWN LOSSES
which we are stuck with if we choose not to buy insurance.

So that is like getting stuck with paying your own medical bills
as the consequence of not buying insurance!

The insurance covers liability and damages to OTHER PEOPLE AND PROPERTY.

As I pointed out before, the EQUIVALENT of car insurance to health insurance
would be to require citizens to buy insurance in case WE INJURE DAMAGE HARM OR KILL *OTHERS* and our insurance covers *THEIR* medical bills -- not ours which is OPTIONAL to pay for. So this would be the equivalent of keeping insurance for our own costs OPTIONAL where we get stuck with the bill if we can't afford it, it's our fault.
(And I argue that's enough to compel people to CHOOSE to buy insurance so they don't get stuck with the bills they can't afford, and does NOT require federal govt to impose this. If people vote on it by State law, that is DIFFERENT from Federal law.)

Does that help, yes or no?

2. Can someone please explain the difference between
State laws and how these represent taxpayers and voters per State
v.
Federal laws and the limitations on federal govt that are different from State?

Penelope if you do not understand the difference between
STATE laws and FEDERAL laws, this is dangerous ignorance of the law.
You and other voters are manipulated and abused constantly by your ignorance,
because Politicians can PROMISE things that cannot be justified on federal levels,
misrepresent the system to GET your VOTE, then NOT be able to deliver!

So you will constantly be exploited if you do not learn the difference
so you know when Politicians are misrepresenting what they can do, when it isn't authorized
and it will get rejected as unconstitutional if they try that.

Obama overreached, and now Trump claims he can do more that others argue is unconstitutional.
So this lying to get votes will continue until ALL citizens learn the difference, and quit listening to lies and fraud!

And lastly, if you don't understand that people WILL NOT CONSENT to federal laws overriding their BELIEFS, then this ALSO causes waste and exploitation because of people's beliefs. (For example, the prolife beliefs cannot be legislated because of faith based arguments govt cannot establish. But as long as politicians promise to push prolife policies, they string along voters who will never get this established because of prochoice beliefs.)

The critical factor in these laws is CONSENT, and with BELIEFS, people just like you will NOT consent to any laws that violate your BELIEFS.

If you don't get this, then you will keep seeing manipulation and bullying, and waste of govt resources trying to force one belief or another, when this will ALWAYS get rejected later!

I gave you the link to get out of the fine of the ACA since you believe in Spiritual healing, but since you refuse to buy HI, and do not believe in medical care, when you get into an accident driving that uninsured vehicle, no medical care for you. When you sign that slip saying your exempt from the ACA fine due to your religious beliefs , it should be mandatory for you to wear a bracelet, saying no medical intervention please, only prayers are needed, hopefully they will not even bring to the ER and we , who have health insurance , will not have to pay for your healthcare.

So you go on the attack and show that you did not even read what yo posted, you just hopped on the standard far left religious narrative and ran with it..

Spiritual healing can be more than prayers, but it shows that you do not care about facts only your far left religious narratives!

Yes go to Benny Hinn.

And the far left drone proves my point!

You should look into Hinduism, the tribes of the American Indians, etc. if you want to understand true Spiritual healing!

Instead you went into the far left religious dogma!

I don't care if you do not want medical attention, just be sure to wear something stating you want no medical intervention.
I'd hate to have you wake up in a hospital after a car accident, and find out you had blood infusions and surgery to stop your internal bleeding.

Amazing how you show that you do not understand what Liability insurance is..

But you are far left drone and will run your religious narratives at all costs!

 

[emilynghiem]

... and we , who have health insurance , will not have to pay for your healthcare.

Good lord, am I reading this correctly? Did a resident lefty just suggest there should be no mandate to buy health insurance and if an uninsured person requires healthcare, they're at the mercy of charity?

Deal!

OK Penelope that two of us in agreement with you!

Totally agree that the point is NOT to force insurance as the only choice
and NOT to force taxpayers to pay if this is the requirement you want.

Now I happen to believe that prolife and antidrug advocates
ALSO have this right NOT to pay for
* abortions
* recreational drug use and its related costs
* people who refuse to get help for addictions or abuse that cost taxpayers
for medical or criminal/prison costs.

If everyone has different rules for what they will agree to pay for or NOT pay for,
that's where I'm saying Federal Govt should leave these to the taxpayers and/or parties
to decide and create their own TERMS and CONDITIONS FOR THEIR MEMBERS.

Taxpayers can choose the collective plans of Democrats/Liberals who want singlepayer on a national level,
or Republicans/Conservatives who want free market choices and free choice of charity,
or their own choices.

