Paul Ryan's Response to Obama's Speech Yesterday

[EriktheRed]

He's talking out both sides of his face. Ryan's Budget was full of Partisanship, his speech presenting his budget was full of partisanship, and now he's scolding the President for Partisanship. How's that work?

Apparently both sides are shocked - SHOCKED! - to find gambling going on in the other sides' casinos.

 

[Zona]

"Exploiting people's emotions of fear, envy, and anxiety is not hope, is not change, it is partisanship." You can tell in the video Ryan is truly pissed off and downright offended by Obama's antics.

All Republicans need to follow Ryan's lead and act that way - downright offended. Republicans on the Hill need to take justified offense at what the Democrats are claiming Republicans want to do. It's disingenuous and downright disgusting. This isn't about taking health care away from anyone, it's about fixing these programs now so that they don't swallow our debt in the future. As Ryan says, it's about saving these programs so that they can be maintained. Delaying action with rhetoric about killing Grandma and hating children is not a solution.

YouTube - Paul Ryan Expresses Disappointment At President's Irresponsible Lack of Leadership​

This idiot wants to privatize medicare. Seriously. He wants to give the top 2% and big businesses even bigger tax cuts. Seriously.
Obama opposes these things.


Nuff said.

 

[code1211]

i'm sorry paul ryan has a problem with people being offended that he thinks medicare should be a voucher system that can't possibly ever pay for old people's health care.

i'm equally sorry that paul ryan thinks that the middle class should be squeezed even further so that rich people can avoid taxes on capital gains.

life's rough that way.

Just to be clear, a Capital Gain is still income and that is taxed at 10% if you are under the limit and 25% if you are over the limit.

Nobody 55 and older is affected by the health care portion of this. The voucher for health care for those who are younger than 55 is $11,000, indexed to inflation and pegged to the income level. There are also MSA's that are pre-tax contributions.

Disagreeing with something about which you know nothing is so Obama-esque. So Democrat. So Liberal and so popular.

 

[Zona]

Yeah Ryan is a real gem.
All he's doing with his plan is taking programs that help the poor and elderly and cutting them and at the same time giving the savings to the wealthy and powerful.
In other words, the continuation of class warfare and the continuation of the growth of the wealth gap. He is Robin Hood to the monetary elite.
Plutocracy in action.

What is your solution?

Ryans plan is to give vouchers to the elderly and have them go to private insurance. Seriously, this is his plan. Wow.

He wants to cut taxes for the rich and big businesses.

How do you respond to this? He takes away from the poor to literally give to the rich.

That is class warfare.

 

[edthecynic]

a radically simplified code, filing a form that fits on a postcard. It would have just two rates: 10 percent on incomes up to $100,000 for joint filers and $50,000 for single filers; 25 percent on higher incomes. There would be no deductions, credits or exclusions, other than the health-care tax credit (see below).

snip

Ryan would eliminate taxes on interest, capital gains, dividends and death. The corporate income tax, the world's second-highest, would be replaced by an 8.5 percent business consumption tax.

So Lyin'Ryan will increase taxes on all income under $100,000 and cut taxes on all income over $100,000 and with the little money the under $100,000 have left they will have to pay an 8.5% sales tax, while the truly wealthy get a tax cut from 15% to ZERO on their realized capital gains that were increasing in value TAX FREE as unrealized cap gains like an unlimited IRA.

Anyone who supports Cryin' Ryan does not work for wages, if they work at all!!!

 

[code1211]

"Exploiting people's emotions of fear, envy, and anxiety is not hope, is not change, it is partisanship." You can tell in the video Ryan is truly pissed off and downright offended by Obama's antics.

All Republicans need to follow Ryan's lead and act that way - downright offended. Republicans on the Hill need to take justified offense at what the Democrats are claiming Republicans want to do. It's disingenuous and downright disgusting. This isn't about taking health care away from anyone, it's about fixing these programs now so that they don't swallow our debt in the future. As Ryan says, it's about saving these programs so that they can be maintained. Delaying action with rhetoric about killing Grandma and hating children is not a solution.

YouTube - Paul Ryan Expresses Disappointment At President's Irresponsible Lack of Leadership​

This idiot wants to privatize medicare. Seriously. He wants to give the top 2% and big businesses even bigger tax cuts. Seriously.
Obama opposes these things.