So as you say, if taxpayers don't agree to health insurance mandates, they don't sign up for your plan.
And you don't have to pay for them.
But if you and your colleagues believe in drug legalization, you may end up paying
for a bunch of deadbeats who can't work and become disabled if they mess up their brains with drugs.
So be CAREFUL what you legalize or mandate, because you should pay for that also!

Last I checked gov funds do no pay for abortions.

Do you pay taxes? Or are you like Trump, a real freeloader.

Dear Penelope not only do I pay taxes
but I have paid over 60,000 in debts I covered because of govt abuses
that nearly destroyed two districts in Houston (by trying to
shut down their nonprofit community organizations and
give taxmoney to corporate interests to take over).
The costs of DEFENDING the citizens rights by
supporting the nonprofits to keep these communities going
totaled over the years to 60K for me to help half a dozen
nonprofits that absorbed the cost of damage and restoration.
(which is a small cost compared to the MILLIONS in tax dollars
that went to corporate interests bilking and destroying communities
in the meantime).

So I have footed the bill personally for restitution
for govt abuses until the wrongdoers can be held responsible
for paying back taxpayers.

I consider this a LOAN because I expect it to get paid back.
Working two jobs, I can only afford to pay the interest and minimum
payments to keep my credit in paid status, but cannot afford to pay the full costs myself.
Likewise, Taxpayers and communities that suffer millions in damages
due to govt abuses by corporate interests CANNOT afford
to keep footing the bill. What I am suffering represents that costs
of violations that isn't being counted, much less paid back.

I took this on to help the nonprofit volunteers and organizations
to save their communities from govt abuse and destruction
that violated their equal rights to protections not recognized
by corporate interests buying out city govt officials and offices.

And to make a statement and set up a process for
PAYING BACK TAXPAYERS for the millions if not billions
in damage every time such abuse happens at our expense.

Do you want to talk about this?

Have you ever tried to intervene yourself in a case
of govt abuse, assess the cost AND PAY IT YOURSELF, to invest in solutions
to the problems caused in order to argue later for taxpayers to be reimbursed
for the cost of correcting the abuses that should never have happened!

I have supported solutions to pay back taxpayers for TWO examples
of corporate abuse at taxpayers expense and built a website around these two
to serve as models for restitution and reform:
* Headwaters Forest in CA destroyed by corporate abuse costing taxpayers
an est. 1.6 billion in bailing out bad junk loans and interest, in addition to the
loss of pristine redwood forest and river ecosystems and endangered wildlife
* Freedmen's Town national historic district also destroyed by corporate collusion
where at least 3 different incidents can be documented as costing taxpayers
3.4 million, 10 million and 15 million that I am arguing should be reimbursed.
(also related to North Forest ISD where abuses cost taxpayers 12 million
that was never paid back, and I lent 16K to save a nonprofit group helping
the at risk youth to finish scho ol instead of getting kicked out by corrupt school
officials, including one that the nonprofit volunteers argued to be removed for preying on children)

So I have paid 60K into helping nonprofits try to cap the damage
until taxpayers get united and start demanding reimbursement
of all our taxes misspent on fraud, abuse, waste and unconstitutional violations of civil rights.

What problems or solutions have you invested your own money, income or labor into?
I have been working two jobs since 2008 to cover the loans I made
until these govt abuses can be outted and corrections demanded.

What are you working on Penelope?
Anything related to this that we could unite on
through the Democrats and progressives and demand corrections?

 

[eflatminor]

Last I checked gov funds do no pay for abortions.

Disingenuous bullshit.

taxpayers subsidize roughly 24% of all abortion costs in the U.S.

Are American Taxpayers Paying For Abortion?

 

[emilynghiem]

Penelope please respond to explanations above if you agree, find them helpful, or hit the target like a bullseye.

1. Do you understand that car insurance is NOT required for US to cover our OWN LOSSES
which we are stuck with if we choose not to buy insurance.

So that is like getting stuck with paying your own medical bills
as the consequence of not buying insurance!

The insurance covers liability and damages to OTHER PEOPLE AND PROPERTY.

As I pointed out before, the EQUIVALENT of car insurance to health insurance
would be to require citizens to buy insurance in case WE INJURE DAMAGE HARM OR KILL *OTHERS* and our insurance covers *THEIR* medical bills -- not ours which is OPTIONAL to pay for. So this would be the equivalent of keeping insurance for our own costs OPTIONAL where we get stuck with the bill if we can't afford it, it's our fault.
(And I argue that's enough to compel people to CHOOSE to buy insurance so they don't get stuck with the bills they can't afford, and does NOT require federal govt to impose this. If people vote on it by State law, that is DIFFERENT from Federal law.)

Does that help, yes or no?

2. Can someone please explain the difference between
State laws and how these represent taxpayers and voters per State
v.
Federal laws and the limitations on federal govt that are different from State?

Penelope if you do not understand the difference between
STATE laws and FEDERAL laws, this is dangerous ignorance of the law.
You and other voters are manipulated and abused constantly by your ignorance,
because Politicians can PROMISE things that cannot be justified on federal levels,
misrepresent the system to GET your VOTE, then NOT be able to deliver!

So you will constantly be exploited if you do not learn the difference
so you know when Politicians are misrepresenting what they can do, when it isn't authorized
and it will get rejected as unconstitutional if they try that.

Obama overreached, and now Trump claims he can do more that others argue is unconstitutional.
So this lying to get votes will continue until ALL citizens learn the difference, and quit listening to lies and fraud!

And lastly, if you don't understand that people WILL NOT CONSENT to federal laws overriding their BELIEFS, then this ALSO causes waste and exploitation because of people's beliefs. (For example, the prolife beliefs cannot be legislated because of faith based arguments govt cannot establish. But as long as politicians promise to push prolife policies, they string along voters who will never get this established because of prochoice beliefs.)

The critical factor in these laws is CONSENT, and with BELIEFS, people just like you will NOT consent to any laws that violate your BELIEFS.

If you don't get this, then you will keep seeing manipulation and bullying, and waste of govt resources trying to force one belief or another, when this will ALWAYS get rejected later!

I gave you the link to get out of the fine of the ACA since you believe in Spiritual healing, but since you refuse to buy HI, and do not believe in medical care, when you get into an accident driving that uninsured vehicle, no medical care for you. When you sign that slip saying your exempt from the ACA fine due to your religious beliefs , it should be mandatory for you to wear a bracelet, saying no medical intervention please, only prayers are needed, hopefully they will not even bring to the ER and we , who have health insurance , will not have to pay for your healthcare.

So you go on the attack and show that you did not even read what yo posted, you just hopped on the standard far left religious narrative and ran with it..

Spiritual healing can be more than prayers, but it shows that you do not care about facts only your far left religious narratives!

Yes go to Benny Hinn.

And the far left drone proves my point!

You should look into Hinduism, the tribes of the American Indians, etc. if you want to understand true Spiritual healing!

Instead you went into the far left religious dogma!

I don't care if you do not want medical attention, just be sure to wear something stating you want no medical intervention.
I'd hate to have you wake up in a hospital after a car accident, and find out you had blood infusions and surgery to stop your internal bleeding.

Dear Penelope
Spiritual Healing would end any rejection of medical help
because it removes FEAR
and restores natural healing that includes ALL forms of medical treatment
and rejects NONE.

 

[Penelope]

I gave you the link to get out of the fine of the ACA since you believe in Spiritual healing, but since you refuse to buy HI, and do not believe in medical care, when you get into an accident driving that uninsured vehicle, no medical care for you. When you sign that slip saying your exempt from the ACA fine due to your religious beliefs , it should be mandatory for you to wear a bracelet, saying no medical intervention please, only prayers are needed, hopefully they will not even bring to the ER and we , who have health insurance , will not have to pay for your healthcare.

So you go on the attack and show that you did not even read what yo posted, you just hopped on the standard far left religious narrative and ran with it..

Spiritual healing can be more than prayers, but it shows that you do not care about facts only your far left religious narratives!

Yes go to Benny Hinn.

And the far left drone proves my point!

You should look into Hinduism, the tribes of the American Indians, etc. if you want to understand true Spiritual healing!

Instead you went into the far left religious dogma!

I don't care if you do not want medical attention, just be sure to wear something stating you want no medical intervention.
I'd hate to have you wake up in a hospital after a car accident, and find out you had blood infusions and surgery to stop your internal bleeding.

Amazing how you show that you do not understand what Liability insurance is..

But you are far left drone and will run your religious narratives at all costs!

Liability, yes I know what liability insurance costs, and also comp.

 

[Kosh]

So you go on the attack and show that you did not even read what yo posted, you just hopped on the standard far left religious narrative and ran with it..

Spiritual healing can be more than prayers, but it shows that you do not care about facts only your far left religious narratives!

Yes go to Benny Hinn.

And the far left drone proves my point!