Nuff said.

Your understanding of this proposal puts the under in understanding.

 

[EriktheRed]

Republicans on the Hill need to take justified offense at what the Democrats are claiming Republicans want to do. It's disingenuous and downright disgusting. This isn't about taking health care away from anyone, it's about fixing these programs now so that they don't swallow our debt in the future.

What's disgusting is these constant attempts to whitewash what Ryan's proposing while still pretending it's so very brave.

Here's a tiny dose of reality for you. Ending CHIP hurts people (in this case, children). Slashing the federal commitment to Medicaid by a third hurts people, namely, children, seniors, low-income parents, and folks in need of long-term care. Dismantling Medicare and instead leaving future seniors to spend significantly more on whatever plan they can get from BlueCross or Aetna or whoever hurts people.

Frankly, I find Ryan's (and his supporters') indignation embarrassing. Take some responsibility for your ideas. Now that would be bold and brave.

It's not like it takes much courage for him to propose this when he comes from a conservative Republican district that re-elected him with 68% of the vote last November. It's like if Nancy Pelosi were to submit a plan to nationalize the oil industry.

 

[NYcarbineer]

Oh, in case any of you haven't heard, the new gag on Ryan is how much he looks like Eddie Munster.

This is exactly the level of incisive critique that makes the Democrat Party and its hacks so valuable to the future of the Republic.

I've made incisive critique on Ryan's crackpot plan. Learn to read.

I am most amazed that Ryan was stupid enough to spend hours days weeks composing a plan that has absolutely ZERO chance of becoming law.

 

[Zona]

a radically simplified code, filing a form that fits on a postcard. It would have just two rates: 10 percent on incomes up to $100,000 for joint filers and $50,000 for single filers; 25 percent on higher incomes. There would be no deductions, credits or exclusions, other than the health-care tax credit (see below).

snip

Ryan would eliminate taxes on interest, capital gains, dividends and death. The corporate income tax, the world's second-highest, would be replaced by an 8.5 percent business consumption tax.

So Lyin'Ryan will increase taxes on all income under $100,000 and cut taxes on all income over $100,000 and with the little money the under $100,000 have left they will have to pay an 8.5% sales tax, while the truly wealthy get a tax cut from 15% to ZERO on their realized capital gains that were increasing in value TAX FREE as unrealized cap gains like an unlimited IRA.

Anyone who supports Cryin' Ryan does not work for wages, if they work at all!!!

"Exploiting people's emotions of fear, envy, and anxiety is not hope, is not change, it is partisanship." You can tell in the video Ryan is truly pissed off and downright offended by Obama's antics.

All Republicans need to follow Ryan's lead and act that way - downright offended. Republicans on the Hill need to take justified offense at what the Democrats are claiming Republicans want to do. It's disingenuous and downright disgusting. This isn't about taking health care away from anyone, it's about fixing these programs now so that they don't swallow our debt in the future. As Ryan says, it's about saving these programs so that they can be maintained. Delaying action with rhetoric about killing Grandma and hating children is not a solution.

YouTube - Paul Ryan Expresses Disappointment At President's Irresponsible Lack of Leadership​

This idiot wants to privatize medicare. Seriously. He wants to give the top 2% and big businesses even bigger tax cuts. Seriously.
Obama opposes these things.


Nuff said.

Your understanding of this proposal puts the under in understanding.

 

[NYcarbineer]

Does Ryan's plan involve sacrifice?

Does any of the sacrifice fall on the Rich?

I say yes and no.

Then I say why? If it just and fair to determine that the Rich owe no sacrifice to the fixing of the deficit/debt problem, then it should be demonstrable that they garnered no benefit over the time the deficits have run and the debt has accumulated.

Does ANYONE here want to make that argument? Does ANYONE here want to claim that the Rich deserve to be exempted from the sacrifices needed to be made,

because they were excluded from the benefits of past borrowing and spending?

ANYONE?

 

[Defiant1]

"Exploiting people's emotions of fear, envy, and anxiety is not hope, is not change, it is partisanship." You can tell in the video Ryan is truly pissed off and downright offended by Obama's antics.