You should look into Hinduism, the tribes of the American Indians, etc. if you want to understand true Spiritual healing!

Instead you went into the far left religious dogma!

I don't care if you do not want medical attention, just be sure to wear something stating you want no medical intervention.
I'd hate to have you wake up in a hospital after a car accident, and find out you had blood infusions and surgery to stop your internal bleeding.

Amazing how you show that you do not understand what Liability insurance is..

But you are far left drone and will run your religious narratives at all costs!

Liability, yes I know what liability insurance costs, and also comp.

No you have proven all you know is far left religious dogma!

 

[emilynghiem]

Yes go to Benny Hinn.

And the far left drone proves my point!

You should look into Hinduism, the tribes of the American Indians, etc. if you want to understand true Spiritual healing!

Instead you went into the far left religious dogma!

I don't care if you do not want medical attention, just be sure to wear something stating you want no medical intervention.
I'd hate to have you wake up in a hospital after a car accident, and find out you had blood infusions and surgery to stop your internal bleeding.

Amazing how you show that you do not understand what Liability insurance is..

But you are far left drone and will run your religious narratives at all costs!

Liability, yes I know what liability insurance costs, and also comp.

No you have proven all you know is far left religious dogma!

Dear Kosh and Penelope
If we can all agree it is far left religious doctrine,
that's enough to argue to SEPARATE IT FROM GOVT.

We don't have to agree whose beliefs are right or wrong
to ARGUE TO SEPARATE THESE.

And not have GOVT abused to endorse and enforce
ONE SET of beliefs while penalizing the other.

Let BOTH sets pursue their OWN terms and conditions,
and let federal dollars be apportioned proportionally to
states to divide between their citizens of different beliefs.

These can be organized by party per state/district, similar to Electoral votes
distributed per state.

Take a vote on which health care plans people BELIEVE IN,
divide the Electoral votes over the Districts, and distribute
tax dollars per state based on
* which plans are approved for that State per District.
* which Districts or parties pay in to federal health care
and which prefer to stay local to state funding and representation.

If there is a GAP, such as more demand in CA or TX to cover the mandated
health plan than there are taxpayers paying into the federal level,
then states/parties with deficits can BORROW from other states/parties with excess.

 

[Kosh]

And the far left drone proves my point!

You should look into Hinduism, the tribes of the American Indians, etc. if you want to understand true Spiritual healing!

Instead you went into the far left religious dogma!

I don't care if you do not want medical attention, just be sure to wear something stating you want no medical intervention.
I'd hate to have you wake up in a hospital after a car accident, and find out you had blood infusions and surgery to stop your internal bleeding.

Amazing how you show that you do not understand what Liability insurance is..

But you are far left drone and will run your religious narratives at all costs!

Liability, yes I know what liability insurance costs, and also comp.

No you have proven all you know is far left religious dogma!

Dear Kosh and Penelope
If we can all agree it is far left religious doctrine,
that's enough to argue to SEPARATE IT FROM GOVT.

We don't have to agree whose beliefs are right or wrong
to ARGUE TO SEPARATE THESE.

And not have GOVT abused to endorse and enforce
ONE SET of beliefs while penalizing the other.

Let BOTH sets pursue their OWN terms and conditions,
and let federal dollars be apportioned proportionally to
states to divide between their citizens of different beliefs.

These can be organized by party per state/district, similar to Electoral votes
distributed per state.

Take a vote on which health care plans people BELIEVE IN,
divide the Electoral votes over the Districts, and distribute
tax dollars per state based on which plans are approved for that State per District.

I want the government out of my health insurance and let me go back and negotiate my own deal with the insurance company of my choice, like I can do with car insurance. Let it go across state lines so it will be cheaper and more affordable to everyone!

 

[Penelope]

I gave you the link to get out of the fine of the ACA since you believe in Spiritual healing, but since you refuse to buy HI, and do not believe in medical care, when you get into an accident driving that uninsured vehicle, no medical care for you. When you sign that slip saying your exempt from the ACA fine due to your religious beliefs , it should be mandatory for you to wear a bracelet, saying no medical intervention please, only prayers are needed, hopefully they will not even bring to the ER and we , who have health insurance , will not have to pay for your healthcare.

So you go on the attack and show that you did not even read what yo posted, you just hopped on the standard far left religious narrative and ran with it..

Spiritual healing can be more than prayers, but it shows that you do not care about facts only your far left religious narratives!

Yes go to Benny Hinn.

And the far left drone proves my point!

You should look into Hinduism, the tribes of the American Indians, etc. if you want to understand true Spiritual healing!

Instead you went into the far left religious dogma!

I don't care if you do not want medical attention, just be sure to wear something stating you want no medical intervention.
I'd hate to have you wake up in a hospital after a car accident, and find out you had blood infusions and surgery to stop your internal bleeding.

Dear Penelope
Spiritual Healing would end any rejection of medical help
because it removes FEAR
and restores natural healing that includes ALL forms of medical treatment
and rejects NONE.

So you want it all. I believe strongly in the mind/body experience, and as a healthcare provider I can tell you stress is a killer in many way, anxiety , etc ,but medical attention is needed. While the mind body can deter illnesses, sooner or later a body breaks down or one is born with bad genes. It will only get worst, if they kill the EPA, and the food we eat is full of chemicals to begin with . A relaxed unstressed mind can create a environment more conducive to health and healing. For some that might be in the form of prayer and meditation, or exercise, but there is a need for medical intervention sooner or later, and if your lucky enough to never have an accident or illness and just keel over and die when 85, good for you, but that is not the norm.

 

[Kosh]

So you go on the attack and show that you did not even read what yo posted, you just hopped on the standard far left religious narrative and ran with it..

Spiritual healing can be more than prayers, but it shows that you do not care about facts only your far left religious narratives!

Yes go to Benny Hinn.

And the far left drone proves my point!

You should look into Hinduism, the tribes of the American Indians, etc. if you want to understand true Spiritual healing!

Instead you went into the far left religious dogma!

I don't care if you do not want medical attention, just be sure to wear something stating you want no medical intervention.
I'd hate to have you wake up in a hospital after a car accident, and find out you had blood infusions and surgery to stop your internal bleeding.

Dear Penelope
Spiritual Healing would end any rejection of medical help
because it removes FEAR
and restores natural healing that includes ALL forms of medical treatment
and rejects NONE.

So you want it all. I believe strongly in the mind/body experience, and as a healthcare provider I can tell you stress is a killer in many way, anxiety , etc ,but medical attention is needed. While the mind body can deter illnesses, sooner or later a body breaks down or one is born with bad genes. It will only get worst, if they kill the EPA, and the food we eat is full of chemicals to begin with . A relaxed unstressed mind can create a environment more conducive to health and healing. For some that might be in the form of prayer and meditation, or exercise, but there is a need for medical intervention sooner or later, and if your lucky enough to never have an accident or illness and just keel over and die when 85, good for you, but that is not the norm.

And once again you are pushing a far left religious narrative!

You have proven you do not understand anything outside your religious dogma..

Spiritual healing is a lot more than prayer, but if you wish to insult all those Native Americans and Hindu's please be my guest!

 

[Penelope]

I don't care if you do not want medical attention, just be sure to wear something stating you want no medical intervention.
I'd hate to have you wake up in a hospital after a car accident, and find out you had blood infusions and surgery to stop your internal bleeding.

Amazing how you show that you do not understand what Liability insurance is..

But you are far left drone and will run your religious narratives at all costs!

Liability, yes I know what liability insurance costs, and also comp.

No you have proven all you know is far left religious dogma!

Dear Kosh and Penelope
If we can all agree it is far left religious doctrine,
that's enough to argue to SEPARATE IT FROM GOVT.

We don't have to agree whose beliefs are right or wrong
to ARGUE TO SEPARATE THESE.

And not have GOVT abused to endorse and enforce
ONE SET of beliefs while penalizing the other.

Let BOTH sets pursue their OWN terms and conditions,
and let federal dollars be apportioned proportionally to
states to divide between their citizens of different beliefs.

These can be organized by party per state/district, similar to Electoral votes
distributed per state.

Take a vote on which health care plans people BELIEVE IN,
divide the Electoral votes over the Districts, and distribute
tax dollars per state based on which plans are approved for that State per District.

I want the government out of my health insurance and let me go back and negotiate my own deal with the insurance company of my choice, like I can do with car insurance. Let it go across state lines so it will be cheaper and more affordable to everyone!

There are really only a few large health insurance companies, and before the ACA a IC paid lots. The reason HI is high is due to not making it mandatory. When companies are in charge they jack the price up. Clinton would of fixed the ACA, which needed some tinkering , but she never got the chance and neither did Obama. Everyone , every the poor has a right to have a family dr. and not have to go to the ers. There are many diseases and conditions that require medical care and would be best if monitored regularly, but the Pubs can't have that. Kick a dog to the street is what they want.