All Republicans need to follow Ryan's lead and act that way - downright offended. Republicans on the Hill need to take justified offense at what the Democrats are claiming Republicans want to do. It's disingenuous and downright disgusting. This isn't about taking health care away from anyone, it's about fixing these programs now so that they don't swallow our debt in the future. As Ryan says, it's about saving these programs so that they can be maintained. Delaying action with rhetoric about killing Grandma and hating children is not a solution.

YouTube - Paul Ryan Expresses Disappointment At President's Irresponsible Lack of Leadership​

As I've explained. Wait till closer to election time. The demonRats will tell the black voter that Republicans will set the dogs on them and bring out the water hoses..

demonRats are despicable people.

Don't forget the chains and pickup trucks.

 

[BrianH]

There is a large consensus that Obama's speech was one of the most dishonest and disingenuous given by a sitting President who was supposed to be speaking about policy, not partisan electioneering.

The WSJ has a good analysis:

The immediate political goal was to inoculate the White House from criticism that it is not serious about the fiscal crisis, after ignoring its own deficit commission last year and tossing off a $3.73 trillion budget in February that increased spending amid a record deficit of $1.65 trillion. Mr. Obama was chased to George Washington University yesterday because Mr. Ryan and the Republicans outflanked him on fiscal discipline and are now setting the national political agenda.

Mr. Obama did not deign to propose an alternative to rival Mr. Ryan's plan, even as he categorically rejected all its reform ideas, repeatedly vilifying them as essentially un-American. "Their vision is less about reducing the deficit than it is about changing the basic social compact in America," he said, supposedly pitting "children with autism or Down's syndrome" against "every millionaire and billionaire in our society." The President was not attempting to join the debate Mr. Ryan has started, but to close it off just as it begins and banish House GOP ideas to political Siberia.

Mr. Obama then packaged his poison in the rhetoric of bipartisanship—which "starts," he said, "by being honest about what's causing our deficit." The speech he chose to deliver was dishonest even by modern political standards.

(snip)

Fifteen members will serve on the Independent Payment Advisory Board, all appointed by the President and confirmed by the Senate. If per capita costs grow by more than GDP plus 0.5%, this board would get more power, including an automatic budget sequester to enforce its rulings. So 15 sages sitting in a room with the power of the purse will evidently find ways to control Medicare spending that no one has ever thought of before and that supposedly won't harm seniors' care, even as the largest cohort of the baby boom generation retires and starts to collect benefits.

(snip)

Mr. Obama rallied the left with a summons for major tax increases on "the rich." Every U.S. fiscal trouble, he claimed, flows from the Bush tax cuts "for the wealthiest 2%," conveniently passing over what he euphemistically called his own "series of emergency steps that saved millions of jobs." Apparently he means the $814 billion stimulus that failed and a new multitrillion-dollar entitlement in ObamaCare that harmed job creation.

Under the Obama tax plan, the Bush rates would be repealed for the top brackets. Yet the "cost" of extending all the Bush rates in 2011 over 10 years was about $3.7 trillion. Some $3 trillion of that was for everything but the top brackets—and Mr. Obama says he wants to extend those rates forever. According to Internal Revenue Service data, the entire taxable income of everyone earning over $100,000 in 2008 was about $1.582 trillion. Even if all these Americans—most of whom are far from wealthy—were taxed at 100%, it wouldn't cover Mr. Obama's deficit for this year.

Review & Outlook: The Presidential Divider - WSJ.com

Obama has been in Campaign mode the entire time he's been in office.

 

[code1211]

Does Ryan's plan involve sacrifice?

Does any of the sacrifice fall on the Rich?

I say yes and no.

Then I say why? If it just and fair to determine that the Rich owe no sacrifice to the fixing of the deficit/debt problem, then it should be demonstrable that they garnered no benefit over the time the deficits have run and the debt has accumulated.

Does ANYONE here want to make that argument? Does ANYONE here want to claim that the Rich deserve to be exempted from the sacrifices needed to be made,

because they were excluded from the benefits of past borrowing and spending?

ANYONE?

First, the rich pay most of the taxes that are paid. The poor pay little. By this measure, the sacrifice is being endured by the rich and only observed by the poor.

The rich will continue to sacrifice and the poor will join the battle. In this way the sacrifice will be shared. Under your delusion, the sacrifice will become ever more focused on fewer and fewer who work.

The rule in 1607 Jamestown became, "Those who do not work, do not eat."

When the indolent were made to work at that time, was their sudden entry into the world of labor called a sacrifice while the work of those who only continued to labor somehow different? Why is one example of work a sacrifice and the other not?

You need to develop a better grip on reality before you try to teach those who live with it every day.

 

[edthecynic]

There is a large consensus that Obama's speech was one of the most dishonest and disingenuous given by a sitting President who was supposed to be speaking about policy, not partisan electioneering.

The WSJ has a good analysis:

The immediate political goal was to inoculate the White House from criticism that it is not serious about the fiscal crisis, after ignoring its own deficit commission last year and tossing off a $3.73 trillion budget in February that increased spending amid a record deficit of $1.65 trillion. Mr. Obama was chased to George Washington University yesterday because Mr. Ryan and the Republicans outflanked him on fiscal discipline and are now setting the national political agenda.

Mr. Obama did not deign to propose an alternative to rival Mr. Ryan's plan, even as he categorically rejected all its reform ideas, repeatedly vilifying them as essentially un-American. "Their vision is less about reducing the deficit than it is about changing the basic social compact in America," he said, supposedly pitting "children with autism or Down's syndrome" against "every millionaire and billionaire in our society." The President was not attempting to join the debate Mr. Ryan has started, but to close it off just as it begins and banish House GOP ideas to political Siberia.

Mr. Obama then packaged his poison in the rhetoric of bipartisanship—which "starts," he said, "by being honest about what's causing our deficit." The speech he chose to deliver was dishonest even by modern political standards.

(snip)

Fifteen members will serve on the Independent Payment Advisory Board, all appointed by the President and confirmed by the Senate. If per capita costs grow by more than GDP plus 0.5%, this board would get more power, including an automatic budget sequester to enforce its rulings. So 15 sages sitting in a room with the power of the purse will evidently find ways to control Medicare spending that no one has ever thought of before and that supposedly won't harm seniors' care, even as the largest cohort of the baby boom generation retires and starts to collect benefits.

(snip)

Mr. Obama rallied the left with a summons for major tax increases on "the rich." Every U.S. fiscal trouble, he claimed, flows from the Bush tax cuts "for the wealthiest 2%," conveniently passing over what he euphemistically called his own "series of emergency steps that saved millions of jobs." Apparently he means the $814 billion stimulus that failed and a new multitrillion-dollar entitlement in ObamaCare that harmed job creation.

Under the Obama tax plan, the Bush rates would be repealed for the top brackets. Yet the "cost" of extending all the Bush rates in 2011 over 10 years was about $3.7 trillion. Some $3 trillion of that was for everything but the top brackets—and Mr. Obama says he wants to extend those rates forever. According to Internal Revenue Service data, the entire taxable income of everyone earning over $100,000 in 2008 was about $1.582 trillion. Even if all these Americans—most of whom are far from wealthy—were taxed at 100%, it wouldn't cover Mr. Obama's deficit for this year.

Review & Outlook: The Presidential Divider - WSJ.com

Obama has been in Campaign mode the entire time he's been in office.

The GOP have been in campaign mode from the day Obama was elected.

 

[Dont Taz Me Bro]

If these reforms are not done then they will eventually bankrupt the country and nobody will have any of it ever. You people seem to think we have an endless supply of money. You are neither serious about this growing problem, nor credible.

There are indeed ways to slow spending growth in public health insurance programs without dismantling them.

Nobody is attempting to dismantle them.

Furthermore, it's not my responsibility to pay the health care bills of other people's children and other people's grandparents.

This! You've gone from "Republicans on the Hill need to take justified offense at what the Democrats are claiming Republicans want to do. It's disingenuous and downright disgusting." to admitting you believe those programs are fundamentally illegitimate.

I know you think that, I know Ryan thinks that. You're free to think that--hell, I hope the Republicans run on it. They ought to make the Ryan plan to end CHIP and Medicare and slash Medicaid the centerpiece of the 2012 campaign.

But why on earth would you or anyone else "take justified offense" for the Democrats reiterating that? What's disingenuous is admitting you don't think these programs should exist while simultaneously spinning the bullshit line about how all you want is to save them.