 

[Penelope]

Yes go to Benny Hinn.

And the far left drone proves my point!

You should look into Hinduism, the tribes of the American Indians, etc. if you want to understand true Spiritual healing!

Instead you went into the far left religious dogma!

I don't care if you do not want medical attention, just be sure to wear something stating you want no medical intervention.
I'd hate to have you wake up in a hospital after a car accident, and find out you had blood infusions and surgery to stop your internal bleeding.

Dear Penelope
Spiritual Healing would end any rejection of medical help
because it removes FEAR
and restores natural healing that includes ALL forms of medical treatment
and rejects NONE.

So you want it all. I believe strongly in the mind/body experience, and as a healthcare provider I can tell you stress is a killer in many way, anxiety , etc ,but medical attention is needed. While the mind body can deter illnesses, sooner or later a body breaks down or one is born with bad genes. It will only get worst, if they kill the EPA, and the food we eat is full of chemicals to begin with . A relaxed unstressed mind can create a environment more conducive to health and healing. For some that might be in the form of prayer and meditation, or exercise, but there is a need for medical intervention sooner or later, and if your lucky enough to never have an accident or illness and just keel over and die when 85, good for you, but that is not the norm.

And once again you are pushing a far left religious narrative!

You have proven you do not understand anything outside your religious dogma..

Spiritual healing is a lot more than prayer, but if you wish to insult all those Native Americans and Hindu's please be my guest!

You mean a dance, and some smoke in the pipe. I'm not interested.

 

[emilynghiem]

So you go on the attack and show that you did not even read what yo posted, you just hopped on the standard far left religious narrative and ran with it..

Spiritual healing can be more than prayers, but it shows that you do not care about facts only your far left religious narratives!

Yes go to Benny Hinn.

And the far left drone proves my point!

You should look into Hinduism, the tribes of the American Indians, etc. if you want to understand true Spiritual healing!

Instead you went into the far left religious dogma!

I don't care if you do not want medical attention, just be sure to wear something stating you want no medical intervention.
I'd hate to have you wake up in a hospital after a car accident, and find out you had blood infusions and surgery to stop your internal bleeding.

Dear Penelope
Spiritual Healing would end any rejection of medical help
because it removes FEAR
and restores natural healing that includes ALL forms of medical treatment
and rejects NONE.

So you want it all. I believe strongly in the mind/body experience, and as a healthcare provider I can tell you stress is a killer in many way, anxiety , etc ,but medical attention is needed. While the mind body can deter illnesses, sooner or later a body breaks down or one is born with bad genes. It will only get worst, if they kill the EPA, and the food we eat is full of chemicals to begin with . A relaxed unstressed mind can create a environment more conducive to health and healing. For some that might be in the form of prayer and meditation, or exercise, but there is a need for medical intervention sooner or later, and if your lucky enough to never have an accident or illness and just keel over and die when 85, good for you, but that is not the norm.

AGREE!!!

YES the whole point is treat the WHOLE person
and not neglect the CAUSE of stress that can weaken the
* mind
* immune system
* body
* and even functional relationships the person has with family, counselors or doctors

NOTE: I AM quoting Dr. Francis MacNutt on this who explains it as treating
the BODY MIND AND SPIRIT, all three levels using all available means,
to treat the 'WHOLE PERSON'.

Thank you Penelope
We agree NOT to reject ANY medical help
which also incurs greater costs and losses
if this isn't used correctly in full where it would help!

What is missing from your information is the use of spiritual healing
to INCREASE the response and recovery rate by removing
emotional blocks that otherwise prevent the patient from healing.

So this ASSISTS medical intervention and has been shown
to reduce costs and risks of complications, obstruction and rejection.

Dr. Francis MacNutt conducted a published study on Rheumatoid Arthritis
where some of the results exceeded anything that could be done with medicine.
So this ADDS to the healing and effectiveness of medical treatment
and does complete, conflict, diminish, deny or interfere in any way.
If anything it REMOVES interference when patients have mental
or emotional problems that otherwise prevent them from getting and complying with professional help.

[See also Scott Peck's books on People of the Lie
and Glimpses of the Devil, where he effectively counseled or
cured people of severe mental illness using these methods
so they could start complying with treatment instead of rejecting lifesaving help.]

 

[Kosh]

Amazing how you show that you do not understand what Liability insurance is..

But you are far left drone and will run your religious narratives at all costs!

Liability, yes I know what liability insurance costs, and also comp.

No you have proven all you know is far left religious dogma!

Dear Kosh and Penelope
If we can all agree it is far left religious doctrine,
that's enough to argue to SEPARATE IT FROM GOVT.

We don't have to agree whose beliefs are right or wrong
to ARGUE TO SEPARATE THESE.

And not have GOVT abused to endorse and enforce
ONE SET of beliefs while penalizing the other.

Let BOTH sets pursue their OWN terms and conditions,
and let federal dollars be apportioned proportionally to
states to divide between their citizens of different beliefs.

These can be organized by party per state/district, similar to Electoral votes
distributed per state.

Take a vote on which health care plans people BELIEVE IN,
divide the Electoral votes over the Districts, and distribute
tax dollars per state based on which plans are approved for that State per District.

I want the government out of my health insurance and let me go back and negotiate my own deal with the insurance company of my choice, like I can do with car insurance. Let it go across state lines so it will be cheaper and more affordable to everyone!

There are really only a few large health insurance companies, and before the ACA a IC paid lots. The reason HI is high is do to not making it mandatory. When companies are in charge they jack the price up. Clinton would of fixed the ACA, which needed some tinkering , but she never got the chance and neither did Obama. Everyone , every the poor has a right to have a family dr. and not have to go to the ers. There are many diseases and conditions that require medical care and would be best if monitored regularly, but the Pubs can't have that. Kick a dog to the street is what they want.

Yes Obamacare allowed the bigger insurance companies to buy up a lot of the smaller ones creating less competition..

And yes you hopped on your far left religious narrative and proved that you have nothing other than your religious dogma not based on reality or facts!

 

[Kosh]

And the far left drone proves my point!

You should look into Hinduism, the tribes of the American Indians, etc. if you want to understand true Spiritual healing!

Instead you went into the far left religious dogma!

I don't care if you do not want medical attention, just be sure to wear something stating you want no medical intervention.
I'd hate to have you wake up in a hospital after a car accident, and find out you had blood infusions and surgery to stop your internal bleeding.

Dear Penelope
Spiritual Healing would end any rejection of medical help
because it removes FEAR
and restores natural healing that includes ALL forms of medical treatment
and rejects NONE.

So you want it all. I believe strongly in the mind/body experience, and as a healthcare provider I can tell you stress is a killer in many way, anxiety , etc ,but medical attention is needed. While the mind body can deter illnesses, sooner or later a body breaks down or one is born with bad genes. It will only get worst, if they kill the EPA, and the food we eat is full of chemicals to begin with . A relaxed unstressed mind can create a environment more conducive to health and healing. For some that might be in the form of prayer and meditation, or exercise, but there is a need for medical intervention sooner or later, and if your lucky enough to never have an accident or illness and just keel over and die when 85, good for you, but that is not the norm.

And once again you are pushing a far left religious narrative!

You have proven you do not understand anything outside your religious dogma..

Spiritual healing is a lot more than prayer, but if you wish to insult all those Native Americans and Hindu's please be my guest!

You mean a dance, and some smoke in the pipe. I'm not interested.

Yes we know the far left hates anything not part of the far left religion!

 

[emilynghiem]

Amazing how you show that you do not understand what Liability insurance is..

But you are far left drone and will run your religious narratives at all costs!

Liability, yes I know what liability insurance costs, and also comp.

No you have proven all you know is far left religious dogma!

Dear Kosh and Penelope
If we can all agree it is far left religious doctrine,
that's enough to argue to SEPARATE IT FROM GOVT.

We don't have to agree whose beliefs are right or wrong
to ARGUE TO SEPARATE THESE.

And not have GOVT abused to endorse and enforce
ONE SET of beliefs while penalizing the other.

Let BOTH sets pursue their OWN terms and conditions,
and let federal dollars be apportioned proportionally to
states to divide between their citizens of different beliefs.

These can be organized by party per state/district, similar to Electoral votes
distributed per state.

Take a vote on which health care plans people BELIEVE IN,
divide the Electoral votes over the Districts, and distribute
tax dollars per state based on which plans are approved for that State per District.

I want the government out of my health insurance and let me go back and negotiate my own deal with the insurance company of my choice, like I can do with car insurance. Let it go across state lines so it will be cheaper and more affordable to everyone!

There are really only a few large health insurance companies, and before the ACA a IC paid lots. The reason HI is high is do to not making it mandatory. When companies are in charge they jack the price up. Clinton would of fixed the ACA, which needed some tinkering , but she never got the chance and neither did Obama. Everyone , every the poor has a right to have a family dr. and not have to go to the ers. There are many diseases and conditions that require medical care and would be best if monitored regularly, but the Pubs can't have that. Kick a dog to the street is what they want.