The Republicans should take justifiable offense because they aren't trying to eliminate them. They are trying to reform and preserve for future generations. The fact that I am not responsible for someone else's family has no bearing on what the Congress is actually doing.

 

[Dont Taz Me Bro]

Ryans plan is to give vouchers to the elderly and have them go to private insurance. Seriously, this is his plan. Wow.

Why is that a problem?

He wants to cut taxes for the rich and big businesses.

Again, why is that a problem?

How do you respond to this? He takes away from the poor to literally give to the rich.

What's he giving the rich?

That is class warfare.

No, class warfare is emasculated pussies like you who think someone else should wipe your ass for you because you're not enough of a man to do it yourself.

 

[edthecynic]

Does Ryan's plan involve sacrifice?

Does any of the sacrifice fall on the Rich?

I say yes and no.

Then I say why? If it just and fair to determine that the Rich owe no sacrifice to the fixing of the deficit/debt problem, then it should be demonstrable that they garnered no benefit over the time the deficits have run and the debt has accumulated.

Does ANYONE here want to make that argument? Does ANYONE here want to claim that the Rich deserve to be exempted from the sacrifices needed to be made,

because they were excluded from the benefits of past borrowing and spending?

ANYONE?

First, the rich pay most of the taxes that are paid. The poor pay little. By this measure, the sacrifice is being endured by the rich and only observed by the poor.

The rich will continue to sacrifice and the poor will join the battle. In this way the sacrifice will be shared. Under your delusion, the sacrifice will become ever more focused on fewer and fewer who work.

The rule in 1607 Jamestown became, "Those who do not work, do not eat."

When the indolent were made to work at that time, was their sudden entry into the world of labor called a sacrifice while the work of those who only continued to labor somehow different? Why is one example of work a sacrifice and the other not?

You need to develop a better grip on reality before you try to teach those who live with it every day.

First of all, the rich don't pay taxes. The upper middle class WAGE EARNER pays the bulk of the taxes and CON$ pass them off as the rich. The poor have very little income so they pay less in the progressive income tax. But in all the other regressive taxes, like FICA, sales, gas taxes, etc., they pay more proportionally than the rich.

Just remember that Libs earn more than CON$, so if those who don't work don't eat, there will be a lot of starving CON$. After all there are about 25 million jobless CON$ who listen to Stuttering LimpTard every day.

April 14, 2011
CALLER: You know, I heard you say that Obama could not have given that speech at a primetime venue. And I think you're absolutely right about that. Most of the working class people at two o'clock in the afternoon yesterday were doing their jobs, I'm sure, and had little if no time to at least digest what he had said.

RUSH: In television, primetime is 8 to 11 p.m. Eastern (7 to 10 central). That's just the way it is. In the early days of this program -- and, in fact, even before this program -- it was thought that the middle of the day was the absolute worst time to be an advertiser on radio because the only people listening were people who have no jobs, and what could they afford to buy? You know, what sponsor could they frequent?

 

[Greenbeard]

Nobody is attempting to dismantle them.

Under Ryan's proposal, will CHIP receive a dime of funding after 2013? (no) Under Ryan's proposal, will the defined public health insurance benefit known as Medicare exist for those who are not grandfathered in? (no) Under Ryan's proposal, will Medicaid cease to be a federal match for state dollars spent on health services but instead be a significantly smaller (in total) lump sum given to states annually, virtually guaranteeing significant losses of coverage? (yes)

To save you time, I've provided the answers for you.

The Republicans should take justifiable offense because they aren't trying to eliminate them. They are trying to reform and preserve for future generations.

Now I'm starting to take justifiable offense. How long are you going to continue pissing on my leg and telling me it's raining?

 

[kiwiman127]

So go ahead and follow your stupid community organizer into bankruptcy....medicaid and medicare are going broke doncha know?....at least Ryan's plan meets the challenge head-on with some realistic solutions.....BO just wants America to go broke...Marxism in action...

I don't have much good to say about Obama's rather vague plan. In my opinion Obama is clueless and doesn't know what he's doing.
On the other hand Ryan knows exactly what he's doing and it's not good for 90% of Americans as he is simply rewarding the top 10% as the rest of the US population sacrifices. If we're going to sacrifice as a nation to lower the deficit, everyone should sacrifice.