Dear Penelope it can still be fixed by transferring the given exchanges and mandates
to Democrats to reform and make sustainable. I suggest by combining this with prison
reform, and converting prisons into medical treatment, research and service programs
for education, training and internships in public and mental health, the same resources
we currently waste per state in the billions on FAILED mental health and prison systems,
that make people sicker and warehouse people in prisons and on drugs, can be used
to fund service providers, facilities and development to support universal care!

What I will suggest to Ted Cruz and other officials and the Governor of Texas
is to separate tracks and appoint Republicans to reform the VA to represent VETS
and make that health care system work sustainably.
And to allocate to Democrats to fix the ACA mandates and system
in conjunction with prison and immigration reform where everyone who opts in
is ENROLLED in sponsored programs to work out terms and conditions
to cover costs of education and care, including jobs and housing.
http://www.earnedamnesty.org

given that the federal shutdown over conflicts in beliefs over ACA as unconstitutional
cost taxpayers an est. 24 billion, I would suggest giving both parties who voted on this
in Congress 12 billion in credit each as reimbursement owed to taxpayers to fix the problem.

Then notes or credits can be issued against this debt to pay for jobs reforming systems
such as VA or prisons, mental health and immigration enrollment,
and the money saved by stopping the waste on crime and prison/medical costs,
over the longrun, can eventually pay back the 24 billion that this cost taxpayers
due to failure of Congress to resolve conflicts in advance that caused a shutdown
instead of passing constitutional reform in the first place by leaving options OPEN.

 

[Penelope]

I don't care if you do not want medical attention, just be sure to wear something stating you want no medical intervention.
I'd hate to have you wake up in a hospital after a car accident, and find out you had blood infusions and surgery to stop your internal bleeding.

Dear Penelope
Spiritual Healing would end any rejection of medical help
because it removes FEAR
and restores natural healing that includes ALL forms of medical treatment
and rejects NONE.

So you want it all. I believe strongly in the mind/body experience, and as a healthcare provider I can tell you stress is a killer in many way, anxiety , etc ,but medical attention is needed. While the mind body can deter illnesses, sooner or later a body breaks down or one is born with bad genes. It will only get worst, if they kill the EPA, and the food we eat is full of chemicals to begin with . A relaxed unstressed mind can create a environment more conducive to health and healing. For some that might be in the form of prayer and meditation, or exercise, but there is a need for medical intervention sooner or later, and if your lucky enough to never have an accident or illness and just keel over and die when 85, good for you, but that is not the norm.

And once again you are pushing a far left religious narrative!

You have proven you do not understand anything outside your religious dogma..

Spiritual healing is a lot more than prayer, but if you wish to insult all those Native Americans and Hindu's please be my guest!

You mean a dance, and some smoke in the pipe. I'm not interested.

Yes we know the far left hates anything not part of the far left religion!

No interested in your new age , old age healing stuff. I went through all that new age/ old age, stuff in my 20's.

 

[Kosh]

Dear Penelope
Spiritual Healing would end any rejection of medical help
because it removes FEAR
and restores natural healing that includes ALL forms of medical treatment
and rejects NONE.

So you want it all. I believe strongly in the mind/body experience, and as a healthcare provider I can tell you stress is a killer in many way, anxiety , etc ,but medical attention is needed. While the mind body can deter illnesses, sooner or later a body breaks down or one is born with bad genes. It will only get worst, if they kill the EPA, and the food we eat is full of chemicals to begin with . A relaxed unstressed mind can create a environment more conducive to health and healing. For some that might be in the form of prayer and meditation, or exercise, but there is a need for medical intervention sooner or later, and if your lucky enough to never have an accident or illness and just keel over and die when 85, good for you, but that is not the norm.

And once again you are pushing a far left religious narrative!

You have proven you do not understand anything outside your religious dogma..

Spiritual healing is a lot more than prayer, but if you wish to insult all those Native Americans and Hindu's please be my guest!

You mean a dance, and some smoke in the pipe. I'm not interested.

Yes we know the far left hates anything not part of the far left religion!

No interested in your new age , old age healing stuff. I went through all that new age/ old age, stuff in my 20's.

Yes we know the far left hates anything not part of the far left religion!

Here’s How Much Obamacare Premiums Are Rising in All 50 States

Obamacare was supposed to be cheaper, yet it is now causing people to decide whether to pay for health insurance or eat!

It is a disaster and only a far left drone would not see it!