I don't know if you are lying intentionally or ignorantly. I also don't know which is worse.

George F. Will - How to get the country to solvency on entitlements - washingtonpost.com

<snip>

To make the economy -- on which all else hinges -- hum, Ryan proposes tax reform. Masochists would be permitted to continue paying income taxes under the current system. Others could use a radically simplified code, filing a form that fits on a postcard. It would have just two rates: 10 percent on incomes up to $100,000 for joint filers and $50,000 for single filers; 25 percent on higher incomes. There would be no deductions, credits or exclusions, other than the health-care tax credit (see below).

Today's tax system was shaped by sadists who were trying to be nice: Every wrinkle in the code was put there to benefit this or that interest. Since the 1986 tax simplification, the code has been recomplicated more than 14,000 times -- more than once a day.

At the 2004 Republican convention, thunderous applause greeted George W. Bush's statement that the code is "a complicated mess" and a "drag on our economy" and his promise to "reform and simplify" it. But his next paragraphs proposed more complications to incentivize this and that behavior for the greater good.

Ryan would eliminate taxes on interest, capital gains, dividends and death. The corporate income tax, the world's second-highest, would be replaced by an 8.5 percent business consumption tax. Because this would be about half the average tax burden that other nations place on corporations, U.S. companies would instantly become more competitive -- and more able and eager to hire.

Medicare and Social Security would be preserved for those currently receiving benefits or becoming eligible in the next 10 years (those 55 and older today). Both programs would be made permanently solvent.

Universal access to affordable health care would be guaranteed by refundable tax credits ($2,300 for individuals, $5,700 for families) for purchasing portable coverage in any state. As persons younger than 55 became Medicare-eligible, they would receive payments averaging $11,000 a year, indexed to inflation and pegged to income, with low-income people receiving more support.

Ryan's plan would fund medical savings accounts from which low-income people would pay minor out-of-pocket expenses. All Americans, regardless of income, would be allowed to establish MSAs -- tax-preferred accounts for paying such expenses.

Ryan's plan would allow workers younger than 55 the choice of investing more than one-third of their current Social Security taxes in personal retirement accounts similar to the Thrift Savings Plan long available to, and immensely popular with, federal employees. This investment would be inheritable property, guaranteeing that individuals will never lose the ability to dispose of every dollar they put into these accounts.

Ryan would raise the retirement age. If, when Congress created Social Security in 1935, it had indexed the retirement age (then 65) to life expectancy, today the age would be in the mid-70s. The system was never intended to do what it is doing -- subsidizing retirements that extend from one-third to one-half of retirees' adult lives.

Compare Ryan's lucid map to the Democrats' impenetrable labyrinth of health-care legislation. Republicans are frequently criticized as "the party of no." But because most new ideas are injurious, rejection is an important function in politics. It is, however, insufficient. Fortunately, Ryan, assisted by Republican Reps. Devin Nunes of California and Jeb Hensarling of Texas, has become a think tank, refuting the idea that Republicans lack ideas.

I have no idea where George Will came up with that theory.

Go to this site and you can see individual tax tables, just click on the links ala the four seperate cash and percentile and it shows what the tax rates are, the difference from now and if the Ryan plan was used.

TPC Tax Topics | Roadmap for America&#39;s Future Act Tables

It's not complicated but then you'll understand I'm not ignorant or lying. The truth may set you free.

 

[mnbasketball]

Why are so many people who don't need anymore than what they have already so inclined to make those who don't have enough, to cover more of the cost of govt and live on less even though they are having a hard time right now?

The truth is the rich use a lot more than any one person does. The average guy uses little of what is provided by the govt through taxes. Business that derive it's money from selling services and product use every aspect of what is provided everyday.

Everything is done for the purpose of business as the main drive, and yes a normal person may get some use out of it but seldom compared to what business use. All the way from infrastructure to education to police and fire to the military. How can you expect a person who is no more than a tool to pay the cost of government.

The people who benefit the most should pay the most. It's that simple. You make more than the next highest tax rate, you need to pay the higher rate and then make as much as you can. YOU OWE IT FOR THE RIGHT TO BE ABLE TO MAKE ALL YOU CAN. stop your bitching and crying and pay your real share of the cost of government.